News:

Thanks to everyone for the feedback on what errors you encountered from the forum database changes made in Fall 2023. Let us know if you discover anymore.

Main Menu

I-95 Md. ETLs nearing completion inside the beltway

Started by talllguy, June 24, 2014, 10:37:16 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

talllguy

Here are some animated GIFs I made showing the northbound entrance to the ETL lane at the 895/95 merge. The pavement markings are done and I saw crews hanging the EZ Pass equipment.

https://plus.google.com/108912181557962474883/posts/HfzKRqEUtHv


1995hoo

How many years has it been since they started work on that project? Seems like it's taking an incredibly long time. I know there was some complicated rebuilding of overpasses and the I-695 junction, but it seems like Virginia's HO/T lane project on the Beltway progressed way more quickly despite also requiring many overpass replacements and partial rebuilding of two major junctions (I-66 and the Dulles exit).
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

Alex

Quote from: 1995hoo on June 24, 2014, 10:51:40 AM
How many years has it been since they started work on that project? Seems like it's taking an incredibly long time. I know there was some complicated rebuilding of overpasses and the I-695 junction, but it seems like Virginia's HO/T lane project on the Beltway progressed way more quickly despite also requiring many overpass replacements and partial rebuilding of two major junctions (I-66 and the Dulles exit).

Work started on the Express Lanes mainline on January 22, 2007.

Preliminary work was done before that:

http://www.i-95expresstolllanes.com/constr_projects/

QuoteCompleted Projects
I-95 Southbound between I-895 and Eastern Avenue (Completed Fall 2012)
I-95 Mainline construction between Chesaco Avenue and Hazelwood Avenue (Completed Summer 2011)
I-95 from I-895 Interchange to Chesaco Avenue (Completed Fall 2011)
Replacement of Rossville Boulevard Bridge over I-95 (Completed Fall 2007)
Replacement of Cowenton Avenue and Joppa Road Bridges over I-95 (Completed Winter 2007)
I-95/I-895 Northbound General-Purpose Lanes, I-895/Moravia Road Interchange (Completed Winter 2009)
Replacement of Kenwood Avenue and Lillian Holt Drive Bridges and I-95/I-695 Interchange ramp lane construction. (Phase I Completed Summer 2010)
I-95 Mainline construction between Rossville Boulevard and Campbell Boulevard (Completed Summer 2010)
I-95/I-695 Managed Lanes (ETLs) Mainline (Completed Fall 2013)

froggie

Hoo:  to be fair, Maryland didn't have a major private investor pumping money into their I-95 toll lanes like VDOT has with both I-95 and the Beltway.  Also, much of the I-95 toll lane construction coincided with a timeframe where MdTA was also trying to fund and build the ICC...

1995hoo

Quote from: froggie on June 24, 2014, 11:02:54 AM
Hoo:  to be fair, Maryland didn't have a major private investor pumping money into their I-95 toll lanes like VDOT has with both I-95 and the Beltway.  Also, much of the I-95 toll lane construction coincided with a timeframe where MdTA was also trying to fund and build the ICC...


Good points. Frankly, I'd forgotten about the ICC! Seems like ages since it opened, but you're very right. I think I may have been aware of the "no investor" thing, but it didn't occur to me when making this comment either. It's a fine example of the two states' very different approaches to a lot of issues, that's for sure.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

talllguy

Good points about the duration. Additionally, the state is still building this interchange at MD 43 / 95. The ETLs won't be open until that is completed. The right of ways are still dirt as of Saturday.

Alex4897

Quote from: talllguy on June 24, 2014, 11:36:01 AM
Good points about the duration. Additionally, the state is still building this interchange at MD 43 / 95. The ETLs won't be open until that is completed. The right of ways are still dirt as of Saturday.

How come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.
👉😎👉

talllguy

Quote from: Alex4897 on June 24, 2014, 01:45:13 PM
Quote from: talllguy on June 24, 2014, 11:36:01 AM
Good points about the duration. Additionally, the state is still building this interchange at MD 43 / 95. The ETLs won't be open until that is completed. The right of ways are still dirt as of Saturday.

How come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.

Excellent Question Alex. I forget the name of that new interchange, but its purpose is to eliminate weaving traffic. You'll see that there is no weaving on either direction on 95. For the loop ramps to 43, I'm not so sure, but I think the lights are to eliminate agressive merging because there are destinations on the opposite sides of 43 that drivers leaving 95 want to get to, that require a 3 lane merge.

BrianP

Are there any interchanges like this new I-95/MD 43 one out there? 

1995hoo

Quote from: BrianP on June 24, 2014, 03:07:33 PM
Are there any interchanges like this new I-95/MD 43 one out there? 

