Spent some time today going through another university library and turned up a few interesting tidbits - only the ones generally relating to Illinois are listed here:
Champaign-Urbana
* In the past there were long-range plans for a southern bypass of the area, running south of Church Road and connecting to I-74 east of the IL 130 interchange. Seems to have died.
* I-74 had two full cloverleafs east of I-57 that have since been downgraded to diamonds - think one was at US 45, but can't remember exactly (it was too wet and too long of walk back to the car for copies).
Quad Cities
* The area transportation plan had the freeway that is now I-88 extending inward towards downtown Moline, but not connecting to I-74. A further extension that would have provided a freeway from I-88 that tied into the end of the IL 92 freeway was not adopted.
* The supplemental freeway for the US 67 corridor was shown using the IL 92 freeway.
* Back when this study was done it was recognized that the Quad Cities area would need another Mississippi River crossing in addition to those that exist today. Still waiting for it.
* Not in Illinois, but the now completely dead freeway for the US 61 corridor in Davenport apparently had the direct connection to the Centennial Bridge cut as part of this study.
Supplemental Freeway Study by consultant in 1976
* This study seemed to be the results of cost increases for the supplemental freeway program and a few corridors/sections having EIS's rejected. It gave recommendations as whether to proceed with a freeway, expressway, or improved two lane route.
* The now dead freeway from the IL 3 interchange at the PSB complex to I-57 at Marion was recommended to be scaled back to only be a freeway from the PSB complex to Waterloo.
* I think what is now I-72 west of Jacksonville was recommended as only a two lane road, and what is now I-39 was recommended only as an expressway (am planning to go back and take another read through this study again).
QuoteNot in Illinois, but the now completely dead freeway for the US 61 corridor in Davenport apparently had the direct connection to the Centennial Bridge cut as part of this study.
Is this the same "561 Freeway" proposed mentioned on Jason Hancock's Quad Cities (http://iowahighways.home.mchsi.com/highways/davenport.html) page? Was there any more details on it?
QuoteWhile "Freeway 561" south of I-80 was killed by the Davenport city council in favor of an extension of the Harrison/Brady one-way system on September 4, 1975, the US 61 freeway between I-80 and US 30 in De Witt was completed on December 1, 1982.
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 15, 2009, 05:46:43 PM
Spent some time today going through another university library and turned up a few interesting tidbits - only the ones generally relating to Illinois are listed here:
Quad Cities
* The area transportation plan had the freeway that is now I-88 extending inward towards downtown Moline, but not connecting to I-74. A further extension that would have provided a freeway from I-88 that tied into the end of the IL 92 freeway was not adopted.
* The supplemental freeway for the US 67 corridor was shown using the IL 92 freeway.
Would this extension of the Interstate 88 freeway travel through downtown East Moline as well? When you refer to the further extension to the end of the Illinois 92 freeway, is that the current Centennial Freeway, or another proposed freeway for the state route?
The supplemental freeway for U.S. 67 exists as part of the IL-92/Centennial Freeway? Was the road going to tie directly into the bridge or lead southward beyond Interstate 280?
QuoteChampaign-Urbana
* In the past there were long-range plans for a southern bypass of the area, running south of Church Road and connecting to I-74 east of the IL 130 interchange. Seems to have died.
I thought the Curtis Road exit (Exit 232) might have been considered a bypass (but in reality, not), but a southern bypass for Champaign-Urbana would make perfect sense now. Like all things IDOT, not happening! :(
I have seen three different maps showing three different names for the Illinois 92 freeway in Rock Island: Rock Island Parkway, Centennial Freeway, Centennial Expressway. What is the current name?
Quote from: AARoadsIs this the same "561 Freeway" proposed mentioned on Jason Hancock's Quad Cities page? Was there any more details on it?
I believe it was the "561 Freeway," and there was a map showing interchange locations. Probably a decent amount of discussion about it, but there were several other studies I wanted to at least skim at the time (early Cincinnati, Louisville, Chicago, and Albuquerque).
Quote from: AARoadsWould this extension of the Interstate 88 freeway travel through downtown East Moline as well? When you refer to the further extension to the end of the Illinois 92 freeway, is that the current Centennial Freeway, or another proposed freeway for the state route?
IIRC, the extension of the I-88 freeway was to continue west towards the Mississippi, parallel the railroad track/IL 84 along the river, and terminate around 7th Street. The rejected option was to have this freeway continue west along/near the riverfront to connect with the already built(?) then IL 199/now IL 92 freeway at the US 67/Centennial Bridge.
Quote from: AARoadsThe supplemental freeway for U.S. 67 exists as part of the IL-92/Centennial Freeway? Was the road going to tie directly into the bridge or lead southward beyond Interstate 280?
I was originally under the impression that the US 67 freeway/FAP 413 was going to be a direct continuation of the US 61 freeway in Iowa into Illinois somehow, but either I was mistaken or the section staying closer to US 67 between I-280 and the Mississippi River had been canceled by the time of this study. This study had the freeway coming up from the south, overlaying the now IL 92 freeway to the Centennial Bridge, and accessing the bridge with a slightly better interchange than what currently exists today - the ramps between IL 92 and the Mississippi River weren't built.
Earlier Illinois Supplemental Freeway plan for partial reference:
http://www.midwestroads.com/illinois/il%20supp%20fwy.pdf
I have extensive info on the supplemental freeway system. It's the original Wilbur Smith Study - many of the corridor studies and what routes are still under construction study, etc.
The 1976 study was never official. IDOT denies the original was, but they issued freeway bonds and put many of the routes in their annual budget. In 1983 they were turned into principal arterials and that is what they are today. None are completly dead but several like Illinois 1 are very dormant.
The Gaines Street Expressway in Davenport is indeed dead and I think may have only existed in that study.
You should see the 1971 Interim CATS Plan for Chicago!
[Edited out grammar/spelling - AlpsROADS]
^ Just found it via Google. Not sure the link below will work; the document is not displaying a web address in reader.
http://www.cmap.illinois.gov/WorkArea/linkit.aspx?LinkIdentifier=id&ItemID=6664 (http://www.cmap.illinois.gov/WorkArea/linkit.aspx?LinkIdentifier=id&ItemID=6664)
Another Chicago area plan:
http://www.catsmpo.com/pub/reports/history/cats_1954-62.pdf (http://www.catsmpo.com/pub/reports/history/cats_1954-62.pdf)
Right The 1962 plan was very close to the 1971 interim plan
I can go over each supplemental freeway route and what happened to it as well when I am feeling better.
It would be really great if someone could post a map I am sure one can be found on google
Came across this the other day:
http://www.lib.niu.edu/1975/ii750255.html (http://www.lib.niu.edu/1975/ii750255.html)
Didn't realize I-255 was apparently coming close to cancellation - wondering if there were other sections of I-255 that were controversial besides the section near Cahokia Mounds. Originally it was suppose to continue more northerly than northeasterly after I-64, putting it closer to the area and I believe on the west side of the visitors center there.
I'm also curious where this construction on the East St. Louis-Marion supplemental freeway occurred.
Also found from the St. Clair County Comprehensive plan that the originally proposed freeway from the Tudor Ramps at the PSB Complex to somewhere on IL 15 around I-255 may be dormant as a lower grade (non-freeway) facility. (See page 54/90):
http://www.co.st-clair.il.us/NR/rdonlyres/F3A3F090-63E8-4959-8240-065B99FD0342/0/081104SCCCompPlanTextforWebsite.pdf (http://www.co.st-clair.il.us/NR/rdonlyres/F3A3F090-63E8-4959-8240-065B99FD0342/0/081104SCCCompPlanTextforWebsite.pdf)
I did not know that about 255 . The good news is it will be finished and more work will continue on FAP 413-US 67
The supplemental freeways are now expressways. I am intrigued about shared 4 that MO is trying . It might be a good alternative on some moribund Illinois projects
I found another study for the St. Louis area from the late 1960's that indicates the real controversial stretch of I-255 was the part through Frank Holten State Park.
This study was looking at what roads to improve or add to the area via several network simulations. One of the networks included a new bridge somehow connecting I-55 and MO 755 to IL 157 to relieve congestion on the PSB, but the network maps weren't clear on the alignment for the bridge. The bridge did not draw enough traffic to be worth constructing.
Since I've managed to get a lot more time to look at the Quad Cities study while being near a computer, I've put together a Google map showing the recommendations:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=117499567522166489363.00047d76987e5e427dff9&z=11 (http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=117499567522166489363.00047d76987e5e427dff9&z=11)
I might add in a few of the considered but rejected routes later, including a further extension of the John Deere Expressway to now the now IL 92 freeway and the "I-88" Extension to the east end of the now IL 92 freeway
Great Map
74 will be the new bridge. The Centennial and Arsenal are old but well built and under capacity . Aresenl will be closed to public this summer for contruction. There was talk of a bridge east of 74 but itwent nowhere.
67 to Monmouth would really be more than fine as a shared 4 There are 3 miles of 3 lane now and preemption and Viola just need the lines repainted. The busiest strech is 6000 vpd in Rock Island County
Have you ever thought about scanning in the maps from these transportation studies, or taking a digital photo of the maps and posting them online instead of using Google Maps to draw them out?
^ Main reason I haven't put images online is due to the lack of a personal website; also moderately concerned about copyright issues for some of them
The most interesting unbuilt freeway in Illinois to me is the phantom I-64/US 50 freeway.
Does that explain the bizarre configuration of I-55/64/70 through East St Louis?
And 755s maps are nicer than some of the documents. I have seen them
No US 50 is being studied as a 4 lane expressway. Part was built for 64 and the supplemental freeway sysytem. Now the I57 to IN -I 69 is being studied. Maybe it could be the Southern Illiana!
Realitically I think it should be a shared 4 . The east part just needs the lines repainted
Quote^ Main reason I haven't put images online is due to the lack of a personal website; also moderately concerned about copyright issues for some of them
Flickr/Photobucket/Picasa/etc etc takes care of that problem. And I wouldn't be concerned about "copyright issues" for agency planning documents....
Found a 1970's plan for Rockford, IL today. Only freeway cancellation appears to be a Southeasterly radial along some railroad tracks. The freeway that evolved into I-39 underwent a shift westward, with the one shown on the map not having a section concurrent with the US 20 bypass. Many of the expressways shown seem to have been built. Google map:
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=117499567522166489363.0004803d2cb2e90b6fa6a&z=11 (http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=117499567522166489363.0004803d2cb2e90b6fa6a&z=11)
Yeah, I'm late to the party.
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 15, 2009, 05:46:43 PM
Spent some time today going through another university library and turned up a few interesting tidbits - only the ones generally relating to Illinois are listed here:
Champaign-Urbana
* I-74 had two full cloverleafs east of I-57 that have since been downgraded to diamonds - think one was at US 45, but can't remember exactly (it was too wet and too long of walk back to the car for copies).
That other exit would be the Neil Street exit, exit 182, and the exit for the Market Place mall.
*sniff* It's sad to see Shampoo-Banana with fewer cloverleaves. One of my earliest roadgeek memories, dating back to my first incarnation in C-U (lived there through age 6, and then again for college) was of marveling over the beauty of the cloverleaves, and of my parents amusing me by going through all four petals at interchange after interchange.
I don't remember whether that was before or after my parents taught me to read by using BGS's.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg706.imageshack.us%2Fimg706%2F3474%2Frf1.jpg&hash=981c370e45f7e701eef6521ca7c2d4164d6ac68c)
Above is an excerpt the minimum build network for Rockford from the study. The xxxx pattern indicates routes that would not be built if there was insufficient funding to carry out the full plan.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg706.imageshack.us%2Fimg706%2F3282%2Fis270eis1.jpg&hash=85ba6fc6e9e7818c3809d7d92967a336d8ebcdaa)
This excerpt comes from Plate 3 from F.A.I. Route 270 From Collinsville To SIU-E Draft Environmental Impact Statement Volume II The folded diamond at the bottom is the Horseshoe Lake Road interchange. I haven't included all of FAP 413 since there is a separate EIS for it, but the map does show an alignment that looks very close to the one being built.
I'm actually surprised there weren't more alternatives for this section of highway; I had been expecting one that would be west of the as built alignment.
Note the I-870 designation for the section of I-270 between what is now I-255 and Troy. Also note the plan for a semi-direct ramp between WB Poag Road and what is now SB IL 255. I'm guessing this was to accommodate SIUE traffic.
There's mention in the DEIS of a connector from South University Drive to I-270 that would provide a bypass of the IL 157/Chain of Rocks Road intersection and tie directly into I-270 with a half semi-directional T interchange. This connector is mentioned as an improvement until the FAP 413/IL 255 route was built. There were two alignments due to the alternatives for I-270; one branching off I-270 west of the Sand Road overpass for the East I-270 alignment with a brief overlay of Chain of Rocks Road, and the other branched off east of the Sand Road overpass for the western I-270 alignment
I have the FAP 413 EIS(and most of the other Illinois EISs). It had a lot of alternates but mostly on the north end.
I have heard Rockford wants a western bypass Considering the cost my guess is it gets nowhere like the Peoria,Bloomington and Decatur proposals
There was a Springfield study from that era as well
I just found Will County 2030 is out Kane has been for a while.
