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Wine

Started by kphoger, March 09, 2021, 06:02:13 PM

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jmd41280

#50
Quote from: kphoger on March 09, 2021, 06:02:13 PM
Forgive me if this topic already exists, but I don't recall that it does.

Let's talk about wine.  General preferences?  Overrated labels?  Crowd pleasers?  Does terroir matter?  Does minerality even exist?

I go through phases where I prefer sweet wines as well as ones for dry wines. Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.
"Increase the Flash Gordon noise and put more science stuff around!"


kphoger

Quote from: jeffandnicole on March 26, 2021, 07:30:38 PM
Most wines I like are under $10; local wines are $15 or less.

Anything more than that...eh.

Depends on the type of wine.  Some varieties are great at the $9 price point, while others are crappy at that price point.  It's really easy to find a good Pinot Grigio for under $12 bucks, though.

I always tell people that I can tell the difference between an $7 bottle of wine and a $15 bottle of wine, and the difference is often worth it.  I can also usually tell the difference between a $15 bottle of wine and a $35 bottle of wine, but that the difference is so very slight, that it's usually not worth the extra money.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

kphoger

Quote from: jmd41280 on March 26, 2021, 07:38:36 PM
Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.

If you can find it where you are, La Vieille Ferme makes a great rosé.  It's the same label as the "chicken wine" I showed earlier.  I usually don't care for rosé all that much, but theirs is good.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

1995hoo

Thanks for the suggestion on the "chicken wine." We like to make piccata, so that might be worth a try if one of the usual stores has it.

Regarding sweet red wine, Fox Meadow's Freezeland Red is a sweet red. Not as sweet as a Port.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

kphoger

Quote from: 1995hoo on March 26, 2021, 08:37:31 PM
Thanks for the suggestion on the "chicken wine." We like to make piccata, so that might be worth a try if one of the usual stores has it.

Regarding sweet red wine, Fox Meadow's Freezeland Red is a sweet red. Not as sweet as a Port.

I usually go with a less-fruity Pinot Gris for making Piccata.  But the chicken wine was already in the fridge.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

OCGuy81

This might be met with some disagreement, but....

My wife bought a box of wine. Not Franzia (though I drank my share. In college we used to have Tour de Frnazia parties) but a Black Box Cabernet that is pretty damn good. I grilled some steaks tonight and it went nicely with em

Takumi

Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 26, 2021, 09:54:28 PM
This might be met with some disagreement, but....

My wife bought a box of wine. Not Franzia (though I drank my share. In college we used to have Tour de Frnazia parties) but a Black Box Cabernet that is pretty damn good. I grilled some steaks tonight and it went nicely with em

No scorn from me. I've got a Wine Cube red blend box from Target in my fridge right now. It's all right. It gets me feeling good with fewer calories than beer, and the box wasn't much more expensive than a 4-pack of local IPAs for 3 liters worth of wine.
Quote from: Rothman on July 15, 2021, 07:52:59 AM
Olive Garden must be stopped.  I must stop them.

Don't @ me. Seriously.

1995hoo

Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 08:40:36 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 26, 2021, 08:37:31 PM
Thanks for the suggestion on the "chicken wine." We like to make piccata, so that might be worth a try if one of the usual stores has it.

Regarding sweet red wine, Fox Meadow's Freezeland Red is a sweet red. Not as sweet as a Port.

I usually go with a less-fruity Pinot Gris for making Piccata.  But the chicken wine was already in the fridge.

We usually use Pinot Grigio, mostly just because we almost always have various ones on hand.




Regarding boxes of wine, it's not a boxed wine. It's cardbordeaux.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

jmd41280

Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 08:24:21 PM
Quote from: jmd41280 on March 26, 2021, 07:38:36 PM
Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.

If you can find it where you are, La Vieille Ferme makes a great rosé.  It's the same label as the "chicken wine" I showed earlier.  I usually don't care for rosé all that much, but theirs is good.

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll have to keep an eye out for it.
"Increase the Flash Gordon noise and put more science stuff around!"

1995hoo

I got a bottle of the "chicken wine" at Wegmans today for $7.99. I'll let you know how it is when we try it. We had hanger steak tonight, so we had Cabernet Sauvignon.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

interstatefan990

Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws

Nope. In fact, only 29 states have a parental exemption, so it's more like a little over half.




I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.

Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.
Multi-lane roundabouts are an abomination to mankind.

JayhawkCO

Quote
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.

Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.

Just because cheaper wines aren't bad doesn't mean more expensive wines aren't better.  You can drive a Geo Metro and it'll get you there, but a BMW is a nicer ride.  If you have the budget for the BMW, it wouldn't be terrible if you had to drive the Metro every once in a while, but it'd be a lot nicer to drive the BMW all the time.  I drink box wine from time to time, but if I go out to get a bottle of wine for non special events, it's normally in the $20-25 range.

