just over a decade ago, our notorious "death valley" had 6 routes,
including us 421. interstate 85 and us 421 were the first 2 to go, in 2003 and 2008, respectively. us 421 today is the link between interstates 85 and 73.
it is 5 routes, but soon, NCDOT will reduce it to only 3:
- us 70 will be the next to be moved. it will be put on Wendover ave from greensboro to High Point and continue on NC-68 South (approval was made this month), to give everyone a single direct route from High point to Burlington.
-Business 85 will be eliminated totally, it isnt even a recognized route in the National Highway system.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=11&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjsw57s0LPlAhWhdt8KHQApAZAQFjAKegQICBAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.highpointnc.gov%2FAgendaCenter%2FViewFile%2FAgenda%2F_06252019-304&usg=AOvVaw1f6BA2XzE9loidUbQI69hw (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=11&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjsw57s0LPlAhWhdt8KHQApAZAQFjAKegQICBAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.highpointnc.gov%2FAgendaCenter%2FViewFile%2FAgenda%2F_06252019-304&usg=AOvVaw1f6BA2XzE9loidUbQI69hw)
interstate 40 will be the only interstate on the road, with just 2 us routes 220 and 29.
also, the "preddy boulevard freeway going from 40 thru the holden road junction to jamestown/high point will be us 29 only.
"death valley" wont be so deadly anymore. only traffic will be those staying on 40 or those using 29 or 220 towards Danville/Martinsville, or Thomasville/Asheboro, or South High Point.
a chunk of High point to Burlington traffic will be removed from interstate 40 and put on the new us-70 (wendover)
Quote from: ushighway421 on October 23, 2019, 08:42:49 PM
a lot of High point to Burlington traffic will be removed from interstate 40 and put on the new us-70 (wendover).
:confused:
Wouldn't they just take I-85N to get to Burlington or follow US29 to I-40? It seems like those would be the faster routes.
Quote from: mvak36 on October 23, 2019, 09:48:13 PM
Quote from: ushighway421 on October 23, 2019, 08:42:49 PM
a lot of High point to Burlington traffic will be removed from interstate 40 and put on the new us-70 (wendover).
:confused:
Wouldn't they just take I-85N to get to Burlington or follow US29 to I-40? It seems like those would be the faster routes.
They'd be more likely to follow I-85 north than US 29 to I-40.
Also, I applaud NCDOT's efforts to make Death Valley better with its reroutings. The NC 68/Wendover route will definitely serve US 70 well.
IIRC, NCDOT plans to eventually fix Death Valley itself. Not that I'm opposed to fixing it, but that would pretty much null and void the motive for moving I-85 onto the loop. I still think I-85 should be put back through Greensboro and the entire loop signed as I-840.
Having driven through this stretch I can affirm (And in believe I have photos) that the signage is a complete cluster fuck. That said, what's up with all these eastern states picking up on the phrase "Death Valley?" All I can ever really associate is Badwater Basin and the landscape of the Mojave Desert when I hear the term "Death Valley."
^ This particular "Death Valley" picked up the moniker from the multitude of fatal crashes that occurred pre-85-relocation.
Quote from: froggie on October 25, 2019, 02:35:00 PM
^ This particular "Death Valley" picked up the moniker from the multitude of fatal crashes that occurred pre-85-relocation.
I'm old enough to remember when I-40 unceremoniously ended by dumping onto I-85 there. There were no "End I-40" signs and you didn't even really know you were on a different route until you started seeing "North I-85" signs. Granted that was the late 60's/early 70's, but still.
I recall the term "Death Valley" being in routine use in the 1995—1998 time period. A Google search indicates its origins are from the early 1960s.
Quote from: LM117 on October 25, 2019, 10:17:01 AM
IIRC, NCDOT plans to eventually fix Death Valley itself. Not that I'm opposed to fixing it, but that would pretty much null and void the motive for moving I-85 onto the loop. I still think I-85 should be put back through Greensboro and the entire loop signed as I-840.
No. I-85 has always been planned to be on the Loop when it was proposed. Moving I-85 back doesn't make sense. Let I-85 and I-73 bypass Greensboro while I-40 is the main route through the town.
As of fixing the I-40 section of Death Valley, it is to replace all the aging bridges as well as widening the road to 8 lanes eventually. That is one of many reasons why I-40 was put back to its current routing from moving along to the Loop. If I-40 has been moved to the Loop along I-73, that section wouldn't receive a federal funding.
This marks a rare moment that a US route was moved off a freeway/interstate onto a local arterial.
Then again, Wendover is a pretty busy thoroughfare throughout Greensboro.
Quote from: Strider on October 28, 2019, 11:02:31 AM
Quote from: LM117 on October 25, 2019, 10:17:01 AM
IIRC, NCDOT plans to eventually fix Death Valley itself. Not that I'm opposed to fixing it, but that would pretty much null and void the motive for moving I-85 onto the loop. I still think I-85 should be put back through Greensboro and the entire loop signed as I-840.
Moving I-85 back doesn't make sense. Let I-85 and I-73 bypass Greensboro while I-40 is the main route through the town.
How does it make better sense to tell people to "take I-85 South and then I-73 North" and vice versa to bypass Greensboro instead of saying "just take I-840 around the south side of Greensboro"?
Not having I-840 on the southern part of the loop I think is to avoid needless multiplexes.
