Traffic signal

[jakeroot]

I have a feeling jakeroot would tear his hair out if he saw the signal installs in the Oklahoma City area.

I'm actually pretty used to bare-bones installations. Many cities have only just started using them around here.

What irks me more is a messy installation. Signals not spaced evenly; some signals hanging while some are mounted centrally; mast arms far longer than they needs to be; signals mis-matched in terms of color; poor application of the yellow reflective border and/or not all signals have the border (just some randomly); the list goes on.

I wish secondary signals were required, but some agencies really need to clean up their act before I trust them with installing any more than the standard amount. One city near me that requires secondary signals recently annexed an intersection, and they modified it from 16 signal heads to at least 26 while only adding two lanes. They've been doing this for a while, so it's a clean install. But some places would find a way to cock it up.

[Scott5114]

Norman has some pretty...weird setups, although they're not messy. Just a little creative?




Oklahoma City installs are pretty standardized when it comes to their signal housings–pretty much everything is a yellow housing with a black backplate, other than the Project 360 area downtown–but they have some extremely crappy mastarm signage which comes in about 17 different standards.

[US 89]

Oklahoma City installs are pretty standardized when it comes to their signal housings—pretty much everything is a yellow housing with a black backplate, other than the Project 360 area downtown—but they have some extremely crappy mastarm signage which comes in about 17 different standards.

I actually like the look of the horizontal signals with black backplates in downtown OKC. They look sleek and modern.



Salt Lake City is also consistent (mostly) for signal housings. As a general rule, Salt Lake City installs use black housings and black backplates, while UDOT installs opt for yellow housings and black backplates. Most of the time, this is a good way to tell if the road is or recently was a state highway, but of course, there are some exceptions.

But mastarm signage is where you could really start making arguments against Utah for consistency. Salt Lake City alone has at least seven different mastarm signage standards: There are two UDOT standards, an older and a newer. There’s also an older and a newer Salt Lake City standard. There is a rare, much older standard that I’m not sure about, and there’s a relatively uncommon version that I think UDOT tried out briefly around 2000. Finally, there’s a standard  only used on the reconstructed portion of North Temple to accommodate the TRAX Green Line. These signals and street blades look like nothing else in the city or even the state, so I almost wonder if they were done by UTA. There are a few other designs seen around, but they’re so wildly inconsistent I haven’t figured out whether they even belong in a category.

[Scott5114]

Oklahoma City installs are pretty standardized when it comes to their signal housings–pretty much everything is a yellow housing with a black backplate, other than the Project 360 area downtown–but they have some extremely crappy mastarm signage which comes in about 17 different standards.

I actually like the look of the horizontal signals with black backplates in downtown OKC. They look sleek and modern.

Those are the aforementioned P360 signals. They'd look awesome in Dallas or somewhere–the swept-back backplates are really neat. But random horizontal signals in the middle of a city that uses vertical signals, in the middle of a state that by and large uses vertical signals, is asking for trouble. OKC is so consistent otherwise on the vertically-mounted yellow housings with black backplates that when you get to the P360 area it almost feels like you're in another city entirely.

That, and the mastarm signage on those is absolute ass.

[traffic light guy]

Here's something that comes into mind. Has anyone ever seen stainless steel signal poles. How do they not get rusty, as many of the signals in this particular area are a couple decades old:

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0448469,-75.3254475,3a,75y,203.14h,85.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s5Ensxkb_3HQjDABwCAqcZA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I think that at one point, the poles were yellow, but they scrapped all the paint off in order to expose the silver lining. I wonder if these poles have special chemicals in them that don't allow them to get rusty, Wilmington Delaware also had these:
"https://s3-media3.fl.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/lyfxL5ghEOexIooC0-jZGA/ls.jpg"

[roadfro]

Bellevue, WA refuses to place their supplemental post-mounted signals on their own posts, always opting for the mast (probably due to power availability). This sometimes results in the signal being quite far off to the right. I have my own photo, but Street View shows it better

I always thought the power for signal heads came from the pedestal and controller cabinet, regardless of where the head is located. (I could be wrong though.) If that's the case, then placement wouldn't matter.

The example you posted is rather peculiar. That supplemental left turn signal head is so far left that it seems it would be outside the field of view for all cars except first in queue. They could easily have put that signal head on the pole at the corner that is supporting pedestrian signal heads–no extra structural elements required.

Based on this FYA study from 2009 (from Federal Way, WA, where secondary signals are now the rule), secondary signal heads are not always used on retrofit jobs due to lack of available "conduit capacity". I misunderstood this as meaning a power supply issue until this exact moment. I guess it has more to due with the current poles not having enough wiring? It could be that the pedestrian signal head poles that Bellevue has [and continues to] utilise don't have enough wiring to support a signal head. Could also be a wind load issue. I really have no idea.

