District of Columbia

[noelbotevera]

It is helpful to connect the two, but you're not supposed to use US 50 to do it. Everyone coming in is supposed to be destined inside the city. That's their thinking, anyway.

Fair point, but...there isn't an Alt US 50 route. US 1 gets one but it's the only route to do so...(and I guess I-395 but that's because of a tunnel)

Granted, through traffic should really be on the Beltway, but everyone knows how that turns out.

[Old Dominionite]

I'm not bothered that US 50 isn't signed well in DC. On both the MD and VA side it serves as a route into or out of the city. It doesn't serve (nor should it serve) as a route through the city for thru traffic.

In which case US 50 should be routed around downtown via I-395. Until then, it deserves to be signed.

There is no navigational justification to or benefit from signing US 50 through DC; there hasn't been for half a century. The same is true for both US 1 and US 29.

The justification is that the route exists. If the route is not intended to be followed, it should be rerouted via some route that is signed.

Sure, the route "exists" , but its purpose has evolved. On the Virginia side it serves as a feeder route to the Roosevelt Bridge. On the Maryland side it serves as a feeder route to New York Ave and DC 295. The US 50 designation becomes virtually pointless within the District itself because it's not used as a thru route anymore for east/west traffic. The Beltway takes care of that, and (to a lesser extent) the I-395/I-695(for now)/DC 295 combo.

A few signs could certainly still point to US 50 "East"  along outbound New York Avenue and to US 50 "West"  along Constitution Avenue, but that's about all the traveling public needs.

And there's no real purpose to rerouting US 50 onto another alignment because – again – it's not a thru route. Most of the traffic on US 50 east in VA is not looking to hook up with US 50 in MD, and even fewer motorists heading on US 50 west in MD are looking to hook up with US 50 in VA.

Maybe it's an unpopular opinion, but I'd have no problem with decommissioning US 1, US 29, and US 50 in the District altogether.

[mrsman]

I guess this is going slightly into fictional territory, but there definitely are some issues with the routing of US 1, 29, and 50 within DC.  These aren't really coherent routes - a lot of turns and the like to stay on route.

US 29 is only a route of national importance south of Gainesville, VA.  Between Gainesville and DC, the main routings involve I-66, US 29 is simply not needed.  Lee Hwy can be signed as a state route [or perhaps reclaim the old US 211].  There is no reason or expectation that any of this traffic will drive through DC on its way to Silver Spring.  For that reason, it would seem to make sense to have MD's US 29 between Silver Spring and Baltimore be a state highway MD-29.  No signed 29 through DC.  The MD and VA portions of this road are not a coherent path, they should not be signed as a single corridor.

US 1 and US 50 are a little different due to their own national importance and length.  While the precise routing in DC should not be set in stone, there is good reason to keep the highways in some fashion.

US 1 is the main street of the Northeast, from Maine to Key West, FL and more locally the non-freeway routing between Baltimore and Richmond.  It is fitting that Baltimore Ave and Richmond Hwy in the local suburbs are all part of US 1.  So how best to connect them?  Currently, the routing is 14th, Constitution, 6th, RI Ave.  But perhaps, it makes sense to go through Downtown on more of a freeway routing, essentially following I-395 to NY Ave to Bladensburg (which was part of the oldeer US 1 routing, now US 1 Alt) to Baltimore Ave. 

US 50 is basically a coast to coast highway (OK, a coast to West Sacramento highway) that already goes through some important cities.  As others have said, Arlington Blvd and the Hanson Hwy (DC-Annapolis) are very important regional routes that deserve some form of a connection.  Currently, the routing is Constitution, 6th, NY Ave.  This is not a terrible routing as the Hanson Hwy defaults onto NY and the TR bridge defaults onto Constitution (and you have to connect these routes in some way) but there may be a better routing to avoid Downtown streets.

US 50 onto Memorial Bridge, to Independence to Maine to I-395 north.  At this point, two main possibilities: (i) I-395 to NY Ave or (ii) the all-freeway route I-395 to I-695 to DC 295 to Hanson Hwy.