I think there are 2020 plans for Lake,McHenry,Dekalb and Kankakee
They include the county suggestions for the state systems as well
I have not read the new Will but it should be interesting because WIll likes to build
Quote from: 3467 on February 23, 2010, 08:44:38 PM
I have heard Rockford wants a western bypass Considering the cost my guess is it gets nowhere like the Peoria,Bloomington and Decatur proposals
The Peoria bypass is actually under study again:
http://www.easternbypass.com/ (http://www.easternbypass.com/)
I think it might get a protected corridor if IDOT really feels the need for it, though it might only get that far like the Gateway Connector has.
Speaking of the Gateway Connector, there's a letter in the EIS's for now I-255 between I-55/70 and I-270 from the Collinsville School District that seems to indicate a study was underway for a similar outerbelt back then.
The supplemental freeway study I mentioned early was done by Seelye Stevenson Value & Knecht, Inc, and Nelson, Ostrom, Baskin, Berman & Assoc. Inc., and is dated March 1976. There's three routes that don't seem to be included in the online map (http://www.midwestroads.com/illinois/il%20supp%20fwy.pdf (http://www.midwestroads.com/illinois/il%20supp%20fwy.pdf)): one for IL 35 from the US 20 route to the Wisconsin border, and the unbuilt freeway between Congress Parkway and the spur off of I-90/94 south of I-55. It's hard to tell from the pdf map, but the Elgin-O' Hare route was also included.
Quote from: 3467There was a Springfield study from that era as well
I've come across one older Springfield plan, but didn't see any new freeways planned. An MTR post mentioned that I-55 was once planned to run through the downtown area, but I've yet to find any verification of that.
I've relocated the
I have a copy of the 1976 report and their suggestions. Those were in there and have just gone away.
I was told by someone at IDOT it too was very political and to note the activity of a Route 1 Association. IL 1survived as a 4 lane while everything else was downsized. I would love to build the system as new interstates but realistically they are almost all low volume and I think all the goals of access that the freeway system was proposed for could be met by a combo of 4 lane expressways and shared 4s.
Could they have thought of runnig 55 in some RR ROW?
Chicago is thinking of a mini-crosstown on RR ROW . CDOT has renamed it the Mid City Transitway
Found a map in the 1969 Fox River Valley Transportation Study Volume 1 by H.W. Lochner & Company that shows some interesting features (particular map for anyone who finds this study is Mpa 15 on Page 78):
* What is now I-88 is shown running immediately to the south of US 30 west of IL 47.
* The US 20 freeway bypass of Rockford is shown as an "existing or committed interstate route". There is a separate category for "existing or proposed freeways," and it also appears this way in the regional map of the 1962 Chicago Area Transportation Study plan, so I'm not sure it can be ruled out as a mapping error too fast.
* In the more immediate Chicago area, the connector between the stub freeway off of I-90/94 near I-55 and I-290 is also shown as a committed interstate route, along with what is now I-90 between I-290 and I-294 (back when I-90 was supposed to use I-290's route.
* The Stony Island Avenue/Lake Shore Drive freeway is still shown as proposed, but not as an interstate. The Crosstown is shown proposed as an interstate route.
Crosstown was Interstate 494 I have the DEIS
CDOT is pusing for a 4 lane mid city transitway all on existing RR ROW which would carry buses and trucks and leave the cars Cicero and other N-S Routes
The CATS 2010 had a 4 lane proposal between the Stevenson and Eisenhower also on RR ROW near Western Ave. It would carry all traffic Both this and the transtway would likly have some sort of toll
Does anyone know why it was dropped?
Quote from: 3467 on March 18, 2010, 11:46:30 PM
The CATS 2010 had a 4 lane proposal between the Stevenson and Eisenhower also on RR ROW near Western Ave. It would carry all traffic Both this and the transtway would likly have some sort of toll
Does anyone know why it was dropped?
This is just an educated guess.
The other big transportation initiative in the CREATE project which is designed to reduce rail transit times through the city. It is behind schedule as the public money part of the funding has been slow in coming. The reason that this might apply is that the RR ROW for those proposed highways won't be available until CREATE re-routes the trains to new route. And if the CREATE step that would free up the RR ROW is stalled, then you can't build a highway on it.
Tonight's find is that I-55 cost more by using a lot of US 66's four lane sections than it would have to have built a mostly new alignment. "'Having two four lane divided pavement highways so close together would not have been regarded as good planning'" (yet for some reason Indiana seems to have done this with US 40 and I-70). I-55 was also one of the last original Illinois interstates to be completed since US 66 was providing better service and safety than the other two lane routes the other interstates were replacing.
Source is "Upgrading of US 66 to Lag Behind Other Interstate Routes" Edwardsville Intelligencer December 16, 1971.
What is the story behind the Maxwell Connector in Peoria? We took it last week and found a four-lane expressway between a half-built cloverleaf interchange with I-474 and Maxwell Road, a Peoria County highway. There is a milepost of 0.02 at the west end touting the number "905". Is that a state route designation?
Quote from: AARoads on May 17, 2010, 05:46:54 PM
What is the story behind the Maxwell Connector in Peoria? We took it last week and found a four-lane expressway between a half-built cloverleaf interchange with I-474 and Maxwell Road, a Peoria County highway. There is a milepost of 0.02 at the west end touting the number "905". Is that a state route designation?
As far as I know, it is the eventual terminus of the IL-336 expressway from Quincy. As to why it has a cloverleaf design with room for it to go to the east, it is in the same category as the I-39/US-20 interchange in Rockford; meant for a freeway/expressway that was planned and never will be built.
Yes It was built when 474 was completed about 1980. Then it was put in hiatus and there was a plan to widen US 24 between Banner and Kingston Mines( so Canton would have a 4 lane). Then it was back to 336 The first few miles are to be freeway the rest of the 60 miles, expressway.
Quote from: AARoads on May 17, 2010, 05:46:54 PM
What is the story behind the Maxwell Connector in Peoria? We took it last week and found a four-lane expressway between a half-built cloverleaf interchange with I-474 and Maxwell Road, a Peoria County highway. There is a milepost of 0.02 at the west end touting the number "905". Is that a state route designation?
I think it was originally planned as a improved arterial, but can't remember for which route exactly - I believe it was for Farmington Road, though it could have been for IL 116.
I think there used to be an earlier transportation study for Peoria online that had it, but I have yet to find the document again. IIRC, that study also briefly looked at a SW-NE freeway parallel to the bluffs on the west side of the Illinois River, but didn't find enough vehicular demand to warrant building such a route.
EDIT: Really can't turn up the plan online tonight; darn sure it used to be readable online.
Old newspaper article turned up tonight indicates I-180 in Illinois was a compromise over relocating I-55 to have a 24 mile longer route via a I-155 and IL 29 route via Peoria to satisfy the steel plant at Hennepin. Source article is "GAO Says Illinois Road Is A 'Favor'."
The Edwardsville Intelligencer, August 4, 1970 in Access Newspaper Archive.
The Kerner Curve after then Gov Kerner who tried to get Interstate Funds to run 55 down the IL 29 corridor and back to 55 on what is now 155 since 66 was 4 lane and at the time didnt need the upgrade.
Feds denied obviously
Couple minor finds from the Illinois State Library today (the only library I've seen where entering requires passing through nearly airport level security). Parking stinks there too
First source: Environmental study: FAI Route 255 (formerly FAI Route 270) : an additional interchange between the Mississippi River and Illinois Route 3, Monroe County, Illinois. Google Book entry: http://books.google.com/books?id=o9SuMQAACAAJ&dq=FAI+255+interchange&cd=8 (http://books.google.com/books?id=o9SuMQAACAAJ&dq=FAI+255+interchange&cd=8)
Google maps of the area for reference:
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=38.465283,-90.218267&spn=0.04664,0.109863&z=14 (http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ie=UTF8&ll=38.465283,-90.218267&spn=0.04664,0.109863&z=14)
* Between the Jefferson Barracks Bridge and the IL 3 interchange, it was originally planned to have two overpasses, one for the road on the Mississippi levee, another for the north-south road just west of the UP tracks.
* A new folded diamond interchange was looked at for an industrial park south of I-255. The interchange would have been on the west side of the as-built overpass.
* It appears the FAP 410 supplemental freeway would have run west of today's IL 3 alignment, but east of Bluff Road. The first access to existing IL 3 would have been at a partial cloverleaf (entrance loops) north of today's Valmeyer Road.
Second book was a draft EIS for the FAP 406 supplemental freeway (now I-155)
* It appeared that tying what is now I-155 into the eastern I-74/I-474 interchange had been briefly considered.
They lend some of these studies out through interlibrary loan at least in state. That is how I got them because going there is such a pain. Has anyone been to Northwesterns Transportation library ? Its great but they dont like lending. They have almost every EIS ever done and many of the state highway studies like the Illinois supplemental freeways.
There were several corridor studies for supllemental freeways done that would be called corridor studies or feasability studies today not EISs because all they did was consider routing. Unlike today thye were all planned as freeways Today other designs would be considered at all stages.
For instance US 41 in Indiana was considered as a corridor for FAP 411 Dropped because it wasnt a freeway and was in Indiana. FAP 413 -now 67 considered a corridor using 74 and going south from Galesburg as well as a rout along the Mississippi river.
Fun Stuff
Made the trip to Northwestern's Transportation Library today - and I have a nice rant I may post somewhere regarding the joys of the Chicagolabnd's traffic, many apparent IDOT District 1 screw-ups, plus the lack of mass transit alternatives for those coming in via I-55.
Main document I was after was an early 1970's EIS for the FAP 410 freeway (East St. Louis to Marion). Due to lack of time - lost at least 90 minutes due to traffic - I didn't get to look through this document or many others as well as I would have liked.
The FAP 410 EIS mentioned early on the five general corridors (the EIS never gave a detailed final alignment, though there was one somewhat detailed map with design hourly volumes) that were considered before selecting one (got the maps copied, don't have scanner access at the moment):
* The Freeburg Corridor - Via the unbuilt US 460 freeway (FAP 414) from the Tudor ramps at the PSB complex to the I-255 cloverleaf with IL 15, down IL 15 to Freeburg, then along IL 13 to just east of Murphysboro.
* The Tilden Corridor - Via the US 460 freeway, IL 15 to Freeburg, IL 13 to the eastern end of the multiplex with IL 4, slightly east of IL 4 to Steelville, then south but generally parallel to IL 4, then bypassing Murphysboro to the northeast.
* The Steeleville Corridor - Generally along IL 3 from the PSB complex to Red Bud, then along IL 154 to Sparta, then the same as the Tilden Corridor.
* The Chester Corridor - Generally along IL 3 from the PSB complex to around Ellis Grove, then generally north/east of IL 3 to Chester, then cutting over to around Ava, then following the same route as the Steeleville and Tilden Corridors. It was noted that this route would compete for traffic with I-55, but given the lack of Mississippi crossings, this seems questionable.
* The Pickneyville Corridor - Generally along IL 3 from the PSB complex to Red Bud, then along IL 154 to Sparta, then north of but parallel to IL 154 to Pickneyville, then generally along IL 13. This seems to have been the selected corridor due to the population served.
The EIS generally wanted the route to service the then-proposed airport at Waterloo. There was also a page showing plans for a Mississippi River crossing near Valmeyer, plus a four lane freeway connecting the bridge to the airport. I'm not sure whether it was this EIS or another one, but there was a map of the St. Louis interstate/freeway system that was either grossly wrong, or there were a couple of corridors that IDOT wanted as interstates. It appeared that the US 460/FAP 414 freeway was marked as an interstate, and there appeared to be an interstate route looping up from I-270 through Alton - whether it came back down on the Illinois or the Missouri side the map wasn't clear on.
This EIS broke up the route around Columbia due to the change of nature of the route from rural to urban at that town.
EIS's for what is now I-39
It appears that early on consideration was given to running future I-39's route closer to Dixon, then down to I-80 near Peru, then mutliplexing with I-80 back to the current alignment of I-39. A separate EIS also showed consideration of bring the route around the east side of the Blormal area to end at I-74.
EIS for the now IL 336 corridor freeway, Quincy area to Macomb
Looks like early on it was decided to locate this freeway in the general area where IL 336 was built.
EIS for US 50 supplemental freeway, Breese to Beckmeyer
There were two alignments shown on in the Carlye area (yes that area is beyond the study limits, but some of the maps still showed them. One brought the freeway east from the interchange with IL 127 to cross the Kaskaskia right at the spillway from Carlye Dam. The other alignment bypassed Carlye to the south.
EIS for the Franklin Street Connector in Chicago (I-90-94 spur to Cermak to Congress Parkway)
It appears there may have been considering tunneling this freeway or selling allowing buildings to be constructed over it.
EIS for the Crosstown Expressway
Some of the maps were very hard to read in this EIS, but it appeared that many of the freeway-freeway interchanges were going to be stacks. One general area map also showed a planned route connecting Lake Shore Drive to the Chicago Skyway, maybe in the area of Stony Island Avenue.
EIS for I-474
Didn't appear to be any alternative alignments proposed for this route.
EIS for I-55 section that includes Atlanta
Didn't appear to be any alternative locations proposed or considered.
Chicago looked like a mess Sat Tell us more .....
I have made the trip to the trans library many a time because they became a pain for Interlibrary Loan. Every EIS ever
I imagine you could spend a week there.
They also have some of the freeway studies in the planning section. I can give you call numbers if you are going back
Have fun
I've pretty much said everything I can remember from reading. Really needed to find the copy machine sooner, much less have another month to go through everything.
I think the EIS collection is missing a few documents from Missouri and Iowa, unless those states got away without doing an EIS for many projects - or I haven't found some in the online catalog yet (Mount Pleasant Bypass in Iowa, Ottumwa bypass in Iowa, I-55 widening in St. Louis and Jefferson Counties, Route M expressway in Jefferson County, MO 32 expressway at Park Hills, MO 21 freeway Otto to the Meramec River).
