Kroger to buy Albertsons?

[Lukeisroads]

So if albertsons gets bought will pavilions vons safeway and the other companies they own go with them

[J N Winkler]

They could also pass a law saying "It shall be unlawful for the FTC to approve a merger between any companies based in Cincinnati, Ohio and any companies based in Boise, Idaho" or some nonsense like that.

I am not sure that would comport with the part of the Contract Clause that bans bills of attainder, though language that is local or private is allowed as long as it confers a benefit (Acts of Congress have occasionally been used to confer US citizenship on named individuals).

[Scott5114]

They could also pass a law saying "It shall be unlawful for the FTC to approve a merger between any companies based in Cincinnati, Ohio and any companies based in Boise, Idaho" or some nonsense like that.

I am not sure that would comport with the part of the Contract Clause that bans bills of attainder, though language that is local or private is allowed as long as it confers a benefit (Acts of Congress have occasionally been used to confer US citizenship on named individuals).

Legislatures in the United States have long sidestepped this by carving out incredibly specific criteria that in practice applies to only one subject (e.g. "all cities in X county, with a population between Y and Z" which happens to resolve to a single target city). I am not sure if there is case law on the subject, however, nor whether this sort of thing is viable at the federal level like it seems to be at the state level. 

[J N Winkler]

Legislatures in the United States have long sidestepped this by carving out incredibly specific criteria that in practice applies to only one subject (e.g. "all cities in X county, with a population between Y and Z" which happens to resolve to a single target city). I am not sure if there is case law on the subject, however, nor whether this sort of thing is viable at the federal level like it seems to be at the state level.

My concern would be that specifying the parties to be disqualified as categories would not suffice to preclude the argument that the measure was in fact a bill of attainder in disguise.

Edit:  I found (through a Google Images search, of all things) a Congressional Research Service report suggesting that this worry is well-founded.  It describes a case (dating from Obama's first term) in which the Second Circuit ruled that a proscription whose target was cast in general terms as organizations active in registering voters was in fact narrowly aimed at ACORN and thus was unconstitutional as a bill of attainder.

[Dirt Roads]

So if albertsons gets bought will pavilions vons safeway and the other companies they own go with them

Maybe.  Kroger is aiming for market share (as compared to total U.S. grocery sales volumes) so as to compete with Walmart in the prices that they pay to largest suppliers (greater volume usually equals lower prices).  But they know that a big part of the merger game is competition.  In the past, it has been common that Kroger will spin off entire subsidiaries in order to deal with complaints (local and regional) about anti-competitive forces of the merger.  When Kroger has spun off a handful of local stores of a particular subsidiary chain, they sometimes get them back in another unrelated store swap later on (but operating under a different name).  Who knows how many stores and chains will get spun off.  Additionally,  Kroger is particularly focused on picking up regional market share in Florida.

Other chains owned by Albertsons are:  Jewel-Osco, Acme, Randalls, Carrs-Safeway, United, Haggen,  Kings, Plated, Shaw's, Tom Thumb and Star Market.  Shaw's and Star Market are in the Northeast and are operated as a single subsidiary.

[Ted$8roadFan]

So if albertsons gets bought will pavilions vons safeway and the other companies they own go with them

Maybe.  Kroger is aiming for market share (as compared to total U.S. grocery sales volumes) so as to compete with Walmart in the prices that they pay to largest suppliers (greater volume usually equals lower prices).  But they know that a big part of the merger game is competition.  In the past, it has been common that Kroger will spin off entire subsidiaries in order to deal with complaints (local and regional) about anti-competitive forces of the merger.  When Kroger has spun off a handful of local stores of a particular subsidiary chain, they sometimes get them back in another unrelated store swap later on (but operating under a different name).  Who knows how many stores and chains will get spun off.  Additionally,  Kroger is particularly focused on picking up regional market share in Florida.

Other chains owned by Albertsons are:  Jewel-Osco, Acme, Randalls, Carrs-Safeway, United, Haggen,  Kings, Plated, Shaw's, Tom Thumb and Star Market.  Shaw's and Star Market are in the Northeast and are operated as a single subsidiary.

I wonder what Kroger's strategy is in Florida, given that their non-Walmart competition is mostly Publix and Winn-Dixie.

[Dirt Roads]

So if albertsons gets bought will pavilions vons safeway and the other companies they own go with them

Maybe.  Kroger is aiming for market share (as compared to total U.S. grocery sales volumes) so as to compete with Walmart in the prices that they pay to largest suppliers (greater volume usually equals lower prices).  But they know that a big part of the merger game is competition.  In the past, it has been common that Kroger will spin off entire subsidiaries in order to deal with complaints (local and regional) about anti-competitive forces of the merger.  When Kroger has spun off a handful of local stores of a particular subsidiary chain, they sometimes get them back in another unrelated store swap later on (but operating under a different name).  Who knows how many stores and chains will get spun off.  Additionally,  Kroger is particularly focused on picking up regional market share in Florida.