As far as holding the glass, by the stem directly underneath the bowl.  That way you don't warm up the wine.

Chris

kphoger

Quote from: jayhawkco on March 28, 2021, 10:53:35 AM

Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.

Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.

Just because cheaper wines aren't bad doesn't mean more expensive wines aren't better.  You can drive a Geo Metro and it'll get you there, but a BMW is a nicer ride.  If you have the budget for the BMW, it wouldn't be terrible if you had to drive the Metro every once in a while, but it'd be a lot nicer to drive the BMW all the time.  I drink box wine from time to time, but if I go out to get a bottle of wine for non special events, it's normally in the $20-25 range.

As far as holding the glass, by the stem directly underneath the bowl.  That way you don't warm up the wine.

But–let's be honest–there's no need to buy a Lamborghini Aventador, even if you can afford one.  I agree that the $20-25 range is good one, but some varietals of similar quality can be found for half that price.

I hold the stem.  I don't try and grip the bottom in any way, or else I'm going to end up spilling it all over the table at some point.

Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM

Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws

Nope. In fact, only 29 states have a parental exemption, so it's more like a little over half.

So...  most?   :-D

Thanks for actually looking up the numbers.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

kphoger

Quote from: 1995hoo on March 27, 2021, 10:08:01 PM
I got a bottle of the "chicken wine" at Wegmans today for $7.99. I'll let you know how it is when we try it. We had hanger steak tonight, so we had Cabernet Sauvignon.

I came on here to warn you that it might be too fruity for your personal taste.  But, if you usually go with Pinot Grigio, then I think you'll be pleased.

Out of curiosity, what are you favorite non-local Pinot Grigio bottles?
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

JayhawkCO

Quote from: kphoger on March 30, 2021, 10:11:44 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 28, 2021, 10:53:35 AM

Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.

Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.

Just because cheaper wines aren't bad doesn't mean more expensive wines aren't better.  You can drive a Geo Metro and it'll get you there, but a BMW is a nicer ride.  If you have the budget for the BMW, it wouldn't be terrible if you had to drive the Metro every once in a while, but it'd be a lot nicer to drive the BMW all the time.  I drink box wine from time to time, but if I go out to get a bottle of wine for non special events, it's normally in the $20-25 range.

As far as holding the glass, by the stem directly underneath the bowl.  That way you don't warm up the wine.

But–let's be honest–there's no need to buy a Lamborghini Aventador, even if you can afford one.  I agree that the $20-25 range is good one, but some varietals of similar quality can be found for half that price.

Agreed, but there are times and places for a $70-$80 bottle (Premier Cru Burgundy, Amarone, Cote-Rotie, aged Barolo, etc.).  I agree re: $2,000 bottles of Chateau Petrus and stuff like that.  I'd love to taste it, but I'm never buying a bottle of Domaine Romanee-Conti (the most expensive wine in the world on release).  I've held and sold one, but never gotten a chance to sample.  I think the most expensive bottle I've ever tasted was Penfolds Grange which new releases go for about $500 wholesale.

Chris

1995hoo

Thanks for the "chicken wine" suggestion. We had a bottle tonight with a chicken pasta dish my wife put together and it was quite pleasant–she said to buy it again, especially given the price.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

interstatefan990

Quote from: kphoger on March 30, 2021, 10:11:44 AM
Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws

Nope. In fact, only 29 states have a parental exemption, so it's more like a little over half.

So...  most?   :-D

Thanks for actually looking up the numbers.

"Most"  would be closer to 35 or 40 states in my book. But you're welcome.  :cool:




For me, the way I hold mine depends on the formality of the event (fancy schmancy, I know). Most formal = by the tippy top of the stem. Least formal = by the bowl. Least, least, least formal = grabbing the entire stem like it's a handle.
Multi-lane roundabouts are an abomination to mankind.

1995hoo

Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 08:24:21 PM
Quote from: jmd41280 on March 26, 2021, 07:38:36 PM
Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.

If you can find it where you are, La Vieille Ferme makes a great rosé.  It's the same label as the "chicken wine" I showed earlier.  I usually don't care for rosé all that much, but theirs is good.

We had the La Vieille Ferme rosé this past Sunday night with the following. It was a very good combination. (The quote tag isn't a link because this is a post from another forum).

Quote from: 1995hoo
I made this last night with the modifications noted below it brackets. Very good. It had been a few years since I'd last made this and I think I should make it more often. This came from Bon Appetit magazine and I believe it is a Steven Raichlen recipe. I didn't bother cutting up the chicken and making kebabs; I just cooked the whole boneless chicken breasts as they were.