Other than the sharp turns at the top of the loop-around ramps and the ETL ramps, it looks very similar to the longstanding interchange of I-395 and King Street (VA-7) in Alexandria, Virginia:
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8353154,-77.0989169,800m/data=!3m1!1e3
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

ARMOURERERIC

It is also similar to the 5/605 interchange in Los Angeles

iwishiwascanadian

Will MdTA ever connect the new lanes to the Beltway?

jeffandnicole

Quote from: 1995hoo on June 24, 2014, 10:51:40 AM
How many years has it been since they started work on that project? Seems like it's taking an incredibly long time. I know there was some complicated rebuilding of overpasses and the I-695 junction, but it seems like Virginia's HO/T lane project on the Beltway progressed way more quickly despite also requiring many overpass replacements and partial rebuilding of two major junctions (I-66 and the Dulles exit).

That's because it is taking an incredible amount of time.  The original projects were to have these toll lanes completed by 2011.  ( http://www.i-95expresstolllanes.com/linked_files/ETL_Groundbreaking_Release_013106.pdf )  And then, construction was to occur further north, extending the lanes to White Marsh.  That section is on indefinite hold.

The ICC may have had something to do with it, but only because the traffic projections for the 95 Express Lanes were so exaggerated off that actual, excepted toll income would barely be able to pay for the expense of operating the toll equipment.  Priorities shifted, and Maryland decided to dedicate their resources to getting the ICC operating, since those toll revenues were looking more promising (and then they screwed that up by keeping the speed limit too low).

Quote from: iwishiwascanadian on June 25, 2014, 02:12:20 AM
Will MdTA ever connect the new lanes to the Beltway?

Probably not.  Since there's now a missing 15 mile or so length of Express toll lanes north of 695, there will be very few people that would make use of the 2 miles of 95 ETL to then use the ramps at 695. 

froggie

QuoteHow come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.

Probably because of distances to the ETL ramp intersection.  Going with a "smooth merge" would be anything but as you'd immediately run into the ETL ramp traffic signal then be forced to merge right afterwards (due to the on-ramp from the opposite I-95 direction).  IMO, the design they went with provides a safer "merge".

Laura

Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 25, 2014, 08:55:23 AM

Quote from: iwishiwascanadian on June 25, 2014, 02:12:20 AM
Will MdTA ever connect the new lanes to the Beltway?

Probably not.  Since there's now a missing 15 mile or so length of Express toll lanes north of 695, there will be very few people that would make use of the 2 miles of 95 ETL to then use the ramps at 695. 

I asked MdTA this question myself at one of the hearings. They do plan to still connect the new lanes to the beltway, but it's definitely a long term goal and not anything you'll see in the near future. The plans also call for extending the ETL lanes up into Harford County.

Quote from: froggie on June 25, 2014, 09:09:43 AM
QuoteHow come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.

Probably because of distances to the ETL ramp intersection.  Going with a "smooth merge" would be anything but as you'd immediately run into the ETL ramp traffic signal then be forced to merge right afterwards (due to the on-ramp from the opposite I-95 direction).  IMO, the design they went with provides a safer "merge".


Yep, although it does also help with the issue that Elliott described: traffic merging across 2-3 lanes to turn left at Honeygo Blvd.

Henry

Quote from: froggie on June 25, 2014, 09:09:43 AM
QuoteHow come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.

Probably because of distances to the ETL ramp intersection.  Going with a "smooth merge" would be anything but as you'd immediately run into the ETL ramp traffic signal then be forced to merge right afterwards (due to the on-ramp from the opposite I-95 direction).  IMO, the design they went with provides a safer "merge".

Surely there would be signals with all three arrows (green, yellow and red) pointing to the right at the end of these ramps? (And no, I'm not calling anybody Shirley, as an old Leslie Nielsen joke)
Go Cubs Go! Go Cubs Go! Hey Chicago, what do you say? The Cubs are gonna win today!

TheOneKEA

Quote from: Laura on June 25, 2014, 10:19:38 AM
I asked MdTA this question myself at one of the hearings. They do plan to still connect the new lanes to the beltway, but it's definitely a long term goal and not anything you'll see in the near future. The plans also call for extending the ETL lanes up into Harford County.

I found the original plans for the I-95 ETLs that the MdTA published in 2003 and the lanes are currently planned to end north of Exit 80. Beyond there the plans show that the existing carriage ways will be widened to four lanes apiece until just north of Exit 85.

In my opinion, the original plans were and are specifying a facility that is way too short. If the MdTA wants to make the ETLs actually be worthwhile they should restudy the segment of I-95 north of Exit 80, and consider extending the ETLs all the way to north of Exit 89. They should also study the construction of a new bridge across the Susquehanna that allows for a full-width 10-lane cross-section, because the existing bridge already passed its 50th anniversary and soon it will need replacement.

In my opinion, the MdTA got stuck in a pretty deep crack as a result of the recession, and that really hurt their ability to finance their construction projects, resulting in the slowdown and the situation we have now. Their decision to open the ICC with a 55mph limit instead of a 60mph limit was also pretty dumb, in my opinion, and I wish they had the authority to sign the ETLs at 70mph.

