Ask me anything about New York.

[kurumi]

Suppose we're taking a road trip upstate, kind of following back roads along I-90. Aside from the obvious (steamed hams), what local foods and brews are not to be missed?

[hbelkins]

We've had a thread about this, but where do New Yorkers consider the line between upstate and downstate to be drawn?

[SkyPesos]

Why does Orleans County exist?

So we can debate about "when is a beach not a beach?"

Is Orleans County the Alanland of NY?

[empirestate]

What is you guy's view on Massachusetts and New England?

Well, there's the obvious sports rivalry between New York and Boston (which some people extend beyond sports to the cities/states themselves, but that's honestly a bit silly as they aren't directly comparable). And some people in one like to complain about the roads/drivers of the other.

But when you come right down to it, New York and New England have a shared history going back to the earliest days, and they really have much more in common that not. (By contrast, compare New York or New England with California or the deep South.) As states and regions go, we're really pretty close family.

Why does Ithaca (Cornell) lack a 4 lane connection to the interstate system?

It befits its status as an island of blue in a sea of red.

Why does Orleans County exist?

To prevent Genesee County from having a beach.

Absolutely not. Heck, people upstate haven't even accepted the city itself, let alone other people's perceptions of it!

Now I'm curious if this is serious to some degree, or completely tongue-in-cheek. It's almost the opposite of my answer, although I decided to give what I thought was an honest answer while carefully avoid "taking the bait".

(And I hope you don't mind me answering some of the questions here - Feel free to let me know if you do  )

Of course! The idea here is absolutely to be tongue-in-cheek. On the other hand, there might be some earnest questions that warrant earnest answers. (And since you've covered some of the earnest answers, it leaves me free to handle the cheek-tonguing!)

[webny99]

Why does Orleans County exist?

So we can debate about "when is a beach not a beach?"

Is Orleans County the Alanland of NY?

That's a terrible insult to Alanland, and you'd better apologize quickly before any punishment is handed out! 

[webny99]

Suppose we're taking a road trip upstate, kind of following back roads along I-90. Aside from the obvious (steamed hams), what local foods and brews are not to be missed?

Those from the Albany area and/or central NY might be able to answer this better, but once you get west of Syracuse, certainly pizza and buffalo chicken wings from a local shop (Pudgie's or Guida's if you're in the Rochester area), and trash plates, another Rochester specialty. And once you get to Buffalo, there's beef on weck (never tried it myself, but heard it's good).

Can't speak much for brews personally, but the Genesee Brew House right on the Genesee River in Rochester is highly rated and always busy, with views of High Falls. Further south, Binghamton is known for their own variation of meat sandwiches, called spiedies. I tried them once several years ago and they were good, but nothing I'd drive there just to try.

And then there's Dinosaur BBQ... debate will rage about where it ranks among BBQ's, certainly not top in the nation or anything, but it's good (and most items, including their meats and cold salads, have a unique blend of seasonings that I enjoy, personally). But it's not so much about the food as it is about the experience, especially at the downtown Syracuse (the original) and Rochester locations. It's got some serious vibes on weekend evenings... you won't experience anything quite like it elsewhere.

All told, there's a lot of great food if you know where to find it, just don't count your calories! 

[webny99]

Why does Orleans County exist?

To prevent Genesee County from having a beach on Lake Ontario

FTFY. An A+ answer other than that though! 

[andrepoiy]

Is the Lake Ontario State Parkway worth driving to? To experience the condition of the road, haha

[webny99]

Is the Lake Ontario State Parkway worth driving to? To experience the condition of the road, haha

I actually haven't been on the section west of Hamlin Beach in several years. But the Street View car has, and it looks like the section west of Hamlin has now been completely repaved as of this past August (you can see in the link where the new pavement ends; this is westbound just past NY 237). That leaves just 10 miles to the end of the parkway; I'm not sure if/when that will be repaved, but I'm pretty sure what's left isn't as bad as the NY 237 to NY 19 segment was at its worst.

It's a very nice road from Hamlin Beach to Rochester though; despite a 10-mile stretch with at-grade intersections, none of them are busy enough to cause any issues for the foreseeable future.

