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Washington

Started by jakeroot, May 21, 2016, 01:56:31 PM

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kkt

Quote from: jakeroot on June 24, 2018, 08:59:38 PM
That bike route sign reminds me. I saw a Kitsap county bike route shield, with a county cutout for the shield:



That's wacky.  Even a lot of people who live there won't recognize it from the outline.  Just putting KITSAP COUNTY on the sign would be more recognizable and less expensive.


jakeroot

#376
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 24, 2018, 10:13:19 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on June 24, 2018, 08:59:38 PM
That bike route sign reminds me. I saw a Kitsap county bike route shield, with a county cutout for the shield:

https://i.imgur.com/otpCLVT.jpg

Isn't that the one on Silverdale Way and Newberry Hill Road?

Bingo! Just north of the roundabout going southbound.

Quote from: Bruce on June 24, 2018, 11:13:33 PM
This appears to be the numbered map (with only 20 to 70): https://www.kitsapgov.com/pw/Documents/Bike_Route_2004.pdf

Thanks for the map!

Quote from: kkt on June 24, 2018, 11:27:54 PM
That's wacky.  Even a lot of people who live there won't recognize it from the outline.  Just putting KITSAP COUNTY on the sign would be more recognizable and less expensive.

I don't think it's too big of a deal. The number is the most important thing. I'm sure Kitsap residents recognise their own county shape.

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: jakeroot on June 24, 2018, 11:47:11 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 24, 2018, 10:13:19 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on June 24, 2018, 08:59:38 PM
That bike route sign reminds me. I saw a Kitsap county bike route shield, with a county cutout for the shield:

https://i.imgur.com/otpCLVT.jpg

Isn't that the one on Silverdale Way and Newberry Hill Road?

Bingo! Just north of the roundabout going southbound.

Quote from: Bruce on June 24, 2018, 11:13:33 PM
This appears to be the numbered map (with only 20 to 70): https://www.kitsapgov.com/pw/Documents/Bike_Route_2004.pdf

Thanks for the map!

Quote from: kkt on June 24, 2018, 11:27:54 PM
That's wacky.  Even a lot of people who live there won't recognize it from the outline.  Just putting KITSAP COUNTY on the sign would be more recognizable and less expensive.

I don't think it's too big of a deal. The number is the most important thing. I'm sure Kitsap residents recognise their own county shape.

I kept trying to get a picture of that Route 31 shield the entire week I was up there but kept missing it in traffic.  I must have passed it a dozen times.

jakeroot

#378
A Minnesota-style option lane sign has popped up along I-5 near downtown Seattle, for Exit 164. Note the unusual use of an exit tab (a necessity given the design of the sign):






A tabbed exit sign has shown up at Hwy 16 and Jackson Ave, north of UP. New sign from the last year: https://goo.gl/9vRS66 -- continues the WSDOT tradition of using multiple weights on one sign  :verymad:


compdude787

Quote from: jakeroot on June 25, 2018, 05:50:37 AM
A Minnesota-style option lane sign has popped up along I-5 near downtown Seattle, for Exit 164. Note the unusual use of an exit tab (a necessity given the design of the sign):



You'd think that they would have used an APL sign there.

jakeroot

Quote from: compdude787 on June 25, 2018, 03:16:04 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on June 25, 2018, 05:50:37 AM
A Minnesota-style option lane sign has popped up along I-5 near downtown Seattle, for Exit 164. Note the unusual use of an exit tab (a necessity given the design of the sign):

https://i.imgur.com/1m8TSly.jpg

You'd think that they would have used an APL sign there.

I thought about that. I would guess, given the number of exit ramps here, it was easier to use down arrows instead. I certainly could have come up with an APL that would have fit.

MNHighwayMan

Is it just me or does the kerning on that sign look a little too tight?

jakeroot

Quote from: MNHighwayMan on June 25, 2018, 09:52:26 PM
Is it just me or does the kerning on that sign look a little too tight?

That's been a WSDOT thing lately. Mostly on arterials and smaller signs, though. Shouldn't have made its way on to a freeway sign.

Bruce

A one-vehicle crash on SR 99 knocked down a sign gantry in south Seattle.




kkt

That driver is going to have a heck of a bill.

jakeroot

Quote from: kkt on July 06, 2018, 04:16:17 PM
That driver is going to have a heck of a bill.

I'm sure insurance would cover it?

Max Rockatansky

Wouldn't mind having the "99 North Seattle"  in my back yard. 

ErmineNotyours

Today I noticed this greenout for Washington SR 900 on I-405.  This would be for West 900, a pair of one-way couplets through downtown Renton.  East 900 multiplexes near here until the next exit.  This greened out section of 900 is still on SR Web.  Where else would I go to find the latest information about deleted sections of Washington State Highways?

