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The Clearview thread

Started by BigMattFromTexas, August 03, 2009, 05:35:25 PM

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Which do you think is better: Highway Gothic or Clearview?

Highway Gothic
Clearview

Brandon

Did some poking around on Google's Street View (dang, I love that!) and found that even Northwest Territories is using Clearview.  Granted, their directional signs are white on blue, but it's definitely Clearview.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=61.073068,-117.494144&spn=0,359.856148&t=h&z=14&layer=c&cbll=61.073086,-117.494568&panoid=QtNA7rUtR6hqDYdDHMkXhQ&cbp=12,297.85,,0,4.14
"If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention." - Ramsay Bolton

"Symbolic of his struggle against reality." - Reg


shoptb1

The first of the new Clearview BGS's have been installed on I-71 Southbound between Columbus and Cincinnati.  The new mounting posts are installed between Grove City and Jeffersonville, but except for these two signs on the 6-lane section around Jeffersonville, the signs themselves haven't been installed yet.  I think they look great...glad that they have finally aligned the OH-435 shield (the old one was just slapped on and not aligned correctly on the sign). 





Riverside Frwy

Shoot, the exit numbers are Clearview. Atleast the shields aren't

BigMattFromTexas

#253
San Antonio...

BigMatt

Ian

Quote from: Riverside Frwy on February 28, 2010, 02:01:31 PM
Shoot, the exit numbers are Clearview. Atleast the shields aren't

Lets keep it this way ;-)
UMaine graduate, former PennDOT employee, new SoCal resident.
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shoptb1

Quote from: PennDOTFan on February 28, 2010, 06:02:40 PM
Quote from: Riverside Frwy on February 28, 2010, 02:01:31 PM
Shoot, the exit numbers are Clearview. Atleast the shields aren't

Lets keep it this way ;-)

I agree.  I do not like the shields in Clearview, although I do think the signs and exit tabs should be.

burgess87

What does the "CH" on the IH 71 BGSes in Ohio stand for?

I've been through there recently, and couldn't understand what it meant.

bulldog1979

Quote from: burgess87 on March 01, 2010, 03:30:41 PM
What does the "CH" on the IH 71 BGSes in Ohio stand for?

I've been through there recently, and couldn't understand what it meant.

Isn't that an abbreviation for the place name "Washington Courthouse"?

andrewkbrown

#258
Quote from: bulldog1979 on March 01, 2010, 03:34:33 PM
Quote from: burgess87 on March 01, 2010, 03:30:41 PM
What does the "CH" on the IH 71 BGSes in Ohio stand for?

I've been through there recently, and couldn't understand what it meant.

Isn't that an abbreviation for the place name "Washington Courthouse"?

That's Correct. It's 20 miles from my hometown, Wilmington.
There's an interesting old sign in Wilmington giving the distance to Washington CH on US22/OH3. Yet, unlike the common abbreviation, this sign shows it as "Wash. Court House." Spelling the CH completely, but not Washington.
Firefighter/Paramedic
Washington DC Fire & EMS

shoptb1

Quote from: burgess87 on March 01, 2010, 03:30:41 PM
What does the "CH" on the IH 71 BGSes in Ohio stand for?

I've been through there recently, and couldn't understand what it meant.

Yep, as stated, it stands for Washington Court House.  I wish that ODOT would sign it 'Washington C.H.' instead of just CH, but that's just me being anal.

mightyace

#260
Here are the northbound versions of signs in December before they were changed:



Notice South Solon instead of Washington Court House as a control point.



They at least had the C and H separated!  And, no mention of Xenia.  (Of course, the correction of the signs and adding "TO" on US 35 was necessary.)

I'll miss ol' button copy signs!  :-(
My Flickr Photos: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mightyace

I'm out of this F***KING PLACE!

burgess87

Thanks for that.  Being a hockey fan, I saw the "CH" and I'm like, "No way the Montreal Canadiens have anything going on in Ohio, unless they're playing Columbus."