Here's a brand new signal that, as of this Street View image, had yet to be finished. As you can see, they always use the mast for the secondary signal heads, despite the availability of pedestrian head poles on all four corners. I wish I had a firm answer for why.

By "conduit capacity", they are most likely referring to the piping used to hold the wiring. My understanding is that the wires going to signal heads can be rather thick due to one wire powering three (or more) signal indications. So if an underground conduit going over to a mast was originally sized for wiring of three signal heads, there may not be enough space in the existing conduit to run a fourth wire to add a supplemental signal on that mast.

With that new signal example you posted, the supplemental signal heads look fine on the masts instead of the ped head poles. I think that positioning is better visible to drivers further back in the queue (I could be biased, as this represents pretty typical Nevada layout, lack of far right supplemental through signal notwithstanding).

[chays]

Can someone identify this signal?
http://goldenruleauction.hibid.com/lot/40880198/vintage-stoplight--does-work-missing-some-paint

It has an overlapping-diamond logo on the back:

[traffic light guy]

Can someone identify this signal?
http://goldenruleauction.hibid.com/lot/40880198/vintage-stoplight--does-work-missing-some-paint

It has an overlapping-diamond logo on the back:

That's a checker signal

[freebrickproductions]

Can someone identify this signal?
http://goldenruleauction.hibid.com/lot/40880198/vintage-stoplight--does-work-missing-some-paint

It has an overlapping-diamond logo on the back:

That's a checker signal

Want to say there's another name (as in an actual brand) associated with it, but I can't remember it off the top of my head. "Checker" is certainly the common knick-name though.

The signals were essentially a knock-off of the Eagle Flat-back (the 8 inch ones are almost identical!), and, IIRC, weren't very well built. Not many are left in service, that's for sure, though I want to say California has a good few.

[traffic light guy]

Can someone identify this signal?
http://goldenruleauction.hibid.com/lot/40880198/vintage-stoplight--does-work-missing-some-paint

It has an overlapping-diamond logo on the back:

That's a checker signal

Want to say there's another name (as in an actual brand) associated with it, but I can't remember it off the top of my head. "Checker" is certainly the common knick-name though.

The signals were essentially a knock-off of the Eagle Flat-back (the 8 inch ones are almost identical!), and, IIRC, weren't very well built. Not many are left in service, that's for sure, though I want to say California has a good few.

It looks a mix between the Crouse-Hinds Model R and the Eagle flatback

[jakeroot]

Kind of getting a PEEK feel from these signals too.

[traffic light guy]

One of the main differences between Peeks and TCTs, is that Peek signals are more sleek looking. Crouse-Hinds Type Rs, although they have the same mold, have a more beige color.

[Signal man619]

Its unknown where the word "Checker" derived from, but the manufacturer that made these signal heads is called Signal Computer Corporation, based out of Texas somewhere.

[thenetwork]

The signals were essentially a knock-off of the Eagle Flat-back (the 8 inch ones are almost identical!), and, IIRC, weren't very well built. Not many are left in service, that's for sure, though I want to say California has a good few.

I remember seeing a lot of them back in the day in Cleveland.  Given how they skimped on signal quality in the 80s and early 90s for both traffic and crosswalk signals, they probably were on the el-cheapo side because most seemed to be replaced by the mid-late 90s, while many much older signals outlasted them.

[jakeroot]

Bellevue, WA refuses to place their supplemental post-mounted signals on their own posts, always opting for the mast (probably due to power availability). This sometimes results in the signal being quite far off to the right. I have my own photo, but Street View shows it better

I always thought the power for signal heads came from the pedestal and controller cabinet, regardless of where the head is located. (I could be wrong though.) If that's the case, then placement wouldn't matter.

The example you posted is rather peculiar. That supplemental left turn signal head is so far left that it seems it would be outside the field of view for all cars except first in queue. They could easily have put that signal head on the pole at the corner that is supporting pedestrian signal heads–no extra structural elements required.

Based on this FYA study from 2009 (from Federal Way, WA, where secondary signals are now the rule), secondary signal heads are not always used on retrofit jobs due to lack of available "conduit capacity". I misunderstood this as meaning a power supply issue until this exact moment. I guess it has more to due with the current poles not having enough wiring? It could be that the pedestrian signal head poles that Bellevue has [and continues to] utilise don't have enough wiring to support a signal head. Could also be a wind load issue. I really have no idea.

Here's a brand new signal that, as of this Street View image, had yet to be finished. As you can see, they always use the mast for the secondary signal heads, despite the availability of pedestrian head poles on all four corners. I wish I had a firm answer for why.

By "conduit capacity", they are most likely referring to the piping used to hold the wiring. My understanding is that the wires going to signal heads can be rather thick due to one wire powering three (or more) signal indications. So if an underground conduit going over to a mast was originally sized for wiring of three signal heads, there may not be enough space in the existing conduit to run a fourth wire to add a supplemental signal on that mast.

