Atchafalaya Basin I-10 Bridge New Speed Enforcement

[sprjus4]

^ Is that the reason for the lower speed limit?

And again... it's not helping if no one is following the speed limit regardless.

[bwana39]

I-10 across Louisiana was built with dedicated 90% -10% funding. Louisiana spent the 10% on the dedicated project  (not always in cash either) or lost the 90%.  Most states did all that was was funded.

Todays funding is 80% - 20% and it is discretionary. They can spend it on any Federal Aid eligible project. AND there is not as much of it as there was during the interstate buildup of the 1960's.

There is some new TIMED funding but is it not intended for this project. The I-10 bridges in Baton Rouge and Lake Charles and finishing I-49 to New Orleans. http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/BillInfo.aspx?s=22RS&b=SB277&sbi=y


I think that I-49 needs to be finished before I-10 can have the Atchafalaya bridges redone. It Probably will be a couple of years with  single lane traffic both ways. then a couple more with 2 lanes each way on a 3-lane width bridge (which will be of similar width as the current lanes with no shoulders).

[ethanhopkin14]

I think you could argue I-10 needs to be at least three lanes in both directions from San Antonio to Jacksonville.  There are some remote stretches in the Florida panhandle that may not need it, but if I-75 is at least 6 lanes throughout Florida, then it wouldn't be that hard to do it to I-10.  All that being said, there are a lot of swamp bridges, the Atchafalaya Basin Bridge being one, that make the task a bit more challenging.  Either you add a lane to an already existing bridge or redo the whole thing. 

[Rothman]

From my view, all it seems reducing the speed limit has done is create a barrier between those traveling a reasonable speed and what the road is designed for (70-75 mph) and those following 55-60 mph. Driving it recently, I noticed a lot of tailgating, brake slamming, weaving in and out, because of the speed differentials.

I don't think the low speed limit has helped anything, except to make people in power feel better.

I still don't see a reason why a lower speed is warranted from an engineering and traffic standpoint. It's a straight road that traffic routinely moves at 70-75 mph when not congested with often little issues.

You don't understand why a 50 year old bridge built in an extremely unfavorable environment, might need specific constraints to prevent catastrophic damage?

The bridge does need replacing, but that's a $2 billion project, minimum, and will likely take the better part of a decade.

The entire I-81 project in Syracuse is $2.25B, which includes rebuilding I-690, rebuilding the I-81/I-481 interchanges and widening I-481 in spots..  That cost is nowhere near prohibitive if Louisiana works with FHWA.

[froggie]

From my view, all it seems reducing the speed limit has done is create a barrier between those traveling a reasonable speed and what the road is designed for (70-75 mph) and those following 55-60 mph. Driving it recently, I noticed a lot of tailgating, brake slamming, weaving in and out, because of the speed differentials.

I don't think the low speed limit has helped anything, except to make people in power feel better.

I still don't see a reason why a lower speed is warranted from an engineering and traffic standpoint. It's a straight road that traffic routinely moves at 70-75 mph when not congested with often little issues.

You don't understand why a 50 year old bridge built in an extremely unfavorable environment, might need specific constraints to prevent catastrophic damage?

The bridge does need replacing, but that's a $2 billion project, minimum, and will likely take the better part of a decade.

The entire I-81 project in Syracuse is $2.25B, which includes rebuilding I-690, rebuilding the I-81/I-481 interchanges and widening I-481 in spots..  That cost is nowhere near prohibitive if Louisiana works with FHWA.

According to FHWA, estimated bridge replacement cost for bridges on the NHS system in Louisiana was $192 per square foot in 2017.  For now, let's ignore what inflation has done since then.

The Atchafalaya Basin Bridges are approximately 96,000 feet long (96,096 per Wikipedia...let's use an even 96K here).  To fit 4 travel lanes and standard (4ft inside, 10ft outside) shoulders plus bridge railings (I'm assuming 1ft width per railing), you would need at least 80ft of width.  96Kft * 80ft * $192/sq ft ≈ $1.47 billion.  Making the bridge 6 lanes would push that close to $2B.

The cost becomes "prohibitive" in Louisiana in the sense that there are already a number of big ticket items on their plate, including I-49 South, I-49 through Shreveport, I-69, and replacing the big I-10 bridge in Lake Charles, not all of which are funded.