It's unlikely I'll get back to the library for a while - I would just assume never drive inside the I-294 loop ever again.
As for traffic:
Morning
* Southbound I-55 was close to becoming stop-and-go near Coal City.
* Northbound I-55 backed up horribly for a lane closure near US 6. Where were the VMS's with "Work Zone Ends x miles" and "X Minutes to End of Work Zone" like MoDOT had on I-44 when it was being widened from the St. Louis County line to Pacific?
* Why the heck a lane closure for installation of a soundwall along I-55 that is at least 35 feet back from the shoulder?
* A slowdown on NB I-55 whenever there's a cop sitting nearby.
* Slow, some stop-and-go on I-55 east of I-294, mainly around poorly designed interchange. Where are the auxiliary lanes, or just a fourth of fifth through lane?
* Poorly signed forced merge from I-55 onto WB I-90/94, with almost non-existent striping.
* Very slow, much stop-and-go on I-90/94 from I-55 to the northern split. The Crosstown would have been very helpful.
Afternoon
* Lake Shore Drive really slows down near the stoplights. Some of those lights took multiple cycles to get through. And this route is cited as an example of an at grade street handling large amounts of traffic well?
* Long queue on NB Lakshore that stretched back onto I-55, then back on NB I-90/94, for a long distance in the express lanes.
* SB I-57 tried to break down near I-80. Otherwise I-57 seems a tad less traveled than I-55, and even lighter once past US 30, enough that a Kankakee - Dwight freeway might be very useful (or at least a western bypass of Kankakee to provide quick access to IL 17).
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 01, 2010, 11:47:04 AM
I've pretty much said everything I can remember from reading. Really needed to find the copy machine sooner, much less have another month to go through everything.
I think the EIS collection is missing a few documents from Missouri and Iowa, unless those states got away without doing an EIS for many projects - or I haven't found some in the online catalog yet (Mount Pleasant Bypass in Iowa, Ottumwa bypass in Iowa, I-55 widening in St. Louis and Jefferson Counties, Route M expressway in Jefferson County, MO 32 expressway at Park Hills, MO 21 freeway Otto to the Meramec River).
It's unlikely I'll get back to the library for a while - I would just assume never drive inside the I-294 loop ever again.
LOL! :-D Driven it far too many times (see may name block). I-90/94 is lots of fun. :banghead:
Quote
As for traffic:
Morning
* Southbound I-55 was close to becoming stop-and-go near Coal City.
There's some construction work to repave this 1956 freeway between Gardner and Braidwood.
Quote
* Northbound I-55 backed up horribly for a lane closure near US 6. Where were the VMS's with "Work Zone Ends x miles" and "X Minutes to End of Work Zone" like MoDOT had on I-44 when it was being widened from the St. Louis County line to Pacific?
This is IDiOT. Why would you expect anything different than backwardness when it comes to construction zones? :rofl:
Quote
* Why the heck a lane closure for installation of a soundwall along I-55 that is at least 35 feet back from the shoulder?
Because the area from Plainfield Rd (US-30) to Renwick Rd is inaccessible from the Frontage Rd for the installation, and there is more than soundwall installation going on. IDOT finally widened the freeway in 2007 after 20 years of begging. In addition to the soundwall, there will be guardrails being installed along that stretch as well as landscaping.
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* A slowdown on NB I-55 whenever there's a cop sitting nearby.
Welcome to the way they drive in Chicagoland. I also fault Scott's Law and the fear people have regarding its use/abuse.
Quote
* Slow, some stop-and-go on I-55 east of I-294, mainly around poorly designed interchange. Where are the auxiliary lanes, or just a fourth of fifth through lane?
What? Did you expect IDiOT to be ISTHA or InDOT? Plus, Daley fought the expansion of I-55 to eight lanes so he could get more riders for the CTA Orange Line nearby. It obviously worked. :ded:
Quote
* Poorly signed forced merge from I-55 onto WB I-90/94, with almost non-existent striping.
A lot of striping does not survive many winters here due to the snowplowing.
Quote
* Very slow, much stop-and-go on I-90/94 from I-55 to the northern split. The Crosstown would have been very helpful.
Helpful yes, victim of puting transit first instead of a balanced network of transit and freeway, yes.
Quote
Afternoon
* Lake Shore Drive really slows down near the stoplights. Some of those lights took multiple cycles to get through. And this route is cited as an example of an at grade street handling large amounts of traffic well?
Yep, works so well, it gives you a preview of what to expect if they tear down part of I-70 between the new bridge and Poplar Street. X-(
Quote
* Long queue on NB Lake Shore Drive that stretched back onto I-55, then back on NB I-90/94, for a long distance in the express lanes.
Sounds like you hit rush hour(s).
Quote
* SB I-57 tried to break down near I-80. Otherwise I-57 seems a tad less traveled than I-55, and even lighter once past US 30, enough that a Kankakee - Dwight freeway might be very useful (or at least a western bypass of Kankakee to provide quick access to IL 17).
Maybe, but IL-17 is not that heavily travelled.
Quote from: Brandon on August 02, 2010, 11:41:02 AMI also fault Scott's Law and the fear people have regarding its use/abuse.
what is Scott's Law?
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 01, 2010, 11:47:04 AM
* A slowdown on NB I-55 whenever there's a cop sitting nearby.
If you're talking a cop watching for speeders Brandon's comment makes sense - remember that huge area round Chicago is 55. Also If he pulled someone over, IL law requires drivers to move over
AND slow down (to 20 under the speed limit).
Quote from: Master son on August 02, 2010, 11:51:10 AM
If you're talking a cop watching for speeders Brandon's comment makes sense - remember that huge area round Chicago is 55. Also If he pulled someone over, IL law requires drivers to move over AND slow down (to 20 under the speed limit).
what if it is impractical to move over? i.e. traffic is so heavy that attempting to drop a lane would be more likely to cause an accident than prevent one? Most states tend to have that exemption and it is sufficient just to slow down.
Quote from: Master son on August 02, 2010, 11:51:10 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 01, 2010, 11:47:04 AM
* A slowdown on NB I-55 whenever there's a cop sitting nearby.
If you're talking a cop watching for speeders Brandon's comment makes sense - remember that huge area round Chicago is 55. Also If he pulled someone over, IL law requires drivers to move over AND slow down (to 20 under the speed limit).
It's asinine, IMHO, and hence, IMHO, Scott's Law should be challenged and repealed. There is nothing in the law stating 20 under the limit. The speed is entirely subjective and up to the ticketing officer.
Few interesting finds for what is now I-88:
* A 1954 study has the second stage of this route (with the first stage ending at today's IL 56) running dead west from IL 56 to today's IL 40 north of Sterling, then curving down to near the present I-80/I-88 interchange, then following a more gently curving version of IL 5 with a terminus at US 67 near Milan. Interchanges would have been at US 67, US 150 (EB on, WB off), IL 2, the then-proposed "Iowa Turnpike" (appears to be approximately near Hillsdale), US 30, now IL 40, IL 26, US 51 and IL 23.
* A 1963 study referred to the route as the Lincoln Tollway. This one had the routing being the same as today's routing until near Ashton, where the tollway would have crossed over IL 38 and run north of Dixon, Sterling, and Morrison to a terminus somewhere apparently near the IL 136 Mississippi crossing to Clinton, Iowa. Interchanges would have been at IL 78, IL 40, US 52, IL 2, US 51, and IL 23. This map also shows I-80 being planned on it's present route, except for fading out at US 61 in Iowa and then reappearing around today's I-280 crossing of US 67 in Illinois.
The original legislative mandate for the tollway was to connect with US 67. Was the 1954 report one of the original tollway plans. I think I saw it many years ago.
Some extremely brief research on the I-494/Crosstown route, from a DEIS for the project.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg262.imageshack.us%2Fimg262%2F9595%2Fis494is9094.jpg&hash=1971caaf1d29b9fd7ba2343e37f0976e5986f117)
At the start of the route. All of the major interchanges with other freeways were planned to resemble stacks. IIRC the large black squares and circles were for images elsewhere in the DEIS.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg707.imageshack.us%2Fimg707%2F4591%2Fis494atunknownroutestif.jpg&hash=0bf4ed219e08b6a28c42e76de07e40c8ce112d88)
Where the route would turn eastward towards I-94. Note the other two routes coming off at the corner - don't recall seeing much info about them in the text. Also note the split alignment to be used for a large portion of the north-south section.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg46.imageshack.us%2Fimg46%2F8029%2Fis494atis94tiff.jpg&hash=7f009a1739d1aec7292835d070bebf1f04606f14)
At the southern end of I-494 with I-94. Some of the alternatives evaluated connected to I-94 right at the interchange with the Skyway.
Also took a look at an EIS for I-72 and the US 51 bypass of Decatur. Only alternative to what appears to have been built was an I-72 alignment much closer to Old US 36 combined with a US 51 bypass that was shifted east slightly.
I think some went to 57. I was looking at Chicago. The RR ROW is still there between the Kennedy and Stevenson. It looks like they could sqeeze in 4 lanes max You could probably estimate better than I can.
Is this the version that had the amazing city between the 8 lane freeway with transit and so on?
Isnt it sad the era we are in now . The" maybe we can sqeeze 4 lanes in era" as opposed to the "lets build a fantatsic new city era"
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 15, 2009, 05:46:43 PM
Champaign-Urbana
* I-74 had two full cloverleafs east of I-57 that have since been downgraded to diamonds - think one at us 45 but can't remember exactly.
Yes one was at US 45 the other was at Neil St. That's what i remember as a kid.
Corridor 410 eventually favored the IL 13/127 corridors, as both are heavily traveled by SIU students. This one will remain a primary arterial, however. Only the Marion/Harrisburg portion of Corridor 411 was widened to 4 lanes, the rest is still 2 lanes.
Corridor 412 south of B-Normal is still being studied by IDiOT, however, I won't be surprised if the alignment really got shifted further west closer to St. Louis.
Corridor 413 - the southern 5 miles became I-255 thanks to some political maneuvering back in the late 1970s. The next 20 miles is IL 255 and it is nearing completion on the final segment. The rest of it is US 67 and most of this will be a 4 lane arterial and some of it is under construction or will be let out for bids.
http://www.growthassociation.com/html/PDF/US%2067%20FY%202011-2016%20map.pdf
Corridor 407 and 405 is not dead by any means given there are still studies out there.
There are threads with updates on all the surviving projects farther down on this page and under Central States for Southern Illinois
Nice map on 67 Thanks
After the census data I am just not wild optimistic about the future of many of these projects. Downstate lost a lot of population.
That is why I started the Poor boy thread under fictional highways to look at cheaper alternatives.Parts of the 4 lane expressway are running over 10 million a mile
Turned up a map today in an old newspaper collection for a tollway plan for Illinois that was proposed before the supplemental freeway system. All of the routes were pretty much the same as those in the supplemental freeway plan except for the 405, 407 and 413 corridors. The 407 corridor would have branched off of I-72 farther east from today's I-172 (maybe around Barry?). The 405 corridor would have run northeasterly to I-55 generally along IL 116. The 413 corridor appeared to branch from I-270 somewhere west of but fairly close to the I-55/70 interchange.
And from more time with the newspaper collection:
* Couple articles regarding Cahokia wasn't happy about I-255 slicing through town. The Bi-State Development Agency was also unhappy about the highway being planned to "pass along a runway of Parks Bistate Airport" limited expansion possibilities ("Route of I-255 Protested" Evansville Courier and Press(?), exact article date unknown but it's between August 1965 and July 1966). The route being protested was supposedly a new straighter route than an earlier one that had some curves to pass around the eastern side of Cahokia. Unfortunately neither of the articles has a map showing the route.
* Funding issues delayed completion of I-57 near I-94 ("Dan Ryan Link Is Delayed; No Federal Funds" Chicago Tribune)
* The I-494/Crosstown Expressway seems to have been originally called the Belt Expressway (from being near the belt railroad corridor. The map with the article shows the route having a southern/eastern terminus at the Chicago Skyway ("Expect Action Soon On Belt Expressway" Chicago Tribune)
* Early plans for the Fox Valley Freeway had it starting at the I-55/IL 126 interchange, kind of wandering east and west of the IL 59 corridor, and terminating at a "Evanston Harvard Freeway" at Lake Zurich. The Evanston Harvard Freeway was supposed to start at the McCormich Blvd/Simpson Street intersection in Evanston, head west to I-294, and then head northwestrly to Madison, WI, with the border crossing near Harvard, WI. Around the Fox Valley Freeway it was to run somewhat parallel but north of US 14 ("Propose 44-Million Thruways for Fox River Area" Chicago Tribune).
* "US Gas Tax Boost Needed, Douglas Says" Chicago Tribune, around July 17, 1965. Interesting how history seems to repeat itself sometimes.
* "Rockford-Decatur Road Study Ok'd", Rockford Register-Republic. Study approved by IL legislature, article hints at the study being necessary for the route to be considered as a future addition to the interstate system.
* A 10 mile section of I-74 opened west of Peoria on August 25, 1965 (from a Chicago Tribune article, headline appears to have been cut off). A Pekin Times article lists the section being from University Street to Kickapoo Edwards Blacktop Road.
* A state rep tried to get IL 180 extended up to I-80 through Galva. ("Barry Backs 180 Extension", Galva News?)
