New Jersey

[storm2k]

Control city question: when 29 turns into I-195 E leaving Trenton, why is the control city Belmar? Wouldn't it make more sense to be New York? Especially given the old gap in I-95 would direct you to pick up the NJ Turnpike via 195 to get to NY.

The control city should be NY up until the Turnpike exit on 195, then it should be Belmar.

Usually (and yes, there are occasional exceptions), the control city is a town directly along the route.  Even with I-195's case, I-195 never actually reaches Belmar; one needs to continue on NJ 138 & NJ 35 first.  Same is true WB also.  Control City is Trenton; I-195 never enters Trenton.

The gap was closed 6 years ago and is irrelevant now.

NJDOT plays fast and loose with control cities and has forever. Reference all the highways (22, 46, etc) that use New York (City) as a control city when they don't actually go to New York, but rather feed into other routes that eventually cross the river. As for 195, Belmar has been the eastern-most point on mileage signs for years, even when NJDOT used to use "Shore Points" more regularly.

[FLAVORTOWN]

Control city question: when 29 turns into I-195 E leaving Trenton, why is the control city Belmar? Wouldn't it make more sense to be New York? Especially given the old gap in I-95 would direct you to pick up the NJ Turnpike via 195 to get to NY.

The control city should be NY up until the Turnpike exit on 195, then it should be Belmar.

Usually (and yes, there are occasional exceptions), the control city is a town directly along the route.  Even with I-195's case, I-195 never actually reaches Belmar; one needs to continue on NJ 138 & NJ 35 first.  Same is true WB also.  Control City is Trenton; I-195 never enters Trenton.

The gap was closed 6 years ago and is irrelevant now.

NJDOT plays fast and loose with control cities and has forever. Reference all the highways (22, 46, etc) that use New York (City) as a control city when they don't actually go to New York, but rather feed into other routes that eventually cross the river. As for 195, Belmar has been the eastern-most point on mileage signs for years, even when NJDOT used to use "Shore Points" more regularly.

This reminds me of all the Marylanders complaining that I-95 North control cities all say New York after you pass Baltimore 

[roadman65]

Also New Jersey doesn't like to sign controls much at interstate entrances from local roads.  For example, on NJ 62 in Totawa there is no control city for I-80 eastbound but US 46 nearby has New York signed for it. Considering I-80 is a better route into the city excluding Midtown which NJ 3 from US 46 is best, it should have better signs.


They did some improvement in 1997 when a massive statewide signage campaign to add mileage signs and traffic light overhead street signs plus upgrading freeway entrances, but still many lack destination controls.

[bzakharin]

Also New Jersey doesn't like to sign controls much at interstate entrances from local roads. 

I checked a random sample of entrances to each interstate (not 676, 95, or 195 because all intersecting state routes are freeways or expressways) from a state route in NJ:
NJ 168 at I-76 signs Walt Whitman Br - Philadelphia
NJ 94 at I-80 signs New York City / Delaware Water Gap
NJ 21 at I-280 signs The Oranges / Harrison
NJ 124 at I-287 no control cities
NJ 168 at I-295 signs Trenton and Del Mem Br / Walt Whitman Br

So that's 4 out of 5

[roadman65]

Also New Jersey doesn't like to sign controls much at interstate entrances from local roads. 

I checked a random sample of entrances to each interstate (not 676, 95, or 195 because all intersecting state routes are freeways or expressways) from a state route in NJ:
NJ 168 at I-76 signs Walt Whitman Br - Philadelphia
NJ 94 at I-80 signs New York City / Delaware Water Gap
NJ 21 at I-280 signs The Oranges / Harrison
NJ 124 at I-287 no control cities
NJ 168 at I-295 signs Trenton and Del Mem Br / Walt Whitman Br

So that's 4 out of 5

That one out of five adds up a lot statewide. Plus they're are concentrated areas that don't have them verses have them..

https://maps.app.goo.gl/TvkygPgNqwWTUUjF9 CR 527 at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/woaaWYuoSjQ4Ruby9 Jackson Mills Rd at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Ku6FdgQb5wdr15AK6 CR 537 WB i
       ( EB does have them there though)
https://maps.app.goo.gl/q8k5RXQm3nvWpGkx5 Imaylaystown- Hightstown       
       Road at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ByM3dCEh2FtYjtMd9 CR 539 NB at I-195 WB ( EB 
        Ramp uses them) CR 539 SB at I-195 EB ( Again WB uses them).
https://maps.app.goo.gl/dSrgE2U4XUCfuHbW7 CR 526 at I-195 EB
https://maps.app.goo.gl/D67tZd5uDShyRBYb9 CR 526 at I-195 WB

[jeffandnicole]

Also New Jersey doesn't like to sign controls much at interstate entrances from local roads. 