[Rothman]

From my view, all it seems reducing the speed limit has done is create a barrier between those traveling a reasonable speed and what the road is designed for (70-75 mph) and those following 55-60 mph. Driving it recently, I noticed a lot of tailgating, brake slamming, weaving in and out, because of the speed differentials.

I don't think the low speed limit has helped anything, except to make people in power feel better.

I still don't see a reason why a lower speed is warranted from an engineering and traffic standpoint. It's a straight road that traffic routinely moves at 70-75 mph when not congested with often little issues.

You don't understand why a 50 year old bridge built in an extremely unfavorable environment, might need specific constraints to prevent catastrophic damage?

The bridge does need replacing, but that's a $2 billion project, minimum, and will likely take the better part of a decade.

The entire I-81 project in Syracuse is $2.25B, which includes rebuilding I-690, rebuilding the I-81/I-481 interchanges and widening I-481 in spots..  That cost is nowhere near prohibitive if Louisiana works with FHWA.

According to FHWA, estimated bridge replacement cost for bridges on the NHS system in Louisiana was $192 per square foot in 2017.  For now, let's ignore what inflation has done since then.

The Atchafalaya Basin Bridges are approximately 96,000 feet long (96,096 per Wikipedia...let's use an even 96K here).  To fit 4 travel lanes and standard (4ft inside, 10ft outside) shoulders plus bridge railings (I'm assuming 1ft width per railing), you would need at least 80ft of width.  96Kft * 80ft * $192/sq ft ≈ $1.47 billion.  Making the bridge 6 lanes would push that close to $2B.

I wasn't arguing against the $2B price, but rather showing how $2B really isn't that much to go begging for nowadays.

[froggie]

^ See the edit I was typing as you added your post.

[ethanhopkin14]

From my view, all it seems reducing the speed limit has done is create a barrier between those traveling a reasonable speed and what the road is designed for (70-75 mph) and those following 55-60 mph. Driving it recently, I noticed a lot of tailgating, brake slamming, weaving in and out, because of the speed differentials.

I don't think the low speed limit has helped anything, except to make people in power feel better.

I still don't see a reason why a lower speed is warranted from an engineering and traffic standpoint. It's a straight road that traffic routinely moves at 70-75 mph when not congested with often little issues.

You don't understand why a 50 year old bridge built in an extremely unfavorable environment, might need specific constraints to prevent catastrophic damage?

The bridge does need replacing, but that's a $2 billion project, minimum, and will likely take the better part of a decade.

The entire I-81 project in Syracuse is $2.25B, which includes rebuilding I-690, rebuilding the I-81/I-481 interchanges and widening I-481 in spots..  That cost is nowhere near prohibitive if Louisiana works with FHWA.

According to FHWA, estimated bridge replacement cost for bridges on the NHS system in Louisiana was $192 per square foot in 2017.  For now, let's ignore what inflation has done since then.

The Atchafalaya Basin Bridges are approximately 96,000 feet long (96,096 per Wikipedia...let's use an even 96K here).  To fit 4 travel lanes and standard (4ft inside, 10ft outside) shoulders plus bridge railings (I'm assuming 1ft width per railing), you would need at least 80ft of width.  96Kft * 80ft * $192/sq ft ≈ $1.47 billion.  Making the bridge 6 lanes would push that close to $2B.

The cost becomes "prohibitive" in Louisiana in the sense that there are already a number of big ticket items on their plate, including I-49 South, I-49 through Shreveport, I-69, and replacing the big I-10 bridge in Lake Charles, not all of which are funded.

I think your estimate might even be generous seeing how these bridges through unstable swamp land are not your normal bridges.  They have the pilings of close to a 100' tall bridge.  It may not be much to a state like New York, but Louisiana is not a very rich state.

I don't think these bridges get the credit for being the engineering marvel they are.  Glenwood Canyon gets all the praise, but I think the Atchafalaya Basin Bridge should get as much praise. 

[Rothman]

From my view, all it seems reducing the speed limit has done is create a barrier between those traveling a reasonable speed and what the road is designed for (70-75 mph) and those following 55-60 mph. Driving it recently, I noticed a lot of tailgating, brake slamming, weaving in and out, because of the speed differentials.

I don't think the low speed limit has helped anything, except to make people in power feel better.

I still don't see a reason why a lower speed is warranted from an engineering and traffic standpoint. It's a straight road that traffic routinely moves at 70-75 mph when not congested with often little issues.

You don't understand why a 50 year old bridge built in an extremely unfavorable environment, might need specific constraints to prevent catastrophic damage?