Other chains owned by Albertsons are:  Jewel-Osco, Acme, Randalls, Carrs-Safeway, United, Haggen,  Kings, Plated, Shaw's, Tom Thumb and Star Market.  Shaw's and Star Market are in the Northeast and are operated as a single subsidiary.

I wonder what Kroger's strategy is in Florida, given that their non-Walmart competition is mostly Publix and Winn-Dixie.

Same question here.  Albertson's has less than 50 stores in Florida, certainly not enough to make a dent in the regional marketshare.  One article that I read indicated that Kroger wants to start a nationwide delivery service similar to Amazon and Walmart.  Kroger doesn't sell a huge volume of [non-grocery] items, but it is my perception that the average Kroger-branded store has three times as much [non-grocery] products on its shelves that any other chain.  In this case, Kroger feels the need to develop a strong warehouse/supply chain presence in many new markets in order to just launch such a service nationwide.  They may be missing the point here, as Amazon seems to be happy to provide [supply chain services] to a not insignificant portion of Walmart customers (and Walmart may be doing the same thing for other chains).

Going down a different rabbit hole, Kroger has a pretty decent delivery network already in place.  After the left the Raleigh/Durham market, I've tried to procure some dry goods from Kroger.com that we can't find elsewhere (not part of Harris-Teeter's regional supply chain).  They can deliver them to my sister in West Virginia, but not to us here in North Carolina (they will deliver some things to us in North Carolina, but these particular products don't show up on the website using our address).  We often have her purchase those items wherever she can find them cheapest, and we get them whenever we see her.

[SP Cook]

At the end of the day the merged Kroger will be very close to a nationwide chain, leaving out Florida for the most part.  Other than simply stores there, which would not be wise and would take more than a decade to reach the economy of scale it needs, there is no merger the government would approve that gets them there. 

[Scott5114]

Kroger just launched a warehouse and delivery network in Central Oklahoma despite the fact that they have no stores here. I'm not sure how many people would actually use grocery delivery from a store they've never been in.

[Dirt Roads]

Kroger just launched a warehouse and delivery network in Central Oklahoma despite the fact that they have no stores here. I'm not sure how many people would actually use grocery delivery from a store they've never been in.

Excellent question (one that is on my mind, as well).  Kroger has a huge following for its own label brands, particularly Big K sodas (where you can get a huge array of flavors in both regular and diet).  Back in their heyday, you could get Kroger peanut butter in 5-pound buckets and everyone kept the old used buckets for years-and-years (and thusly, Kroger peanut butter is still a big draw).  Once or twice a year, you can get whole wheat bagels from Thomas, but Kroger has their store brand all year long.  But many of us are not huge fans of Kroger itself; too big, impersonal and understaffed.   I've forgotten some of the other goodies.  Although I like having Kroger online as an option, but many of the products are not simply worth bothering with the effort (and security risk) of online shopping.

Unless Kroger can find a way to move enough of its store-label products quickly enough to warrant restocking, it is hard to imagine how they can sell this stuff in states where they don't have a presence (or even a strong presence).  Perhaps (as I eluded before), Kroger is getting more into the distribution and warehouse side and selling their services to smaller chains (and competitors).  ...And blocking customers from being capable of ordering stuff that is not profitable in certain regions (even if we were willing to pay to have the dry goods shipped from somewhere else).

[WillWeaverRVA]

Kroger just launched a warehouse and delivery network in Central Oklahoma despite the fact that they have no stores here. I'm not sure how many people would actually use grocery delivery from a store they've never been in.

Are there any Kroger-owned chains in that part of Oklahoma?

[hbelkins]

But many of us are not huge fans of Kroger itself; too big, impersonal and understaffed.

As I've stated many times before, my complaint about Kroger is that when items aren't on sale, they're extremely expensive. I've noticed this more over the last 25 or so years, much more so than when I was in college and Kroger was a great place to shop for college kids with limited funds.

Kroger's sales are great, but if they don't have a sale going on, I'd much rather shop at a Walmart Supercenter.

[bandit957]

For several years now, since even before the pandemic, our Kroger has always been out of everything. The store is full of bare shelves. And that's for items they even still carry.

[Dirt Roads]

But many of us are not huge fans of Kroger itself; too big, impersonal and understaffed.

