Why did the highway shield standards move away from cutout designs?

[Quillz]

Is it because it's simply cheaper and easier to manufacture a sign that is basically square in shape, or was it because AASHTO (or whoever publishes the MUTCD) only wanted Interstate shields to be cutout?

It's kind of a shame, really... I think cutout shields look much better, and luckily California still uses them.

[agentsteel53]

Is it because it's simply cheaper and easier to manufacture a sign that is basically square in shape, or was it because AASHTO (or whoever publishes the MUTCD) only wanted Interstate shields to be cutout?

It's kind of a shame, really... I think cutout shields look much better, and luckily California still uses them.

cheaper, and more versatile.  a 24" square with rounded corners can be a shield once and a DO NOT ENTER sign the next time around.  A cutout shield is just a cutout shield.

check out this US-56 24" sign that has two sets of mounting holes - it can be made a square or a diamond as needed.



cutouts are cool as hell, though!

[Quillz]

I know they are. I hate driving on the 101 from CA to OR and seeing the ugly shield against a black background. It's just so... generic looking.

[KEK Inc.]

Yeah, I love cut-outs.  California is the only state that still uses 100% cut-outs from my knowledge. 

There are few out there in other states.


I'm not sure if this one still exists, but I love this.  The font is more modern, but the style is something you'd see from the '40s. 

[US71]

Is it because it's simply cheaper and easier to manufacture a sign that is basically square in shape, or was it because AASHTO (or whoever publishes the MUTCD) only wanted Interstate shields to be cutout?

My guess is the squares are easier to read at faster speeds.

[agentsteel53]

the simpler non-state-named cutouts are just as easy to read as the black squares.

the Oregon US 97 and eagle 39 are gone as of April, 2007.  that was the last known Oregon US cutout.  they were 1960s or early 70s signs - the slightly larger 18" version, not the older 16".

[Quillz]

Is California the only state left using cutout state route markers? I've looked at the shield gallery here and it seems all the other states have moved to the generic and boring "shape on black square" look.

[agentsteel53]

Is California the only state left using cutout state route markers? I've looked at the shield gallery here and it seems all the other states have moved to the generic and boring "shape on black square" look.

correct.  not just the generic black square, but a lot of states have moved to the bloated 1970 spec black square.



compare the 70 and the 80.  the 80 is the classic shield shape; I see nothing objectionable about it being used on the black square, but the more modern 70 is horrid.

[Quillz]

Yeah, the 1970 spec doesn't look very good.

It's a shame... There was a time when almost every state had its own unique state route shield in a cutout design... Now it's all gone. Standards are nice, but so is unique identity.

[Scott5114]

I think Oklahoma might be unique in that each shield design used has been an improvement. (Yes, even the white square. Better than having your shield confused for a warning sign!)

[Quillz]

California's got better over the years, too, I think. They went from an all-white shield to the now familiar green one. Although I do wish the '64 revision brought back the bear.

[agentsteel53]

I think Oklahoma might be unique in that each shield design used has been an improvement. (Yes, even the white square. Better than having your shield confused for a warning sign!)

nope, that "state road" variety is boring as hell.  "The OK State Highway" adds a lot of character.  but yes, the cleaver beats the circle, which beats the square.  

I wonder if the large square STATE ROAD design went with the white squares at junctions, while the smaller OK State Highway diamonds kept being used with the 16" OKLAHOMA/US cutout reassurance markers.

[Scott5114]

According to an OTA standard I have, it said "OKLAHOMA/#/STATE", not "STATE ROAD".

[US71]

Has anyone ever contacted the FHWA to find out?

[Scott5114]

Has anyone ever contacted the FHWA to find out?

I'm sure it would simply elicit one of the obvious answers posted here.

Another part of it might have to do with the way square markers were introduced. Prior to 1948, all of the cutout markers were 16x16. When the first 24x24 U.S. shield was introduced in the 1948 MUTCD, it was on a white square. It is possible that this is so because of possible problems at the time with fabricating larger markers, or simply a desire not to force the states to buy new collar dies* or upgrade their equipment to handle larger cutouts. From there, it's easy to see the black being added in 1961 for visibility reasons.

*I am not actually clear on what a collar die is, exactly, but have gleaned from Jake it is very expensive and a necessary part of the start-up set when manufacturing a new type of sign.

[J N Winkler]

A collar die holds the metal blank in place while it is stamped by the hammer and anvil dies.

The 24" x 24" marker was introduced specifically for conspicuity, so I suspect it was designed for use with Scotchlite retroreflective sheeting.  The square shape allowed fabrication from blank sheet steel without waste and coverage of the entire panel with Scotchlite sheeting maximized target value at night.  From that point on the use of a full black silkscreened background would have resulted in a cleaner, less busy design and better recognition of the route type at night.

Since the 1948 MUTCD, and other MUTCD editions up to at least the 1961 edition, allowed reversal of black and white on guide signs, an interesting question is how many states decided to go with the square 24" x 24" design, but in white against a black background, with button reflectors for the white foreground elements.  I know Caltrans tried something like this in the late 1950's.

[agentsteel53]

According to an OTA standard I have, it said "OKLAHOMA/#/STATE", not "STATE ROAD".

you were closer.  it is OKLA/#/STATE.  the fact that none of us can remember it should indicate something about its memorability.

[TheStranger]

you were closer.  it is OKLA/#/STATE.  the fact that none of us can remember it should indicate something about its memorability.

Not just its memorability, but its readability!

[agentsteel53]

Another part of it might have to do with the way square markers were introduced. Prior to 1948, all of the cutout markers were 16x16.

not quite.  there have always been oversize markers, but on an ad hoc basis.  Here is a 39x37 sign from California with a 1938 date.