The bridge does need replacing, but that's a $2 billion project, minimum, and will likely take the better part of a decade.

The entire I-81 project in Syracuse is $2.25B, which includes rebuilding I-690, rebuilding the I-81/I-481 interchanges and widening I-481 in spots..  That cost is nowhere near prohibitive if Louisiana works with FHWA.

According to FHWA, estimated bridge replacement cost for bridges on the NHS system in Louisiana was $192 per square foot in 2017.  For now, let's ignore what inflation has done since then.

The Atchafalaya Basin Bridges are approximately 96,000 feet long (96,096 per Wikipedia...let's use an even 96K here).  To fit 4 travel lanes and standard (4ft inside, 10ft outside) shoulders plus bridge railings (I'm assuming 1ft width per railing), you would need at least 80ft of width.  96Kft * 80ft * $192/sq ft ≈ $1.47 billion.  Making the bridge 6 lanes would push that close to $2B.

The cost becomes "prohibitive" in Louisiana in the sense that there are already a number of big ticket items on their plate, including I-49 South, I-49 through Shreveport, I-69, and replacing the big I-10 bridge in Lake Charles, not all of which are funded.

Those other big ticket items are for new Interstate alignments.  I-10 is a matter of preservation and should take priority.

[Hot Rod Hootenanny]

Somebody had posted this years ago, but maybe some of you need to see this again (for the first time)

[Plutonic Panda]

Hopefully the state government will come through and make speed enforcement through automated means illegal. This entire Via needs to be replaced and widened to three lanes each way.

[bwana39]

Hopefully the state government will come through and make speed enforcement through automated means illegal. This entire Via needs to be replaced and widened to three lanes each way.

They JUST made it legal and only for the Atchafalaya Bridge.


BTW. The other projects DO have funding.

Apparent progress toward the replacement of the I-10 Calcasieu River bridge: http://wwwapps.dotd.la.gov/administration/announcements/Announcement.aspx?key=25419

Project website www.i10lakecharles.com

Funding is proposed by the legislature:
There is some new TIMED funding  for this project SB277 was passed as ACT 505 of 2022. The I-10 bridges in Baton Rouge and Lake Charles and finishing I-49 to New Orleans. http://www.legis.la.gov/legis/BillInfo.aspx?s=22RS&b=SB277&sbi=y

[Bobby5280]

I think all the long swamp bridges I-10 has in Louisiana should be re-built with at least 3 lanes in each direction. Not just the bridges over the Atchafalaya. The ones just East of New Orleans should be re-built in that manner too. The beginning of I-55 might be worthy of inclusion too. Those are all fairly old bridges. Replacement can't be put off forever. When those bridges are replaced it should happen with capacity improvements in mind.

I-10 is one of the most important highways in the Interstate network. That should put more emphasis on the federal government helping such a project along. Periodically I-10 (and I-55) have to be used as hurricane evacuation routes. If future re-builds of those bridges feature 3x3 lanes plus shoulders it would open more emergency options. If contra-flow is used in emergency evacuation it could be used for a shorter amount of time. The 3x3 configuration would handle a lot more traffic under normal operation.

[US 89]

I think all the long swamp bridges I-10 has in Louisiana should be re-built with at least 3 lanes in each direction. Not just the bridges over the Atchafalaya. The ones just East of New Orleans should be re-built in that manner too.

The I-10 bridge across Lake Pontchartrain east of New Orleans is already 3 lanes each direction plus shoulders.

[TXtoNJ]

I think all the long swamp bridges I-10 has in Louisiana should be re-built with at least 3 lanes in each direction. Not just the bridges over the Atchafalaya. The ones just East of New Orleans should be re-built in that manner too. The beginning of I-55 might be worthy of inclusion too. Those are all fairly old bridges. Replacement can't be put off forever. When those bridges are replaced it should happen with capacity improvements in mind.

I-10 is one of the most important highways in the Interstate network. That should put more emphasis on the federal government helping such a project along. Periodically I-10 (and I-55) have to be used as hurricane evacuation routes. If future re-builds of those bridges feature 3x3 lanes plus shoulders it would open more emergency options. If contra-flow is used in emergency evacuation it could be used for a shorter amount of time. The 3x3 configuration would handle a lot more traffic under normal operation.