I checked a random sample of entrances to each interstate (not 676, 95, or 195 because all intersecting state routes are freeways or expressways) from a state route in NJ:
NJ 168 at I-76 signs Walt Whitman Br - Philadelphia
NJ 94 at I-80 signs New York City / Delaware Water Gap
NJ 21 at I-280 signs The Oranges / Harrison
NJ 124 at I-287 no control cities
NJ 168 at I-295 signs Trenton and Del Mem Br / Walt Whitman Br

So that's 4 out of 5

That one out of five adds up a lot statewide. Plus they're are concentrated areas that don't have them verses have them..

https://maps.app.goo.gl/TvkygPgNqwWTUUjF9 CR 527 at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/woaaWYuoSjQ4Ruby9 Jackson Mills Rd at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Ku6FdgQb5wdr15AK6 CR 537 WB i
      ( EB does have them there though)
https://maps.app.goo.gl/q8k5RXQm3nvWpGkx5 Imaylaystown- Hightstown       
      Road at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ByM3dCEh2FtYjtMd9 CR 539 NB at I-195 WB ( EB 
        Ramp uses them) CR 539 SB at I-195 EB ( Again WB uses them).
https://maps.app.goo.gl/dSrgE2U4XUCfuHbW7 CR 526 at I-195 EB
https://maps.app.goo.gl/D67tZd5uDShyRBYb9 CR 526 at I-195 WB

I like it when they don't sign the interstate, period.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/wvSedxzd5iFr42xy9  (CR 653 onto 295 North)

https://maps.app.goo.gl/bM2ieCvZWz6E5e299 (Straughns Mill-Pedricktown Rd onto 295 North)

(Often the result of a sign knockdown and never replaced.)

[roadman65]

Also New Jersey doesn't like to sign controls much at interstate entrances from local roads. 

I checked a random sample of entrances to each interstate (not 676, 95, or 195 because all intersecting state routes are freeways or expressways) from a state route in NJ:
NJ 168 at I-76 signs Walt Whitman Br - Philadelphia
NJ 94 at I-80 signs New York City / Delaware Water Gap
NJ 21 at I-280 signs The Oranges / Harrison
NJ 124 at I-287 no control cities
NJ 168 at I-295 signs Trenton and Del Mem Br / Walt Whitman Br

So that's 4 out of 5

That one out of five adds up a lot statewide. Plus they're are concentrated areas that don't have them verses have them..

https://maps.app.goo.gl/TvkygPgNqwWTUUjF9 CR 527 at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/woaaWYuoSjQ4Ruby9 Jackson Mills Rd at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Ku6FdgQb5wdr15AK6 CR 537 WB i
      ( EB does have them there though)
https://maps.app.goo.gl/q8k5RXQm3nvWpGkx5 Imaylaystown- Hightstown       
      Road at I-195.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/ByM3dCEh2FtYjtMd9 CR 539 NB at I-195 WB ( EB 
        Ramp uses them) CR 539 SB at I-195 EB ( Again WB uses them).
https://maps.app.goo.gl/dSrgE2U4XUCfuHbW7 CR 526 at I-195 EB
https://maps.app.goo.gl/D67tZd5uDShyRBYb9 CR 526 at I-195 WB

I like it when they don't sign the interstate, period.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/wvSedxzd5iFr42xy9  (CR 653 onto 295 North)

https://maps.app.goo.gl/bM2ieCvZWz6E5e299 (Straughns Mill-Pedricktown Rd onto 295 North)

(Often the result of a sign knockdown and never replaced.)

Chancellor Avenue in Newark at I-78 don't sign I-78 either.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/xCBhe2Nkb8SW35Ti6

Plus EB Vauxhall Road in Union don't sign I-78. Unless you count the stoplight overhead, however no shields on the ground even.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/jMtUtZQftY7AXbXp9


On another subject, I see on US 30 in AC, neither NJ 87 or NJ 187  get signed on the overhead. Sine Salad instead.  However I'm guessing the overhead sign assembly is not NJDOT but the South Jersey Transportation Authority property. So that's why it's not signed.

[NJRoadfan]

The sign at Vauxhall was knocked down and never replaced.

[roadman65]

Speaking of signs not being replaced the North- East end of the US 130 and NJ 33 overlap intersection in East Windsor and NJ 33 at CR 652 in Hamilton have a lot to be desired.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/B9FJc2YcSW47UxRy5
Also, what's up with the overhead panels being moved here to ground level?

[vdeane]

Speaking of signs not being replaced the North- East end of the US 130 and NJ 33 overlap intersection in East Windsor and NJ 33 at CR 652 in Hamilton have a lot to be desired.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/B9FJc2YcSW47UxRy5
Also, what's up with the overhead panels being moved here to ground level?

