Resolving I-10, US 80, SR 84 and SR 86 Mysteries

[707]

While I'm in agreement that topographical maps aren't exact the best source I'd say that the evidence is pretty strong that AZ 86 was on Ajo Way between US 80 and US 89 given there is photographic proof on top of it.

There is no photographic proof; the sign is at Benson and 6th pointing south on 6th.

Let me rephrase then, it's implied that AZ 86 is southward given the sign just says "Ajo Way."   The inference is that 86 is present on Ajo Way and not a particular direction of travel such as an western segment. Given that there is no AZ 86 shield at the junction of 6th and Benson it also seems to suggest that it is present to the south.

Granted that doesn't resolve if there was a gap in 86 at one point or if the route was co-signed to Benson with US 80.  The photo also doesn't have a date and the only description Arizonaroads gave was about colorized shields starting in the 1950s. 

Speaking of signage mysteries (saw the thread retitle) what about AZ 789?   I honestly don't think I've ever a single photo of AZ 789 Signed in the field.  Does anyone have any old photographs of 789 on sign assembles?...I'd love to see them if they are out there.

I believe that sign is meant to be a "To SR 86" sign. If the highway really was divided into two segments, then that sign wpuld still look the same. It would also explain the lack of a 2nd generation "swastika" SR shield saying West 86 goes left at that intersection. To me the sign implies SR 86 hasn't been signed along US 80 yet and the sign is directing people to use US 89 to reach the eastern terminus of SR 86(W). If SR 86 took Ajo Way at this point, then there wouldn't be signage directing cars down US 89 to reach 86. Instead, the sign would be at Benson and Ajo telling traffic to turn there. So far, besides the vague resolution and the 1963 Topo, I have been seeing more evidence in the forms of state highway maps and that photo implying SR 86 went north on 6th then east on Benson.

As for SR 789, I do believe it was signed. There is a photo of a 2nd Gen Swastika shield of SR 789 in someone's private collection with the same amount of wear and tear you would find on a sign that has been used in the field. Its not much, but its the best I can go off of.

VS988

[Max Rockatansky]

While I'm in agreement that topographical maps aren't exact the best source I'd say that the evidence is pretty strong that AZ 86 was on Ajo Way between US 80 and US 89 given there is photographic proof on top of it.

There is no photographic proof; the sign is at Benson and 6th pointing south on 6th.

Let me rephrase then, it's implied that AZ 86 is southward given the sign just says "Ajo Way."   The inference is that 86 is present on Ajo Way and not a particular direction of travel such as an western segment. Given that there is no AZ 86 shield at the junction of 6th and Benson it also seems to suggest that it is present to the south.

Granted that doesn't resolve if there was a gap in 86 at one point or if the route was co-signed to Benson with US 80.  The photo also doesn't have a date and the only description Arizonaroads gave was about colorized shields starting in the 1950s. 

Speaking of signage mysteries (saw the thread retitle) what about AZ 789?   I honestly don't think I've ever a single photo of AZ 789 Signed in the field.  Does anyone have any old photographs of 789 on sign assembles?...I'd love to see them if they are out there.

I believe that sign is meant to be a "To SR 86" sign. If the highway really was divided into two segments, then that sign wpuld still look the same. It would also explain the lack of a 2nd generation "swastika" SR shield saying West 86 goes left at that intersection. To me the sign implies SR 86 hasn't been signed along US 80 yet and the sign is directing people to use US 89 to reach the eastern terminus of SR 86(W). If SR 86 took Ajo Way at this point, then there wouldn't be signage directing cars down US 89 to reach 86. Instead, the sign would be at Benson and Ajo telling traffic to turn there. So far, besides the vague resolution and the 1963 Topo, I have been seeing more evidence in the forms of state highway maps and that photo implying SR 86 went north on 6th then east on Benson.

As for SR 789, I do believe it was signed. There is a photo of a 2nd Gen Swastika shield of SR 789 in someone's private collection with the same amount of wear and tear you would find on a sign that has been used in the field. Its not much, but its the best I can go off of.

VS988

I'm pretty sure the AZ 789 shield commonly floating around online is the one also posted on Arizonaroads.com:

[707]

While I'm in agreement that topographical maps aren't exact the best source I'd say that the evidence is pretty strong that AZ 86 was on Ajo Way between US 80 and US 89 given there is photographic proof on top of it.

There is no photographic proof; the sign is at Benson and 6th pointing south on 6th.