Sure, for long distance travel, the Beltway probably makes sense to connect portions of US 1 and US 50 on different  sides of teh Beltway.  So Mt Vernon to Laurel and Fairfax to Annapolis would probably be routed along the Beltway.  But let's say your starting point (or your destination point) is well within the Beltway.  How to route a trip from Inner Arlington to Annapolis or Crystal City to Laurel?  For those trips a route of US 50 and US 1 through the city is needed.  And to the extent possible the routings should avoid the Downtown streets (as I outlined above).

[cpzilliacus]

US 29 is only a route of national importance south of Gainesville, VA.  Between Gainesville and DC, the main routings involve I-66, US 29 is simply not needed.  Lee Hwy can be signed as a state route [or perhaps reclaim the old US 211].  There is no reason or expectation that any of this traffic will drive through DC on its way to Silver Spring.  For that reason, it would seem to make sense to have MD's US 29 between Silver Spring and Baltimore be a state highway MD-29.  No signed 29 through DC.  The MD and VA portions of this road are not a coherent path, they should not be signed as a single corridor.

I think you would get disagreement from MDOT on that, for U.S. 29 in Maryland is not just a principal arterial, but also on the NHS - and because there are no freeways between Montgomery County and the District of Columbia, U.S. 29 is an important route for freight too.  Several other routes crossing the border between Montgomery and D.C. are ones where DDOT has discouraged truck traffic, including Piney Branch Road (MD-320), 16th Street (MD-396) and Colesville Road (MD-384).  Maryland prohibits trucks on MD-185 (Connecticut Avenue) between MD-410 and Chevy Chase Circle due to narrow lanes.  Trucks on MD-355 (Wisconsin Avenue) are not forbidden, but are discouraged due to heavy traffic and long traffic signal waits.  MD-190 (River Road) is a good truck route, but I do not think the wealthy people that live near it want a lot of truck traffic passing by, though they get some.

Clara Barton Parkway and MacArthur Boulevard in Montgomery County have truck bans at all times.

While U.S. 29 does not carry as many trucks as U.S. 50 (New York Avenue, N.E.), it will probably remain a legal truck route for the indefinite future.

[jakeroot]

....

We drove into DC yesterday to go see the Eisenhower Memorial, mainly just for an excuse to get out of the house and do something. On the way home, we came over Memorial Bridge. Don't have any pictures because it was getting dark, but it's worth passing along that the ramp marked on the map above with "Remove southern exit ramp from Arlington Blvd. to S. Washington Blvd. prior to Hotspot #2" is now closed–blocked off with a jersey barrier. Don't know whether it's been demolished yet, but you now have to go around to the other ramp a little further up the road. As the map above indicates, that's now a two-lane exit; the left lane is left-turn only and the right lane is an option lane allowing a left onto the ramp or a straight-ahead movement towards Rosslyn. The main thing that struck me is that the turn is an extremely sharp left turn. I would be quite wary of going left from the option lane during rush hour, or whenever there's another vehicle in the left lane, simply because the turn is so sharp I would not trust people to stay in their lane. The curve seen on Google Street View there is a far more gentle curve than how it's now configured.

Memorial Bridge, incidentally, is in the best shape I've ever seen it. They did an outstanding job repairing the road surface.

Took me a moment to realize the ramp being closed was the closer ramp with the more gradual curve.

For the life of me, I can't figure out why that closer, gradual-curve ramp is a hotspot. It doesn't seem to conflict with any other movements, and I can't figure out why traffic entering from the bypass would need to take that left turn to head back southbound. And from what I can tell, they are the only traffic that couldn't previously access the more gradual-curve ramp.

Needless to say: that double left turn that now exists will need to be rebuilt. That is way too sharp for what I assume are a substantial number of cars now using the ramp.

[1995hoo]

The reason I can think of for why someone using the bypass ramp would want to go left to head southbound is to access the I-395 express lanes. If you're coming from Reagan Airport and you want to use the express lanes, you essentially have two choices–use that route or go through Crystal City and Pentagon City. (Similarly, if you're in the express lanes heading TO Reagan Airport, the best route is usually to exit to VA-27 towards Memorial Bridge and then take the ramp on the right to the GW Parkway just after the on-ramp from the Pentagon parking.)