[vdeane]

Suppose we're taking a road trip upstate, kind of following back roads along I-90. Aside from the obvious (steamed hams), what local foods and brews are not to be missed?

Those from the Albany area and/or central NY might be able to answer this better, but once you get west of Syracuse, certainly pizza and buffalo chicken wings from a local shop (Pudgie's or Guida's if you're in the Rochester area), and trash plates, another Rochester specialty. And once you get to Buffalo, there's beef on weck (never tried it myself, but heard it's good).

Can't speak much for brews personally, but the Genesee Brew House right on the Genesee River in Rochester is highly rated and always busy, with views of High Falls. Further south, Binghamton is known for their own variation of meat sandwiches, called spiedies. I tried them once several years ago and they were good, but nothing I'd drive there just to try.

And then there's Dinosaur BBQ... debate will rage about where it ranks among BBQ's, certainly not top in the nation or anything, but it's good (and most items, including their meats and cold salads, have a unique blend of seasonings that I enjoy, personally). But it's not so much about the food as it is about the experience, especially at the downtown Syracuse (the original) and Rochester locations. It's got some serious vibes on weekend evenings... you won't experience anything quite like it elsewhere.

All told, there's a lot of great food if you know where to find it, just don't count your calories! 

People from the eastern part of the state would argue with you about pizza and the western part of the state (and Italian food in general).

Utica has tomato pie and chicken riggies.

[Rothman]

Dinosaur BBQ has gone downhill.  Totally overhyped and probably the blandest BBQ in the country now.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

Dinosaur BBQ has gone downhill.  Totally overhyped and probably the blandest BBQ in the country now.

It can't be worse than Famous Dave's.

[webny99]

Dinosaur BBQ has gone downhill.  Totally overhyped and probably the blandest BBQ in the country now.

Haven't had it super recently (probably been a year or so?) but bland is the last word I would use to describe it. Maybe the Syracuse one has gone downhill, but the Rochester one hasn't, at least to my knowledge.

[Rothman]

Dinosaur BBQ has gone downhill.  Totally overhyped and probably the blandest BBQ in the country now.

Haven't had it super recently (probably been a year or so?) but bland is the last word I would use to describe it. Maybe the Syracuse one has gone downhill, but the Rochester one hasn't, at least to my knowledge.

I'd take Sticky Lips in Rochester over Dinosaur.

Had Dinosaur somewhat recently.  Within the last couple of years.

[webny99]

Suppose we're taking a road trip upstate, kind of following back roads along I-90. Aside from the obvious (steamed hams), what local foods and brews are not to be missed?

Those from the Albany area and/or central NY might be able to answer this better, but once you get west of Syracuse, certainly pizza and buffalo chicken wings from a local shop (Pudgie's or Guida's if you're in the Rochester area), and trash plates, another Rochester specialty. And once you get to Buffalo, there's beef on weck (never tried it myself, but heard it's good).

...

People from the eastern part of the state would argue with you about pizza and the western part of the state (and Italian food in general).

Not sure I've had much pizza east of Syracuse, at least from local chains. What is your experience, is it really much different or any better in that direction?

I always thought pizza was sort of a Western New York "thing"... maybe partly by association with chicken wings. But it could also be that I just really like a good pizza and I'm overrating it as a local specialty.

[empirestate]

Suppose we're taking a road trip upstate, kind of following back roads along I-90. Aside from the obvious (steamed hams), what local foods and brews are not to be missed?

Just make a stop at Beers of the World, and I won't have to suggest any brews because you can try them all!

As for foods, I'll tackle that separately...

We've had a thread about this, but where do New Yorkers consider the line between upstate and downstate to be drawn?

In the wrong place.

Is Orleans County the Alanland of NY?

Eh, it is and it isn't.

Is the Lake Ontario State Parkway worth driving to? To experience the condition of the road, haha

No.

[empirestate]

Those from the Albany area and/or central NY might be able to answer this better, but once you get west of Syracuse, certainly pizza and buffalo chicken wings from a local shop (Pudgie's or Guida's if you're in the Rochester area), and trash plates, another Rochester specialty.

Pudgie's is more of Southern Tier chain, in my estimation. I haven't tried Guida's, but for pizza in the Rochester area, Mark's, Pontillo's and Salvatore's are pretty much go-to names.