The gantry probably failed inspection and NJDOT might not have thought it warranted the cost to replace it.

[roadman65]

Speaking of signs not being replaced the North- East end of the US 130 and NJ 33 overlap intersection in East Windsor and NJ 33 at CR 652 in Hamilton have a lot to be desired.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/B9FJc2YcSW47UxRy5
Also, what's up with the overhead panels being moved here to ground level?

The gantry probably failed inspection and NJDOT might not have thought it warranted the cost to replace it.

Meanwhile it's out of place.  Sure money is the issue, but in my homestate we would instantly replace it. Only those on local off freeway roads they wouldn't.

[SignBridge]

What's out of place ? The signs are at the same location as the gantry that you can see behind them. They are clearly visible so it doesn't much matter if one's on the right and one on the left. Years ago the Garden State Pkwy. used to mount lots of advance signs in the median.

Anyway, it might be only temporary until a new gantry can be built. 

[vdeane]

What's out of place ? The signs are at the same location as the gantry that you can see behind them. They are clearly visible so it doesn't much matter if one's on the right and one on the left. Years ago the Garden State Pkwy. used to mount lots of advance signs in the median.

Anyway, it might be only temporary until a new gantry can be built. 

Street view shows them as having been at ground level since the Obama administration.  Clearly NJDOT isn't in any hurry to replace that gantry.

This type of thing does happen.  NYSDOT Region 2 has gotten rid of a lot of gantries and replaced them with ground-mounted signage in recent years.

[jeffandnicole]

Speaking of signs not being replaced the North- East end of the US 130 and NJ 33 overlap intersection in East Windsor and NJ 33 at CR 652 in Hamilton have a lot to be desired.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/B9FJc2YcSW47UxRy5
Also, what's up with the overhead panels being moved here to ground level?

The gantry probably failed inspection and NJDOT might not have thought it warranted the cost to replace it.

This was a contractor hitting the sign gantry while spreading salt on 295.  I remember hearing this on my radio while I was plowing/salting.

NJ unfortunately takes a *long* time to replace these gantries.  That said, this one has been longer than normal.

[roadman65]

What's out of place ? The signs are at the same location as the gantry that you can see behind them. They are clearly visible so it doesn't much matter if one's on the right and one on the left. Years ago the Garden State Pkwy. used to mount lots of advance signs in the median.

Anyway, it might be only temporary until a new gantry can be built. 

Yes considering the rest of the freeway uses them regularly and not this place. 

Inconsistent is more the word.

[storm2k]

What's out of place ? The signs are at the same location as the gantry that you can see behind them. They are clearly visible so it doesn't much matter if one's on the right and one on the left. Years ago the Garden State Pkwy. used to mount lots of advance signs in the median.

Anyway, it might be only temporary until a new gantry can be built. 

Street view shows them as having been at ground level since the Obama administration.  Clearly NJDOT isn't in any hurry to replace that gantry.

This type of thing does happen.  NYSDOT Region 2 has gotten rid of a lot of gantries and replaced them with ground-mounted signage in recent years.

NJDOT will take its sweet time with gantry replacements for sure. This gantry came down around 2009 or 2010 (I'm not sure if it was struck or if it failed inspection--it was an old triangular truss gantry that just had its signage replaced in the early aughts) and lived with a ground mount sign until 2021 when a new gantry and new overhead signs were installed.

[roadman65]

Come to think of it there were times in the seventies that gantries were removed and took years to replace.

NJ 495 WB at US 1-9 SB had a missing gantry there for a long time and because it's a viaduct no ground mounts weren't even mounted. So only a US 1 and a US 9 shields ( yes separate as 1-9 wasn't yet established lol,) were in the gore as only that could be mounted easily.

In Newark on US 1-9 SB at Wilson Avenue lost its overhead in the early eighties and didn't get replaced until the viaduct was replaced in the mid or late nineties.  Heck it took several years to replace that viaduct as well as traffic on both directions used the NB viaduct from 1991 to 1994 and maybe later as once the original 1931 structure was removed and the land sat empty until replaced with its current structure.

Plus isn't the WB Exit 13  guides on I-280 still missing?

[storm2k]

Come to think of it there were times in the seventies that gantries were removed and took years to replace.

NJ 495 WB at US 1-9 SB had a missing gantry there for a long time and because it's a viaduct no ground mounts weren't even mounted. So only a US 1 and a US 9 shields ( yes separate as 1-9 wasn't yet established lol,) were in the gore as only that could be mounted easily.

In Newark on US 1-9 SB at Wilson Avenue lost its overhead in the early eighties and didn't get replaced until the viaduct was replaced in the mid or late nineties.  Heck it took several years to replace that viaduct as well as traffic on both directions used the NB viaduct from 1991 to 1994 and maybe later as once the original 1931 structure was removed and the land sat empty until replaced with its current structure.

