Making a u-turn at a left lane signed with R3-5L sign

[SeriesE]

https://www.tssco.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Left_turn_only_R3-5L.jpg

Is it legal in your state to make a u-turn at a lane with this sign (and no "no u-turn" signs are present)?

[roadfro]

In Nevada, yes. Nevada allows a U-turn where it can be made safely, unless a "No U-Turn" sign is posted or the maneuver is otherwise prohibited by statute.

[7/8]

Ontario also allows U-turns unless prohibited by signage. They're also illegal if you're on a curve in the road, on or near a railway crossing or hilltop, or near a bridge or tunnel that blocks your view. You must be able to see at least 150 metres in both directions. (source).

It annoys me that Hespeler Rd in Cambridge has "U-turn permitted" signage at most intersections (GSV link), since they're already permitted even if the sign isn't there. I remember during my co-op at the Region of Waterloo some employees were arguing that the signs are a bad idea since they could confuse people into thinking U-turns aren't permitted elsewhere without that sign.

[Rothman]

https://www.tssco.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Left_turn_only_R3-5L.jpg

Is it legal in your state to make a u-turn at a lane with this sign (and no "no u-turn" signs are present)?

Hope it is in NY.

[kphoger]

FWIW, the UVC doesn't prohibit it, and it specifically lists U-turns as a valid movement from a TWLTL.

[roadman65]

I always thought that ONLY means for what it specifies.  Then again I used to think arriving at a toll plaza with empty pockets meant instant uniform traffic citation.  Then I became a toll collector and found out it doesn't.

I used to think it was common sense to be more aware of your surroundings on strange roads. Then I found out people who are strangers to new areas don't read the road signs because the GPS is there and everybody knows that everybody uses the GPS and we can lie back, relax, and enjoy the ride so we can always concentrate on being the fastest car on any road.

I guess I fear Authority way too much.

[kphoger]

Dear Mr. Johnson:

Thank you for your letter of September 25 requesting an Official Interpretation of Section 2B.21 of the Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices (MUTCD) regarding whether a U-turn is allowed from a lane over which a Left-Turn Only Mandatory Movement Lane Control (R3-5L) sign is placed or next to which a LEFT LANE MUST TURN LEFT (R3-7L) sign is placed. Your question is based upon the first sentence of Section 2B.21 of the 2003 MUTCD, which states:

If used, Mandatory Movement Lane Control (R3-5, R3-5a, and R3-7) signs (see Figure 2B-4) shall indicate only those vehicle movements that are required from each lane and shall be located where the regulation applies.

We have reviewed your request and have concluded that the use of an R3-5L and/or an R3-7L sign does not in and of itself prohibit a U-turn.

A few States prohibit U-turns at all intersections unless a particular approach is specifically signed that U-turns are allowed. In these States, it is the State law, not the presence of an R3 5L sign or an R3-7L sign that makes the U-turn illegal.

Most of the States allow U-turns at all intersections unless a particular approach is specifically signed that U-turns are prohibited. The prohibition of a U-turn from a mandatory left-turn lane in these States is accomplished by the installation of a No U-Turn (R3-4) sign. In these States, if the R3-4 sign is not present on an intersection approach on a two-way street or highway (or at a midblock median opening) that has a mandatory left-turn lane, then U-turns are also allowed from that lane.

Because of the differences in State laws, please be aware of any laws that exist in your State regarding U-turns.

https://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/resources/interpretations/2_670.htm

[interstatefan990]

What about a U-turn on a five-lane arterial with a TWLTL in the middle, except instead of entering the TWLTL you make the U-turn from the left lane of your current direction?

[kphoger]

What about a U-turn on a five-lane arterial with a TWLTL in the middle, except instead of entering the TWLTL you make the U-turn from the left lane of your current direction?

As I said, the UVC specifically says that's one of the things the TWLTL is for.

Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road

Article VI – Turning and Starting and Signals on Stopping and Turning

§ 11-601 – Required position and method of turning

(d) Two-way left turn lanes – Where a special lane for making left turns by drivers proceeding in opposite directions has been indicated by official traffic-control devices:

1. A left turn shall not be made from any other lane.

2. A vehicle shall not be driven in the lane except when preparing for or making a left turn from or into the roadway or when preparing for or making a U turn when otherwise permitted by law.

[interstatefan990]

What about a U-turn on a five-lane arterial with a TWLTL in the middle, except instead of entering the TWLTL you make the U-turn from the left lane of your current direction?

As I said, the UVC specifically says that's one of the things the TWLTL is for.

Chapter 11 – Rules of the Road

Article VI – Turning and Starting and Signals on Stopping and Turning

§ 11-601 – Required position and method of turning

(d) Two-way left turn lanes – Where a special lane for making left turns by drivers proceeding in opposite directions has been indicated by official traffic-control devices:

1. A left turn shall not be made from any other lane.

2. A vehicle shall not be driven in the lane except when preparing for or making a left turn from or into the roadway or when preparing for or making a U turn when otherwise permitted by law.

I mean, it dosen't specify whether or not the vehicle is actually in the turning lane before executing the turn, instead of just crossing over it from another lane, but I guess that's correct. Also, this UVC should include a section about using TWLTLs to 'complete' a left turn, i.e. turning left and entering the road into the turning lane, then entering the other side when traffic clears. I think this is mentioned somewhere in the NY V&T law.

https://www.tssco.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Left_turn_only_R3-5L.jpg

Is it legal in your state to make a u-turn at a lane with this sign (and no "no u-turn" signs are present)?

Hope it is in NY.

Seems like it is, since it's referred to here:

(e) U-turns. U-turns shall be made from and to  that  portion  of  the
highway  nearest  the  marked center line. Where more than one lane of a
highway has been designated for left turns, U-turns shall be made only
from the lane so designated that is adjacent to the marked center line.

[kphoger]

I mean, it dosen't specify whether or not the vehicle is actually in the turning lane before executing the turn, instead of just crossing over it from another lane,

It does.  That's what "preparing for a U turn" means.

Also, this UVC should include a section about using TWLTLs to 'complete' a left turn, i.e. turning left and entering the road into the turning lane, then entering the other side when traffic clears.

It does.  That's what "preparing for or making a left turn ... into the roadway" means.

[interstatefan990]

I mean, it dosen't specify whether or not the vehicle is actually in the turning lane before executing the turn, instead of just crossing over it from another lane,

It does.  That's what "preparing for a U turn" means.

Also, this UVC should include a section about using TWLTLs to 'complete' a left turn, i.e. turning left and entering the road into the turning lane, then entering the other side when traffic clears.

It does.  That's what "preparing for or making a left turn ... into the roadway" means.

I should have been clearer, I meant it doesn't specify whether it's legal to just use it while crossing over from another lane, unless that's included within the definition of "making" a left turn/U-turn.

It does.  That's what "preparing for or making a left turn ... into the roadway" means.

So, merging right into the main travel lanes from the TWLTL after you've turned left into it is included in the definition of "preparing for or making a left turn into the roadway"? All I'm saying is, ambiguity or unspecific language is never a good idea when it comes to the law.

[kphoger]

I should have been clearer, I meant it doesn't specify whether it's legal to just use it while crossing over from another lane, unless that's included within the definition of "making" a left turn/U-turn.

That's what "shall not be made from any other lane" means.

So, merging right into the main travel lanes from the TWLTL after you've turned left into it is included in the definition of "preparing for or making a left turn into the roadway"?

Yes.  The same way it's perfectly legal to "be in" the left lanes when turning across them onto a roadway, it's perfectly legal to "be in" the TWLTL when turning across it onto a roadway.  That doesn't need to be spelled out in law.  The whole reason for that section to be in there at all is to make it clear that it's OK to turn into the TWLTL while making a left turn onto the roadway.

You're making it harder than it is.