* A temporary, two lane, at grade connect was to be used to access I-57 near Bonnie, IL (first town on IL 37 south of I-64) ("Build Access To Interstate 57 At Bonnie" Mt. Vernon Register-News)
* Several articles regarding shifting I-55 to run through Peoria and then up to I-180, a few noting that Blormal, which strongly opposed the shift, already had a somewhat decent route provided by US 66.
* ("State Road Finances In Terrible Shape" Illinois State Register) Illinois apparently had issues with matching federal funds back in the 1960's.
* Not sure on which article it goes with, but there is a map of the I-55 shift through Peoria that has two "future additions" to the route: One from I-80 to I-90 at Rockford, and another one from Lincoln down to Decatur and then mostly straight south but with a curve to intersect I-57 at Dix (location estimated, but it's definitely somwhat close to Mt. Vernon).
* There was also a proposal to reroute I-55 to follow the east bank of the Illinois River south of Peoria and somehow connect to I-70 west of downtown St. Louis with an Illinois (Mississippi?) River crossing north of Alton ("Illinois River Valley Expressway," Illinoisan Star)
* A few articles on fighting over the route of what turned into I-355 between I-55 and I-290.
* Illinois apparently had the lowest national gas tax at one time - five cents a gallon ("Engineer Says Financial Crisis Slows Improvements of Route 3" Waterloo (IL) Republican).
* One article has a picture for a Crosstown Proposal which would have the highway built on a viaduct directly over railroad lines (for 98 percent of the highway, not a bunch of simple perpendicular bridges) ("Expressway Over Belt Line Tracks" Chicago Daily News, December 1, 1965). Another article in the Chicago News on 12/27/1965 calls refers to the design as a "Stiltway."
* Apparently IL 13 was at one time proposed to be four-laned to Shawneetown ("Route 13 Funds Urged" Southern Illinoisan, 12/31/1965)
* The original I-72 Mississippi crossing was supposed to be two miles north of the US 36 bridge ("Outlines Midstate Expressway: Chicago Tribune, 1/14/1966)
* An article mentions first stirrings for the what became the Avenue of the Saints, with lobbying for a secondary freeway from Minneapolis-St. Paul through Iowa to I-80 west of Waterloo and Iowa City, then merging with I-80 to the Quad Cities before heading south to St. Louis.
* An article has a map of a supplemental freeway system that has two corridors that seem to have disappeared from the later plans: A US 24 route between the Peoria area and I-55, and a route between I-55 and Kankakee. In addition this map has the current I-39/US 51 Rockford-Salem corridor heading west through Lincoln, Peoria, and curving westward again to pass close to Dixon. The article indicates hope for a new interstate system program after 1972 ("East-West Expressway Is Recommended For Inclusion In 1972 Interstate Road Plans" Springfield Sun, 3/13/1966).
* Another article on the possibility of building a statewide tollway system has the IL 1 corridor route taking a diagonal route between I-57 at Marion and IL 1, and curving back west to pass by Kankakee and end at I-55 at the IL 129 interchange. This map also has a route running northwesterly from the St. Louis area near the Mississippi River to around Quincy, and has the I-39/US 51 corridor route crossing I-70 around Altamont and ending at I-57 maybe around Edgewood. ("Statewide Toll Road Net?" Chicago News, 7/22/1967)
* The US 66/Toronto Road interchange on the south side of Springfield was supposed to be closed when the route was upgraded to I-55 ("Highway Division Discloses I-55 Interchange Location" Illinois State Journal 9/8/1967)
* Several articles indicate the first section of the Crosstown Expressway in Chicago to be built was between I-55 and Midway Airport.
* One article with a sketch of an earlier plan for a split alignment of the Crosstown Expressway shows the route splitting cars and trucks into separate lanes ("A new plan for Crosstown Route," Chicago News, 11/28/1967)
* An couple of pictures for the I-80 opening at Kedzie Avenue in Hazel Creek have an I-80 shield above signs given distances and times to New York and San Francisco (770 miles, 13 hours and 2210 miles, 37 hours) (Chicago Heights Star, 1/21/1968)
* Another map for future I-72 has the route angling north of Harristown before rejoining the presently built route ("Time Factor May Be Aid to Expressway," Decatur Herald, 3/17/1968)
* Couple articles briefly discuss moving signs 35 feet back from the edge of pavement on interstates in Illinois.
* Further revisions to the split Crosstown Alignment did have the northbound and southbound lanes reversed - the southbound lanes would be east of the northbound lanes - for the north south section. The northbound lanes would be over Cicero Avenue, while the southbound lanes would parallel the belt line railroad tracks ("Daley Tells New Plan for Crosstown" Chicago Tribune, 6/25/1968)
* Article on the opening of most of I-180 has a picture of a Jct/Spur/I-180 assembly at the IL 29 intersection ("Interstate 180 Section Opens Near Princeton," Peoria Journal-Star, 10/31/1968)
* An article on the Galesburg-Monmouth US 34 freeway mentions possible use of a Super 2 design. There were three alternative locations: Upgrade the existing US 34 (now IL 164) between Galesburg and the as built freeway end, a new northern route using north of but generally parallel to US 34 with a farther out northern bypass of Monmouth, and a southern route which is a straighter version of the as built route but with a southern bypass of Monmouth ("Future Freeway West From Galesburg: Hearing Topic" Galesburg Register-Mail, 1/10/1969)
* Picture of a sign being erected on eastbound I-55/70 at the US 40 interchange in Troy has I-70 with a control city of Vandalia (East St. Louis Journal, 1/2/1969)
* An article goes over a planned second phase for the expressway system near Chicago, including many of the unbuilt routes from the 1962 planning study, including a loop between the Crosstown and I-294 via First Avenue between I-90 and I-55 and then eastward to the Crosstown's eastward turn; the Fox River route with a northern bend to curve over to a terminus at Lake Forest; the South Suburban route going south from the I-55/I-294 interchange and curving eastward into Indiana to pass north of Chicago Heights; and what appears to be a spur route from the current I-355/I-290 interchange running west-northwest to Elgin ("Second Phase of Expressway Plans Started," Chicago News, 2/15/1969)
* Another map of the supplemental freeway system with variations and new routes: I-88 between Rock Falls and the Quad Cities heading for the I-80/I-74 bump interchange; present I-72 west of Jacksonville heading straight to Quincy; a spur route to the Jacksonville-Quincy corridor to Hannibal, Mo; the US 34 Galesburg-Burlington route passing well north of Monmouth; an extension of the now I-55 corridor southeastward to Mattoon via Decatur (in addition to the US 51 route); and a route between I-24 at Vienna and the Marion to Chicago east side of state route at Harrisburg ("Cellini [public works director] Sees New Road Network" Illinois State Register, 4/21/1969)
* There's an article with mention by the district state engineer of a freeway generally along US 136 in the Macomb area, possibly in addition to a separate US 24 Peoria-Quincy freeway ("Outlines Road Study, Freeway Proposals" Macomb Journal, 3/11/69).
And more research from the newspaper article collection:
* Another article has mention of the IL 1 supplemental freeway connecting to I-24 at Vienna ("Coming Kankakee [somewhat in] Area Freeway" Kankakee Journal, 5/2/1969)
* The extension of the spur off I-90/94 near I-55 apparently made it at least to the land clearing phase ("Demolition Begins for Dan Ryan Extension," Chicago Tribune, 10/19/1969)
* The proposed interchange with the US 50 freeway immediately north of the cloverleaf with I-64 was originally going to be a trumpet, but faced objections by the St. Clair County Highway Department, which preferred a diamond ("Interchange Plans Awaited," Metro East Journal, 9/16/1969)
*Centralia was not happy with the US 51 supplemental freeway connecting to I-57 near Alma ("Proposed Highway Faces Program of Resistance," Centralia Sentinel, 10/20/1969)
* A combined state police district headquarters and rest area was proposed over I-55 at the Bluff Road interchange (Exit 247). Closing the interchange for the facility was opposed by locals ("Proposed I-55 oasis outlined," Joliet Herald-News, 2/4/1970)
* More cyclic history: A major bond plan for road building was ruled unconstitutional by the Illinois Supreme Court ("Ogilvie's Road Bond Issue Ruled Unconstitutional," Springfield Register, 3/24/1970); the state apparently had a limit on the amount of debt it could take on that needed to be changed by voters.
I had never heard of the tollroad plan. I wonder if it was ever seriously looked at by the Toll Authority.The original plan out in 66 which is in the state library did mention tolls as a funding source and it from that plan the map with the zig zag I -39 came from.
Old 34 now 164 has ROW for a 4 lane expressway for several miles east of Monmouth(as it does just east of Galeburg now) so I bet that was in the existing route option. I do know there was livly discussions about where the freeway corridors should be.
This stuff is great!
Came across a couple documents today that may be in error or may be indicative of a possible early plan to number the FAP 408 freeway (I-72 west of Springfield) as I-155. Time frame would have been around when today's I-155 route was under construction, so it could easily be someone got confused on which FAP 4xx route was getting which interstate number.
Wild speculation: If I-155 was being considered for the Springfield-Jacksonville route, I-355 was going to be used for the Lincoln-Peoria route, leading to the possible I-455 numbering for the North-South Tollway.
You might be right Illinois has always tried for Interstate numbers Illinois tried to get 34 as 174 and in fact I saw an old plat book with it in there as 174 so they might have tried 155.
355 might have been 355 because IDOT tried to get what is now 155 as 37!
How about 37 for I-255/IL 255 at least it crosses a state line and would be a place holder.......
If I-155 went to the I-72/Springfield, and I-355 went to I-155/Lincoln, then today's I-355 wouldn't have been I-455, but rather I-555.
Long-time lurker - thanks to Revive755 for the research efforts - great reading!
Current I-155 was originally IL 121 and when the whole stretch between Lincoln and Peoria was turned into a freeway, IDOT applied for I-155. I want to say that was around 1989 or so. I have the state maps at home somewhere.
Because it connects to other interstates at both ends, the current I-355 would have been a perfectly serviceable even x55. This is usually my preference unless it involves burning a state's last even 3di for that interstate.
Wouldn't it make more sense though to try and limit the amount of number changes for the sake of changing? Until I-355 is going at more of an angle at the top or bottom to make it look more like a bypass like 294, leave it as 355.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on March 04, 2011, 06:34:38 PM
Because it connects to other interstates at both ends, the current I-355 would have been a perfectly serviceable even x55. This is usually my preference unless it involves burning a state's last even 3di for that interstate.
However, that's not how 3dis work in Illinois. From what I can see, IDOT and ISTHA seem to think that an even 3di must connect back to its parent at both ends. This is why I-155 and I-355 are odd 3dis that connect to other interstates, and why I-294 is multiplexed with I-80 to I-94.
I been searching newspaper archives and that I-43 from Milwaukee to Green Bay got designated as such so they did not have to ask the state of Illinois to sign a I-57/94 concurrency through Chicago (Sheboygan Press, April 5, 1974).
Quote from: Brandon on March 05, 2011, 09:29:48 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on March 04, 2011, 06:34:38 PM
Because it connects to other interstates at both ends, the current I-355 would have been a perfectly serviceable even x55. This is usually my preference unless it involves burning a state's last even 3di for that interstate.
However, that's not how 3dis work in Illinois. From what I can see, IDOT and ISTHA seem to think that an even 3di must connect back to its parent at both ends. This is why I-155 and I-355 are odd 3dis that connect to other interstates, and why I-294 is multiplexed with I-80 to I-94.
I would say Illinois is inconsistent. You could add I-270, I-280, I-290, and I-474 to your argument, but I-255 does not end at I-55 in Illinois.
Quote from: mukade on March 06, 2011, 09:32:19 AM
Quote from: Brandon on March 05, 2011, 09:29:48 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on March 04, 2011, 06:34:38 PM
Because it connects to other interstates at both ends, the current I-355 would have been a perfectly serviceable even x55. This is usually my preference unless it involves burning a state's last even 3di for that interstate.
However, that's not how 3dis work in Illinois. From what I can see, IDOT and ISTHA seem to think that an even 3di must connect back to its parent at both ends. This is why I-155 and I-355 are odd 3dis that connect to other interstates, and why I-294 is multiplexed with I-80 to I-94.
I would say Illinois is inconsistent. You could add I-270, I-280, I-290, and I-474 to your argument, but I-255 does not end at I-55 in Illinois.
But I-255 does connect to I-55 twice, once in MO and once in IL. It just happens to go further north. And the part north of I-55 to I-270 was the last segment built of it if i recall correctly.
^ Correct. However, the I-255/I-270 loop was going to be signed only as I-270, with I-270 between I-255 and I-55/70 at Troy changed to I-870, but apparently objections to changing the I-255 to I-55/70 section to I-870 shelved this plan.
EDIT:
Looking through the Google News Archive tonight, it appears both the Crosstown and I-290/I-90-94 connector along the Chicago River may have been canceled around the same time in June of 1979, but it appears to be another one of the pay-per-view articles.
It also appears the transfer of the I-494 designation from Lake Shore Drive to the Crosstown route occurred around 12/4/1963 - per another pay-per-view blurb.
Quote from: Brandon on March 05, 2011, 09:29:48 PM
However, that's not how 3dis work in Illinois. From what I can see, IDOT and ISTHA seem to think that an even 3di must connect back to its parent at both ends. This is why I-155 and I-355 are odd 3dis that connect to other interstates, and why I-294 is multiplexed with I-80 to I-94.
