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[Beltway]

"Strengthening a shoulder" would be performed by removing the shoulder pavement and subbase and excavating to the depth needed to place full depth subbase and pavement to the same design as a traffic lane.

Basically, from what 1995hoo described, the right lane heading southbound (the added 3rd lane) is located where the full 10 right shoulder previously was when it was only two lanes with full shoulders on both sides. When they restriped the lanes by narrowing the lanes to 11 foot and eliminating the full shoulder (to the right when heading southbound) in order to squeeze the 3 lanes and a full shoulder on one side into the ~45 ft of roadway, if that new lane is not as smooth as the others, my guess is that the previous shoulder was not full depth since it was not a travel lane, and when they striped it as a travel lane, it was never made full depth.

I can't imagine that they would do that, because within a couple years it would begin to crumble and settle.  No trucks there but buses have high axle loadings and would damage such pavement.

Now that traffic is using it as a full-time lane, it's probably wearing down quicker since it's not as strengthened as the other lanes.

He said that it "is not quite as smooth as the other two lanes."  I didn't notice this when I drove it, but the trench widening seam could account for that, even though surface courses would overlay the widened base courses.

The on-going and previous widening projects on I-64 in Hampton Roads and the Peninsula involved strengthening the shoulders to handle traffic moving on them before they shifted the lanes.

Temporary usage, six months or whatever.  Probably a normal shoulder could handle that; I would have to see the design plans.
 

[sprjus4]

Temporary usage, six months or whatever.  Probably a normal shoulder could handle that; I would have to see the design plans.

Segment 1 -

Outside Shoulder Strengthening Construction to start September 2015

Segment 2 -

Initial work will include shoulder strengthening beginning in the eastbound direction for approximately two weeks, followed by similar work in the westbound direction.

Segment 3 -

Initial work will include shoulder strengthening operations beginning in the westbound direction, followed by similar work in the eastbound direction.

High Rise Bridge corridor (VA-168 Business to I-664) -

Upcoming Traffic Shift for shoulder strengthening

Here's an interesting find. So the shoulder strengthening not only allowed traffic to utilize the shoulder during construction, it was also done as a "stealth" lane for future use, at least in this particular segment between Fort Eustis Blvd and Jefferson Ave.

During design, VDOT issued a contract modification to strengthen the outside shoulders between the Fort Eustis Boulevard Interchange and the eastern project limit to allow operation of a 4th thru lane in each direction in the future. Shoulder strengthening was incorporated by removal of the existing shoulder pavement and partial subbase removal, and replacement with a full-depth pavement section

[Beltway]

Temporary usage, six months or whatever.  Probably a normal shoulder could handle that; I would have to see the design plans.

Segment 1 -

Outside Shoulder Strengthening Construction to start September 2015

Here's an interesting find. So the shoulder strengthening not only allowed traffic to utilize the shoulder during construction, it was also done as a "stealth" lane for future use, at least in this particular segment between Fort Eustis Blvd and Jefferson Ave.

During design, VDOT issued a contract modification to strengthen the outside shoulders between the Fort Eustis Boulevard Interchange and the eastern project limit to allow operation of a 4th thru lane in each direction in the future. Shoulder strengthening was incorporated by removal of the existing shoulder pavement and partial subbase removal, and replacement with a full-depth pavement section

"Shoulder strengthening" sounds like a term created by the public affairs office.

The design engineers would design what your last sentence said, remove and replace to a full-depth pavement section.

Again, I would have to look at the particular design plans, to see exactly what pavement design they are using for the temporary traffic usage on the newly constructed shoulder.

Stealth future lanes are something that I have pointed out in the past.

[sprjus4]

Temporary usage, six months or whatever.  Probably a normal shoulder could handle that; I would have to see the design plans.

Segment 1 -

Outside Shoulder Strengthening Construction to start September 2015

Here's an interesting find. So the shoulder strengthening not only allowed traffic to utilize the shoulder during construction, it was also done as a "stealth" lane for future use, at least in this particular segment between Fort Eustis Blvd and Jefferson Ave.