[SeriesE]

I always thought that ONLY means for what it specifies.  Then again I used to think arriving at a toll plaza with empty pockets meant instant uniform traffic citation.  Then I became a toll collector and found out it doesn't.

I used to think it was common sense to be more aware of your surroundings on strange roads. Then I found out people who are strangers to new areas don't read the road signs because the GPS is there and everybody knows that everybody uses the GPS and we can lie back, relax, and enjoy the ride so we can always concentrate on being the fastest car on any road.

I guess I fear Authority way too much.

That's my thought too. In California, u-turn permitted lanes are usually unsigned or signed with https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-media/programs/safety-programs/documents/signs/r/f0019110-r73-2-a11y.pdf so I interpreted "ONLY" as in that direction only, not including u-turns since it's not shown in the arrows. Not sure if my interpretation was correct though.

In Nevada, yes. Nevada allows a U-turn where it can be made safely, unless a "No U-Turn" sign is posted or the maneuver is otherwise prohibited by statute.

Good to know. Nevada was what prompted this question.

[kphoger]

In California, u-turn permitted lanes are usually unsigned or signed with https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-media/programs/safety-programs/documents/signs/r/f0019110-r73-2-a11y.pdf so I interpreted "ONLY" as in that direction only, not including u-turns since it's not shown in the arrows. Not sure if my interpretation was correct though.

Absent any explicit California state law to the contrary, I assume the official FHWA interpretation I posted earlier applies.

[interstatefan990]

I should have been clearer, I meant it doesn't specify whether it's legal to just use it while crossing over from another lane, unless that's included within the definition of "making" a left turn/U-turn.

That's what "shall not be made from any other lane" means.

It says left turns shall not be made from any other lane, doesn't say anything about U-turns. But the next section (2) probably applies for those U-turns.

So, merging right into the main travel lanes from the TWLTL after you've turned left into it is included in the definition of "preparing for or making a left turn into the roadway"?

Yes.  The same way it's perfectly legal to "be in" the left lanes when turning across them onto a roadway, it's perfectly legal to "be in" the TWLTL when turning across it onto a roadway.  That doesn't need to be spelled out in law.  The whole reason for that section to be in there at all is to make it clear that it's OK to turn into the TWLTL while making a left turn onto the roadway.

I still think that should be made more specific and clear in the law. But eh, whatever, at this point I'll take your word for it.

You're making it harder than it is.

That's what he said.

[kphoger]

A.  If there's a TWLTL, then left turns shall only be made from that lane.
B.  You can only drive in the TWLTL if preparing for or making...
  1.  a left turn into or out of the main road
  2.  a U-turn on the main road

It appears that a U-turn is considered to be a subset of left turns by the UVC.

[roadfro]

In Nevada, yes. Nevada allows a U-turn where it can be made safely, unless a "No U-Turn" sign is posted or the maneuver is otherwise prohibited by statute.

Good to know. Nevada was what prompted this question.

The specifics for U-Turns in Nevada are codified in NRS 484B.403:

NRS 484B.403  When U-turns are authorized and prohibited; additional penalty for violation committed in work zone or pedestrian safety zone.

• A U-turn may be made on any road where the turn can be made with safety, except as prohibited by this section and by the provisions of NRS 484B.227, 484B.363 and 484B.407.
• If an official traffic-control device indicates that a U-turn is prohibited, the driver shall obey the directions of the device.
• The driver of a vehicle shall not make a U-turn in a business district, except at an intersection or on a divided highway where an appropriate opening or crossing place exists.
• Notwithstanding the foregoing provisions of this section, local authorities and the Department of Transportation may prohibit U-turns at any location within their respective jurisdictions.
• A person who violates any provision of this section may be subject to any additional penalty set forth in NRS 484B.130 or 484B.135.

For line 1, the sections referenced are about divided highways (can only make U-turn at intersection/crossover), school zones and school crossing zones (cannot perform a U-turn when the zone is active), and turning on a curve or crest of grade.

For line 5, additional penalties can apply in work zones or marked pedestrian safety zones.