But I-294 originally went into Indiana. It was in 1964 when I-90 and I-94 swapped paths that it was pulled back so that I-94 and I-294 did not over lap.
Some website information on potential improvements in the old Supplemental Freeway corridors.
www.us51eis-idot.com
Pana to Centralia on US 51
www.elginohare-westbypass.org
Extension of Elgin Ohare to access a future western terminal of O'Hare airport, also includes a N-S bypass of the airport connecting I-294 and I-90.
www.dot.state.il.us/us67/index.html
US 67 corridor in western IL
http://www.dot.state.il.us/us20/index.html
US 20 Freeport to Galena
http://www.dot.state.il.us/us30/index1.html
US 30 Fulton to Rock Falls
http://www.dot.state.il.us/il29/default.aspx
IL 29 Peoria to I-80
http://www.dot.state.il.us/projects.html
Here are the rest of them except US 34 Biggville bypass and US 50 from Olney to Indiana
Found the EIS for the IL 97/Madison Street project in Springfield, IL. A map of the transportation plan for Springfield had interchanges on IL 4 at the IL 97 and IL 29 (near the Airport) intersections. There was also consideration of a below grade expressway for IL 97 and for an interchange at IL 97/Madison and MacArthur Boulevard, but there was apparently a second volume to this EIS that said why the built alternative was selected - but I didn't find this second volume today.
Looking through an online database of Chicago Tribune articles, it appears the Crosstown Expressway was killed mainly by the governor of Illinois; there are a couple of articles where Chicago is wanted to bid the expressway instead of the state. There's also mention of only the section of the Crosstown south of I-290 possibly being built.
^^ Would've been very useful in getting to/from Midway.
Made another trip to Northwestern's Transportation Library today. There was a sign inside saying some books may be unavailable due to Google digitizing them.
* From one of the EIS's for the Lake Freeway (IL 137) between I-94 and the IL 137 interchange with Grand Avenue, it appears IDOT went ultimately went with Alternative 4. Two of the alternatives were full freeways between the then-existing end of the freeway at Grand Avenue in Waukegan and the interchange between IL 137 and I-94. One of the freeway alternatives was an upgrade of existing IL 137, the other curved northward to follow 24th Street. Another alternative had an arterial design for the east-west portion, but turned into a freeway for the north-south portion (this was the recommend design for the draft EIS). It appears that the section between the two built sections of freeway would have crossed over and run on the east side of the railroad track along IL 137. Almost all of the interchanges in the freeway sections would have been SPUI's. None of the alternatives with an east-west freeway portion had any access to US 41. In addition, all alternatives had the I-94/IL 137 interchange being nearly identical to today's lousy half access design used at I-94 and IL 120.
* An EIS for the Franklin Street Connector (an extension of the spur off of the Dan Ryan near I-55), the northern section of freeway between Roosevelt Road and Congress Parkway would have been a two level design like Wacker Drive, but with the freeway on the bottom and a local road on top. The freeway would have tied directly into Wacker Drive, but the present day interchange design with Congress Parkway would have remained.
* Found two EIS's for I-255 from the mid 1970's. The first was for the section between MO 231 and just west of the southern IL 3 interchange. This one indicated the outer beltway that has come back as today's Gateway Connector was still alive. The second, more recent EIS was for the section from just west of the southern IL 3 interchange to the interchange with I-55/70, and seemed to be comparing the as-built route with alternatives that avoided Frank Holten State Park. The avoidance alternatives included a few eastern alignments near IL 157 and one western alignment that went a decent ways into East St. Louis and had a section that was almost parallel but south of I-64. The location of the interchange with I-55/70 did not entirely seem to be nailed down yet, as there was one alternative that used the interchange between I-55/70 and IL 111.
Here's some stuff I remember about the planning of I-39 between I-80 and Bloomington-Normal when I was with IDOT.
There were a few options explored with freeway and expressway sections. The expressway version was almost approved. The Diamond-Star (Mitsubishi and Chrysler) car plant then came under potential development, and pressure came to make it a full freeway to provide the proposed plant better connectivity with Chrysler's Belvidere plant. Then-Gov. Thompson made the decision to design it as a full freeway. The entire stretch probably cost $400 million (in '80's dollars) including the bridge over the IL River at Oglesby.
At the same time, the stretch between Bloomington and Decatur was studied. District 3 decided to grade separate its US 136 intersection. District 5 looked at grade separations around Clinton, but ultimately built signalized intersections to save money. Some of the old timers have later regretted that decision as well as the mess they allowed to occur with all the signalized intersections at Forsythe, north of Decatur. This "expressway" often is not "express".
Looked through a couple early EIS's today for the Elgin O'Hare Expressway. It appears that originally the EOE was going to curve back to the north and run alongside a slightly shifted US 20 and tie into to US 20's Elgin bypass. However, later plans had the EOE curving back up to US 20 and having a stoplight infested gap between the EOE and the Elgin bypass, with one of the reasons for leaving the stoplights being a desire to not attract traffic to the EOE from other routes.
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
Quote from: 3467 on August 07, 2011, 10:20:18 PM
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
I remember that I-39 designation in IL was done in 2 parts. They got the section north of 80 approved before the south section. Perhaps b/c of the uncertainty of going to an interstate design standard from Oglesby to B-N until 1986 or so.
Quote from: 3467 on August 07, 2011, 10:20:18 PM
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
I remember doing traffic counts on US 51 in the mid 80's and there were about 7,000-8,000 vpd around Lostant. There are still 1,000 or more vpd on old US 51 (now IL 251) but I-39 is probably in the low 20 thousands, way more than growth in background traffic alone. It is obvious that I-39 is being used, at least by some, as a Chicagoland bypass.
Quote from: Rick Powell on August 08, 2011, 01:43:29 AM
Quote from: 3467 on August 07, 2011, 10:20:18 PM
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
I remember doing traffic counts on US 51 in the mid 80's and there were about 7,000-8,000 vpd around Lostant. There are still 1,000 or more vpd on old US 51 (now IL 251) but I-39 is probably in the low 20 thousands, way more than growth in background traffic alone. It is obvious that I-39 is being used, at least by some, as a Chicagoland bypass.
By many - I-39 in Illinois is a big-time interstate truck route for traffic both between eastern Wisconsin and points south and southwest and between the northwestern USA and points east and southeast. It's the midwest version of I-81 in southern Pennsylvania, Maryland and northern Virginia (bypassing the eastern seaboard metro areas). Further, Union Pacific's 'Global III' intermodal yard was built in Rochelle, IL in part due to the site's the easy access to and from I-39.
Mike
it would been even bigger if IDiOT ever upgraded US 51 from B-N south towards Centralia/Mt. Vernon area, as I-57 is a major trucking artery itself (parts of I-57 near Mt. Vernon pushing 40k vpd with about 30% of that truck traffic).
Quote from: kharvey10 on August 08, 2011, 11:49:43 AM
it would been even bigger if IDiOT ever upgraded US 51 from B-N south towards Centralia/Mt. Vernon area, as I-57 is a major trucking artery itself (parts of I-57 near Mt. Vernon pushing 40k vpd with about 30% of that truck traffic).
They have a long range study to do just that. And 51 is an expressway all the way from Bloomington to north of Pana, although some stretches of it have several stoplights and reduced speed zones.
www.us51eis.com
Forgot to mention that I looked through another EIS for the IL 137 freeway around Waukegan. One of the maps showed a formerly proposed alignment change for US 41 around IL 137 - labeled formerly proposed FAP [can't recall the number]. It would have been from between the intersection of US 41 and MLK Drive and US 41's curve near Atkinson Road running west of the current road.
The EIS also referred to SPUI's as compact diamonds.
This article seems to indicate that at one time, I-57 was going to be closer to US 51 in more of southern Illinois:
http://news.yahoo.com/marion-ill-still-celebrating-interstate-50-years-later-183000255.html?bouchon=602,il (http://news.yahoo.com/marion-ill-still-celebrating-interstate-50-years-later-183000255.html?bouchon=602,il)
Turned up an article in ProQuest that indicates I-94 was originally going to use the US 41 corridor until the Tri-State Tollway alignment was decided to be close to the US 41 corridor; the shift in interstate designation occured in 1952. The US 41 freeway was going to be built with only a 50% federal match. Source article is "Plan Skokie Road Expressway A 1950 Project Comes to Life 12 Yrs. Later" Chicago Tribune July 8, 1962
EDIT Other finds:
* Another article indicates that the IL 83 corridor was strongly consider for the Tri-State; the article also mentions plans for the Tri-State to hook up with a Wisconsin Turnpike. Source article is "Sidetracks Skokie Highway Plans Toll route is cited as alternative" Chicago Tribune November 23, 1953.
* US 41 was also apparently shifted onto the Edens between the Skokie Road interchange (Exit 34A) and Touhy Avenue interchange (Exit 39). "US 41 Marked On Edens Hwy.; Aid To Trucks" Chicago Tribune August 30, 1953.
* There's a 1944 article that has two decent maps of Chicago highway plans, with the Dan Ryan along Union Street from Archer Avenue to maybe 51st Street, then curving west to follow Halstead Street to 119th Street. The Kennedy would be along Clybourn Avenue from Congress Street to Western Avenue where it then follows the C&NW railroad to Cicero Avenue. The Kennedy and Dan Ryan routes tie into the Congress Street route via a flipped over "h" shape with the western route being the longer. A bypass of the loop from today's I-55 is shown along California Avenue. East-West radial routes are shown along Higgins Road, Butterfield Road, and North Avenue, with the North Avenue route splitting west of St. Charles. Today's I-57 is shown stopping at a belt route that resembles I-294, with today's IL 394 shown extending out of the region. The main I-294 analogue is shown running through Elmhurst, the east side of Arlington Heights, and the east side of Libertyville before connecting with the Edens around the curve on US 41 in what I think is the area of Delany Road in Gurnee. There's a diagonal route running west from the Edens perhaps around IL 22 west to Fox Lake and beyond. A sort of inner loop is shown branching off the outer loop, passing east of Willow Springs, briefly merging with the I-55ish corridor, before continuing north, passing through the east side of Des Plaines and ending at the Fox Lake diagonal. An east-west route is shown near the US 30 corridor that dies out near today's I-57. Interestingly, the larger map does not have the North Avenue and IL 394ish corridors connect within the city limits to any other expressways. Source article is "Edens Parkway Is A Key Route In Traffic Plans." Chicago Tribune July 30, 1944.
* A map with an article has a giant triangle (maybe three miles to a side) shown for the interchange between the Tri-State and Edens Spur routes. "Suburbs Wait Shift In Toll Road Routing" Chicago Tribune October 10, 1954
* Apparently what evolved into I-90 was to follow the unbuilt Stony Island/Lake Shore drive route between the Skyway and the loop. The article and maps seem to have placeholder numbers for designating the interstates with the various IL routes having numbers between 1 and 14. "Illinois Using 150 Million In Road Aid In '57" Chicago Tribune June 21, 1957.
* Chicago canceled the Stony Island Expressway in late 1959: "City Changes Plans; Expressway Dropped" Chicago Tribune, December 13,1959
Map from one of the EIS's for the US 50 supplemental freeway:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg849.imageshack.us%2Fimg849%2F5875%2Fus50supfreewaynearis57.jpg&hash=23b5bb64e2ce315bd245f7db57cfa2cb9280180d)
I didn't take the time to read all the way through the EIS to see if a reason was given for going north of Salem.
A different EIS for what is now I-72 west a Springfield indicated that there was plans for a rest area (I think for a pair, not just a shared facility for both directions) near the Illinois River crossing, but west of the river.
And now for your pleasure a map of a few alternatives for what evolved into I-39. Not the best scan, but I'll try to get a better one someday.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg694.imageshack.us%2Fimg694%2F7564%2Fi39alts.jpg&hash=3b217880850b71ef98d4291e8e0293cdf3efe3d5)
Corridor C's are generally near US 51. Corridor D's start off near US 51 but swing over to parallel IL 23 from Streator to DeKalb before heading north to I-90 near Belvidere. Corridor E's generally stay closer to IL 23.
This one comes from 1954 study for a turnpike system for IL:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg338.imageshack.us%2Fimg338%2F1870%2Filturnpikestudy.jpg&hash=136e4490b85f43bf3a7ba463e8a7ae9579ecc75d)
The dashed potential toll road near US 66 from Mt. Olive to East St. Louis was supposedly due to that section of US 66 being two lanes and having operational problems.
This is really strange because the IDOT annual reports statred showing th epropoed interstates on almost exactly their same corridors ex for 64 which was on US 50 .
It howver does explain an old story that I thought was just imagination. Kewanee claims that I-74 was planned to go by them and not Galesburg...well here it is.
The zig zag north south route was on the first outline map of the SFS.
There was a Feas Study that did show 72 North of Jacksonville
I'm not sure whether this is a somewhat long-lived mappo from the past or an indication of plans that did not come to fruition, but the Iowa state map insert for Davenport have today's IL 92 freeway from I-280 to US 67 shown as I-199 from 1962 up to 1967, then for 1967 and 1968 this freeway is shown with no number. The section south of I-280 is shown as IL 199 in the 1969 map.
http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1962_back.pdf (http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1962_back.pdf)
http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1965_back.pdf (http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1965_back.pdf)
http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1969_back.pdf (http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1969_back.pdf)
Quote from: Revive 755 on April 03, 2013, 10:05:50 PM
I'm not sure whether this is a somewhat long-lived mappo from the past or an indication of plans that did not come to fruition, but the Iowa state map insert for Davenport have today's IL 92 freeway from I-280 to US 67 shown as I-199 from 1962 up to 1967, then for 1967 and 1968 this freeway is shown with no number. The section south of I-280 is shown as IL 199 in the 1969 map.