Otherwise with I-840 on the whole loop you would still say take I-840 south on the east side of Greensboro when heading west. Then at the I-85 split you would say take I-840 north. If you just say follow I-840 south then it could get confusing when you get the split when all you see is I-85 south and I-840 north. Where is I-840 south? So either way you must specify south then north. So does it matter what number is used at that point?
So the current setup helps by requiring you to be explicit where the N-S direction change happens when giving directions.
Quote from: LM117 on October 28, 2019, 03:03:25 PM
Quote from: Strider on October 28, 2019, 11:02:31 AM
Quote from: LM117 on October 25, 2019, 10:17:01 AM
IIRC, NCDOT plans to eventually fix Death Valley itself. Not that I'm opposed to fixing it, but that would pretty much null and void the motive for moving I-85 onto the loop. I still think I-85 should be put back through Greensboro and the entire loop signed as I-840.
Moving I-85 back doesn't make sense. Let I-85 and I-73 bypass Greensboro while I-40 is the main route through the town.
How does it make better sense to tell people to "take I-85 South and then I-73 North" and vice versa to bypass Greensboro instead of saying "just take I-840 around the south side of Greensboro"?
That is why there are signage leading the motorists which routes they need to use when they want to bypass Greensboro. You can find them before the Loop interchanges along I-40 (approaching I-73/I-840 interchange) to the west and the I-85/I-40 multiplex (before the I-85 Split/I-785/I-840 interchange) to the east.
I-840 is never meant to be signed on the whole Loop, just the northern part of the Loop.
Quote from: Strider on October 28, 2019, 11:02:31 AM
As of fixing the I-40 section of Death Valley, it is to replace all the aging bridges as well as widening the road to 8 lanes eventually. That is one of many reasons why I-40 was put back to its current routing from moving along to the Loop. If I-40 has been moved to the Loop along I-73, that section wouldn't receive a federal funding.
There's no more dedicated funding for interstates anymore, any roadway on the National Highway System (pretty much any road) receives a cut of federal funding for maintenance, etc.
Quote from: LM117 on October 28, 2019, 03:03:25 PM
Quote from: Strider on October 28, 2019, 11:02:31 AM
Quote from: LM117 on October 25, 2019, 10:17:01 AM
IIRC, NCDOT plans to eventually fix Death Valley itself. Not that I'm opposed to fixing it, but that would pretty much null and void the motive for moving I-85 onto the loop. I still think I-85 should be put back through Greensboro and the entire loop signed as I-840.
Moving I-85 back doesn't make sense. Let I-85 and I-73 bypass Greensboro while I-40 is the main route through the town.
How does it make better sense to tell people to "take I-85 South and then I-73 North" and vice versa to bypass Greensboro instead of saying "just take I-840 around the south side of Greensboro"?
We'll have to see how it plays out, but it's possible that the north loop of 840 may be a better (less congested) bypass option for I-40 through traffic than the I-85/I-73 option on the south. It will be longer, but not by that much.
If it was up to me, I'd move US 220 to Freeman Mill Road, Battleground Avenue, and the associated one-way streets.
IMO, I-85 should be routed on its original routing thru Greensboro, and the entire loop be I-840 with I-73 following the section it currently does. Along with that, massively overhaul I-85 and I-40 thru Greensboro to at least 8 lanes each way plus auxiliary lanes and reconstruct every exit. Think of I-85 near Durham, a nice wide modern interstate highway, then picture that inside the beltway at Greensboro, and I-840 (the southern loop, currently I-85) acting as a bypass for thru traffic.
This would create a left exit scenario, but it could still work. It'd be sort of like how I-95 was supposed to follow I-295 around Richmond so continuity was designed into the interchanges, but ultimately I-95 stayed thru Richmond and now left exits exist to I-295. It still works.
Would it require a lot of condemning of surrounding property to "theoretically" upgrade the "Death Valley" interchange to full Interstate Standards?
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 28, 2019, 09:41:38 PM
IMO, I-85 should be routed on its original routing thru Greensboro, and the entire loop be I-840 with I-73 following the section it currently does. Along with that, massively overhaul I-85 and I-40 thru Greensboro to at least 8 lanes each way plus auxiliary lanes and reconstruct every exit. Think of I-85 near Durham, a nice wide modern interstate highway, then picture that inside the beltway at Greensboro, and I-840 (the southern loop, currently I-85) acting as a bypass for thru traffic.
My question would be: If it's desirable to route I-85 through traffic on the southern loop, why doesn't it make sense to post the I-85 shields on that route?
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on October 29, 2019, 04:32:43 PM
Would it require a lot of condemning of surrounding property to "theoretically" upgrade the "Death Valley" interchange to full Interstate Standards?
Not really. The road itself is already "interstate standard" except for aging bridges (the bridges over South Buffalo Creek, under the railroad, and over the old US 421 *MLK Jr. Dr* does NOT meet current standards)
The purpose of upgrading the area is to meet current standards. The first section (replacing South Buffalo Creek) should start next year or after I-840 is fully completed.
They're upgrading the road to 6 lanes with a room for 8 in the future without having to widen the road again.
If you look at a traffic map of Greensboro the only consistent red spots at rush hour are: The Death Valley Interchange (reconstruction) and Battleground Ave between Westridge Ave and I-840. (Battleground Ave will be widened from 4 to 6 lanes) Both projects are in the STIP to begin construction sometime within the next 10 yrs.