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Regional television markets

Started by Desert Man, November 18, 2017, 10:37:53 PM

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ThatRandomOshawott

Quote from: hbelkins on April 08, 2018, 03:05:31 PM
Quote from: ThatRandomOshawott on April 08, 2018, 02:44:00 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on April 07, 2018, 11:21:03 PM
Quote from: ThatRandomOshawott on April 07, 2018, 11:03:53 PM
Calloway County, KY has an interesting situation with its stations. It is officially in the Paducah/Cape Girardeau/Harrisburg market, but its cable stations get the Big Three Nashville stations. In addition, until recently, they got WBBJ from Jackson.

Is that instead of, or in addition to, the local market stations?
The cable networks get Nashville's stations (and formerly WBBJ) in addition to the Paducah/Cape Girardeau/Harrisburg stations.

What about satellite? Do you know?
They only get the Paducah/Cape Girardeau/Harrisburg stations.
As a side note, back in the days of analog, in the eastern area of the county, you could only get WSIL, WSMV, WTVF, and WPSD. You could not get KFVS.


bing101

Interesting that Palm Springs DMA on the Nielsen Map does not include east Riverside County. It's interesting that Central Riverside county gets a different DMA designation while West and East Riverside County get the Los Angeles TV Stations.

ftballfan

Quote from: bing101 on April 12, 2018, 12:20:36 PM
Interesting that Palm Springs DMA on the Nielsen Map does not include east Riverside County. It's interesting that Central Riverside county gets a different DMA designation while West and East Riverside County get the Los Angeles TV Stations.

The Palm Springs stations are extremely weak and can't reach Blythe (which is basically all that eastern Riverside County contains). Speaking of Blythe, the local cable system carries a mix of Los Angeles and Phoenix stations, with one or two coming from Yuma (which is much closer to Blythe than either LA or Phoenix).

Life in Paradise

Quote from: ftballfan on April 12, 2018, 11:51:47 PM
Quote from: bing101 on April 12, 2018, 12:20:36 PM
Interesting that Palm Springs DMA on the Nielsen Map does not include east Riverside County. It's interesting that Central Riverside county gets a different DMA designation while West and East Riverside County get the Los Angeles TV Stations.

The Palm Springs stations are extremely weak and can't reach Blythe (which is basically all that eastern Riverside County contains). Speaking of Blythe, the local cable system carries a mix of Los Angeles and Phoenix stations, with one or two coming from Yuma (which is much closer to Blythe than either LA or Phoenix).
It is kind of understandable why Palm Springs TV can't make it to Blythe.  It is almost 100 miles between the two by air and there are a couple of mountain ranges between the two (Chuckwalla and Palen).  I'd guess when getting signals for the cable system, it was voted to go with the big time LA stations rather than the little time localls in Palm Springs.

Nanis

Quote from: ftballfan on April 12, 2018, 11:51:47 PM
Quote from: bing101 on April 12, 2018, 12:20:36 PM
Interesting that Palm Springs DMA on the Nielsen Map does not include east Riverside County. It's interesting that Central Riverside county gets a different DMA designation while West and East Riverside County get the Los Angeles TV Stations.

The Palm Springs stations are extremely weak and can't reach Blythe (which is basically all that eastern Riverside County contains). Speaking of Blythe, the local cable system carries a mix of Los Angeles and Phoenix stations, with one or two coming from Yuma (which is much closer to Blythe than either LA or Phoenix).
Who even cares about Blythe? It only has 20,000 or so people. Also I always thought that eastern Riverside county was served by Phoenix only