900 functions as a highway between Rainier Avenue and Interstate 5, but seems more like a local street through downtown Renton.  I don't know of many motorists who would treat the downtown section of 900 as a thru highway, so perhaps it's just as well that it's being decertified.  Renton is trying to kick the transit center out of downtown so it can turn 3rd Street (eastbound 900) into a street that can be easily closed for festivals.  Perhaps this is the first sign of this happening.

SR 900 Greenout by Arthur Allen, on Flickr

Bruce

Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

jakeroot

Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 10:20:35 PM
Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

As you might imagine, judging the number on the sign, somewhere in the 425. But those signs are all over Pierce County. I could have several photos for you by tomorrow.

Bruce

Quote from: jakeroot on July 07, 2018, 11:01:27 PM
Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 10:20:35 PM
Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

As you might imagine, judging the number on the sign, somewhere in the 425. But those signs are all over Pierce County. I could have several photos for you by tomorrow.

Do share a few locations, especially if I can reach them by bus. I've been meaning to travel down there for a few errands soon.

ErmineNotyours

Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 10:20:35 PM
Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

Redmond.  They were waiting for the railroad to be abandoned before they extended it.  There is still another sign existing a few miles away.

Road to be extended in the future by Arthur Allen, on Flickr

jakeroot

#392
Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 11:43:54 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 07, 2018, 11:01:27 PM
Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 10:20:35 PM
Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

As you might imagine, judging the number on the sign, somewhere in the 425. But those signs are all over Pierce County. I could have several photos for you by tomorrow.

Do share a few locations, especially if I can reach them by bus. I've been meaning to travel down there for a few errands soon.

I'm sure there are more, but here's three. Turns out, it's not a Pierce County thing (I think -- need more time to be sure), but rather a Puyallup thing.

Roads ending at those red and white chevron signs are very common in Puyallup; roads are often designed to be extended, though I'm not sure if there are any finite plans for them:

23 Pl SE: https://goo.gl/sHpQsD

12 Ave SE/22 St SE: https://goo.gl/u9rKrE

47 Ave SE (should still be there -- road wasn't completely finished through): https://goo.gl/htqsVq

There might be one here, farther south in unincorporated Pierce County, but I'm not 100% sure: https://goo.gl/LC3y68 (nothing there; 9 July 2018)

There are a lot of roads in Pierce County that were very clearly designed to extend beyond their current terminus. I'm not sure how common this type of situation is up north.

jakeroot

#393
Here's one of these City of Puyallup-installed "Road to be extended in the future" signs. This one is brand new, near the current dead end of 47 Ave SE behind the YMCA: https://goo.gl/Q3dLKe (Google Earth satellite only).

The city has started putting the message on the pavement as well! :-D The one on 23 Pl SE in the valley had this message on the ground as well, but I did not get a good picture.

(FWIW, the city has switched back to using FHWA on their less common signage)


mrsman

Quote from: jakeroot on July 07, 2018, 11:01:27 PM
Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 10:20:35 PM
Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

As you might imagine, judging the number on the sign, somewhere in the 425. But those signs are all over Pierce County. I could have several photos for you by tomorrow.

An interesting harbinger for good things to come.  Must be a local practice.   Don't know of such signs being signed near where I live.

jakeroot

Quote from: mrsman on July 24, 2018, 07:59:54 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 07, 2018, 11:01:27 PM
Quote from: Bruce on July 07, 2018, 10:20:35 PM
Off-topic, but where did you photograph the "Road to be Extended" sign in your avatar?

As you might imagine, judging the number on the sign, somewhere in the 425. But those signs are all over Pierce County. I could have several photos for you by tomorrow.

An interesting harbinger for good things to come.  Must be a local practice.   Don't know of such signs being signed near where I live.

I do find the sign to be quite odd. Because if any plans change, you've presented this false hope to the nearby community that a missing connection might one day be filled. If you don't publicize your plans, at least you can cancel them without anybody getting angry. Several of the ones that I know of have been in place for easily two decades. Probably longer. I think, eventually, people start to give up. Although the one I posted directly above is brand-new, so clearly the city of Puyallup is following through, to some degree.

MNHighwayMan

#396
Quote from: jakeroot on July 25, 2018, 01:53:44 AM
I do find the sign to be quite odd. Because if any plans change, you've presented this false hope to the nearby community that a missing connection might one day be filled. If you don't publicize your plans, at least you can cancel them without anybody getting angry. Several of the ones that I know of have been in place for easily two decades. Probably longer. I think, eventually, people start to give up. Although the one I posted directly above is brand-new, so clearly the city of Puyallup is following through, to some degree.

The thing is, whenever I see a road like that, where the pavement and curb suddenly ends, and has red reflectors on the end, I assume that that means it's intended to be extended someday. I don't need a sign to tell that to me, because with the way things are set up, somewhat prepped and ready for additional road to be added on, I just expect that it will happen.

