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Author Topic: Delaware  (Read 575922 times)


MASTERNC

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1801 on: September 15, 2021, 09:08:52 AM »

Not sure the multiple access points is an excuse for not enforcing on I-95 southbound.  There are only three points you need to watch - south of 202 (for any trucks proceeding past the exit), the North Jackson Street on-ramp, and the ramp from the Riverfront area.  When they switch sides next year, I imagine that goes down to two.
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Alex4897

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1802 on: September 15, 2021, 01:23:36 PM »

Not sure the multiple access points is an excuse for not enforcing on I-95 southbound.  There are only three points you need to watch - south of 202 (for any trucks proceeding past the exit), the North Jackson Street on-ramp, and the ramp from the Riverfront area.  When they switch sides next year, I imagine that goes down to two.

I think it's more likely that they left southbound alone because it's been experiencing far fewer traffic-snarling wrecks than northbound has.
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« Last Edit: September 18, 2021, 10:20:41 AM by 74/171FAN »
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jeffandnicole

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1804 on: September 18, 2021, 11:08:10 PM »

There is a big and disastrous change for motorists on 295 South approaching 95 South.

The big change:  Traffic on 295 South has now switched over to a new roadway that maintains separation of 295 from 95 for another 1/2 mile or so, after motorists have traveled under the DE 141 Overpasses.  https://www.sr141improvements.com/2021/09/10/new-traffic-pattern-on-i95-i295-new-i-295-travel-lanes/

The disastrous change:  Motorists on 295 South now don't have 2 thru lanes after the merge with 95 South.  Just after the merge point, the left lane from 295 ends, effectively narrowing 295 down to 1 lane just as it merges with 95!  I took notice to this Friday evening.  Traffic on 295 South was backed up from US 13 to I-95.  I figured just normal Friday evening volume.  Nope...it was due to this very ill-advised lane merge!  Traffic otherwise was fairly light from this point on South to Baltimore.  I believe the change greatly benefits southbound motorists coming from 95 & 495 from Wilmington, which will now have 4 continuous lanes thru the interchange area.  While traffic on I-95 can be heavy, it didn't seem to abnormally congest.   Instead, they will severely impact traffic coming from NJ, which gets horribly pinched as it approaches 95.

Before I posted this, I tried doing some research.  DelDOT appears to be keeping this aspect of the project very, very quiet, as the closest hint I could find easily regarding this lane loss is in a vague, color-coded project phase status page, which doesn't show the actual lanes on I-295: https://live-deldot-sr-141.pantheonsite.io/construction-information/
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Alex4897

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1805 on: September 19, 2021, 12:44:53 AM »

There is a big and disastrous change for motorists on 295 South approaching 95 South.

The big change:  Traffic on 295 South has now switched over to a new roadway that maintains separation of 295 from 95 for another 1/2 mile or so, after motorists have traveled under the DE 141 Overpasses.  https://www.sr141improvements.com/2021/09/10/new-traffic-pattern-on-i95-i295-new-i-295-travel-lanes/

The disastrous change:  Motorists on 295 South now don't have 2 thru lanes after the merge with 95 South.  Just after the merge point, the left lane from 295 ends, effectively narrowing 295 down to 1 lane just as it merges with 95!  I took notice to this Friday evening.  Traffic on 295 South was backed up from US 13 to I-95.  I figured just normal Friday evening volume.  Nope...it was due to this very ill-advised lane merge!  Traffic otherwise was fairly light from this point on South to Baltimore.  I believe the change greatly benefits southbound motorists coming from 95 & 495 from Wilmington, which will now have 4 continuous lanes thru the interchange area.  While traffic on I-95 can be heavy, it didn't seem to abnormally congest.   Instead, they will severely impact traffic coming from NJ, which gets horribly pinched as it approaches 95.

Before I posted this, I tried doing some research.  DelDOT appears to be keeping this aspect of the project very, very quiet, as the closest hint I could find easily regarding this lane loss is in a vague, color-coded project phase status page, which doesn't show the actual lanes on I-295: https://live-deldot-sr-141.pantheonsite.io/construction-information/

We talked about this a while back, I'd found evidence of this change in the construction plans but it definitely wasn't advertised as being a major part of the project anywhere. It didn't occur to me how much of a potential mess that altered lane drop was going to create, I'm curious to see how long it holds before they reconsider the layout.