Laura


Quote from: Henry on June 25, 2014, 02:28:56 PM
Quote from: froggie on June 25, 2014, 09:09:43 AM
QuoteHow come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.

Probably because of distances to the ETL ramp intersection.  Going with a "smooth merge" would be anything but as you'd immediately run into the ETL ramp traffic signal then be forced to merge right afterwards (due to the on-ramp from the opposite I-95 direction).  IMO, the design they went with provides a safer "merge".

Surely there would be signals with all three arrows (green, yellow and red) pointing to the right at the end of these ramps? (And no, I'm not calling anybody Shirley, as an old Leslie Nielsen joke)

There are.


iPhone

cpzilliacus

Quote from: Laura on June 25, 2014, 07:40:40 PM

Quote from: Henry on June 25, 2014, 02:28:56 PM
Quote from: froggie on June 25, 2014, 09:09:43 AM
QuoteHow come the loop ramps coming from I-95 to MD 43 end at what appears to be an intersection as opposed to merging smoothly?  I can't imagine they'd really need to give people the option to access the new lanes from the opposite direction of I-95.

Probably because of distances to the ETL ramp intersection.  Going with a "smooth merge" would be anything but as you'd immediately run into the ETL ramp traffic signal then be forced to merge right afterwards (due to the on-ramp from the opposite I-95 direction).  IMO, the design they went with provides a safer "merge".

Surely there would be signals with all three arrows (green, yellow and red) pointing to the right at the end of these ramps? (And no, I'm not calling anybody Shirley, as an old Leslie Nielsen joke)

There are.


iPhone

At least the ICC is generating a decent amount of revenue.

I know the MdTA is also trying to figure out how to fund a $1 billion replacement of the Gov. Harry Nice Memorial Bridge (U.S. 301 crossing the Potomac River).

The MdTA has approved  environmental documents for a replacement of the Nice Bridge, but they don't have the financing capacity (right now) to advertise the project for construction. 
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

NJRoadfan

Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 25, 2014, 08:55:23 AM
The ICC may have had something to do with it, but only because the traffic projections for the 95 Express Lanes were so exaggerated off that actual, excepted toll income would barely be able to pay for the expense of operating the toll equipment.  Priorities shifted, and Maryland decided to dedicate their resources to getting the ICC operating, since those toll revenues were looking more promising (and then they screwed that up by keeping the speed limit too low).

Or running a perpetual speed camera zone is far more profitable than actually opening the lanes. ;)

cpzilliacus

Quote from: NJRoadfan on June 26, 2014, 03:51:23 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 25, 2014, 08:55:23 AM
The ICC may have had something to do with it, but only because the traffic projections for the 95 Express Lanes were so exaggerated off that actual, excepted toll income would barely be able to pay for the expense of operating the toll equipment.  Priorities shifted, and Maryland decided to dedicate their resources to getting the ICC operating, since those toll revenues were looking more promising (and then they screwed that up by keeping the speed limit too low).

Or running a perpetual speed camera zone is far more profitable than actually opening the lanes. ;)

Unlikely, since MdTA gets absolutely no revenue from automated speed limit enforcement.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

Baltimore Sun: New toll lanes on I-95 scheduled to open

QuoteNew Interstate-95 express toll lanes are scheduled to open Saturday along the highway north of Baltimore.

QuoteThe toll lanes, two in each direction, run for about eight miles along the highway, in between the northbound and southbound traffic lanes. They will be free to use for a week as travelers get used to how they operate.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

TheOneKEA

And they won't be signed at 70mph to get people to use them. Ugh.

I also still believe that the ETLs should eventually end at Exit 89 and that the general-purpose lanes should be eight lanes to Exit 89. I doubt the MdTA will be able to finance any capital projects for at least 2-3 years, which may be enough time to restudy the project north of Exit 80 and consider these types of alterations.

Are any private investors likely to come calling to the MdTA? Does the regulatory structure of the MdTA even allow private investment?

1995hoo

State law doesn't allow 70 mph anywhere, but I can't help but wonder whether the new governor might prompt another attempt to change the law in that respect. I'm not trying to get political, but we've seen in the past that elections do sometimes matter with respect to road issues. The old National Speed Limit was finally repealed in 1995 after the 1994 elections flipped control of Congress (and while Bill Clinton said he opposed repealing the speed limit provision, he felt overall the rest of the highway bill was too important to veto over that issue). Virginia allowed a 70-mph speed limit after the governor's mansion changed parties. In Maryland, they finally broke ground on the ICC during the Ehrlich administration.

Of course, the governor is but one guy and it has to get through the legislature first. Last year the 70-mph bill passed the Maryland House unanimously, but it foundered because one senator refused to let it out of committee. I think that sort of thing is an abuse of power.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

davewiecking

I looked at some of the traffic cameras today (Sunday afternoon), and the toll lanes seemed to be carrying about as many cars (per lane) as the regular lanes.



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.