I believe Michigan was the first state to really formally start using oversize (24") markers at intersections, sometime around 1940.  they did make a 24" MICHIGAN/US collar die.  Oregon had 36" shields on their expressways as early as 1942.  They were wood and had glass cateyes.

When the first 24x24 U.S. shield was introduced in the 1948 MUTCD, it was on a white square. It is possible that this is so because of possible problems at the time with fabricating larger markers, or simply a desire not to force the states to buy new collar dies* or upgrade their equipment to handle larger cutouts. From there, it's easy to see the black being added in 1961 for visibility reasons.

the collar die expense does explain why states no longer used embossed shields - but the flat cutout was still in the 1961 MUTCD.  It was only the 1970 that stated that all shields must be at least 24" in size... and standardized on one design, likely just for simplicity's sake.  Why have two styles of shield to worry about?

[agentsteel53]

A collar die holds the metal blank in place while it is stamped by the hammer and anvil dies.

close.  there are only two dies - the hammer and anvil.  When I say "collar die" I actually refer to a die pair - it is particular notches set in the anvil die that hold the blank in place, while the hammer comes down.  Into blank spaces on the hammer and anvil one may place individual characters and symbols to form a complete legend.

for example, the US route marker collar die features just the outline and crossbar.  Then there are two blank areas - a small one for a state name, and a large one for US and a number. 

The 24" x 24" marker was introduced specifically for conspicuity, so I suspect it was designed for use with Scotchlite retroreflective sheeting.

that is correct.  though the first generation of Scotchlite, developed in 1938, was specifically made to be able to be applied to embossed surfaces.  the heat and vacuum adhesive treatment allowed the material to expand where needed to cover the legend.  In fact, old signs could be retrofitted with it.

Scotchlite didn't become popular in all applications until the mid-50s or so: a lot of states used glass-bead paint instead, and some went with distinct cateye or Stimsonite reflectors.

Since the 1948 MUTCD, and other MUTCD editions up to at least the 1961 edition, allowed reversal of black and white on guide signs, an interesting question is how many states decided to go with the square 24" x 24" design, but in white against a black background, with button reflectors for the white foreground elements.  I know Caltrans tried something like this in the late 1950's.

hmm, I think here you are conflating individual 24x24 shields, with shields that appear on larger guide signs.  I have never seen a black and white 24" 1948-spec outline shield, but I do have that green and white US-56 Kansas, and Rhode Island used red and white, and blue and white, all of the same basic pattern.  Florida is the one who introduced the colored background solid shield with a white number, sometime before 1956.  I actually have a photo from 1952 with what appears to be a light-colored US-90 and a darker US-27!  By 1956 the color scheme was finalized.

as for shields on guide signs - bear in mind that the 1927 signing manual did make note of this style of guide sign:



Michigan did, at least once, invert the colors.  And where the hell is that picture??  California by 1931 was using large black guide signs, but while their text was white legend, the shields themselves remained white background with black legend.



only in 1955 did California start using white outline shields on a black background.  The 1957 AASHO interstate manual which first specified green guide signs to be used on the interstates also adopted white outline shields, simply as an extension of the 1948 specification in use at the time - a contrasting foreground color to go on a default background, which happened to be changing from white to green.  That, I think, was the first real mention of a dark-colored background, though I will have to look in the 1948 MUTCD again as I have seen quite a few states use outline shields on black guide signs as early as 1951.



hastily colorized by Michael Summa, that is a 1951 photo.

but as for an independent mount shield that is black background, white shield outline, and white number?  Nope, never seen that. 

[J N Winkler]

but as for an independent mount shield that is black background, white shield outline, and white number?  Nope, never seen that.

But in the 1950's Caltrans did have white-on-black button-reflectorized rectangular tab signs which had white borders on only three sides.  I think these were intended to be affixed to other sign panels which had just a route marker (in outline, probably), or possibly a route marker superimposed over an arrow.  Unlike modern tab signs, which are all-uppercase, these were mixed-case.

[agentsteel53]

But in the 1950's Caltrans did have white-on-black button-reflectorized rectangular tab signs which had white borders on only three sides.  I think these were intended to be affixed to other sign panels which had just a route marker (in outline, probably), or possibly a route marker superimposed over an arrow.  Unlike modern tab signs, which are all-uppercase, these were mixed-case.

I do wonder about those.  Especially the ones with a cardinal direction.  I don't recall seeing in that giant heap of specifications any sign that was just a shield on a black background.  at the very least, it had an arrow through it each time.

and yes, CA liked its mixed-case banners from around 1950 to 1958.  the "great modernization" of mid'58 that gave us 3:4 letter heights, rounded-corner white rectangle borders on guide signs, the new shield shapes, etc ... also gave us all-uppercase banners.

[Scott5114]

According to an OTA standard I have, it said "OKLAHOMA/#/STATE", not "STATE ROAD".

you were closer.  it is OKLA/#/STATE.  the fact that none of us can remember it should indicate something about its memorability.

ftp://ftp.pikepass.com/Original%20Construction%20Drawings/HE%20Bailey/cont271/SH009.tif

Have some specs. These say "OKLAHOMA" is spelled out.

(Incidentally that has to be the most infuriating way to store construction drawings. Just put all of them in folders corresponding to the contract number! That way people looking for something specific like signs will certainly know they need to click the "271" folder and not just guess randomly at where it is. I swear, they have like 25 contracts just for guardrails in here...)

[US71]

you were closer.  it is OKLA/#/STATE.  the fact that none of us can remember it should indicate something about its memorability.

Either that or we're not old enough to remember

[agentsteel53]

Have some specs. These say "OKLAHOMA" is spelled out.

can you please email me that?  my browser is having a hell of a time with the FTP protocol.