Well obviously it should be done; the question is how to make that happen in the current political context, where getting directed federal money to the extent necessary is like getting blood from a stone. They don't like losing highway funds up in Northern Louisiana, and haven't since the days of Huey Long.

Are you prepared to sell a very conservative state on doubling the gas tax, or converting it to a higher-overall kWh tax? Because that's the level of investment it'll take to get these projects done in an expedited timetable.

[Bobby5280]

The I-10 bridge across Lake Pontchartrain east of New Orleans is already 3 lanes each direction plus shoulders.

Oops. Typo. I meant the I-10 bridges immediately West of the New Orleans area (Kenner) where I-310 terminates. Those are currently 2 lanes with shoulders. The same goes for the first 20 or so miles of I-55.

By the way, the I-10 bridges going East of New Orleans up to Slidell were originally just 2 lanes in each direction. We can thank Hurricane Katrina for there being newer bridges with a 3x3 configuration.

Are you prepared to sell a very conservative state on doubling the gas tax, or converting it to a higher-overall kWh tax? Because that's the level of investment it'll take to get these projects done in an expedited timetable.

Louisiana taxpayers should not have to shoulder most of the funding burden for those bridges. They are of nation-wide importance.

[bwana39]

Well obviously it should be done; the question is how to make that happen in the current political context, where getting directed federal money to the extent necessary is like getting blood from a stone. They don't like losing highway funds up in Northern Louisiana, and haven't since the days of Huey Long.

What world are you in? North Louisiana gets hardly anything. No I -69, the ICC is not firmly positioned , the 3132 port connector is not funded. I-20 needs work all the way across the state just like I-10. It clearly is not northern LA getting anything outsized.

The new main entry to Barksdale is about retaining Barksdale, not about northern LA.

Just one of those ideas, for most of the people in NW LA, Pineville is not Northern LA. It is closer from Lafayette to Pineville than Shreveport to Pineville. I guess if EVERYTHING north of the 31st parallel is north LA, you have a point. The point being that even the Alexandria area doesn't really get all that much either.

[US 89]

The I-10 bridge across Lake Pontchartrain east of New Orleans is already 3 lanes each direction plus shoulders.

Oops. Typo. I meant the I-10 bridges immediately West of the New Orleans area (Kenner) where I-310 terminates. Those are currently 2 lanes with shoulders. The same goes for the first 20 or so miles of I-55.

By the way, the I-10 bridges going West East of New Orleans up to Slidell were originally just 2 lanes in each direction. We can thank Hurricane Katrina for there being newer bridges with a 3x3 configuration.

FTFY. 

[bwana39]

Nothing new really , just the way it will be enforcing the photo speed enforcement and the higher fines for repeat offenders.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/dotd-adds-new-restrictions-on-atchafalaya-basin-bridge/ar-AA10d7Jx?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=7e3edb0a1c3b4300ec2eacfb1e671c26

[TXtoNJ]

Well obviously it should be done; the question is how to make that happen in the current political context, where getting directed federal money to the extent necessary is like getting blood from a stone. They don't like losing highway funds up in Northern Louisiana, and haven't since the days of Huey Long.

What world are you in? North Louisiana gets hardly anything. No I -69, the ICC is not firmly positioned , the 3132 port connector is not funded. I-20 needs work all the way across the state just like I-10. It clearly is not northern LA getting anything outsized.

The new main entry to Barksdale is about retaining Barksdale, not about northern LA.

Just one of those ideas, for most of the people in NW LA, Pineville is not Northern LA. It is closer from Lafayette to Pineville than Shreveport to Pineville. I guess if EVERYTHING north of the 31st parallel is north LA, you have a point. The point being that even the Alexandria area doesn't really get all that much either.

You just made my point for me. They're not going to sacrifice what little they get for an outrageously expensive project that mainly benefits the southern part of the state, along with interstate traffic. Heck, diverting more trucks to I-20 is to their economic benefit.

[bwana39]

Well obviously it should be done; the question is how to make that happen in the current political context, where getting directed federal money to the extent necessary is like getting blood from a stone. They don't like losing highway funds up in Northern Louisiana, and haven't since the days of Huey Long.

What world are you in? North Louisiana gets hardly anything. No I -69, the ICC is not firmly positioned , the 3132 port connector is not funded. I-20 needs work all the way across the state just like I-10. It clearly is not northern LA getting anything outsized.

The new main entry to Barksdale is about retaining Barksdale, not about northern LA.