That mappo explains why several gas station maps I have from that era show I-199 on their Quad Cities inset. They must have grafted their insets wholly on the official highway map. The Iowa cartographers likely overlooked it for years since it was on the Illinois side of the map (something I noted in my days working for a map company was that cartographers often overlooked areas outside the general scope of the map they were working on). For what its worth, I have an Illinois General Highway map from that era that shows 199 north of I-280:
(//www.aaroads.com/forum_images/midwest/quad_cities_map.jpg) (//www.aaroads.com/forum_images/midwest/quad_cities_map.jpg)
Quote from: Revive 755 on April 03, 2013, 10:05:50 PM
I'm not sure whether this is a somewhat long-lived mappo from the past or an indication of plans that did not come to fruition, but the Iowa state map insert for Davenport have today's IL 92 freeway from I-280 to US 67 shown as I-199 from 1962 up to 1967, then for 1967 and 1968 this freeway is shown with no number. The section south of I-280 is shown as IL 199 in the 1969 map.
http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1962_back.pdf (http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1962_back.pdf)
http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1965_back.pdf (http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1965_back.pdf)
http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1969_back.pdf (http://www.iowadot.gov/maps//msp/historical/pdf/1969_back.pdf)
Has to be a mapo. The Centennial Expressway in Rock Island was originally IL 199, then became IL 92 when some highways in the Quad Cities area were renumbered around the end of 1975 when the last segment of I-74 opened through Moline. (At the same time, US 150 was truncated to its present north end and IL 92 was rerouted to go through the downtowns of Rock Island and Moline.)
My guess is that whoever did the cartography for the Iowa Highway Commission got confused.
^ I was just wondering if there had been discussion of seeking an interstate designation for the Centennial Expressway and the map maker got confused because of such discussion.
Quote from: Revive 755 on April 03, 2013, 10:05:50 PM
I'm not sure whether this is a somewhat long-lived mappo from the past or an indication of plans that did not come to fruition, but the Iowa state map insert for Davenport have today's IL 92 freeway from I-280 to US 67 shown as I-199 from 1962 up to 1967, then for 1967 and 1968 this freeway is shown with no number.
I-199? You mean this (https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=40.801726,-77.802944&spn=0.066401,0.143166&sll=37.6,-95.665&sspn=35.330654,73.300781&t=m&z=13)
Quote from: Steve on April 08, 2013, 05:13:18 PM
I-199? You mean this (https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=40.801726,-77.802944&spn=0.066401,0.143166&sll=37.6,-95.665&sspn=35.330654,73.300781&t=m&z=13)
Nah, the Google downgrade to Ebensburg.
Quote from: mgk920 on August 08, 2011, 10:22:22 AM
Quote from: Rick Powell on August 08, 2011, 01:43:29 AM
Quote from: 3467 on August 07, 2011, 10:20:18 PM
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
I remember doing traffic counts on US 51 in the mid 80's and there were about 7,000-8,000 vpd around Lostant. There are still 1,000 or more vpd on old US 51 (now IL 251) but I-39 is probably in the low 20 thousands, way more than growth in background traffic alone. It is obvious that I-39 is being used, at least by some, as a Chicagoland bypass.
By many - I-39 in Illinois is a big-time interstate truck route for traffic both between eastern Wisconsin and points south and southwest and between the northwestern USA and points east and southeast. It's the midwest version of I-81 in southern Pennsylvania, Maryland and northern Virginia (bypassing the eastern seaboard metro areas). Further, Union Pacific's 'Global III' intermodal yard was built in Rochelle, IL in part due to the site's the easy access to and from I-39.
Mike
Using I-39 and I-74 to get from southern WI to Indianapolis was a very quick and easy alternative to the Chicago mess. Did it a bunch of times on trips to the southeastern US.
More from the ProQuest archive for the Chicago Tribune:
* Apparently the extension of the IL 53 corridor shown in one of the Chicago transportation plans from the IL 120 corridor to the Wisconsin border made it into the public hearing phase. The article has a map that show two main corridors, one east of IL 83, one west of IL 83 that runs near IL 59 from IL 132 to Grass Lake Road. The western corridor then has either a western or eastern bypass option of Antioch ("Second Lake-Will Freeway Hearing Planned Tonight" 1/22/1970)
* The same article discusses the US 41 freeway in the Gurnee/Waukegan area and has a map showing three general corridors under consideration: Along US 41 to a point south of IL 173, then northeasterly to a point west of IL 131 on the Wisconsin border; between Delany Road and the UP Railroad; and between the UP Railroad and IL 131.
* It appears that the IL 53 freeway was at one time planned to stay closer to Rohwling Road, have a brief east-west section along Baldwin Road to about Hicks Road, then angle northeasterly to end at IL 83 just east of the intersection with today's IL 53. A map shows the freeway going under US 14 and crossing IL 68 immediately east of the intersection with US 12. ("Two Suburbs Debate Route For Highway: Limited Access Road Sought" 9/4/1958
* A later alignment for the IL 53 freeway followed the as built route except for the section north of IL 68, which an a map shows running northeasterly to a terminus with IL 83 maybe at near the Arlington Heights Road intersection. Apparently there was orginally to be a full interchange at US 12 instead of at IL 68. The article also states that the extension of the freeway to Madison was originally going to be an interstate, but the interstate route was shifted to use the Northwest Tollway. ("Decide Route of Highway As An Expressway Link: Six Miles of IL 53 to Be Relocated" 6/22/1961)
* A later articles seems to indicate that shifting I-90 from the NW Tollway to the new IL 53 freeway corridor/freeway to Madison corridor may have still been intended. ("New 53 Route Irks Neighbors" 7/20/1961)
* Even after the demise of the Lake Shore Drive route for I-494, there seems to have been some interest in extended the Ohio Street Feeder eastward. ("N. Michigan Av. Group Details Two-Street Expressway Plan" 11/5/1965)
* There were apparently proposals for the Amstutz Expressway to start at the interchange of I-94 with IL 176 ("Lake Bluff Opposes Expressway Proposal" 11/12/1970)
* The Bureau of Public Roads was apparently not thrilled with the section of I-80 that uses the Tri-State Tollway ("1st Expressway Across Illinois Runs Into Snag: U. S. Turns Down Proposal by Toll Agency" 3/17/1963)
Two maps from an EIS for the western section of FAP 409, the supplemental freeway for the US 50 corridor. The first is at the west end of the facility. The wooded area includes the wetlands that would nowadays require the facility to intersection I-64 near IL 4.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimageshack.com%2Fa%2Fimg802%2F7689%2F5kni.jpg&hash=7cf6967fef80d3826e312a60dfc3f24f40d944f9)
One showing two alternate routes in the Caryle area:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimageshack.com%2Fa%2Fimg829%2F5116%2Fopxa.jpg&hash=d333ebfa53d9d675f458f76ea2131fd1a8e54f12)
Quote from: Rick Powell on August 08, 2011, 01:43:29 AM
Quote from: 3467 on August 07, 2011, 10:20:18 PM
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
I remember doing traffic counts on US 51 in the mid 80's and there were about 7,000-8,000 vpd around Lostant. There are still 1,000 or more vpd on old US 51 (now IL 251) but I-39 is probably in the low 20 thousands, way more than growth in background traffic alone. It is obvious that I-39 is being used, at least by some, as a Chicagoland bypass.
I have regularly taken that route for 20+ years, and the amount of traffic that uses it has steadily grown during that time. Back when it first opened, you could go miles without seeing another car.
And the US-51 section between Bloomington and Decatur is maddening to drive due to the stop lights.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on August 07, 2013, 09:51:30 AM
Quote from: Rick Powell on August 08, 2011, 01:43:29 AM
Quote from: 3467 on August 07, 2011, 10:20:18 PM
I recall some stories that ISTHA was worried about it taking traffic from 90.now that ISTHA is going to get the free part I wonder if they will want to connect it to the Elgin part now.
Did I-39 get its designation when it connected to 80? I think it did because the EIS from 80 to 55 wasnt even done yet. 39 has had the most dramatic growth of any road in downstate Illinois because it became and outer truck by pass of Chicago. No expected that in the early 80s.
I remember doing traffic counts on US 51 in the mid 80's and there were about 7,000-8,000 vpd around Lostant. There are still 1,000 or more vpd on old US 51 (now IL 251) but I-39 is probably in the low 20 thousands, way more than growth in background traffic alone. It is obvious that I-39 is being used, at least by some, as a Chicagoland bypass.
I have regularly taken that route for 20+ years, and the amount of traffic that uses it has steadily grown during that time. Back when it first opened, you could go miles without seeing another car.
And the US-51 section between Bloomington and Decatur is maddening to drive due to the stop lights.
I remember those days, not long after I-39, then US-51 freeway, opened. The East-West Tollway was quiet west of Aurora, even more dead west of DeKalb, and I-39 between there and Rockford was wide open. We used to cut over to I-88 at IL-47 from Bolingbrook when I was going to college up in Houghton, Michigan in the late 1990s and take I-39 from there north to Wisconsin. It was a pleasant drive with a lot fewer vehicles than I-355 and I-90.
Quote from: Brandon on August 07, 2013, 09:58:54 AM
I remember those days, not long after I-39, then US-51 freeway, opened. The East-West Tollway was quiet west of Aurora, even more dead west of DeKalb, and I-39 between there and Rockford was wide open. We used to cut over to I-88 at IL-47 from Bolingbrook when I was going to college up in Houghton, Michigan in the late 1990s and take I-39 from there north to Wisconsin. It was a pleasant drive with a lot fewer vehicles than I-355 and I-90.
I went from Aurora to Rochelle on I-88 a few weeks ago, and could not believe the volume of traffic on I-88 as compared to the old days. Went to the DeKalb Oasis and people were four and five deep in the lines at the concessionaires. Might have been an unusally busy day, but wow. Traffic reminded me of I-80 between Morris and Joliet.
Quote from: Rick Powell on August 07, 2013, 12:38:59 PM
I went from Aurora to Rochelle on I-88 a few weeks ago, and could not believe the volume of traffic on I-88 as compared to the old days. Went to the DeKalb Oasis and people were four and five deep in the lines at the concessionaires. Might have been an unusally busy day, but wow. Traffic reminded me of I-80 between Morris and Joliet.
I'm leaning towards the volume of traffic on I-88 being up due to people avoiding the construction on I-90 between I-39 and the Elgin Toll Plaza.
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 07, 2013, 05:59:55 PM
Quote from: Rick Powell on August 07, 2013, 12:38:59 PM
I went from Aurora to Rochelle on I-88 a few weeks ago, and could not believe the volume of traffic on I-88 as compared to the old days. Went to the DeKalb Oasis and people were four and five deep in the lines at the concessionaires. Might have been an unusally busy day, but wow. Traffic reminded me of I-80 between Morris and Joliet.
I'm leaning towards the volume of traffic on I-88 being up due to people avoiding the construction on I-90 between I-39 and the Elgin Toll Plaza.
It's up period. There's a lot more traffic that's discovered I-88 as a way to go west from Chicago, especially with the explosion in growth in Aurora and Naperville.
From the ProQuest Archie tonight:
"US Rejects Freeway Project To Madison" Chicago Daily Tribune, November 26, 1956 - The Federal Government rejected building a freeway along US 12 due "to a government policy not to support freeways that would duplicate toll routes" So why did New Jersey get away with duplicating the New Jersey Turnpike and New York with duplicating parts of the Thruway with I-90 and I-684?
The map of the corridor also has today's I-290 crossing the Northwest Tollway closer to Barrington Road, with the continuation passing maybe a mile or two east of Barrington before parallel the US 12 corridor.
Found a 1940 Highway plan for Cook County tonight:
http://www.connectingcookcounty.org/pdf/1940%20Long%20Range%20HighwayPlan.pdf#page=27 (http://www.connectingcookcounty.org/pdf/1940%20Long%20Range%20HighwayPlan.pdf#page=27)
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 28, 2013, 10:45:29 PM
From the ProQuest Archie tonight:
"US Rejects Freeway Project To Madison" Chicago Daily Tribune, November 26, 1956 - The Federal Government rejected building a freeway along US 12 due "to a government policy not to support freeways that would duplicate toll routes" So why did New Jersey get away with duplicating the New Jersey Turnpike and New York with duplicating parts of the Thruway with I-90 and I-684?
For that matter, doesn't 94 between Chicago and Lake Station serve as a duplication of the Chicago Skyway/Indiana Toll Road? (And to some extent, Ohio SR 2 between Sandusky and Elyria)
Quote from: TheStranger on June 07, 2014, 12:59:45 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 28, 2013, 10:45:29 PM
From the ProQuest Archie tonight:
"US Rejects Freeway Project To Madison" Chicago Daily Tribune, November 26, 1956 - The Federal Government rejected building a freeway along US 12 due "to a government policy not to support freeways that would duplicate toll routes" So why did New Jersey get away with duplicating the New Jersey Turnpike and New York with duplicating parts of the Thruway with I-90 and I-684?