The now-closed ramp is not itself identified as a "hotspot" on that map–note how they refer to it as the southern ramp "prior to Hotspot #2." I don't know why they decided to close it. I do note that as you come off the circle there, the road is now only two lanes (used to be three), and the lane that was eliminated was the left lane that used to be left-turn-only onto that ramp. So maybe it's related to the deletion of that lane.

For many years, the main use for the ramp that is now in use was by people who wanted to park for a while to wait for HOV restrictions to expire (I may have done that myself a few times). The ramp got so little traffic that it was an ideal place to wait without impacting other traffic or putting yourself in danger the way the "wait on the shoulder" crowd did. Pull off the shoulder at 5:58 and drive the speed limit up to the ramp to the express lanes, hit that right at 6:00, and floor it.

[froggie]

people who wanted to park for a while to wait for HOV restrictions to expire

Which itself is a huge can-of-worms...

[cpzilliacus]

For many years, the main use for the ramp that is now in use was by people who wanted to park for a while to wait for HOV restrictions to expire (I may have done that myself a few times). The ramp got so little traffic that it was an ideal place to wait without impacting other traffic or putting yourself in danger the way the "wait on the shoulder" crowd did. Pull off the shoulder at 5:58 and drive the speed limit up to the ramp to the express lanes, hit that right at 6:00, and floor it.

Sometimes the Arlington County Police and the Virginia State Police would swoop down on the motorists waiting for the HOV-3 restrictions on the I-395 managed roadway to expire, and all of the waiters would get ticketed.  I have seen that happen myself a few times.

[1995hoo]

For many years, the main use for the ramp that is now in use was by people who wanted to park for a while to wait for HOV restrictions to expire (I may have done that myself a few times). The ramp got so little traffic that it was an ideal place to wait without impacting other traffic or putting yourself in danger the way the "wait on the shoulder" crowd did. Pull off the shoulder at 5:58 and drive the speed limit up to the ramp to the express lanes, hit that right at 6:00, and floor it.

Sometimes the Arlington County Police and the Virginia State Police would swoop down on the motorists waiting for the HOV-3 restrictions on the I-395 managed roadway to expire, and all of the waiters would get ticketed.  I have seen that happen myself a few times.

I used to see that fairly frequently on I-395 itself, but I never saw it happen on the ramp I in question here, most likely for two reasons–(1) until recently when it became the only route there, it was sort of isolated and not well-known, so parking there to wait wasn't a safety hazard and the cops likely ignored it; and (2) more importantly, I seldom went that way myself (other than a very few times when I want to do the "wait for 6:00 thing") and so I didn't have many opportunities to see what, if any, enforcement there was.

All moot now, of course!

[epzik8]

It's been four months and I only just learned of the plan to shift I-395 over I-695 and turn the Center Leg Freeway into I-195. The Center Leg is a very different highway physically from the rest of 395, thanks to the tunnel, so I can't complain about AASHTO approving the District's request. In fact, I used to think the Southeast Freeway was part of 295 since 695 wasn't signed when I first took the Baltimore-Washington Parkway into the District and followed DC 295 to I-295 to the Wilson Bridge.

[The Ghostbuster]

Although the renumbering of Interstates 395 and 695 were approved in January, I am beginning to wonder if the renumbering will occur at all. Does anyone know how long it takes to manufacture and erect new signs? At any rate, if the approved renumbering is going to happen, DC had better get a move on it.

[froggie]

It will get done eventually.  Though it took them 40 years, I-695 did get signed.

Many of the signs in question are fairly new.  While DDOT could certainly slap an overlay up, it wouldn't surprise me if they waited until the overheads needed replacement.

[cpzilliacus]

WTOP Radio: Changing driving patterns emerge as traffic in DC region picks up

[froggie]

A recent WSJ article noted that that in several metro areas, especially in Florida, afternoon traffic is actually HIGHER now than it was pre-COVID.  Morning traffic is still noticeably lower.  The premise is that many people who have been working from home are out running errands in the afternoon.