Let me rephrase then, it's implied that AZ 86 is southward given the sign just says "Ajo Way."   The inference is that 86 is present on Ajo Way and not a particular direction of travel such as an western segment. Given that there is no AZ 86 shield at the junction of 6th and Benson it also seems to suggest that it is present to the south.

Granted that doesn't resolve if there was a gap in 86 at one point or if the route was co-signed to Benson with US 80.  The photo also doesn't have a date and the only description Arizonaroads gave was about colorized shields starting in the 1950s. 

Speaking of signage mysteries (saw the thread retitle) what about AZ 789?   I honestly don't think I've ever a single photo of AZ 789 Signed in the field.  Does anyone have any old photographs of 789 on sign assembles?...I'd love to see them if they are out there.

I believe that sign is meant to be a "To SR 86" sign. If the highway really was divided into two segments, then that sign wpuld still look the same. It would also explain the lack of a 2nd generation "swastika" SR shield saying West 86 goes left at that intersection. To me the sign implies SR 86 hasn't been signed along US 80 yet and the sign is directing people to use US 89 to reach the eastern terminus of SR 86(W). If SR 86 took Ajo Way at this point, then there wouldn't be signage directing cars down US 89 to reach 86. Instead, the sign would be at Benson and Ajo telling traffic to turn there. So far, besides the vague resolution and the 1963 Topo, I have been seeing more evidence in the forms of state highway maps and that photo implying SR 86 went north on 6th then east on Benson.

As for SR 789, I do believe it was signed. There is a photo of a 2nd Gen Swastika shield of SR 789 in someone's private collection with the same amount of wear and tear you would find on a sign that has been used in the field. Its not much, but its the best I can go off of.

VS988

I'm pretty sure the AZ 789 shield commonly floating around online is the one also posted on Arizonaroads.com:

Yup, that's the one. One of the few photos I've ever seen of a 2nd Gen Swastika. Just look at how beaten up that sign is. If it was never used, it would be in great shape like the Alaska US 97 signs the state produced but never put up. Probably would have sat in a warehouse gathering dust not rust. I have a very strong suspicion that this sign was indeed used in the field.

[707]

Browsing David Rumsey's Map Collection, I found two highway maps of Tucson from 1950 and 1956 published by Rand McNally and HM Goshua:

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~293040~90065324:Map-of-greater-Tucson-and-surroundi?sort=Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No&qvq=q:Tucson;sort:Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=1&trs=8

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~212277~5500329:Shell-Street-Map-of-Tucson--Shell-M?sort=Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No&qvq=q:Tucson;sort:Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=5&trs=8

Both maps tell an interesting story. At least by 1951, SR 84 ended at the southern Oracle Road traffic circle with Drachman Street. An even stranger terminus than the US 80/US 89 junction at Benson and 6th. Also, both maps show SR 86 ending at Ajo and 6th (US 89).

[Zonie]

Interestingly, I came across an article today (Daily Star, 9/27/55) where the US 90 Association was trying to extend US 90 from Van Horn, TX to San Diego using AZ 84 and 86.

The last paragraph mentioned how it'd be a shorter, more direct route from Tucson to San Antonio/Houston/New Orleans/Jacksonville.  :-)

[Max Rockatansky]

This 1938 Arizona State Highway Map seems to suggest that the original routing of 86 only ran between the State Line and US 80 in Benson:

[707]

Interestingly, I came across an article today (Daily Star, 9/27/55) where the US 90 Association was trying to extend US 90 from Van Horn, TX to San Diego using AZ 84 and 86.

The last paragraph mentioned how it'd be a shorter, more direct route from Tucson to San Antonio/Houston/New Orleans/Jacksonville.  :-)

Ha! That would've created another crazy US 60/70 problem. Thanls for the input!

VS988

[707]

This 1938 Arizona State Highway Map seems to suggest that the original routing of 86 only ran between the State Line and US 80 in Benson:

That's true. The Ajo to Tucson segment through the Papago Reservation and Sells didn't happen until 1942. Before the, the road was owned and administered by Pima County. I can pull up the resolutions if you'd like. Also, if ypu pook closely, the pre 1940 route of SR 86 and US 666 follows Dragoon Road and an abandoned ROW on the north side of the SPRR across the Playa in to Wilcox. In fact, most of the pre 1940 route is separate from I-10, but either abandoned, cut up or passable by AWD or 4WD only. Sadly, the most beautiful section which was through Texas Canyon itself is now on Private Property and is illegal to use.

On the subject, when SR 86 was first designated in 1934 it was completely concurrent with SR 81 (US 666 after 1937) between Cochise and east of Wilcox. In 1936 and 1937, it was extended west to US 80 in Benson, then east to NM 14 near San Simon. It was retired on the eastern section around 1970. If you travel the I-10 Business routes, you'll find a lot of cool old motels abd cafes that have long been forgotten. SR 86/NM 14 was not too different from Miracle Mile at one point.