For that matter, doesn't 94 between Chicago and Lake Station serve as a duplication of the Chicago Skyway/Indiana Toll Road? (And to some extent, Ohio SR 2 between Sandusky and Elyria)
The sky way when into the city and I-94 linked to the old US 41 Toll? (by pass route)
Quote from: TheStranger on June 07, 2014, 12:59:45 AM
For that matter, doesn't 94 between Chicago and Lake Station serve as a duplication of the Chicago Skyway/Indiana Toll Road? (And to some extent, Ohio SR 2 between Sandusky and Elyria)
I don't believe OH 2 was intended to be marked as an interstate so, it is not really the same situation (corrections are welcomed if I'm wrong). But I-94 is definitely a duplication of the Indiana Toll Road between and at least Michigan City. Using the same logic as a direct Chicago - Madison route being a duplicate of the NW Tollway, I-94 should have been posted on the Indiana Toll Road to at least South Bend and then had a north-south section along US 31 before rejoining its present route.
It's really a shame Illinois and Wisconsin didn't fight harder and win over I-90's routing, although I wonder if this would have resulted in a different gap in the interstate system, such as between Rockford and Madison, or I-43 not making it west of the Elkhorn area.
Quote from: TheStranger on June 07, 2014, 12:59:45 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 28, 2013, 10:45:29 PM
From the ProQuest Archie tonight:
"US Rejects Freeway Project To Madison" Chicago Daily Tribune, November 26, 1956 - The Federal Government rejected building a freeway along US 12 due "to a government policy not to support freeways that would duplicate toll routes" So why did New Jersey get away with duplicating the New Jersey Turnpike and New York with duplicating parts of the Thruway with I-90 and I-684?
For that matter, doesn't 94 between Chicago and Lake Station serve as a duplication of the Chicago Skyway/Indiana Toll Road? (And to some extent, Ohio SR 2 between Sandusky and Elyria)
1. The Kingery/Borman and Calumet (aka Bishop Ford) Expressways were started prior to the 1956 act (and even the Skyway and Toll Road for that matter) in 1950.
2. OH-2 was not built with federal finding, IIRC. It's entirely done by ODOT.
From a June 1970 report for the US 41 freeway from IL 120 to the Wisconsin Border:
[Supposed to be an image here, but I see the image host I had been using now wants $3.99/month for direct links]
The image would have been of the Supplemental Freeway system proposed for Illinois but with two freeways that seems to have died off earlier than the rest: the Dwight to Kankakee corridor, and a Quad Cities to Rockford route. At this time what is now I-88 would have stayed along US 30 from Sugar Grove to Clinton, Iowa.
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 13, 2014, 10:13:50 PM
From a June 1970 report for the US 41 freeway from IL 120 to the Wisconsin Border:
and that was right along side I-94 / old Toll US41
Quote[Supposed to be an image here, but I see the image host I had been using now wants $3.99/month for direct links]
Guessing this is why none of your earlier images are showing anymore. Any plans to find a new image host? Plenty of options out there.
^ Eventually, but for the time it is a tad low on my priority list.
I've got space available if you're interested - just PM me.
Forgive me if this was already discussed on this post, but is there any info as to why US 12 Freeway was never built from Chicago to Madison? My assumption would be NIMBYs, but I never did find out for sure.
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 07, 2014, 08:55:12 PM
^ Eventually, but for the time it is a tad low on my priority list.
We could host them here directly too if you want.
Trying this again . . .
[firefox locks up while typing]
Trying yet again . . .
From a June 1970 report for the US 41 freeway from IL 120 to the Wisconsin Border:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fag457%2Frevive755%2FUS41FreewayStudyFigure4_zps205bb48b.jpg&hash=3d5b4c4b3d3851d76d6c021ad372c56431fdc4e4)
Above is an image of the Supplemental Freeway system proposed for Illinois but with two freeways that seems to have died off earlier than the rest: the Dwight to Kankakee corridor, and a Quad Cities to Rockford route. At this time what is now I-88 would have stayed along US 30 from Sugar Grove to Clinton, Iowa.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fag457%2Frevive755%2FUS41FreewayStudyFigure5_zps3ea8cdb4.jpg&hash=407dd412f62695959f7baa7aa39c0f7ebff29744)
Above is a map of a freeway plan with names for some of the corridors (probably not visible in the linked version), plus a possible variant of the more official CATS plan. Of note:
* Harvard - North Chicago Freeway: From around the IL 60 intersection with US 41 west, eventually running parallel along US 14 west of Crystal Lake to the Wisconsin border.
* Southwest Suburban Freeway: From I-57 at 99th Street west to I-55 near IL 126 where it would have turned into the Fox Valley Freeway
As for the variant routes:
* The east-west leg of the Crosstown/I-494 is shown extending east of I-94 to I-90
* The Bryn Mawr corridor is shown being a continuation of the IL 171 corridor. The 1971 interim CATS plan has the Bryn Mawr corridor stopping at I-90 near Bryn Mawr exit (82B).
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1375.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fag457%2Frevive755%2FUS41FreewayStudyFigure7_zps0ac161e2.jpg&hash=1c26e60bd41c14687640a93d0f7082847f717eb1)
This figure shows what some of the Illinois freeways were supposed to connect with in Wisconsin.
Amazing. If Cicero (50) was part of the Interstate network, it would have been a bullet straight shot from I-57 to the Edens (I-94 W), avoiding most of downtown traffic and also not having to go out into the suburbs (I-294). But I guess urban development took priority and it ended up as an arterial road. Still, not sure if it would have made it better or worse (i.e. induced demand, dividing/segregating communities, etc.)
It's moreso a case that "urban development" happened before freeway planning began. Especially north of Midway, Chicago urbanization leapfrogged over Cicero years before we started planning the Interstates and other freeways. The Interstate idea was to squeeze it into a rail right-of-way, but it A) still would have required additional right-of-way, especially north of the Eisenhower, and B) that rail line turns east at Midway, so there was no corridor south of there to 57 that wouldn't have involved bulldozing through a lot of built-up land.
BTW, revive, are those the largest sizes of those maps you have? Still a bit small and hard to pick out detail, especially on that last one (the joint WI/IL map).
Quote from: froggie on October 03, 2014, 08:40:22 AM
It's moreso a case that "urban development" happened before freeway planning began. Especially north of Midway, Chicago urbanization leapfrogged over Cicero years before we started planning the Interstates and other freeways. The Interstate idea was to squeeze it into a rail right-of-way, but it A) still would have required additional right-of-way, especially north of the Eisenhower, and B) that rail line turns east at Midway, so there was no corridor south of there to 57 that wouldn't have involved bulldozing through a lot of built-up land.
BTW, revive, are those the largest sizes of those maps you have? Still a bit small and hard to pick out detail, especially on that last one (the joint WI/IL map).
Don't short the south side, Froggie. Urban development also leapfrogged Cicero south of Midway well before the freeways as well. The Ford City Mall area was a former industrial plant (hence the name "Ford City") before and during the Second World War. Afterwards, it was sold as surplus and bought by Preston Tucker to build his car (of which 50 were built). Then, the building was remodeled and reused for the mall.
Oak Lawn having a freeway through it...
Quote from: froggie on October 03, 2014, 08:40:22 AM
BTW, revive, are those the largest sizes of those maps you have? Still a bit small and hard to pick out detail, especially on that last one (the joint WI/IL map).
The version that was not resized is not much bigger; for some reason this report used photographs of maps instead of the actual maps.
Quote from: adamlanfort on October 08, 2014, 10:15:09 AM
It would make it much easier for traffic coming up from I-57 to get on I-39 in Salem and not have to cut over on I-74 in Champaign-Urbana.
150 miles of new freeway for a 20 mile savings is hardly worthwhile.
Quote from: NE2 on October 08, 2014, 11:54:44 AM
Quote from: adamlanfort on October 08, 2014, 10:15:09 AM
It would make it much easier for traffic coming up from I-57 to get on I-39 in Salem and not have to cut over on I-74 in Champaign-Urbana.
150 miles of new freeway for a 20 mile savings is hardly worthwhile.
More like 75 miles of new freeway, and about 55 miles of new interchanges, overpasses, and access closures, since the highway north of Assumption is already 4-laned, and there's already bypasses in place around most towns. The only grossly expensive part will be the two miles or so north of I-72 in Decatur, which they would have to either bypass or grade-separate the existing highway.
From an economic point of view, the highway would pull a lot of truck traffic off of I-57 and I-74, two roads that could certainly use it. It would also provide a valuable relief route if I-55 or I-57 are closed. And connectivity between northern Illinois and point south (Nashville, Memphis) would be dramatically improved, particularly for cities in northwestern Illinois.
Are there better ways for IDOT to spend its limited funding? Sure. I find the case for just building 4-lane controlled-access expressway over the remaining 75 miles much stronger than upgrading all 150 miles to Interstate-grade highway. Then, take the remaining funding and build out the rest of the US-20 expressway from Freeport to Dubuque.
]The East-West Gateway Council of Governments has posted the 1970Alternative Patterns for Growth (http://www.ewgateway.org/pdffiles/maplibrary/altpatternsforgrowth-1970.pdf) (~10 MB pdf) for the St. Louis region. Of note for the Illinois side in many of the concepts is the earlier routing of I-255, with the extension beyond I-55/I-70 running closer to the Mississippi. On the Local Concepts Combined Alternative (Page 40/), the early Outer Belt corridor (very similar to the currently dormant Gateway Connector) on the Illinois side makes an apperance, along with a new bridge and corridor (which may or may not have been a freeway) across the Mississippi near Festus-Crystal City.
It appears Google is finally allowing full access to the older environmental impact statements, although some of the fold out maps have not scanned well.
* Here's one for adding the US 40 interchange with I-70 at Vandalia (https://books.google.com/books?id=usE1AQAAMAAJ&lpg=PA40&ots=P4TEv4LH3W&dq=FAI%2024%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PA9#v=onepage&q=FAI%2024%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt supplemental freeway from Columbia to Marion (https://books.google.com/books?id=kJU1AQAAMAAJ&dq=FAP%20410%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PP4#v=onepage&q=FAP%20410%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt South Suburban Expressway (https://books.google.com/books?id=cac1AQAAMAAJ&dq=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&pg=PA1#v=onepage&q=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&f=false) (the precursor to the Illiana or what would have been the next phase of the I-355 extension)
* One for the unbuilt supplemental freeway from Decatur to I-57 near Salem (https://books.google.com/books?id=XKg1AQAAMAAJ&dq=FAP%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PT10#v=onepage&q=FAP%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt supplemental freeway along US 50, for the I-64 to US 51 segment (https://books.google.com/books?id=CyI3AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20409%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PP5#v=onepage&q=fap%20409%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the Crosstown Expressway (https://books.google.com/books?id=AJQ1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fai%20494%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PR2#v=onepage&q=fai%20494%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the Amstutz Expressway (https://books.google.com/books?id=J5o1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20400%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PA39#v=onepage&q=fap%20400%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt IL 1 supplemental freeway around Danville (https://books.google.com/books?id=cpQ1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20411%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PT3#v=onepage&q=fap%20411%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* For the freeway that became I-39 from Bloomington-Normal to Oglesby (https://books.google.com/books?id=7JE1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PR1#v=onepage&q=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* For the freeway that became I-39 from Rockford to Rochelle (https://books.google.com/books?id=mJY1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&pg=PA37#v=onepage&q=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&f=false)
* For the freeway that became I-155 (https://books.google.com/books?id=l5g1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20406%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&pg=PA337#v=onepage&q=fap%20406%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&f=false)
(Edited to fix missing url for the South Suburban EIS)
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 08, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
* One for the unbuilt South Suburban Expressway (//http://) (the precursor to the Illiana or what would have been the next phase of the I-355 extension)
This url didn't make it in. Could you please repost it?
Quote from: Finrod on July 09, 2017, 12:26:50 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 08, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
* One for the unbuilt South Suburban Expressway (//http://) (the precursor to the Illiana or what would have been the next phase of the I-355 extension)
This url didn't make it in. Could you please repost it?
Repost of the link to the South Suburban EIS (https://books.google.com/books?id=cac1AQAAMAAJ&dq=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&pg=PA1#v=onepage&q=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&f=false)
This is all fascinating stuff.
I've been going through the state digital archives road maps, and finding a lot of interesting things. Seriously, almost every road map Illinois has ever put out in one handy place? Yes, please.
I just wish they'd fix the zooming feature so that when you zoom in, it doesn't default back to Decatur.
historicaerials.com has aerials taken in 1971 of I-55 under construction in Illinois along US 66 between Glenarm and Farmersville.
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on July 13, 2017, 08:56:52 PM
historicaerials.com has aerials taken in 1971 of I-55 under construction in Illinois along US 66 between Glenarm and Farmersville.
I was kinda surprised when looking at US 66 over the Des Plaines river at Channahon, that 66 actually crossed the river at close to a 45 degree angle.
Quote from: inkyatari on July 13, 2017, 08:59:42 AM
This is all fascinating stuff.
I've been going through the state digital archives road maps, and finding a lot of interesting things. Seriously, almost every road map Illinois has ever put out in one handy place? Yes, please.
I just wish they'd fix the zooming feature so that when you zoom in, it doesn't default back to Decatur.
You found that too? Yeah, that's an awesome map. If I have a question about an old route from the 60s, 70s, or even the 80s and 90s, I will refer to those maps.
I don't remember if I saw the Illinois Digital Archives in this thread. I'm sure it's probably been linked to....
Illinois Road Map Archives (http://www.idaillinois.org/ui/custom/default/collection/default/resources/custompages/bin/edi.php?collection=isl9&startrec=1&startrec=1)
The second page of http://www.iahe-il.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Andy-Plummer-Cook-County-Expressways-.pdf (http://www.iahe-il.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Andy-Plummer-Cook-County-Expressways-.pdf) has a map with an earlier plan that had the Tri-State running through DuPage County.