:pan:

BigMattFromTexas

#262
*OFF TOPIC*
^ GO PENGUINS!!!
Okay so I'll put it back on topic now, haha
San Angelo uses Clearview on all of the signs except for the standalones on Loop 306 just before it becomes US 67.
Here's a shot of it on near downtown:

Highway gothic :)


Sorry, I erased what DTP said, but I understand, but I've still seen worse on here... haha
BigMatt

J N Winkler

#263
The conversion to Clearview has led to problems in how signs are shown in construction plans sets.  Here is a before-and-after example courtesy of Illinois DOT, whose default sign design program is Transoft's GuidSIGN.

This sign design sheet was produced shortly before Illinois DOT adopted Clearview:



Note that all of the sign legend, including shields and white-on-green text elements, is pattern-accurate.

Now compare with this sheet, which comes from one of five or six fairly large contracts which Illinois DOT has let recently for major work on I-290 (the Eisenhower Expressway) in suburban Chicago:



As you can see, an ugly placeholder typeface (from the same general family as Arial and Helvetica) has been used in place of the actual Clearview legend.  The only parts of the sign that actually use the correct typeface are the shields, which still use the FHWA alphabet series.

This problem is especially common with state DOTs, like Illinois DOT and Virginia DOT, which have standardized on GuidSIGN for their sign design, but it is by no means confined to them--other state DOTs which use SignCAD instead have had problems getting Clearview legend to render correctly on plan sheets.  If you don't have the right version of signcad.rsc, Clearview legend will not render correctly, full stop.

In the distant past it took a special effort to produce pattern-accurate sign design sheets--you had to work with special stencils or stamps to get letters of the correct shape on the plan sheet.  This is why relatively few states, like Arizona, Minnesota, and Nevada, have pattern-accurate sign design sheets dating from the era of first Interstate construction.  But the number of state DOTs producing pattern-accurate sign design sheets has increased monotonically since 2000 with the increasing availability of sign design software capable of producing pattern-accurate output.  So the introduction of Clearview without adequate support for it in state DOT sign design software installations has been very much a retrograde step.  VDOT has finally got its act together and is now producing pattern-accurate Clearview signs in GuidSIGN, and Illinois DOT will probably follow suit eventually, but in the meantime there are literally hundreds of sign design sheets for the I-290 work which are not pattern-accurate for want of Clearview font support.
"It is necessary to spend a hundred lire now to save a thousand lire later."--Piero Puricelli, explaining the need for a first-class road system to Benito Mussolini

ctsignguy

Quote from: mightyace on March 01, 2010, 08:44:24 PM
Here are the northbound versions of signs in December before they were changed:



Notice South Solon instead of Washington Court House as a control point.



They at least had the C and H separated!  And, no mention of Xenia.  (Of course, the correction of the signs and adding "TO" on US 35 was necessary.)

I'll miss ol' button copy signs!  :-(

ODOT has had a general practice of not placing cities on BGS where you would have to 'drive back' to get to that town.  That was why you see no mention of Xenia on that Ohio 435/US 35 BGS.....by their thinking, US 68 was the Xenia exit for I-71 north.  But when you drive south on I-71, 435/35 is Xenia....but no real mention on the US 68 exit

There are exceptions, but not many
http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u102/ctsignguy/<br /><br />Maintaining an interest in Fine Highway Signs since 1958....

WNYroadgeek


vdeane

So does this mean NYSDOT is doing clearview or not?  Given the sign's location, I can't really tell which authority put it up.

Though I've always wondered if one sign on I-390 for exit 15B is clearview.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

cu2010

It (and the one it replaced) looks like a NYSTA sign. It's just at the end of the concrete just past the Exit 47 tollbooth heading up 490.

It wouldn't look so bad if the letters weren't entirely too large.
This is cu2010, reminding you, help control the ugly sign population, don't have your shields spayed or neutered.

Duke87

Quote from: cu2010 on March 24, 2010, 12:47:31 PM
It wouldn't look so bad if the letters weren't entirely too large.