I always thought pizza was sort of a Western New York "thing"... maybe partly by association with chicken wings. But it could also be that I just really like a good pizza and I'm overrating it as a local specialty.

Pizza is a downstate thing, for sure. There are well-loved local favorites in the Upstate cities, to be sure, but the regional culinary identity lies elsewhere.

In western New York it's really about the wings, and the best I've had anywhere (and that includes the Anchor Bar) are at Jeremiah's. But you can find wings of comparable quality throughout the region, and even a few downstate places have at least the right basic ideas. (Pro tip: if it's not orange, it's not a Buffalo wing.) There are also Country Sweet wings, which are a highly prized alternative. They basically use Boss Sauce instead of Buffalo sauce.

"Trash plates" are really called "garbage plates", but most restaurants don't own that trademark so they call them "trash plates", "mess plates", "heartburn special", etc. I've had maybe one, ever, and it was...it was fine.

Can't speak much for brews personally, but the Genesee Brew House right on the Genesee River in Rochester is highly rated and always busy, with views of High Falls.

The brewing scene in Rochester has really kicked in lately, with Three Heads having really opened things up on the craft beer line. (I believe both they and Genesee do a lot of contract brewing, so you'll see Rochester, NY on the labels of beers around the country.) Rohrbach is also a reliable local staple; they opened back in the first wave of craft brewing during the '90s.

Dinosaur BBQ has gone downhill.  Totally overhyped and probably the blandest BBQ in the country now.

Haven't had it super recently (probably been a year or so?) but bland is the last word I would use to describe it. Maybe the Syracuse one has gone downhill, but the Rochester one hasn't, at least to my knowledge.

Definitely not bland, and by far not the blandest even within the state. I think what's really happened is that BBQ elitism has grown, rather than any one place gotten better or worse. It used to be that you could mention Dinosaur as a favorite without much fear of reprisal, but nowadays you'd better be prepared to hear about how worthless it is compared to Kansas City or Memphis or Texas, or...well, you can just read this thread to see what I mean.

I'd take Sticky Lips in Rochester over Dinosaur.

I've got friends with the same opinion.

Perhaps it's safest just to say that Dinosaur is the Orleans County of BBQ.

[vdeane]

Yes, pizza is definitely more associated with downstate (and northern NJ).  It's actually interesting... I think Rochester pizza is fine, but a coworker from Schenectady think's it's bad.  Then I have another coworker from Fishkill who doesn't like Capital District pizza because she's used to NYC style.  It seems like the closer to NYC one is, they more they're going to be influenced by pizza elitism.

Speaking of Rohrbach's, I enjoy their buffalo chicken plate, though it's very filling (and feels like it's larger every time I have one).

[webny99]

... once you get west of Syracuse, certainly pizza and buffalo chicken wings from a local shop (Pudgie's or Guida's if you're in the Rochester area), and trash plates, another Rochester specialty.

Pudgie's is more of Southern Tier chain, in my estimation.

Interesting. Before I looked it up earlier today, the only locations I knew about were Rochester (Goodman St.) and Canandaigua (NY 332).

I haven't tried Guida's, but for pizza in the Rochester area, Mark's, Pontillo's and Salvatore's are pretty much go-to names.

You're missing out! Guida's pizza and wings are the best, especially their cajun wings. In my experience Mark's and Salvatore's are OK, but they're not as good as Guida's. If you're going to get Pontillo's, it's got to be from the Bushnell's Basin location. That one makes a way better pizza than all their other locations, and it's not just imagination - the top chef there basically said as much to a friend of ours. Not sure how he does it, but the end result is fantastic.

In western New York it's really about the wings, and the best I've had anywhere (and that includes the Anchor Bar) are at Jeremiah's. But you can find wings of comparable quality throughout the region, and even a few downstate places have at least the right basic ideas. (Pro tip: if it's not orange, it's not a Buffalo wing.) There are also Country Sweet wings, which are a highly prized alternative. They basically use Boss Sauce instead of Buffalo sauce.

Yeah, the pizza is often secondary to the wings around here. Most places have just about any flavor of wing sauce you could ask for... Garlic parm is another good one. Guida's wings are among the best. Windjammers up by Charlotte has great wings too, especially if you prefer a dry rub. There was a place downtown with great wings as well... sadly it's no longer around.