Map of state roads I have taken pictures for the signs for can be seen here (although four routes ave not been added yet because of their lengths.):
https://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/us_route_map/s7vYO7rC80

bugo

Mena, Arkansas is surrounded by rugged terrain and it is hard to get a good signal from any of the TV stations. When I was a kid, many households could only get KFSM-TV, channel 5, out of Fort Smith. Before cable TV, there was an antenna up on Rich Mountain and you could purchase "cable" TV which was basically just a cable that connected to the antenna. I think the antenna is still there but I don't know if it is still used to bring in TV signals or not. I also don't know if digital signals from any stations are able to be picked up using an over the air antenna. I live in the middle of Tulsa and I can't get some of the local stations, and the terrain is fairly flat and most of the antennas are in Oneta, which is maybe 20 miles from me.

bing101

http://eyesofageneration.com/april-19-1948-the-start-of-the-abc-television-network68-years-ago-today-on/

Here is an interesting one WFIL-TV/WPVI Philadelphia and WMAL/WJLA-TV Washington D.C. have been ABC Affiliates months before ABC started their O&O's from August 1948-1949.

bandit957

Quote from: bugo on April 15, 2018, 04:36:07 PM
Mena, Arkansas is surrounded by rugged terrain and it is hard to get a good signal from any of the TV stations. When I was a kid, many households could only get KFSM-TV, channel 5, out of Fort Smith. Before cable TV, there was an antenna up on Rich Mountain and you could purchase "cable" TV which was basically just a cable that connected to the antenna. I think the antenna is still there but I don't know if it is still used to bring in TV signals or not. I also don't know if digital signals from any stations are able to be picked up using an over the air antenna. I live in the middle of Tulsa and I can't get some of the local stations, and the terrain is fairly flat and most of the antennas are in Oneta, which is maybe 20 miles from me.

I remember seeing maps that had the whole country divided into TV markets, and I did notice Polk County was in the Little Rock market. I thought that was strange, since it's much closer to Fort Smith.
Might as well face it, pooing is cool

Nanis

I don't know how but I can't get my ABC station. What is even odder is that people in my neighborhood get it with antennas.
Map of state roads I have taken pictures for the signs for can be seen here (although four routes ave not been added yet because of their lengths.):
https://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/us_route_map/s7vYO7rC80

Nanis

Quote from: bandit957 on April 15, 2018, 06:14:19 PM
Quote from: bugo on April 15, 2018, 04:36:07 PM
Mena, Arkansas is surrounded by rugged terrain and it is hard to get a good signal from any of the TV stations. When I was a kid, many households could only get KFSM-TV, channel 5, out of Fort Smith. Before cable TV, there was an antenna up on Rich Mountain and you could purchase "cable" TV which was basically just a cable that connected to the antenna. I think the antenna is still there but I don't know if it is still used to bring in TV signals or not. I also don't know if digital signals from any stations are able to be picked up using an over the air antenna. I live in the middle of Tulsa and I can't get some of the local stations, and the terrain is fairly flat and most of the antennas are in Oneta, which is maybe 20 miles from me.

I remember seeing maps that had the whole country divided into TV markets, and I did notice Polk County was in the Little Rock market. I thought that was strange, since it's much closer to Fort Smith.
Those maps are quite inaccurate due to age. The younger it is, the more accurate it is This is due to the fact that the counties "flip flop" from market to market.
Map of state roads I have taken pictures for the signs for can be seen here (although four routes ave not been added yet because of their lengths.):
https://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/us_route_map/s7vYO7rC80

SP Cook

Quote from: bandit957 on April 15, 2018, 06:14:19 PM
I remember seeing maps that had the whole country divided into TV markets, and I did notice Polk County was in the Little Rock market. I thought that was strange, since it's much closer to Fort Smith.

Those maps are copyright by the Nielsen company and they are VERY defensive of it.  Posts of the maps get taken down quickly. 

With trivial exceptions, the maps are based strictly on county lines and are based on which town's stations are watched the most in that county.  They can change every year, and lots of factors can change them.  Small markets, which do not have "all" four networks tend to get squeezed.  Often a change can come down to the preferences of the handful of Nielsen "families" in a rural county from one year's survey to the next. 