And if the numbers in the NY 19 shield weren't too small.
If you always take the same road, you will never see anything new.

andrewkbrown

#269
Quote from: ctsignguy on March 23, 2010, 09:08:25 PM
Quote from: mightyace on March 01, 2010, 08:44:24 PM
Here are the northbound versions of signs in December before they were changed:



I've noticed that too. The I-71 north exit to US

Notice South Solon instead of Washington Court House as a control point.



They at least had the C and H separated!  And, no mention of Xenia.  (Of course, the correction of the signs and adding "TO" on US 35 was necessary.)

I'll miss ol' button copy signs!  :-(

ODOT has had a general practice of not placing cities on BGS where you would have to 'drive back' to get to that town.  That was why you see no mention of Xenia on that Ohio 435/US 35 BGS.....by their thinking, US 68 was the Xenia exit for I-71 north.  But when you drive south on I-71, 435/35 is Xenia....but no real mention on the US 68 exit

There are exceptions, but not many

I've noticed that too, with Wilmington posted for I-71 south exit to US 68, and Xenia for I-71 north at US 68.
Yet at SR 73 and I-71, both directions are signed Waynesville Wilmington.
Then there's the SR 72 exit at I-71. For Jamestown Sabina, even though SR 72 doesn't actually go through Sabina.
Firefighter/Paramedic
Washington DC Fire & EMS

BigMattFromTexas

Okay, so am I the only one who thinks if an areas highway signage is gonna be in Clearview, the rest of it should be in Clearview, and not Gothic? They seem to do that a whole lot here in Angelo...
BigMatt

Ian

Quote from: BigMatt on March 24, 2010, 09:04:41 PM
Okay, so am I the only one who thinks if an areas highway signage is gonna be in Clearview, the rest of it should be in Clearview, and not Gothic? They seem to do that a whole lot here in Angelo...
BigMatt

Not really. I mean, each sign has a right to stay put up until its lifespan is done or if it is damaged or badly faded.
UMaine graduate, former PennDOT employee, new SoCal resident.
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BigMattFromTexas

#272
Quote from: BigMatt on March 24, 2010, 09:12:31 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on March 24, 2010, 09:07:29 PM
Okay, so am I the only one who thinks if an areas highway signage is gonna be in Clearview, the rest of it should be in Clearview, and not Gothic? They seem to do that a whole lot here in Angelo...
BigMatt

Not really. I mean, each sign has a right to stay put up until its lifespan is done or if it is damaged or badly faded.

Ok, let me explain, here in Angelo they built Houston Harte Expressway, all the signs (except for one) are in Clearview, then theres this one sign that was put up at the same time as the other ones, that is in Gothic, I don't really get where that came in, I'm saying that if you're gonna do new signage in a complete area, wouldn't you expect all the signs to be in the same font...
BigMatt

Ian

Quote from: BigMatt on March 24, 2010, 09:12:31 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on March 24, 2010, 09:07:29 PM
Quote from: BigMatt on March 24, 2010, 09:04:41 PM
Okay, so am I the only one who thinks if an areas highway signage is gonna be in Clearview, the rest of it should be in Clearview, and not Gothic? They seem to do that a whole lot here in Angelo...
BigMatt

Not really. I mean, each sign has a right to stay put up until its lifespan is done or if it is damaged or badly faded.
Ok, let me explain, here in Angelo they built Houston Harte Expressway, all the signs (except for one) are in Clearview, then theres this one sign that was put up at the same time as the other ones, that is in Gothic, I don't really get where that came in, I'm saying that if you're gonna do new signage wouldn't you expect all the signs to be in the same font...
BigMatt

Oh ok. Probably a different contractor doing the signage or something. There are plenty of new signage bring installed in the Philadelphia area that are both clearview and gothic.
UMaine graduate, former PennDOT employee, new SoCal resident.
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BigMattFromTexas

Ok, cause it's for Central High School, SAISD prolly ignorantly requested the sign after the rest of the signs had been ordered and whatnot. Central thinks they're the best even though last year the football team went 0-10 and this year was 2-8...
BigMatt



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