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Alps

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1806 on: September 19, 2021, 12:46:54 AM »

The problem already is that 295 only has 2 lanes during the summer when it really needs to add 3. So whoa.

jeffandnicole

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1807 on: September 19, 2021, 06:59:05 AM »

There is a big and disastrous change for motorists on 295 South approaching 95 South.

The big change:  Traffic on 295 South has now switched over to a new roadway that maintains separation of 295 from 95 for another 1/2 mile or so, after motorists have traveled under the DE 141 Overpasses.  https://www.sr141improvements.com/2021/09/10/new-traffic-pattern-on-i95-i295-new-i-295-travel-lanes/

The disastrous change:  Motorists on 295 South now don't have 2 thru lanes after the merge with 95 South.  Just after the merge point, the left lane from 295 ends, effectively narrowing 295 down to 1 lane just as it merges with 95!  I took notice to this Friday evening.  Traffic on 295 South was backed up from US 13 to I-95.  I figured just normal Friday evening volume.  Nope...it was due to this very ill-advised lane merge!  Traffic otherwise was fairly light from this point on South to Baltimore.  I believe the change greatly benefits southbound motorists coming from 95 & 495 from Wilmington, which will now have 4 continuous lanes thru the interchange area.  While traffic on I-95 can be heavy, it didn't seem to abnormally congest.   Instead, they will severely impact traffic coming from NJ, which gets horribly pinched as it approaches 95.

Before I posted this, I tried doing some research.  DelDOT appears to be keeping this aspect of the project very, very quiet, as the closest hint I could find easily regarding this lane loss is in a vague, color-coded project phase status page, which doesn't show the actual lanes on I-295: https://live-deldot-sr-141.pantheonsite.io/construction-information/

We talked about this a while back, I'd found evidence of this change in the construction plans but it definitely wasn't advertised as being a major part of the project anywhere. It didn't occur to me how much of a potential mess that altered lane drop was going to create, I'm curious to see how long it holds before they reconsider the layout.

Thanks...I looked back a little but couldn't find it.  And I even commented about it...but I don't think I realized how close that lane would end to the gore point.  Maybe, when the final striping is done, there will be more room to merge.  But I dunno about this...real life seems to indicate that motorists on 295's right lane wouldn't merge over into the fast lane of 95 at the first moment, leading to conditions where, when 295's left lane ends, those motorists are forced to fight their way into that next lane, creating congestion.
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MASTERNC

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1808 on: September 19, 2021, 12:41:03 PM »

There is a big and disastrous change for motorists on 295 South approaching 95 South.

The big change:  Traffic on 295 South has now switched over to a new roadway that maintains separation of 295 from 95 for another 1/2 mile or so, after motorists have traveled under the DE 141 Overpasses.  https://www.sr141improvements.com/2021/09/10/new-traffic-pattern-on-i95-i295-new-i-295-travel-lanes/

The disastrous change:  Motorists on 295 South now don't have 2 thru lanes after the merge with 95 South.  Just after the merge point, the left lane from 295 ends, effectively narrowing 295 down to 1 lane just as it merges with 95!  I took notice to this Friday evening.  Traffic on 295 South was backed up from US 13 to I-95.  I figured just normal Friday evening volume.  Nope...it was due to this very ill-advised lane merge!  Traffic otherwise was fairly light from this point on South to Baltimore.  I believe the change greatly benefits southbound motorists coming from 95 & 495 from Wilmington, which will now have 4 continuous lanes thru the interchange area.  While traffic on I-95 can be heavy, it didn't seem to abnormally congest.   Instead, they will severely impact traffic coming from NJ, which gets horribly pinched as it approaches 95.