Now obviously, sometimes plans change and that temporary end becomes a little more permanent, but I still know that the intention was once there, at least.

That, combined with the potential for false promises, just makes the sign seem wholly unnecessary (never mind going through the effort of printing it onto the road surface :eyebrow:). Just put up the red reflector barriers and call it a day.

jakeroot

Quote from: MNHighwayMan on July 25, 2018, 02:22:35 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 25, 2018, 01:53:44 AM
I do find the sign to be quite odd. Because if any plans change, you've presented this false hope to the nearby community that a missing connection might one day be filled. If you don't publicize your plans, at least you can cancel them without anybody getting angry. Several of the ones that I know of have been in place for easily two decades. Probably longer. I think, eventually, people start to give up. Although the one I posted directly above is brand-new, so clearly the city of Puyallup is following through, to some degree.

The thing is, whenever I see a road like that, where the pavement and curb suddenly ends, and has red reflectors on the end, I assume that that means it's intended to be extended someday. I don't need a sign to tell that to me, because with the way things are set up, somewhat prepped and ready for additional road to be added on, I just expect that it will happen.

Now obviously, sometimes plans change and that temporary end becomes a little more permanent, but I still know that the intention was once there, at least.

That, combined with the potential for false promises, just makes the sign seem wholly unnecessary (never mind going through the effort of printing it onto the road surface :eyebrow:). Just put up the red reflector barriers and call it a day.

I'm not quite sure I agree. Those red barriers are more often used in my area to warn that a road ends, not to warn drivers that the road ends and that it will one day continue. Sometimes, there isn't room for a cul-de-sac, so you end up having to use those barriers to tell drivers to slow down and turn around, even if it's awkward. I've also seen them used when a road ends and there's some "geographical" barriers to keep one from continuing (such as trees, a lake, or a cliff).

There are some examples of the sign being used where the plan to continue the road is blatantly obvious (the picture above, for example), but the sign has been used at dead-ends where plans weren't so obvious: https://goo.gl/u9rKrE --&-- https://goo.gl/pnTKQJ. The first is on a curve, the second on a cul-de-sac.

FWIW, I have never seen the message printed on the road surface before. I don't think that's necessary either. But it's cool!

All told, the sign is clearly not necessary. Puyallup is the only city that I know of anywhere (now, Renton and Redmond had examples), so most agencies clearly don't see any value in it. But it doesn't hurt to keep the public in the loop.

MNHighwayMan

Quote from: jakeroot on July 25, 2018, 02:55:12 PM
Quote from: MNHighwayMan on July 25, 2018, 02:22:35 PM
The thing is, whenever I see a road like that, where the pavement and curb suddenly ends, and has red reflectors on the end, I assume that that means it's intended to be extended someday. I don't need a sign to tell that to me, because with the way things are set up, somewhat prepped and ready for additional road to be added on, I just expect that it will happen.

Now obviously, sometimes plans change and that temporary end becomes a little more permanent, but I still know that the intention was once there, at least.

That, combined with the potential for false promises, just makes the sign seem wholly unnecessary (never mind going through the effort of printing it onto the road surface :eyebrow:). Just put up the red reflector barriers and call it a day.
I'm not quite sure I agree. Those red barriers are more often used in my area to warn that a road ends, not to warn drivers that the road ends and that it will one day continue. Sometimes, there isn't room for a cul-de-sac, so you end up having to use those barriers to tell drivers to slow down and turn around, even if it's awkward. I've also seen them used when a road ends and there's some "geographical" barriers to keep one from continuing (such as trees, a lake, or a cliff).

There are some examples of the sign being used where the plan to continue the road is blatantly obvious (the picture above, for example), but the sign has been used at dead-ends where plans weren't so obvious: https://goo.gl/u9rKrE --&-- https://goo.gl/pnTKQJ. The first is on a curve, the second on a cul-de-sac.

FWIW, I have never seen the message printed on the road surface before. I don't think that's necessary either. But it's cool!

All told, the sign is clearly not necessary. Puyallup is the only city that I know of anywhere (now, Renton and Redmond had examples), so most agencies clearly don't see any value in it. But it doesn't hurt to keep the public in the loop.

Well, in those examples, it's far less obvious, although that first example where there's clearly a marked off right-of-way (a given by how the edges are fenced off by the adjacent property owners) at least gives a hint of the idea.

I just don't think putting up signs saying "Hey, eventually there'll be a road here!" is at all necessary.

jakeroot

Quote from: MNHighwayMan on July 25, 2018, 03:00:42 PM
I just don't think putting up signs saying "Hey, eventually there'll be a road here!" is at all necessary.

If you lived in an area where traffic sucked as much as it does here, you'd understand why local agencies like to assure their residents that they are doing something to improve the situation.



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