During design, VDOT issued a contract modification to strengthen the outside shoulders between the Fort Eustis Boulevard Interchange and the eastern project limit to allow operation of a 4th thru lane in each direction in the future. Shoulder strengthening was incorporated by removal of the existing shoulder pavement and partial subbase removal, and replacement with a full-depth pavement section

"Shoulder strengthening" sounds like a term created by the public affairs office.

The design engineers would design what your last sentence said, remove and replace to a full-depth pavement section.

Again, I would have to look at the particular design plans, to see exactly what pavement design they are using for the temporary traffic usage on the newly constructed shoulder.

Stealth future lanes are something that I have pointed out in the past.

These are the only design plans per se I can find for Segment 2 from a public hearing back in 2015.

http://www.virginiadot.org/Projects/resources/hampton_roads/Plan%20and%20Profile%20Sheets.pdf

VDOT doesn't do a good job of making all of this publicly available as far as I'm aware of.

Something like this would be nice to have, a public database of all the project lettings and associated design plans such as pavement, utility, signage, structures, subsurface, roadway, etc. would be useful to have, as far as I know none exists.

Example from the upcoming I-73 Rockingham Bypass project.

[Beltway]

I drove the I-395 HOT lanes northbound today (Thanksgiving) morning entering about 9:20 am.  Entered them as part of the continuous I-95/I-395 express roadway, got on the I-95 HOT lanes at Garrisonville.

I went thru D.C. using I-395, I-695, DC-295 Kenilworth Avenue (freeway), and US-50 freeway to the Eastern Shore.

Very fine trip and newly widened and paved 3-lane express roadway on I-395 to where it divides near the Pentagon and crosses the middle 14th Street Bridge.  65 mph speed limit and drops just before the 14th Street Bridge.

Updated my spreadsheet for
http://www.capital-beltway.com/VA-Freeway-Widening-Projects.xlsm
(389 miles completed, 62 miles under construction)

The toll was $2.00 on I-395, starting near I-495.

Thanksgiving day, light traffic on I-395 in morning, low toll.


Turkeycock Interchange area.


Popular vantage point for Shirley Highway photo, the sag vertical curve between Duke Street and Seminary Road.


New ramp between express lanes and Seminary Road.


King Street interchange area.


Shirlington interchange area.


Between Glebe Road and Mixing Bowl (the real Mixing Bowl!)


Toll on VMS for general purpose lanes to express 14th Street Bridge.


Approaching 14th Street Bridge, which passes over the Potomac River.


On 14th Street Bridge.  Left lane exits onto 14th Street northbound, right lane exits onto GP lanes of DC I-395 Southwest Freeway.

Light traffic on morning of Thanksgiving!
 

[sprjus4]

^

I don't think I've seen Transurban tolls that low before!

Looks like a nice result overall. Definitally a narrow shoulder on that one side, probably no larger than 2 ft.

[jeffandnicole]

Back to that shoulder issue...was there a rumble strip there? Unless the pavement was completely milled and repaved, a minor repaving usually causes people to still feel the vibration.

[sprjus4]

Back to that shoulder issue...was there a rumble strip there? Unless the pavement was completely milled and repaved, a minor repaving usually causes people to still feel the vibration.

Doesn't appear to be, but it looks like a road surface that's seen better days -
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8409615,-77.0846137,3a,75y,236.59h,80.22t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sSOV38XZbeBkudiQG_YpFMA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

[1995hoo]

That ramp to Seminary isn’t “new” in that it wasn’t built as part of the HO/T project, though it’s fair to view it as “new” relative to most of I-395. It was built in 2014 and opened in early 2015 after that Defense Department office building went up at the Mark Center (southwest corner of the Seminary Road interchange) and there were a lot of complaints about the ramp not being built before the building opened.

That ramp carries an HOV-3 restriction at all times. I don’t know whether they require E-ZPass Flex to use it—after all, you can use the lanes with three people and still pay the toll if you don’t have a Flex, such as if you’re here on a business trip. I didn’t see any signs saying a Flex is required to use that ramp.