1½ tablespoons Aleppo pepper or 2 teaspoons dried crushed red pepper plus 2 tablespoons Hungarian sweet paprika, plus additional Aleppo pepper or paprika for sprinkling [I used the paprika option]
1 cup plain whole-milk Greek-style yogurt  (8 ounces) [I used two four-ounce containers of lemon-flavored Siggi's skyr]
3 tablespoons extra-virgin olive oil
2 tablespoons red wine vinegar
2 tablespoons tomato paste [I skipped this because we didn't have any]
2 teaspoons coarse kosher salt
1 teaspoon freshly ground black pepper
6 garlic cloves, peeled, flattened
2 unpeeled lemons; 1 thinly sliced into rounds, 1 cut into wedges for serving [I skipped this in favor of using the lemon-flavored skyr]
2¼ pounds skinless boneless chicken (thighs and/or breast halves), cut into 1¼-inch cubes [we used breasts and I didn't bother cutting them up]
Flat metal skewers [I skipped skewers]

If using Aleppo pepper, place in large bowl and mix in 1 tablespoon warm water. Let stand until thick paste forms, about 5 minutes. If using dried crushed red pepper and paprika combination, place in large bowl and stir in 2 tablespoons warm water and let stand until paste forms, about 5 minutes.

Add yogurt, olive oil, red wine vinegar, tomato paste, 2 teaspoons coarse salt, and 1 teaspoon black pepper to spice mixture in bowl; whisk to blend. Stir in garlic and lemon slices, then chicken. Cover and chill at least 1 hour. (Can be made 1 day ahead. Keep chilled.)

Prepare grill (medium-high heat). Thread chicken pieces on metal skewers, dividing evenly. Discard marinade in bowl. Sprinkle each skewer with salt, pepper, and additional Aleppo pepper or paprika. Brush grill rack with oil. Grill chicken until golden brown and cooked through, turning skewers occasionally, 10 to 12 minutes total. Transfer skewers to platter. Surround with lemon wedges and serve.

"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

kphoger

My wife and I went out to Olive Garden Saturday evening for our 15th anniversary.

(Aside:  You don't like Olive Garden?  That isn't authentic Italian food! you say?  Get over it.  I had pasta with marinara sauce and meatballs.  How is that not authentic Italian food?  At any rate, even if you don't like Olive Garden, it's worth going there the same weekend your city's schools have prom.  It's great people watching.  Girls who probably shouldn't have tried to squeeze into that dress, boys who have obviously never worn a suit before, colors that do not exist in nature.)

When the waiter brought our salads out, I said to him, I forgot to ask earlier, but could you bring me a glass of Chianti?
He got this confused look on his face.  Uhhh, probably, I guess so... he started.
It's on the menu, I said.
In that case, then I'm sure I can.
Not a minute later he came to the table, menu in hand, and asked me to point it out to him–which I did.

At that point, I became telepathic and could hear what the waiter was thinking:  Oh, the CHAI-ant-ee!   :-D

(This was the same waiter I had told earlier to bring me a mineral water.  He apparently consulted with someone else, and that someone else then came to the table to inform me they don't sell mineral water, and that the closest thing they have is San Pellegrino.  That's what I meant, I said.  So then she went back and brought me a bottle that says 'MINERAL WATER' right there on the label.   :banghead: )

OK, now, the restaurant was using a limited menu–presumably the one they've been using since restaurants reopened nearly a year ago.  On that limited menu, there are like five red wines.  FIVE.  And one of them is called 'Red Blend'.  I ordered what is arguably the most famous varietal from Italy.  And he had no clue.

Maybe he was on loan from Burger King...
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

OCGuy81

Quote from: kphoger on April 26, 2021, 12:55:40 PM
My wife and I went out to Olive Garden Saturday evening for our 15th anniversary.

(Aside:  You don't like Olive Garden?  That isn't authentic Italian food! you say?  Get over it.  I had pasta with marinara sauce and meatballs.  How is that not authentic Italian food?  At any rate, even if you don't like Olive Garden, it's worth going there the same weekend your city's schools have prom.  It's great people watching.  Girls who probably shouldn't have tried to squeeze into that dress, boys who have obviously never worn a suit before, colors that do not exist in nature.)

When the waiter brought our salads out, I said to him, I forgot to ask earlier, but could you bring me a glass of Chianti?
He got this confused look on his face.  Uhhh, probably, I guess so... he started.
It's on the menu, I said.
In that case, then I'm sure I can.
Not a minute later he came to the table, menu in hand, and asked me to point it out to him–which I did.