Market size is important to broadcast companies, because ad buyers pay based on it, ignoring the survey errors.  Stations do lots of things to keep rural counties on their borders.  In my area, the Huntington - Charleston stations grossly over-cover goings on in Athens county, Ohio and of Ohio University, in order to keep it in their market.  The Columbus stations, also receivable there, do not care because their market is large enough already.  They are also careful to cover the geographically huge (largest in Kentucky, I think) Pike county, because the terrain makes OTA TV pretty difficult and depending on what part you are in the closest set of TV stations can be one of four posibilities. 

bandit957

Quote from: SP Cook on April 16, 2018, 09:43:51 AM
Market size is important to broadcast companies, because ad buyers pay based on it, ignoring the survey errors.  Stations do lots of things to keep rural counties on their borders.  In my area, the Huntington - Charleston stations grossly over-cover goings on in Athens county, Ohio and of Ohio University, in order to keep it in their market.  The Columbus stations, also receivable there, do not care because their market is large enough already.  They are also careful to cover the geographically huge (largest in Kentucky, I think) Pike county, because the terrain makes OTA TV pretty difficult and depending on what part you are in the closest set of TV stations can be one of four posibilities.

I don't know how over-the-air reception in Pike County or Athens County is even possible, since I can't even get all the Cincinnati stations anymore, even though I'm only a couple miles from Cincinnati.
Might as well face it, pooing is cool

Nanis

I still don't get how Mercer county is part of my market.
Map of state roads I have taken pictures for the signs for can be seen here (although four routes ave not been added yet because of their lengths.):
https://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/us_route_map/s7vYO7rC80

hotdogPi

Quote from: Nanis on April 20, 2018, 07:45:51 PM
I still don't get how Mercer county is part of my market.

Assuming you mean Mercer County, NJ and not Mercer County, PA, it's reasonable; Trenton doesn't have its own market.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

Nanis

Quote from: 1 on April 20, 2018, 07:56:43 PM
Quote from: Nanis on April 20, 2018, 07:45:51 PM
I still don't get how Mercer county is part of my market.

Assuming you mean Mercer County, NJ and not Mercer County, PA, it's reasonable; Trenton doesn't have its own market.
I know that much, but why is it not part of the NYC market?
Map of state roads I have taken pictures for the signs for can be seen here (although four routes ave not been added yet because of their lengths.):
https://www.scribblemaps.com/maps/view/us_route_map/s7vYO7rC80

KEVIN_224

Probably because it's physically closer to Philadelphia and that Pennsylvania is on the other side of the river? I've seen ads for WPVI-TV (ABC) channel 6 at Arm & Hammer Field more than once.


Desert Man

Quote from: bing101 on April 12, 2018, 12:20:36 PM
Interesting that Palm Springs DMA on the Nielsen Map does not include east Riverside County. It's interesting that Central Riverside county gets a different DMA designation while West and East Riverside County get the Los Angeles TV Stations.

I recalled when channel 13 (KBLU/KYEL/KSWT) and channel 9 (KECY) was somewhat on air in Indio-Coachella CA, but on a non-Daylight "Mountain Time" schedule. You need a good antennae to receive a second ABC, CBS or NBC affiliate, along with Palm Springs' KPLM/KESQ (always ABC) and KMIR (always NBC). In the 1970s, 3 LA TV and 1 San Diego TV station had low-watt transmitters in Palm Springs, but didn't quite reach Indio. If you're in between the two cities, you had 3 "big 3" and a PBS station (KVCR 24 from Riverside-San Bernardino) and Spanish either from KMEX Los Angeles or XHBC Mexicali. 
Get your kicks...on Route 99! Like to turn 66 upside down. The other historic Main street of America.