With that new signal example you posted, the supplemental signal heads look fine on the masts instead of the ped head poles. I think that positioning is better visible to drivers further back in the queue (I could be biased, as this represents pretty typical Nevada layout, lack of far right supplemental through signal notwithstanding).

I see. So really, it should be harder to add an additional signal to a mast, versus a ped head pole, due to the already restrictive thickness of the piping in a mast arm. Seems to me that more signals should be popping up on ped head poles than on the mast for that reason, but I'm no electrician.

For the record, I prefer supplemental heads to be on the mast (looks cleaner to me), but not if the mast is way off to the side like in my first example. So, agreed on the second intersection being well signalised. Just wish they'd start using supplemental through heads while they're at it. More than one signal for a movement is certainly a good start.

[freebrickproductions]

Its unknown where the word "Checker" derived from, but the manufacturer that made these signal heads is called Signal Computer Corporation, based out of Texas somewhere.

Probably in the early days of the internet, based on the text-less logo on the back. And thanks! I had through they were made by Signal Computer Corp. (SCC), but couldn't remember.

The signals were essentially a knock-off of the Eagle Flat-back (the 8 inch ones are almost identical!), and, IIRC, weren't very well built. Not many are left in service, that's for sure, though I want to say California has a good few.

I remember seeing a lot of them back in the day in Cleveland.  Given how they skimped on signal quality in the 80s and early 90s for both traffic and crosswalk signals, they probably were on the el-cheapo side because most seemed to be replaced by the mid-late 90s, while many much older signals outlasted them.

They were, from my understanding. Off the top of my head, the only states that I can think of that still have a few of them in service are California, Alabama, and Arkansas. Wouldn't be surprised if there're a few hiding out in Texas somewhere or some up in Ohio that I'm not remembering.

[roadman65]

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/html/infrastructure/signals.shtml NYCDOT's webpage on traffic signals in the Big Apple.

The Flashing Left Turn Arrow in NYC is not the same as elsewhere.  In New York, the Flashing Arrow is to alert motorists to yield to pedestrians in the crosswalk and not for saying its okay to turn left against oncoming traffic as is elsewhere.

[jakeroot]

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/html/infrastructure/signals.shtml NYCDOT's webpage on traffic signals in the Big Apple.

The Flashing Left Turn Arrow in NYC is not the same as elsewhere.  In New York, the Flashing Arrow is to alert motorists to yield to pedestrians in the crosswalk and not for saying its okay to turn left against oncoming traffic as is elsewhere.

More common than you think.

I have two videos that show FYA's being used exclusively at crosswalks here in Washington:

https://youtu.be/Yk4m574Bi-o

https://youtu.be/UPhOC9G8s88

[freebrickproductions]

Three-sections FYAs are used here in downtown Huntsville where one direction is required to all make a turn at an intersection.

[roadfro]

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/html/infrastructure/signals.shtml NYCDOT's webpage on traffic signals in the Big Apple.

The Flashing Left Turn Arrow in NYC is not the same as elsewhere.  In New York, the Flashing Arrow is to alert motorists to yield to pedestrians in the crosswalk and not for saying its okay to turn left against oncoming traffic as is elsewhere.

The FYA indicates a permitted turn, in which vehicles may cautiously enter the intersection to turn in the direction of the arrow, yielding the right of way to any pedestrians or other vehicles lawfully in the intersection.

So NYC's FYA is the same, they are just applying it for cases of left turns against busy crosswalks or bike lanes, and not necessarily oncoming traffic.

[RestrictOnTheHanger]

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/html/infrastructure/signals.shtml NYCDOT's webpage on traffic signals in the Big Apple.

The Flashing Left Turn Arrow in NYC is not the same as elsewhere.  In New York, the Flashing Arrow is to alert motorists to yield to pedestrians in the crosswalk and not for saying its okay to turn left against oncoming traffic as is elsewhere.

There are 2 such "normal" installs in NYC, one at 57th st at the entranve to the Queensboro Bridge and a recent installation on Staten Island

[TBKS1]

E. Saint Louis, IL

Taken Yesterday.

[plain]

E. Saint Louis, IL

Taken Yesterday.

That visor took a mean right hook lmao

[US 89]

In the same vein, here's this from Atlanta:

[traffic light guy]

Here's something that's a bit confusing. These signals are mounted at an askew intersection, notice how the Eagle Siemens and the TCT signal are wired on the same circuit (Showing red at the same time, showing green at the same time, and so and so forth). This looks a bit dangerous, since the TCT is facing a different direction than the Siemens, wouldn't this cause accidents? This has been this way for a while, is this a wiring issue?

A TCT, an Eagle Siemens, another TCT, and a third TCT by thesignalman, on Flickr