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Tolls proposed for Cottonwood Canyons

Started by US 89, January 25, 2018, 12:58:15 AM

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Rothman

Quote from: Plutonic Panda on November 26, 2024, 07:56:11 PMI think that photo with a gondola in it would look awesome. There are tons and tons of valleys you can go to where there won't ever be a gondola.

Beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder.

Reminds me of Alonzo Hawk in Herbie Rides Again wanting to tear down the Coliseum and put up a shopping center...
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.


Jim

Quote from: Plutonic Panda on November 26, 2024, 08:12:14 PMAs for the capacity carrying only 16 people a minute seems wrong. The proposed gondola in LA claims it can carry 5k people per hour

QuoteWhen completed, the proposed project would have a maximum capacity of approximately 5,000 people per hour per direction, and the travel time between Union Station and Dodger Stadium would be approximately seven minutes.

https://www.metro.net/projects/aerial-rapid-transit/

Here's one article that mentions capacity.  One 35-passenger cabin about every 2 minutes.  That sounds reasonable to me, given that it takes some time to load and unload 35 people and their ski/board equipment into and out of a gondola car.  It's also a long ride - 30 minutes to Snowbird and a few more up to Alta.
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paulthemapguy

Quote from: US 89 on November 26, 2024, 04:14:16 PMYep, bus lanes and snow sheds are the real answer to this issue. Assuming bus service can actually be increased as promised.
The real issue I have with the gondola is that it will cost 729 million dollars to initially build, it will be expensive to operate, it can only carry 16 people a minute on average, it won't be able to operate in anything resembling high winds or avalanche danger, one of the support towers is actually in an avalanche path... just seems to me like a huge waste of money to not meaningfully improve anything.

Well they have to do something to improve capacity, and if expanding the roadway is off the table, the solution has to involve another mode of transportation besides the passenger car. Buses are a great idea, because they would use the existing roadway, but that solution would be completely impotent if the same volume of passenger cars is allowed to use the road as before.  The buses will do nothing to help if they're stuck in the same traffic jams as those that currently exist. Scrapping that idea, the next-least obtrusive transportation option would be aerial gondola, or giving buses exclusive usage of the existing roadway. The terrain is unsuitable for any rail line to go straight enough to achieve an efficient speed, I'm assuming.
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Plutonic Panda

Quote from: Jim on November 27, 2024, 08:39:30 AM
Quote from: Plutonic Panda on November 26, 2024, 08:12:14 PMAs for the capacity carrying only 16 people a minute seems wrong. The proposed gondola in LA claims it can carry 5k people per hour

QuoteWhen completed, the proposed project would have a maximum capacity of approximately 5,000 people per hour per direction, and the travel time between Union Station and Dodger Stadium would be approximately seven minutes.

https://www.metro.net/projects/aerial-rapid-transit/

Here's one article that mentions capacity.  One 35-passenger cabin about every 2 minutes.  That sounds reasonable to me, given that it takes some time to load and unload 35 people and their ski/board equipment into and out of a gondola car.  It's also a long ride - 30 minutes to Snowbird and a few more up to Alta.
I completely forgot to factor in loading and unloading skis and snowboards and what not. That is a great point. I'm sure that will slow things down.

US 89

Quote from: paulthemapguy on November 27, 2024, 10:37:48 AM
Quote from: US 89 on November 26, 2024, 04:14:16 PMYep, bus lanes and snow sheds are the real answer to this issue. Assuming bus service can actually be increased as promised.
The real issue I have with the gondola is that it will cost 729 million dollars to initially build, it will be expensive to operate, it can only carry 16 people a minute on average, it won't be able to operate in anything resembling high winds or avalanche danger, one of the support towers is actually in an avalanche path... just seems to me like a huge waste of money to not meaningfully improve anything.

Well they have to do something to improve capacity, and if expanding the roadway is off the table, the solution has to involve another mode of transportation besides the passenger car. Buses are a great idea, because they would use the existing roadway, but that solution would be completely impotent if the same volume of passenger cars is allowed to use the road as before.  The buses will do nothing to help if they're stuck in the same traffic jams as those that currently exist. Scrapping that idea, the next-least obtrusive transportation option would be aerial gondola, or giving buses exclusive usage of the existing roadway. The terrain is unsuitable for any rail line to go straight enough to achieve an efficient speed, I'm assuming.

Yeah, the canyon is generally too steep and narrow for a conventional rail line to be workable.

Quote from: Plutonic Panda on November 27, 2024, 01:08:37 PM
Quote from: Jim on November 27, 2024, 08:39:30 AM
Quote from: Plutonic Panda on November 26, 2024, 08:12:14 PMAs for the capacity carrying only 16 people a minute seems wrong. The proposed gondola in LA claims it can carry 5k people per hour

QuoteWhen completed, the proposed project would have a maximum capacity of approximately 5,000 people per hour per direction, and the travel time between Union Station and Dodger Stadium would be approximately seven minutes.

https://www.metro.net/projects/aerial-rapid-transit/

Here's one article that mentions capacity.  One 35-passenger cabin about every 2 minutes.  That sounds reasonable to me, given that it takes some time to load and unload 35 people and their ski/board equipment into and out of a gondola car.  It's also a long ride - 30 minutes to Snowbird and a few more up to Alta.
I completely forgot to factor in loading and unloading skis and snowboards and what not. That is a great point. I'm sure that will slow things down.

Also, you ever watch people move in ski boots? Not exactly quickly...

Plutonic Panda

So then, what would be the big deal about just widening the road a little bit to allow for buses?

Rothman

Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Plutonic Panda

Quote from: Rothman on November 27, 2024, 01:28:22 PMPerhaps a cog railway... :D
Remember that picture that Max posted about those little Robo cars in Las Vegas? Those don't take up much room. You wouldn't have to widen the road that much. Now all we would need them to do is get them to go 150 mph and problem solved.

Plutonic Panda




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