As I've stated many times before, my complaint about Kroger is that when items aren't on sale, they're extremely expensive. I've noticed this more over the last 25 or so years, much more so than when I was in college and Kroger was a great place to shop for college kids with limited funds.

Kroger's sales are great, but if they don't have a sale going on, I'd much rather shop at a Walmart Supercenter.

...And my complaint about Walmart is that when items aren't on sale, they're extremely expensive.  That wasn't true before 2019.  So you can imagine what I think about Kroger's prices.  Harris Teeter's prices are worse (except they usually have a bunch of stuff that I'm cherry-picking on sale).   

[hotdogPi]

I refuse to shop at Walmart and will continue to do so until they get a union.

[Pink Jazz]

During the holidays, Fry's (Kroger) usually has equal or best prices on the Welch's Sparkling juices, while outside the holiday season, Walmart usually wins.

[hbelkins]

I refuse to shop at Walmart and will continue to do so until they get a union.

That's on the employees, not the company. If you want Walmart to unionize, convince the employees to start the process.

Unionization is one reason Kroger's prices are so high. They require their part-time high school workers join the union. (Source: a number of people in Powell County, Ky., when Kroger bought out a local store and converted it to a Kroger as an experiment in re-entering smaller markets that the chain had abandoned in prior years, such as in neighboring Estill County, Ky., which had a Kroger when I was growing up.)

[bandit957]

Unionization is one reason Kroger's prices are so high. They require their part-time high school workers join the union.

What's worse is that it's the UFCW, which is run by a bunch of crooks.

[kphoger]

Kroger just launched a warehouse and delivery network in Central Oklahoma despite the fact that they have no stores here. I'm not sure how many people would actually use grocery delivery from a store they've never been in.

Are there any Kroger-owned chains in that part of Oklahoma?

Nope, not for decades.

[Road Hog]

There were plans for a Tom Thumb on the south end of my town, but there's a Kroger a mile south of it, so something else will go there. Maybe an H-E-B?

[-- US 175 --]

Kroger just launched a warehouse and delivery network in Central Oklahoma despite the fact that they have no stores here. I'm not sure how many people would actually use grocery delivery from a store they've never been in.

Similarly, Kroger has begun delivery service in Austin and San Antonio-- 2 cities that Kroger hasn't had stores in in quite a few years.  Other than Walmart and Whole Foods, the predominant grocer in both cities is H-E-B.  I'm not sure how well Kroger thinks they'll do there after being absent for so long.  H-E-B has their own delivery through Favor, and Walmart has their own delivery service.

[Rothman]

I refuse to shop at Walmart and will continue to do so until they get a union.

That's on the employees, not the company. If you want Walmart to unionize, convince the employees to start the process.

Unionization is one reason Kroger's prices are so high. They require their part-time high school workers join the union. (Source: a number of people in Powell County, Ky., when Kroger bought out a local store and converted it to a Kroger as an experiment in re-entering smaller markets that the chain had abandoned in prior years, such as in neighboring Estill County, Ky., which had a Kroger when I was growing up.)

Pfft.  Doesn't seem to hurt Kroger, either.  Other chains are unionized, though, like Stop & Shop.

Still, I am wary of the effectiveness of supermarket unions.  They do seem to be captured by management, in my limited experience.

[hotdogPi]

Still, I am wary of the effectiveness of supermarket unions.  They do seem to be captured by management, in my limited experience.

The one I was in was quite good, although part of that might have been that the location I worked was a low-volume store so the management wasn't trying to do stuff they weren't supposed to since it didn't matter as much.

[Rothman]

Still, I am wary of the effectiveness of supermarket unions.  They do seem to be captured by management, in my limited experience.

The one I was in was quite good, although part of that might have been that the location I worked was a low-volume store so the management wasn't trying to do stuff they weren't supposed to since it didn't matter as much.

Glad to hear it.

Although I certainly haven't agreed with all of my union's actions, I'd rather have one than not.  In my case, it really does make negotiations more even-keeled than if it was everyone for themselves.

[thenetwork]

I refuse to shop at Walmart and will continue to do so until they get a union.

That's on the employees, not the company. If you want Walmart to unionize, convince the employees to start the process.

Unionization is one reason Kroger's prices are so high. They require their part-time high school workers join the union. (Source: a number of people in Powell County, Ky., when Kroger bought out a local store and converted it to a Kroger as an experiment in re-entering smaller markets that the chain had abandoned in prior years, such as in neighboring Estill County, Ky., which had a Kroger when I was growing up.)

I think that's more of a union demand (high schoolers in the union).  I worked at a union grocer back in my high school and had to join the UFCW.  I remember having 2-3 paychecks where about 80% of my take home was taken out to pay for "initiation fees" on top of the usual union dues.