[Beltway]

That ramp to Seminary isn’t “new” in that it wasn’t built as part of the HO/T project, though it’s fair to view it as “new” relative to most of I-395. It was built in 2014 and opened in early 2015 after that Defense Department office building went up at the Mark Center (southwest corner of the Seminary Road interchange) and there were a lot of complaints about the ramp not being built before the building opened.

I didn't mean "new" in the sense of just opened, just that it was recently completed.

That ramp carries an HOV-3 restriction at all times. I don’t know whether they require E-ZPass Flex to use it—after all, you can use the lanes with three people and still pay the toll if you don’t have a Flex, such as if you’re here on a business trip. I didn’t see any signs saying a Flex is required to use that ramp.

A question was raised when I posted the sag curve photo that shows "HOV EXIT," in another highways forum, and he said, "Shouldn’t that Seminary Road sign say 'Express Exit'?"

"All existing I-395 HOV entry and exit points are now 395 Express Lanes entry and exit points, except for the Seminary Road ramp that faces south, which is still HOV-only."
[That was built to serve the Mark Center]
https://www.expresslanes.com/395
. . . . . .

Wonder why they didn't make it HOT like the others?  The ramp doesn't connect directly to the Mark Center, it has an intersection with Seminary Road on its overpass bridge over I-395.  That wouldn't seem to cause any traffic problem, but then again it might, if there are high volumes of HOV-3+ vehicles using the ramp in peak hours.

[1995hoo]

I read somewhere that the 24/7 HOV restriction on that ramp was intended to discourage solo commuting to the Mark Center. I don't know any details, though. If that was the thought process, though, I guess it'd presumably remain valid even after HO/T conversion.

[Beltway]

I read somewhere that the 24/7 HOV restriction on that ramp was intended to discourage solo commuting to the Mark Center. I don't know any details, though. If that was the thought process, though, I guess it'd presumably remain valid even after HO/T conversion.

Since it is the only one not converted from HOV to HOT, we can conclude that there was some local issue at work here.

For example, the Pentagon is a much bigger traffic generator, but it is in an area zoned for government and commercial development; while the Mark Center was built in an area that is generally residential.  Eads Street also provides direct access to the Pentagon parking lots.

[AlexandriaVA]

Plus the Pentagon literally has a metro station beneath it

[Beltway]

Plus the Pentagon literally has a metro station beneath it

Transit bus station on top of the Metro station.

[1995hoo]

The Metro station isn’t actually underneath the Pentagon building. It’s underneath the bus lanes outside. There used to be a direct entrance up into the building from the subway station, but that was sealed off years ago as a security risk.

[Beltway]

The Metro station isn’t actually underneath the Pentagon building. It’s underneath the bus lanes outside. There used to be a direct entrance up into the building from the subway station, but that was sealed off years ago as a security risk.

Parallel to the bus platforms, parallel to the southeast wall of the Pentagon.

Under the green-grassed area that has what look like two small brown squares.
https://www.google.com/maps/search/arlington+va/@38.8691986,-77.0539969,350m/data=!3m1!1e3

[froggie]

I read somewhere that the 24/7 HOV restriction on that ramp was intended to discourage solo commuting to the Mark Center. I don't know any details, though. If that was the thought process, though, I guess it'd presumably remain valid even after HO/T conversion.

Since it is the only one not converted from HOV to HOT, we can conclude that there was some local issue at work here.

It's part of the TMP (Transportation Management Plan) for the Mark Center development.

[Beltway]

I read somewhere that the 24/7 HOV restriction on that ramp was intended to discourage solo commuting to the Mark Center. I don't know any details, though. If that was the thought process, though, I guess it'd presumably remain valid even after HO/T conversion.

Since it is the only one not converted from HOV to HOT, we can conclude that there was some local issue at work here.

It's part of the TMP (Transportation Management Plan) for the Mark Center development.

I just spent about 10 minutes looking at various BRAC-133 documents and FHWA and VDOT documents, about Mark Center access, and there is good information but I can't yet pin down the exact official decision point.

One document said that the City of Alexandria wanted to prohibit easterly access to the ramp in peak hours, but that FHWA refused.  It is apparent enough that enhanced direct transit southerly access to the Mark Center was the goal of the new ramp, that would include car pools and buses, but limiting other uses given the otherwise residential land uses in the immediate area.