At that point, I became telepathic and could hear what the waiter was thinking:  Oh, the CHAI-ant-ee!   :-D

(This was the same waiter I had told earlier to bring me a mineral water.  He apparently consulted with someone else, and that someone else then came to the table to inform me they don't sell mineral water, and that the closest thing they have is San Pellegrino.  That's what I meant, I said.  So then she went back and brought me a bottle that says 'MINERAL WATER' right there on the label.   :banghead: )

OK, now, the restaurant was using a limited menu–presumably the one they've been using since restaurants reopened nearly a year ago.  On that limited menu, there are like five red wines.  FIVE.  And one of them is called 'Red Blend'.  I ordered what is arguably the most famous varietal from Italy.  And he had no clue.

Maybe he was on loan from Burger King...

Happy anniversary to you and the Mrs!  Sorry to hear it wasn't that great of an experience, but you got a laugh out of me on a Monday morning.

Been there before.....I usually am a generous tipper but "service" like that greatly draws down my generosity.

kphoger

I still tipped pretty well, because he was very friendly and attentive.  That made up for the obvious newbie gaffes.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Scott5114

Quote from: kphoger on April 26, 2021, 12:55:40 PM
(Aside:  You don't like Olive Garden?  That isn't authentic Italian food! you say?  Get over it.  I had pasta with marinara sauce and meatballs.  How is that not authentic Italian food?  At any rate, even if you don't like Olive Garden, it's worth going there the same weekend your city's schools have prom.  It's great people watching.  Girls who probably shouldn't have tried to squeeze into that dress, boys who have obviously never worn a suit before, colors that do not exist in nature.)

I like Olive Garden all right but Norman has an independent Italian restaurant that is a little bit better for about the same price, so I usually vote for that whenever we're making dinner arrangements and Italian is a possibility. We have a friend who joins us sometimes and I tend to get outvoted whenever she's around, though.

As for the rest of your experience, it sounds like your waiter may have been frazzled by all of hubbub of the prom date couples, such that he just wasn't in the frame of mind to handle the more refined taste of the old folks celebrating their anniversary! :P
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

kphoger

I thought I had posted this, but apparently not...

Because my wife only likes to have a small amount of wine with any meal, and because she doesn't like any red wine at all, I've long been hesitant to open a bottle.  If it's for cooking with, then it usually only calls for a cup or so, and then there's enough left in the bottle after dinner that it starts to go "off" before I can finish it.  (I'm pretty sensitive to the "off" flavors that wine gets when left over, even with a vacuum pump.)  So my general rule has been to only open a bottle if I can reasonably expect to finish it that day or the next.  Otherwise, I've felt it was a waste of perfectly good wine.

Recently, however, I tried something out.  After dinner, I poured whatever was left in the bottle into an ice cube tray.  Because of the alcohol content, they came out a little slushy, but still solid enough to put in a gallon-size Ziploc bag in the deep-freeze.  It's no good for drinking after that, of course, but it's perfectly suitable for cooking with.  I find myself reaching for that Ziploc bag all the time now when cooking, to plop a couple of "wine cubes" into the pan.  Great for deglazing, or for adding flavor to grains as they boil.  I'd already been regularly making my own vegetable stock and storing it in the deep-freeze, but this is great to have on hand too.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

JayhawkCO

Quote from: kphoger on October 24, 2023, 02:13:29 PM
I thought I had posted this, but apparently not...

Because my wife only likes to have a small amount of wine with any meal, and because she doesn't like any red wine at all, I've long been hesitant to open a bottle.  If it's for cooking with, then it usually only calls for a cup or so, and then there's enough left in the bottle after dinner that it starts to go "off" before I can finish it.  (I'm pretty sensitive to the "off" flavors that wine gets when left over, even with a vacuum pump.)  So my general rule has been to only open a bottle if I can reasonably expect to finish it that day or the next.  Otherwise, I've felt it was a waste of perfectly good wine.

Recently, however, I tried something out.  After dinner, I poured whatever was left in the bottle into an ice cube tray.  Because of the alcohol content, they came out a little slushy, but still solid enough to put in a gallon-size Ziploc bag in the deep-freeze.  It's no good for drinking after that, of course, but it's perfectly suitable for cooking with.  I find myself reaching for that Ziploc bag all the time now when cooking, to plop a couple of "wine cubes" into the pan.  Great for deglazing, or for adding flavor to grains as they boil.  I'd already been regularly making my own vegetable stock and storing it in the deep-freeze, but this is great to have on hand too.

Just seems to me that you just have to drink 3.5 glasses of wine when you open a bottle.

Despite the fact that I'm a certified sommelier, I still almost always keep a box of white wine in the fridge for cooking/drinking a random glass.

kphoger

Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 25, 2023, 11:04:41 AM
Just seems to me that you just have to drink 3.5 glasses of wine when you open a bottle.

I know your tongue was halfway in your cheek as you typed that, but...  Three glasses is pushing it for me, and requires me to spread them out over a couple of hours.  Even then, I can't have anywhere to go that evening.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.



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