Plus isn't the WB Exit 13  guides on I-280 still missing?

It's been this LGS for years at this point and I'll bet it won't change anytime soon.

[chrisg69911]

Come to think of it there were times in the seventies that gantries were removed and took years to replace.

NJ 495 WB at US 1-9 SB had a missing gantry there for a long time and because it's a viaduct no ground mounts weren't even mounted. So only a US 1 and a US 9 shields ( yes separate as 1-9 wasn't yet established lol,) were in the gore as only that could be mounted easily.

In Newark on US 1-9 SB at Wilson Avenue lost its overhead in the early eighties and didn't get replaced until the viaduct was replaced in the mid or late nineties.  Heck it took several years to replace that viaduct as well as traffic on both directions used the NB viaduct from 1991 to 1994 and maybe later as once the original 1931 structure was removed and the land sat empty until replaced with its current structure.

Plus isn't the WB Exit 13  guides on I-280 still missing?

It's been this LGS for years at this point and I'll bet it won't change anytime soon.

The road markings there are just atrocious too. The exit lane just appears out of nowhere with a solid line the whole distance for some reason. The only point you have to get into the lane is right after the Clifton Ave entrance, which is the stupidest design ever. It just looks like a shoulder until you reach the chevrons, and say oh shit, theres my exit

[roadman65]

Come to think of it there were times in the seventies that gantries were removed and took years to replace.

NJ 495 WB at US 1-9 SB had a missing gantry there for a long time and because it's a viaduct no ground mounts weren't even mounted. So only a US 1 and a US 9 shields ( yes separate as 1-9 wasn't yet established lol,) were in the gore as only that could be mounted easily.

In Newark on US 1-9 SB at Wilson Avenue lost its overhead in the early eighties and didn't get replaced until the viaduct was replaced in the mid or late nineties.  Heck it took several years to replace that viaduct as well as traffic on both directions used the NB viaduct from 1991 to 1994 and maybe later as once the original 1931 structure was removed and the land sat empty until replaced with its current structure.

Plus isn't the WB Exit 13  guides on I-280 still missing?

It's been this LGS for years at this point and I'll bet it won't change anytime soon.

The exit sign is bigger than the guide. Pathetic!

The same situation in Marlboro on Route 18. The SB exit to Tennent Road has a LGS with no exit number while just before it CR 520 has standard freeway guides and an exit number.  All the guides were redone in the nineties but they didn't add them for Tennent Road for whatever reason.

[roadman65]

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/17sx1WXbzW/
Old US 9 photo in Sayreville with the old white post cable guardrail. Plus it appears the Edison Bridge was originally three lanes with a reversible center lane.

[kernals12]

Found this 1972 planning document with all sorts of delicious maps of never built freeways













All the freeways planned for the Northwest weren't just for anticipated suburban growth from New York City, but also for visitors to the planned Delaware Water Gap recreation area, to be formed by the Tocks Island Dam.

[BrianP]

What was that NJ 51 in Camden?

NJ 55 goes around the east side of Glassboro and Clayton instead of west.

I'd still like that US 322 freeway to be built.  That's pretty much where I put my fictional version of it.  Now I would have the SJTA build it as a toll road.  I'd call it the AC Expressway Western Spur. Kinda impressive that 50 years later it still looks feasible.

[NE2]

What was that NJ 51 in Camden?

Typo for 151: https://www.alpsroads.net/roads/nj/log/9.html#151
Same for 74/174 at Trenton.

[ixnay]

Come to think of it there were times in the seventies that gantries were removed and took years to replace.

NJ 495 WB at US 1-9 SB had a missing gantry there for a long time and because it's a viaduct no ground mounts weren't even mounted. So only a US 1 and a US 9 shields ( yes separate as 1-9 wasn't yet established lol,) were in the gore as only that could be mounted easily.

In Newark on US 1-9 SB at Wilson Avenue lost its overhead in the early eighties and didn't get replaced until the viaduct was replaced in the mid or late nineties.  Heck it took several years to replace that viaduct as well as traffic on both directions used the NB viaduct from 1991 to 1994 and maybe later as once the original 1931 structure was removed and the land sat empty until replaced with its current structure.

Plus isn't the WB Exit 13  guides on I-280 still missing?

It's been this LGS for years at this point and I'll bet it won't change anytime soon.

The road markings there are just atrocious too. The exit lane just appears out of nowhere with a solid line the whole distance for some reason. The only point you have to get into the lane is right after the Clifton Ave entrance, which is the stupidest design ever. It just looks like a shoulder until you reach the chevrons, and say oh shit, theres my exit

It's on the wrong side of the Hudson. It looks like a typical NYC point of interest wayfinder, which appears on NYC expressways and parkways as well as surface streets.