Non-HOV traffic does have access to Seminary Road to/from the southerly express lanes, but thru the Turkeycock Interchange which entails about 1/2 mile of GP lane usage.

[1995hoo]

Allowing general-purpose use of that ramp does present traffic management problems on Seminary Road. The way it is now, thru traffic going over the top-level overpass on Seminary (heading towards Beauregard Street and Skyline) is forced into a left-turn-only lane onto Beauregard heading towards Landmark. You have to move right just as you come off that overpass as you pass the entrance to Southern Towers. At the same spot, traffic coming off I-395's general-purpose lanes is trying to move left to turn left onto Beauregard to access the Mark Center or other locations down the road there. There have been some discussions of rebuilding the Seminary/Beauregard intersection to eliminate this weaving problem, but until they do that, I won't be surprised if they do not move quickly on allowing non-HOVs to use that ramp, especially during rush hour.

[sprjus4]

It's days like this I question the reversible schedule...

I-95 southbound between Woodbridge and Fredericksburg, 30 miles, 90 minutes travel time, roughly 60 minutes of delay.
I-95 northbound between Fredericksburg and Woodbridge, 30 miles, 40 minutes travel time, roughly 10 minutes of delay.

And yet the Express Lanes are pointed northbound.

[Alps]

It's days like this I question the reversible schedule...

I-95 southbound between Woodbridge and Fredericksburg, 30 miles, 90 minutes travel time, roughly 60 minutes of delay.
I-95 northbound between Fredericksburg and Woodbridge, 30 miles, 40 minutes travel time, roughly 10 minutes of delay.

And yet the Express Lanes are pointed northbound.

Okay, well, what if they were pointed southbound? You think those would be more or less imbalanced the opposite way? The only way to know which way is worse is to close them entirely. I would expect NB to be the hotter direction.

[jeffandnicole]

It's days like this I question the reversible schedule...

I-95 southbound between Woodbridge and Fredericksburg, 30 miles, 90 minutes travel time, roughly 60 minutes of delay.
I-95 northbound between Fredericksburg and Woodbridge, 30 miles, 40 minutes travel time, roughly 10 minutes of delay.

And yet the Express Lanes are pointed northbound.

Well, of course the delay going north should be less because they have 3 extra lanes to use.

I'm sure they have years of data to know what direction has more traffic on Sunday after Thanksgiving.

[sprjus4]

With the toll as low as it is, only $8 for 30 miles (for Transurban that's low), that indicates there's not high demand for the HO/T lanes. Also keep in mind, there's a 6 mile section between Fredericksburg and the southern terminus of the HO/T lanes, and that stretch of northbound is operating adequately. Southbound in the same corridor has severe congestion.

It's pretty easy to watch the traffic cameras in 3-5 minute increments multiple times and easily realize there's more demand southbound than northbound. All the traffic northbound is spread apart decently amount to the point there would likely be some delay if 2 lanes (the NB HO/T lanes) were closed, but certainly not as much as southbound.

Of course if they had built it the right way, there would be two HO/T lanes in each direction, but that's a different story.

[Beltway]

It's pretty easy to watch the traffic cameras in 3-5 minute increments multiple times and easily realize there's more demand southbound than northbound.

That is the problem with eyeball analysis, and not even while on the highway.

The historical traffic engineering analysis has been that on the last day of a major holiday weekend, that the net flow heavily favors the direction -toward- Washington, as in the net flow being the number of people returning to homes in the area; and that is why the express lanes are oriented that way all day long, and not just for half of the day.

[sprjus4]

It's pretty easy to watch the traffic cameras in 3-5 minute increments multiple times and easily realize there's more demand southbound than northbound.

That is the problem with eyeball analysis, and not even while on the highway.

The historical traffic engineering analysis has been that on the last day of a major holiday weekend, that the net flow heavily favors the direction -toward- Washington, as in the net flow being the number of people returning to homes in the area; and that is why the express lanes are oriented that way all day long, and not just for half of the day.

That's the problem with having reversible HO/T lanes on a highway that has congestion issues in both directions.