[1995hoo]

That seems plausible enough to me. I don't generally run errands during the day despite working from home, but on Tuesday we took one of the cars to the mechanic at 1:00 and traffic on Van Dorn Street was fairly heavy, enough so that it took almost 40 minutes to go maybe six miles roundtrip (including the time spent speaking to the mechanic as part of the roundtrip travel time).

[cpzilliacus]

A recent WSJ article noted that that in several metro areas, especially in Florida, afternoon traffic is actually HIGHER now than it was pre-COVID.  Morning traffic is still noticeably lower.  The premise is that many people who have been working from home are out running errands in the afternoon.

That is consistent with my observations.

[1995hoo]

Great stuff here from Dave Dildine of WTOP. The paragraphs quoted below are just the first three paragraphs of a much longer story.

Full story: Surviving DC traffic: A satirical guide to navigating the nation's capital

D.C. morning rush hour starts at 5 a.m. and lasts until 4 p.m. The afternoon rush hour starts at 7 a.m. and lasts until Sunday. Friday rush hour started during the Hoover administration and will last until the end of time and space.

East-west travel through the District of Columbia is impossible, unless you're on the Southeast-Southwest Freeway where the average speed is 90 mph. No one knows what the freeway is called or numbered though. Some people call it I-695. Some people call it I-395. Some people refer to it as West Side Highway.

Another busy freeway that runs through D.C. is the Potomac River Freeway. No one knows what this freeway is called either, so they simply refer to it as "that road behind the Kennedy Center."  If you need to tell someone what road you're on, you can refer to it as "that road behind the Kennedy Center"  but they might assume you're talking about the E Street Expressway, which is an entirely different road.

[cpzilliacus]

Great stuff here from Dave Dildine of WTOP. The paragraphs quoted below are just the first three paragraphs of a much longer story.

Only thing that Dave left out was an admonishment not to get into a crash on any D.C. freeway, since help will invariably be sent by D.C. 911 to the wrong location - sometimes it takes two or three attempts for the Metropolitan Police Department and D.C. Fire to arrive at the correct location.

[1995hoo]

Great stuff here from Dave Dildine of WTOP. The paragraphs quoted below are just the first three paragraphs of a much longer story.

Only thing that Dave left out was an admonishment not to get into a crash on any D.C. freeway, since help will invariably be sent by D.C. 911 to the wrong location - sometimes it takes two or three attempts for the Metropolitan Police Department and D.C. Fire to arrive at the correct location.

https://twitter.com/1995hoo/status/1395721921556254723

[jemacedo9]

That story was absolutely fantastic!!!!   

[vdeane]

That bit about the DC 295 exit numbers made me think of the MUTCD thread.  Looks like we have somewhere that does the suffixes as FHWA wants, with all the confusion that entails.

I know Dave Dildine has interacted with roadgeek circles before... some of the things in that article remind me of Alanland.  I wonder if he's read that thread.

[1995hoo]

That bit about the DC 295 exit numbers made me think of the MUTCD thread.  Looks like we have somewhere that does the suffixes as FHWA wants, with all the confusion that entails.

I know Dave Dildine has interacted with roadgeek circles before... some of the things in that article remind me of Alanland.  I wonder if he's read that thread.

I thought about mentioning the exit number part in my prior post because I knew you in particular would get a kick out of that, but I figured it was more fun to read the article for yourself.

I suppose I could respond to his most recent tweet by asking him whether the sequel will tell us where to find the portal to Alanland.

https://twitter.com/DildineWTOP/status/1395789745482084356

[vdeane]

I suppose I could respond to his most recent tweet by asking him whether the sequel will tell us where to find the portal to Alanland.

I'm pretty sure that's I-366.

[Alps]

I suppose I could respond to his most recent tweet by asking him whether the sequel will tell us where to find the portal to Alanland.

I'm pretty sure that's I-366.

Which must intersect I-66...

[mariethefoxy]

was it ever revealed what this concealed sign said? I know this one was removed in the conversion to Southeast Blvd



I know the one on 66 ended up having a 695 South sign on it.