Just one of those ideas, for most of the people in NW LA, Pineville is not Northern LA. It is closer from Lafayette to Pineville than Shreveport to Pineville. I guess if EVERYTHING north of the 31st parallel is north LA, you have a point. The point being that even the Alexandria area doesn't really get all that much either.

You just made my point for me. They're not going to sacrifice what little they get for an outrageously expensive project that mainly benefits the southern part of the state, along with interstate traffic. Heck, diverting more trucks to I-20 is to their economic benefit.

You said it though what little they get

[TXtoNJ]

Well obviously it should be done; the question is how to make that happen in the current political context, where getting directed federal money to the extent necessary is like getting blood from a stone. They don't like losing highway funds up in Northern Louisiana, and haven't since the days of Huey Long.

What world are you in? North Louisiana gets hardly anything. No I -69, the ICC is not firmly positioned , the 3132 port connector is not funded. I-20 needs work all the way across the state just like I-10. It clearly is not northern LA getting anything outsized.

The new main entry to Barksdale is about retaining Barksdale, not about northern LA.

Just one of those ideas, for most of the people in NW LA, Pineville is not Northern LA. It is closer from Lafayette to Pineville than Shreveport to Pineville. I guess if EVERYTHING north of the 31st parallel is north LA, you have a point. The point being that even the Alexandria area doesn't really get all that much either.

You just made my point for me. They're not going to sacrifice what little they get for an outrageously expensive project that mainly benefits the southern part of the state, along with interstate traffic. Heck, diverting more trucks to I-20 is to their economic benefit.

You said it though what little they get

I don't understand this combative tone you're taking.

[sprjus4]

Nothing new really , just the way it will be enforcing the photo speed enforcement and the higher fines for repeat offenders.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/dotd-adds-new-restrictions-on-atchafalaya-basin-bridge/ar-AA10d7Jx?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=7e3edb0a1c3b4300ec2eacfb1e671c26

The article says it takes 19 minutes to cross the bridge, and any shorter is punishable with a ticket.

But if the bridge is 18 miles long... that would be 18 minutes at 60 mph, the legal speed limit for automobiles. So is everyone an offender?

[ethanhopkin14]

Nothing new really , just the way it will be enforcing the photo speed enforcement and the higher fines for repeat offenders.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/dotd-adds-new-restrictions-on-atchafalaya-basin-bridge/ar-AA10d7Jx?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=7e3edb0a1c3b4300ec2eacfb1e671c26

The article says it takes 19 minutes to cross the bridge, and any shorter is punishable with a ticket.

But if the bridge is 18 miles long... that would be 18 minutes at 60 mph, the legal speed limit for automobiles. So is everyone an offender?

Awesome.  I can't wait for that ticket.

Fun fact, last time I crossed the bridge was at the end of June and it took me about 12 hours to cross it.  Granted I stopped at the Atchafalaya Welcome Center in Butte La Rose and bedded down in the motorhome for the night.   

[longhorn]

The fines are doubling and camera enforcement including tickets by mail are coming to the Atchafalaya Basin I-10 bridges.

https://www.thecentersquare.com/louisiana/louisianas-edwards-signs-bill-to-allow-speed-cameras-on-atchafalaya-basin-bridge/article_6c7ebac6-f18b-11ec-ba77-1f543105932e.html

Doug Warner KSLA  (From Facebook)
1d  ·
Not that I'm aware if I've ever sped across this south Louisiana I-10 bridge, but daaang! You won't even be able to speed in the middle because they'll be timing you on the ends. Starting August 1st, if you cross it in less than 18 minutes, you'll get a speeding ticket. By the way, it's 18.2 miles long. #SoKeepItUnder60

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/well-i-ll-be-reaction-from-la-state-trooper-as-he-realizes-he-s-just-pulled-over-head-of-lsp-for-speeding/ar-AAZn0Ll?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=e70b272f220e4e5385a06a3c14e09515

Good.  People drive way to fast on the Atchafalaya Basin Bridge.  It's a delicate bridge and it has a low speed limit for a reason.  Don't upset the vibration because you are an impatient reckless diver.

What is the bridge's resonance frequency? Sounds like a design issue to me.

I don't know, I am not that smart.  Just drive slower on it so it won't collapse is all I got out of the article I read some years back.  Of course it's a design issue.  It's Louisiana. 

I remember as a kid this being built, not sure its pathetic or sad about the condition of the bridge. Louisiana need to tap into the Infrastructure money and design a replacement.