VS988

[707]

Here's another I-10 mystery: I believe there are ADOT resolutions and a state highway log I once accessed saying Kolb Road in Tucson was either added to the State Highway system albeit unsigned or was planned to be added and cancelled at the last minute. I'll pull up the resolutions, which I know ADOT passed in regards to planned SR 910. If they actually took over Kolb Road though remains a mystery until further notice, but I'm guessing it was unlikely and SR 910 was never designated.

VS988

[Zonie]

It was at one point part of the Tucson urban plans as AZ 110, but as far as I know, never came to fruition.

https://arizonaroads.com/pics/urban1997tucson.gif

[sparker]

The southern "detour" of US 80 vs. the relatively "straightline" of AZ 86 would be in itself questionable if not for the history of the local rail lines.  The Southern Pacific was the first to penetrate this territory circa 1879-80; their line functionally followed today's I-10 from Casa Grande east to the NM state line, but with heavy WB gradients over Steins Pass on the AZ/NM border and a very circuitous EB alignment between Benson and Willcox, necessary to maintain a less than 2.2% grade.  Several years later the El Paso and Southwestern, owned by the Phelps-Dodge mining company, made its way west from El Paso through Columbus, NM, following US 80 through Douglas, AZ before hugging the Mexican border again to the San Pedro River valley, which it followed north to Benson.  From there it paralleled the SP tracks into Tucson, which became its interim western terminus; it was slated to head west via Ajo before turning south into Mexico to access a new planned Gulf of California port south of Puerto Penasco.  The more favorable gradients of the El Paso and Southwestern tracks allowed it to dominate the coal and ore traffic west from El Paso, mostly originating it its northern New Mexico lines, reached by its "El Paso & Northeastern" branch from El Paso up to Tucumcari and turning north from there to the Raton area where the coal and ore mines were located.  However, it never made it past Tucson; by 1924 the expenses of running a full-service railroad caused Phelps-Dodge to offload the railroad onto Southern Pacific, which promptly moved most of its heavy freight and passenger traffic onto the former EP&SW.  That figured prominently in the elevation of Douglas and Bisbee as the principal population centers of SE AZ.  When it came time to deploy the U.S. highways, the southward arc through Douglas was selected for US 80 in order to serve the largest population.  That corridor received asphalt pavement well before AZ 86, which prompted through traffic to use it rather than the gravel AZ 86 -- at least until the latter was finally full paved by 1941.  At that time through commercial traffic between Tucson and El Paso largely shifted to the AZ 86/NM 14 combination.  Eventually, after I-10 was built in the area, and rail passenger traffic was but a small fraction of its former self, SP elected to sever the Douglas/EP&SW line due to maintenance costs, particularly sand clearance in extreme SW NM and flash floods along the San Pedro River between Bisbee and Benson; all now-UP traffic uses the original SP line via Willcox, which underwent grade-reduction realignment between Benson and Willcox in the late '70's.  SP sold the remains of the line from Benson to Douglas to a small start-up regional in the early '80's.  But for over 40 years both rail and road corridors via Douglas and the border region thrived despite being much longer than the straighter AZ 86 & NM 14 -- partially due to Douglas' promotion as a tourist-friendly border town -- and the presence of the historic town of Tombstone south of Benson -- which became in itself a tourist attraction due to its wealth of Earp/OK Corral-related western lore. 

[707]

Makes sense. Acording to a set of 1937 county maps, all of SR 86 was mostly unimproved and dirt between Benson and NM 14 save for the concurrency with SR 81/US 666 from Cochise to Bowie Junction. Plus there were tons of hairpin curves and winding indirect sections. Most of that old roadbed still exists, its just overgrown and abandoned or on private lands in many cases. Luzena Road/Rio Oro Trail from US 191 to Bowie is a drivable 4WD section of old SR 86 as proven by the old 1937 maps. Interestingly between Bowie and San Simon, SR 86 originally followed an abandoned roadbed north of the SP. The 1941 route is now the north frontage road. I-10 overlays the 1941 SR 86 after it was rebuilt on a straighter alignment. It must've been interesting to motor across the Wilcox Playa by way of Model T following the old heavy gauge steel swastikas.

VS988

[707]

Also, here's the 1998 ADOT Log, which for some reason includes SR 910, SR 810, SR 589, etc. even though none of these highways were ever established.