Before I posted this, I tried doing some research.  DelDOT appears to be keeping this aspect of the project very, very quiet, as the closest hint I could find easily regarding this lane loss is in a vague, color-coded project phase status page, which doesn't show the actual lanes on I-295: https://live-deldot-sr-141.pantheonsite.io/construction-information/

To me, an equally significant disaster is giving SB I-295 traffic a half-mile less to cross four lanes over to the right for SR 1. I don’t know how much traffic makes that move (I imagine most beach traffic, if anyone from NJ goes to the Delaware beaches over the Jersey Shore, would exit onto US 13) but you would definitely have traffic for tax-free shopping at Christiana Mall make that move.
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NJRoadfan

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1809 on: September 19, 2021, 08:44:17 PM »

That movement to DE-1 is common for more travelers now that the US-301 Middletown bypass is open. It provides an alternate route to DC and points south vs. taking I-95.
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MASTERNC

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1810 on: September 19, 2021, 09:16:11 PM »

That movement to DE-1 is common for more travelers now that the US-301 Middletown bypass is open. It provides an alternate route to DC and points south vs. taking I-95.

The 301 exit is south of the US 13 merge, so you could still take 13, if not for all the traffic lights
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jeffandnicole

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1811 on: September 19, 2021, 10:21:39 PM »

That movement to DE-1 is common for more travelers now that the US-301 Middletown bypass is open. It provides an alternate route to DC and points south vs. taking I-95.

The 301 exit is south of the US 13 merge, so you could still take 13, if not for all the traffic lights

Even though using 13 is 4 miles shorter, those lights generally create a longer trip overall.  I don't know what most people do, but going south, I almost always just take 295 to 95 South to 1 South.  Heading North, I'm more inclined to take US 13, mostly because 95 North approaching 295 is jammed the times I'm coming thru the area.
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froggie

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1812 on: September 20, 2021, 04:55:58 PM »

That movement to DE-1 is common for more travelers now that the US-301 Middletown bypass is open. It provides an alternate route to DC and points south vs. taking I-95.

The 301 exit is south of the US 13 merge, so you could still take 13, if not for all the traffic lights

Even though using 13 is 4 miles shorter, those lights generally create a longer trip overall.  I don't know what most people do, but going south, I almost always just take 295 to 95 South to 1 South.  Heading North, I'm more inclined to take US 13, mostly because 95 North approaching 295 is jammed the times I'm coming thru the area.

I typically took 13 regardless of the direction I was going.  Despite the signals along 13, I saw no benefit to taking the "long way around" via 95 and 1.  I'd also often get gas & food at one of the Wawa's along 13, so I had other rationale for taking it.
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mrsman

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1813 on: September 20, 2021, 06:53:28 PM »

There is a big and disastrous change for motorists on 295 South approaching 95 South.

The big change:  Traffic on 295 South has now switched over to a new roadway that maintains separation of 295 from 95 for another 1/2 mile or so, after motorists have traveled under the DE 141 Overpasses.  https://www.sr141improvements.com/2021/09/10/new-traffic-pattern-on-i95-i295-new-i-295-travel-lanes/

The disastrous change:  Motorists on 295 South now don't have 2 thru lanes after the merge with 95 South.  Just after the merge point, the left lane from 295 ends, effectively narrowing 295 down to 1 lane just as it merges with 95!  I took notice to this Friday evening.  Traffic on 295 South was backed up from US 13 to I-95.  I figured just normal Friday evening volume.  Nope...it was due to this very ill-advised lane merge!  Traffic otherwise was fairly light from this point on South to Baltimore.  I believe the change greatly benefits southbound motorists coming from 95 & 495 from Wilmington, which will now have 4 continuous lanes thru the interchange area.  While traffic on I-95 can be heavy, it didn't seem to abnormally congest.   Instead, they will severely impact traffic coming from NJ, which gets horribly pinched as it approaches 95.

Before I posted this, I tried doing some research.  DelDOT appears to be keeping this aspect of the project very, very quiet, as the closest hint I could find easily regarding this lane loss is in a vague, color-coded project phase status page, which doesn't show the actual lanes on I-295: https://live-deldot-sr-141.pantheonsite.io/construction-information/

To me, an equally significant disaster is giving SB I-295 traffic a half-mile less to cross four lanes over to the right for SR 1. I don’t know how much traffic makes that move (I imagine most beach traffic, if anyone from NJ goes to the Delaware beaches over the Jersey Shore, would exit onto US 13) but you would definitely have traffic for tax-free shopping at Christiana Mall make that move.