Desert Man

3 things about the Palm Springs DMA is 1. it's among the smallest in size (35 mile radius from Palm Springs to reach Hemet, Morongo Basin and the Salton Sea), 2. smallest in population (the bottom 50) and 3. existed for only 50 years (1968) when KMIR and KPLM, later KESQ went on the air. In the 1950s, Palm Springs was the test site of the world's first pay-premium TV known as Telemeter which had 7 big LA TV stations and a movie channel, but the local theater managed to get that shut down within one year.
Get your kicks...on Route 99! Like to turn 66 upside down. The other historic Main street of America.

bing101


SP Cook

Gray is, IMHO, a good TV station owner.  They usually are the ratings leader in local news, because they try harder.  They tend to keep politics out of their news.  They try to be involved in the community, have outreach programs and give tours to school kids. 

Sinclair, BTW, has doubled down on the stupid trying to get its merger with Tribune approved.  For those of you who don't know, federal law prevents any one company from owning stations in more than 39% of the country or more than one of the "big 4" stations in any one market.  Sinclair has a group of dummy companies owned by shills (two of which are currently dead) to bypass these limits.  With the FCC and FTC looking to turn down its purchase of Tribune, it released a list of stations it will "sell".  The its own shills.


hbelkins

Quote from: SP Cook on May 03, 2018, 01:44:13 PM
Gray is, IMHO, a good TV station owner.  They usually are the ratings leader in local news, because they try harder.  They tend to keep politics out of their news.  They try to be involved in the community, have outreach programs and give tours to school kids. 

WYMT-TV in Hazard is a Gray station, and they really do an excellent job with community outreach and being involved. Their sister station WKYT in Lexington is also a Gray station, and Gray owns a station in Knoxville and the Huntington/Charleston market as well, but I can't think of their affiliations (WKYT and WYMT are CBS affiliates.)

There are a number of commenters on WKYT and WYMT's websites and Facebook pages who would disagree with that "no politics" observation. I've seen both stations frequently described as being too liberal.


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

SP Cook

Their Huntington station is WSAZ, which is NBC.  Since ratings started in 1968, it has never had a local news rating lower than double all other stations combined.  They also own the local CW channel, which has a WSAZ produced 10:00 news show. 

Yes, in national politics, most all TV stations, including Gray's and Sinclair's, are at the conspiracy theorist left edge, when they do national coverage.  This goes without saying.  However in local politics around here, WSAZ tends to look at both sides of things.  This is a huge contrast to Charleston and Huntington 's extremist left newspapers; and to the other local stations which are Sinclair's illegally owned Fox/ABC combination which is in the pocket of the Charleston courthouse gang and are more or less a PR agency for their goofy development plans and the previous owners of the CBS, which was a shill for the pure evil Goodwin/Rockefeller political crime family.  Nextstar just bought the place out of quasi-bankruptcy, but really has not yet made any significant staff changes.  Nobody takes either of the other two TV stations' reporting seriously. 

                                                                                     

vdeane

If FOX/ABC combos are illegal, then there are a LOT of places in violation.  Nextar owns both the ABC and FOX stations here in Albany.  This does allow for there to be a LOT of local news in the evening; the ABC station carries 4-6:30, and 11-11:35, with FOX carrying 7-7:30 and 10-11.

On another note, I find it hard to consider a company that forces its stations to air segments where the CEO complains about snowflakes and social justice warriors to be "conspiracy theorist left".  Unless you meant the "world" news, which comes from the main network rather than Sinclair.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

bugo

Quote from: hbelkins on May 03, 2018, 02:44:48 PM
There are a number of commenters on WKYT and WYMT's websites and Facebook pages who would disagree with that "no politics" observation. I've seen both stations frequently described as being too liberal.

To you, HB, anything to the left of Sputnik News, Russia Times or Breitbart is "too liberal". I wouldn't be surprised if you called Fox News a part of the "liberal media". It's all about perspectives.

bugo

Sinclair is a propaganda arm of the Republican Party. It is the American version of the Soviet era Pravda newspaper.



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