Heres resolutions too:
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?syear=&eyear=&crc=3&rtnum=910&submit1=Submit
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?syear=&eyear=&crc=3&rtnum=810&submit1=Submit
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?syear=&eyear=&crc=3&rtnum=982&submit1=Submit
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?syear=&eyear=&crc=3&rtnum=589&submit1=Submit
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?syear=&eyear=&crc=3&rtnum=983&submit1=Submit
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?syear=&eyear=&crc=3&rtnum=989&submit1=Submit

Looks like they existed only in legislation, similar to how SR 11 (the present one) only existed on paper until it was built. Only difference is they were never built and later removed from legislation (or still exist in legislation but will never be used). Of course 989 was the only one actually added and that was just to maintain the bridge on Tangerine Road.

[707]

Okay, there's a new mystery afoot regarding SR 84's eastern terminus after 1940. This resolution and postcard show SR 84 ended at 6th and Benson:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/edge_and_corner_wear/6339348976
http://azhighwaydata.com/resolutions/?resnum=1937-P-447

There are no resolutions available online stating SR 84 had ever been truncated past that point in the 40's, but this map along with the insets of every state highway map and other road maps I've observed during SR 84's existence in Tucson suggest the designation ended at the traffic circle with Drachman and Oracle. This is seriously confusing me, especially since SR 93 and SR 789 are shown on later maps still concurring with US 80 and US 89 south of Drachman, minus SR 84.

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~212277~5500329:Shell-Street-Map-of-Tucson--Shell-M?sort=pub_list_no_initialsort%2Cpub_date%2Cpub_list_no%2Cseries_no&qvq=q:where%3DTucson;sort:pub_list_no_initialsort%2Cpub_date%2Cpub_list_no%2Cseries_no;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=2&trs=5

[KeithE4Phx]

Here is a link to a 1950 Tucson map showing AZ 84 multiplexed with US 80/89 down to Oracle Rd. and Drachmann St., but no further. The road to Nogales is just US 89 -- no AZ 93 or 789 at the time.  AZ 84 turns left at "Casa Grande Rd." about a mile north of downtown.  I have no idea what that street is called today.

AZ 86 to Ajo is there, but the street name is Indian School Rd., not Ajo Way, and it ends at US 89 (6th Ave).  It is not co-signed with US 80 on Tucson-Benson Highway.

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~293040~90065324:Map-of-greater-Tucson-and-surroundi

[KeithE4Phx]

Here's one from 1956 from the same site.  It shows US 80, US 89, AZ 84, AZ 93, and AZ 789 co-signed on Oracle Rd. to downtown, where 84 is dropped.  Casa Grande Rd. is still AZ 84 (and AZ 93), but it ends at the Tucson Controlled Access Highway, with what would later become I-10 already marked on the map, and some access roads built.  I'm guessing now that then-Casa Grande Rd. is now Miracle Mile.  6th Ave. (Nogales Hwy) is shown as US 89/AZ 93/AZ 789.

AZ 86 is now shown as Ajo Way, but it still ends at 6th Ave.

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~212277~5500329:Shell-Street-Map-of-Tucson--Shell-M

[DJStephens]

This 1938 Arizona State Highway Map seems to suggest that the original routing of 86 only ran between the State Line and US 80 in Benson:

Most of that alignment was likely overlaid by Interstate 10 when it was completed likely circa 1970 in that area (Benson).   There is a short piece of AZ 86 shown on the Benson chamber of commerce map, it extends east from AZ 80 / former US 80, to end, as a frontage stub just east of the Pomerene Road exit.   Of course the chamber of commerce map gives both 86 and 80 US Federal shields.   

[707]

This 1938 Arizona State Highway Map seems to suggest that the original routing of 86 only ran between the State Line and US 80 in Benson:

Most of that alignment was likely overlaid by Interstate 10 when it was completed likely circa 1970 in that area (Benson).   There is a short piece of AZ 86 shown on the Benson chamber of commerce map, it extends east from AZ 80 / former US 80, to end, as a frontage stub just east of the Pomerene Road exit.   Of course the chamber of commerce map gives both 86 and 80 US Federal shields.

Yeah. Further research showed an old railroad underpass near the US 191 interchange east of Wilcox (now part of a dead end west/south frontage road), the Business Loops in Wilcox, Bowie and San Simon, as well as the north frontage road between Bowie and San Simon are the last remaining parts of the 1941 route of SR 86 that haven't been overlaid by I-10 besides the section you mentioned in Benson. There's also a small bit of old roadbed north of the Interstate at the state border which used to be both SR 86 abd NM 14.

VS988