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 18, 2018, 01:31:12 PM
The second page of http://www.iahe-il.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Andy-Plummer-Cook-County-Expressways-.pdf (http://www.iahe-il.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Andy-Plummer-Cook-County-Expressways-.pdf) has a map with an earlier plan that had the Tri-State running through DuPage County.
It looks like they ultimately combined the Tri-State and River Parkway concepts into the actually built Tri-State. It seems the Tri-State would have been closer to the alignment of IL 83 through DuPage County (or overtaken it entirely). Basically, South of O'Hare they just ultimately ended up having it straddle the Cook-DuPage County Line to the Stevenson and then aligned back to the River Parkway route North of O'Hare. IL 53 basically would serve the same purpose in North Cook County that the "original" Tri-State would if not for these little towns in Lake County called Long Grove and Hawthorne Woods (if only people could have seen the future on that one, and built that through sooner before became a problem and those towns came up with the ammunition to basically hold it up like that have for half a century). As for not building the crosstown... HUGE MISTAKE! While I agree that building the blue line into O'Hare and orange line to Midway absolutely was the right call with the diverted funds... the crosstown would have made a huge difference... just look at the mess at the Circle now! Some of that would have been alleviated, but I think we can safely say that ship has long sailed!
I revived crosstown and the Mid city transit way are in the into 2050 plan . Comments closed last week . But the crosstown is not dead yet.
The only difference is that in the original plan, the Crosstown was to diverge from the Kennedy at about Diversey Ave. IDOT removed the ghost ramps for its interchange there when they rebuilt the Kennedy in the 1980s, replacing them with new slip ramps for the Kennedy's reversible express lanes. More recently, the proposals that I have seen for the Crosstown have it connecting with the Kennedy farther out at its Edens Split interchange.
Mike
Quote from: 3467 on August 18, 2018, 06:21:52 PM
I revived crosstown and the Mid city transit way are in the into 2050 plan . Comments closed last week . But the crosstown is not dead yet.
Quote from: mgk920 on August 19, 2018, 11:33:11 AM
The only difference is that in the original plan, the Crosstown was to diverge from the Kennedy at about Diversey Ave. IDOT removed the ghost ramps for its interchange there when they rebuilt the Kennedy in the 1980s, replacing them with new slip ramps for the Kennedy's reversible express lanes. More recently, the proposals that I have seen for the Crosstown have it connecting with the Kennedy farther out at its Edens Split interchange.
Mike
Well, it would be very beneficial for many reasons. First of all, the traffic congestion that would be reduced speaks for itself! Secondly, the neighborhoods it would go through could actually see some good economic benefit for better highway and transitway access. I agree it makes a lot more sense for the Crosstown to diverge at the junction. Honestly, if built to interstate standards, some would say I-494 like the original plan, but I would make an argument to reroute I-90 along it (basically, I-90 and I-94 do a "bump" at the junction, and then I-290 becomes an extension of I-88). I know I am starting to get a bit into potential fictional territory here, but just saying. Would it still go by Midway?
Yes. It would go past Midway. There are actually two proposals in the INTO 2050 plan. One is from CDOT and one from the public both have some idea for a highway or transit or both. The right of way from the original stiltway plan is still there. Sorry autocorrect made A an I in my post.
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 09, 2017, 11:54:41 AM
Quote from: Finrod on July 09, 2017, 12:26:50 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 08, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
* One for the unbuilt South Suburban Expressway (//http://) (the precursor to the Illiana or what would have been the next phase of the I-355 extension)
This url didn't make it in. Could you please repost it?
Repost of the link to the South Suburban EIS
(https://books.google.com/books?id=cac1AQAAMAAJ&dq=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&pg=PA1#v=onepage&q=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&f=false)
Just think if even half of those proposals got built, some would be quite beneficial (I see you Lake County highways)
Quote from: 3467 on August 19, 2018, 06:52:46 PM
Yes. It would go past Midway. There are actually two proposals in the INTO 2050 plan. One is from CDOT and one from the public both have some idea for a highway or transit or both. The right of way from the original stiltway plan is still there. Sorry autocorrect made A an I in my post.
IIRC, the proposal described on Wikipedia has the Crosstown starting at the Edens Split, heading down Cicero to 63rd or 67th, and turning east to connect with the Dan Ryan at its junction with the Skyway.
Quote from: 3467 on August 19, 2018, 06:52:46 PM
Yes. It would go past Midway. There are actually two proposals in the INTO 2050 plan. One is from CDOT and one from the public both have some idea for a highway or transit or both. The right of way from the original stiltway plan is still there. Sorry autocorrect made A an I in my post.
Anything would be a help to Midway. The Cicero and 63rd Street corridors are terrible. I was nearly shot by CPD at 63rd and Halsted. Any new highway construction between the Ryan and Western Avenue would be an improvement, as crime in that area is bad.
I love it that for many, many years, even in sub zero weather, for a small donation, you have guys washing the salt off your windshield while you wait to get on I-55 at Cicero Ave.
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 08, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
It appears Google is finally allowing full access to the older environmental impact statements, although some of the fold out maps have not scanned well.
* Here's one for adding the US 40 interchange with I-70 at Vandalia (https://books.google.com/books?id=usE1AQAAMAAJ&lpg=PA40&ots=P4TEv4LH3W&dq=FAI%2024%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PA9#v=onepage&q=FAI%2024%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt supplemental freeway from Columbia to Marion (https://books.google.com/books?id=kJU1AQAAMAAJ&dq=FAP%20410%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PP4#v=onepage&q=FAP%20410%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt South Suburban Expressway (https://books.google.com/books?id=cac1AQAAMAAJ&dq=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&pg=PA1#v=onepage&q=South%20suburban%20expressway%20eis&f=false) (the precursor to the Illiana or what would have been the next phase of the I-355 extension)
* One for the unbuilt supplemental freeway from Decatur to I-57 near Salem (https://books.google.com/books?id=XKg1AQAAMAAJ&dq=FAP%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PT10#v=onepage&q=FAP%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt supplemental freeway along US 50, for the I-64 to US 51 segment (https://books.google.com/books?id=CyI3AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20409%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PP5#v=onepage&q=fap%20409%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the Crosstown Expressway (https://books.google.com/books?id=AJQ1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fai%20494%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PR2#v=onepage&q=fai%20494%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the Amstutz Expressway (https://books.google.com/books?id=J5o1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20400%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PA39#v=onepage&q=fap%20400%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* One for the unbuilt IL 1 supplemental freeway around Danville (https://books.google.com/books?id=cpQ1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20411%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PT3#v=onepage&q=fap%20411%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* For the freeway that became I-39 from Bloomington-Normal to Oglesby (https://books.google.com/books?id=7JE1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&pg=PR1#v=onepage&q=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement&f=false)
* For the freeway that became I-39 from Rockford to Rochelle (https://books.google.com/books?id=mJY1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&pg=PA37#v=onepage&q=fap%20412%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&f=false)
* For the freeway that became I-155 (https://books.google.com/books?id=l5g1AQAAMAAJ&dq=fap%20406%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&pg=PA337#v=onepage&q=fap%20406%20environmental%20impact%20statement%20rockford&f=false)
(Edited to fix missing url for the South Suburban EIS)
Regarding that bit about the rejected FAP-411 corridor in the Danville/Georgetown area:
- The northern portion of that sector (from Perrysville Road northward) is currently being considered for the proposed "Danville Beltline" project, although the proposed Danville Beltline, if it were built, would not be built to freeway standards
- A proposed dam along the Little Vermilion River near Georgetown was referenced in the FAP-411 study, although that never got built for whatever reason
- From Perrysville Road to US-136, there would have been three grade-separated interchanges (including an interchange with I-74) on FAP-411 over a relatively short distance
Dusting off this thread rather than creating a new one . . .
Found this 1960 planning document for East St. Louis: https://openscholarship.wustl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1018&context=books (https://openscholarship.wustl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1018&context=books).
The map on Page 28 of 149 has an alternate design for the PSB Complex with a loop ramp for the Pigott to PSB movement, a farther south location of the unbuilt corridor to Belleville (called the "Belleville Radial"), and a proposed but never built "12th Street Radial Connector Link" freeway that would have linked the Belleville Radial to I-64 around 21st Street.
Also very interesting is the map on Page 13 of 149:
* It shows an outer belt route from Columbia to Troy similar to the dead Gateway Connector, but farther west (would have crossed I-64 a little east of IL 159).
* It shows the originally planned alignment for I-70 that split from I-55 near the US 40 interchange.
* It shows the earlier alignment for I-55 in St. Louis where I-55 and the unbuilt North-South Distributor would split south of Gravois.
* It shows a corridor stretching north from the I-55/I-64/I-70 interchange along IL 3. The corridor is shown with a line similar to other freeways and has a shield similar to that used for interstates but is missing the "I" from "FAI". The number appears to be 155. While it does appear that there was a "Federal Aid 155" (from snippets through Google Books for the highway to Alton), I really have to wonder if that number was coincidence or some unrealized plan.
Thanks for dusting it off. Have you seen the original map from the 1966 Illinois Highway Needs study? I have it . I have not seen it online. The big difference is 39. It follows IL 2 then 26 and 89 then 121 to Decatur. The rest are close to same corridors.
The date is interesting because that is about the time Kerner is offering LTV 180.
He was offering this 39 corridor too but it went right where the plant was to be
The F 5 freeway was added later to give FHWA some cover on 180. This is all in the GAO
Report.
Also there were 2 short segments that vanished 24 from Peoria to 55 no shorter than 89
And IL 17 from 55 to Kankakee. An early South Suburban?
Some of your older pictures don't come up anymore . Tried on two devices.
They were really great finds it would be nice to see them again.
Quote from: Revive 755 on June 06, 2021, 01:43:34 AM
Dusting off this thread rather than creating a new one . . .
Found this 1960 planning document for East St. Louis: https://openscholarship.wustl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1018&context=books (https://openscholarship.wustl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1018&context=books).
The map on Page 28 of 149 has an alternate design for the PSB Complex with a loop ramp for the Pigott to PSB movement, a farther south location of the unbuilt corridor to Belleville (called the "Belleville Radial"), and a proposed but never built "12th Street Radial Connector Link" freeway that would have linked the Belleville Radial to I-64 around 21st Street.
Also very interesting is the map on Page 13 of 149:
* It shows an outer belt route from Columbia to Troy similar to the dead Gateway Connector, but farther west (would have crossed I-64 a little east of IL 159).
* It shows the originally planned alignment for I-70 that split from I-55 near the US 40 interchange.
* It shows the earlier alignment for I-55 in St. Louis where I-55 and the unbuilt North-South Distributor would split south of Gravois.
* It shows a corridor stretching north from the I-55/I-64/I-70 interchange along IL 3. The corridor is shown with a line similar to other freeways and has a shield similar to that used for interstates but is missing the "I" from "FAI". The number appears to be 155. While it does appear that there was a "Federal Aid 155" (from snippets through Google Books for the highway to Alton), I really have to wonder if that number was coincidence or some unrealized plan.
Thanks for posting this. People ask me why certain roads were built certain ways and I always say you have to look at the study that was done to support the building of it.
The other reason I like reading the old ones is you find out where assumptions or traffic estimates were way off, or way under calculated.
So much has changed in the USA since most of these roads were laid out and its very educational to see what is different.
Sorry I see the missing pictures were discussed. Still hope to have them back.
Also 180 covered. I see the 1966 map was discussed but it was not clear it was map 1 of the system although it is clear reviewing that those corridors and others predated it.
Also the CATS L3 system as well as the 1971 system were never official plans because the only project Chicago was interested in was the crosstown.
I grew up in NW side of Chicago, and residents were adamant about "no Crosstown" :angry:, and with the current 'mass transit first' City Hall, it won't get brought back to the table.
Amstutz X-way, a true road to nowhere, as I am sure was posted a before I signed up here.
Should make it a bikeway, just sits there.
Quote from: US20IL64 on September 08, 2021, 04:06:46 PM
Amstutz X-way, a true road to nowhere, as I am sure was posted a before I signed up here.
Should make it a bikeway, just sits there.
As someone who lives in the area it serves it's purpose well. It diverts traffic off of Sheridan Rd which becomes a residential street with several stop lights. Saves a tremendous amount of time. I've seen how badly backed up Sheridan Rd can get when the Amstutz gets closed for an event. Imagine that being everyday. So no, it should not be removed especially since it just got resurfaced back in 2019.
Looking on the Amstutz, is this (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3636542,-87.8286534,3a,75y,328.77h,85.17t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1szT24m5bkLpkr6sv4DwlWdw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) the only SPUI interchange in the US with stop signs on off-ramp left turns? Never seen one before, and I'm questioning the safety of it too, crossing so many lanes of traffic diagonally.
Quote from: SkyPesos on September 09, 2021, 12:40:54 AM
Looking on the Amstutz, is this (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3636542,-87.8286534,3a,75y,328.77h,85.17t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1szT24m5bkLpkr6sv4DwlWdw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) the only SPUI interchange in the US with stop signs on off-ramp left turns? Never seen one before, and I'm questioning the safety of it too, crossing so many lanes of traffic diagonally.
I've never had an issue with crossing there whenever I'd exit there. The sight points are decent, the light further down is often red so traffic rarely comes from that direction. A stop sign however, was added to the opposite direction on the ramp at the end of the Amstutz.