Is this meant to be a temporary change due to construction, or a permanent layout change?  If it is the second, I hope that heads will roll for something so ill conceived.
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Alps

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1814 on: September 20, 2021, 07:21:40 PM »

That movement to DE-1 is common for more travelers now that the US-301 Middletown bypass is open. It provides an alternate route to DC and points south vs. taking I-95.

The 301 exit is south of the US 13 merge, so you could still take 13, if not for all the traffic lights

Even though using 13 is 4 miles shorter, those lights generally create a longer trip overall.  I don't know what most people do, but going south, I almost always just take 295 to 95 South to 1 South.  Heading North, I'm more inclined to take US 13, mostly because 95 North approaching 295 is jammed the times I'm coming thru the area.
295 is so bad that enough people exit to 13 that they generally balance each other and you're better off using 9.

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1815 on: September 21, 2021, 12:59:07 AM »

^ IIRC, Delaware also signs the main route to/from Dover and the NJTP as following US-13 as opposed to DE-1 and I-95/I-295.

And as you mention, if all traffic was truly following the freeway route, how much worse would traffic be on there?

US-13 is at grade, but it’s still a higher quality design and isn’t the worst. I’ve personally utilized both routes before, though usually just follow US-13.

In reality, US-13 should just be upgraded to a full freeway design between DE-1 and I-295, but that’s likely to never happen. It almost serves as a “gap” in the freeway system for that heavy traffic movement between DE-1 and the NJTP.
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jeffandnicole

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1816 on: September 21, 2021, 11:14:10 AM »

^ IIRC, Delaware also signs the main route to/from Dover and the NJTP as following US-13 as opposed to DE-1 and I-95/I-295.

Delaware doesn't really sign any route as the main route.  The DRBA has signage (advertising) to get to the CBBT and the Cape May Lewis Ferry, which instructs motorists to us Exit 4A to DE 1 (They apparently forget to omit that Exit 4A is on I-95 South!) https://goo.gl/maps/YfxfbukWcsDXmYaR6

The BGS for the 13/40 exit coming up is signed for Dover and Wilmington, as they are appropriate control cities for those routes. 

But for motorists who are eventually getting to DE 1 and points south (across the C&D canal), no transportation department encourages any specific route.

And as you mention, if all traffic was truly following the freeway route, how much worse would traffic be on there?

US-13 is at grade, but it’s still a higher quality design and isn’t the worst. I’ve personally utilized both routes before, though usually just follow US-13.

In reality, US-13 should just be upgraded to a full freeway design between DE-1 and I-295, but that’s likely to never happen. It almost serves as a “gap” in the freeway system for that heavy traffic movement between DE-1 and the NJTP.

Much of this plays into the redundancy of the overall roadway system.  The removal of any one route for any reason would cause traffic to be much heavier on alternate routes.  Some people will avoid I-95 no matter what.  Some people will avoid US 13 no matter what.  Traffic, relatively speaking, evens itself out due to these factors.

As far as upgrading US 13 to full freeway, not sure if it was you or someone else that mentioned it before, but it would be nearly impossible on its current routing (for the reasons why someone like froggie uses it), and the 'gap' is resolved by simply using I-95.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2021, 11:46:18 AM by jeffandnicole »
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plain

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1817 on: September 21, 2021, 06:18:38 PM »

Yeah I would leave things exactly the way they are (of course improving I-295 and I-95 even more in the area would certainly be welcomed). I use either the all freeway route or the US 13 route, depends on the time of day and/or wether or not I want to make a stop. It's actually pretty nice to have that option there.
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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1818 on: September 21, 2021, 08:35:48 PM »

Delaware doesn't really sign any route as the main route.  The DRBA has signage (advertising) to get to the CBBT and the Cape May Lewis Ferry, which instructs motorists to us Exit 4A to DE 1 (They apparently forget to omit that Exit 4A is on I-95 South!) https://goo.gl/maps/YfxfbukWcsDXmYaR6
Northbound, at the US-13 / DE-1 split, US-13 is signed as “To I-295” and “NJ-NY”.

https://goo.gl/maps/w89HUZ3jPB7GyDzv7

Quote
The BGS for the 13/40 exit coming up is signed for Dover and Wilmington, as they are appropriate control cities for those routes.