"Trash plates" are really called "garbage plates", but most restaurants don't own that trademark so they call them "trash plates", "mess plates", "heartburn special", etc. I've had maybe one, ever, and it was...it was fine.

Right... they're more commonly known as trash plates now even though "garbage" is the original name. The best trash plates aren't from a restaurant, though, they're homemade. I'm fortunate to have some friends and family that know how to do it right - including homemade meat sauce - and there's no comparison with what you can get in a restaurant. Much better on every level! 

Perhaps it's safest just to say that Dinosaur is the Orleans County of BBQ.

Safest!? I think you know that's probably the least safe thing to say around here! 

[abefroman329]

Admit it: NY-style pizza sold by the slice, and not from a fresh pie, is actually kind of gross.

I'm sorry, that's not a question.

Sorry, Alex Trebek. 

Is NY-style pizza sold by the slice, and not from a fresh pie, actually kind of gross?

[webny99]

Is NY-style pizza sold by the slice, and not from a fresh pie, actually kind of gross?

Well, the logical answer to that would be that if you're going to buy it by the slice, make sure you buy a fresh slice! There aren't many pizzas that aren't best fresh!

[andrepoiy]

Plattsburgh NY or Burlington VT

[Rothman]

Dinosaur BBQ has gone downhill.  Totally overhyped and probably the blandest BBQ in the country now.

Haven't had it super recently (probably been a year or so?) but bland is the last word I would use to describe it. Maybe the Syracuse one has gone downhill, but the Rochester one hasn't, at least to my knowledge.

Definitely not bland, and by far not the blandest even within the state. I think what's really happened is that BBQ elitism has grown, rather than any one place gotten better or worse. It used to be that you could mention Dinosaur as a favorite without much fear of reprisal, but nowadays you'd better be prepared to hear about how worthless it is compared to Kansas City or Memphis or Texas, or...well, you can just read this thread to see what I mean.

I'm not comparing it to Kansas City or Memphis or Texas.  I'm comparing it to itself, actually.  It was good, once upon a time, whether you ate in Troy or in Syracuse.  But, it wasn't only my last time there, but the time before that where I was shocked at their decline in quality.  And it was bland.  Like grandma's oatmeal.

Sticky Lips is better.

(And, Luling City Market in Luling, TX for the best ever. )

[tolbs17]

If this thread was made sooner then I would have put the 270 Park Avenue question in here!

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=30342.0

[empirestate]

Pudgie's is more of Southern Tier chain, in my estimation.

Interesting. Before I looked it up earlier today, the only locations I knew about were Rochester (Goodman St.) and Canandaigua (NY 332).

Yeah, I spent some time in the Southern Tier during the 90s and recall Pudgie's there at the time, before there were any locations near Rochester.

You're missing out! Guida's pizza and wings are the best, especially their cajun wings. In my experience Mark's and Salvatore's are OK, but they're not as good as Guida's.

I wouldn't be in the market for cajun wings–what interests me is the actual Buffalo sauce. (I developed a taste for it while working at Mark's, as it happens. We used to get to fry up and eat any supernumerary wings after packing our dozens.)

That does point up a hazard in trying to identify the best wings, however. Many people are considering fried wings of any flavor, while others are only comparing Buffalo wings. Some would even define a "Buffalo" wing by the cooking method rather than by the sauce. Like so many controversies, it could be that people aren't disagreeing on the answer, but on the question.

There was a place downtown with great wings as well... sadly it's no longer around.

Richmond's?

Right... they're more commonly known as trash plates now even though "garbage" is the original name.

How the times have changed... "In my day" one would never hear "trash plate"!

I'm not comparing it to Kansas City or Memphis or Texas.  I'm comparing it to itself, actually.  It was good, once upon a time, whether you ate in Troy or in Syracuse.  But, it wasn't only my last time there, but the time before that where I was shocked at their decline in quality.  And it was bland.  Like grandma's oatmeal.

Right, I wasn't meaning to describe your specific experience, because of course it didn't happen to me. But rather, just to point out what others are most likely to experience.