But for motorists who are eventually getting to DE 1 and points south (across the C&D canal), no transportation department encourages any specific route.
Which is where Dover is… much further south.
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jeffandnicole

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1819 on: September 21, 2021, 09:57:37 PM »

Delaware doesn't really sign any route as the main route.  The DRBA has signage (advertising) to get to the CBBT and the Cape May Lewis Ferry, which instructs motorists to us Exit 4A to DE 1 (They apparently forget to omit that Exit 4A is on I-95 South!) https://goo.gl/maps/YfxfbukWcsDXmYaR6
Northbound, at the US-13 / DE-1 split, US-13 is signed as “To I-295” and “NJ-NY”.

https://goo.gl/maps/w89HUZ3jPB7GyDzv7

Quote
The BGS for the 13/40 exit coming up is signed for Dover and Wilmington, as they are appropriate control cities for those routes.

But for motorists who are eventually getting to DE 1 and points south (across the C&D canal), no transportation department encourages any specific route.
Which is where Dover is… much further south.

We know you know how control cities work, and that they aren't necessarily signing the 'main' route.

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=13255.msg2630202#msg2630202

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Alps

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1820 on: September 21, 2021, 11:07:24 PM »

Yeah I would leave things exactly the way they are (of course improving I-295 and I-95 even more in the area would certainly be welcomed). I use either the all freeway route or the US 13 route, depends on the time of day and/or wether or not I want to make a stop. It's actually pretty nice to have that option there.
I would use all that swampland and build a freeway connecting DE 1 directly into I-295, bypassing the stretch of I-95.

plain

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1821 on: September 22, 2021, 12:01:11 AM »

Yeah I would leave things exactly the way they are (of course improving I-295 and I-95 even more in the area would certainly be welcomed). I use either the all freeway route or the US 13 route, depends on the time of day and/or wether or not I want to make a stop. It's actually pretty nice to have that option there.
I would use all that swampland and build a freeway connecting DE 1 directly into I-295, bypassing the stretch of I-95.

I hope you're not serious.
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Alps

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1822 on: September 22, 2021, 12:06:22 AM »

Yeah I would leave things exactly the way they are (of course improving I-295 and I-95 even more in the area would certainly be welcomed). I use either the all freeway route or the US 13 route, depends on the time of day and/or wether or not I want to make a stop. It's actually pretty nice to have that option there.
I would use all that swampland and build a freeway connecting DE 1 directly into I-295, bypassing the stretch of I-95.

I hope you're not serious.
Why not? An elevated freeway with minimal disturbance, a ton of unused land sitting there.

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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1823 on: September 22, 2021, 12:37:03 AM »

Drainage, wetlands, and whatever natural habitat is left just east of the mall? There would have to be some real fancy flyovers here. Almost Glen Canyon like.
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Re: Delaware
« Reply #1824 on: September 22, 2021, 03:13:28 PM »

Yeah I would leave things exactly the way they are (of course improving I-295 and I-95 even more in the area would certainly be welcomed). I use either the all freeway route or the US 13 route, depends on the time of day and/or wether or not I want to make a stop. It's actually pretty nice to have that option there.
I would use all that swampland and build a freeway connecting DE 1 directly into I-295, bypassing the stretch of I-95.

I hope you're not serious.
Why not? An elevated freeway with minimal disturbance, a ton of unused land sitting there.

I have always thought that a US 13 freeway from DE 1 to I-495 was the best option here.

In other news: TRAFFIC ALERT - New Castle County - Delaware Memorial Bridge UHPC Project Requires Continuous Lane Closures
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