Which remaing Northeast 65 state is most likely to raise their speed limit.

[1995hoo]

....

Not that someone who has a learner's permit from NYS is going to go driving out of state until they have a driver's license... ....

Why not? When I had my learner's permit (Virginia), I drove most of the way to New York on a family trip during spring break. My father had me pull off at the last service area we passed on the Jersey Turnpike and he then drove the rest of the way across Staten Island and into Brooklyn. I believe on the way home he pulled off at the first service area we reached and then I drove the rest of the way.

Out of state permit holders aren't allowed to drive within the limits of NYC or on surrounding parkways.

I know. That's one reason why we switched, plus having to parallel park in Brooklyn (parallel parking is not part of the road test in Virginia and I didn't learn how to do it until I taught myself some two years later). But that's not the point I was making. He said someone with a New York learner's permit will not be driving out-of-state until after obtaining a license and I asked why not, citing my own experience as an example.

[kphoger]

....

Not that someone who has a learner's permit from NYS is going to go driving out of state until they have a driver's license... ....

Why not? When I had my learner's permit (Virginia), I drove most of the way to New York on a family trip during spring break. My father had me pull off at the last service area we passed on the Jersey Turnpike and he then drove the rest of the way across Staten Island and into Brooklyn. I believe on the way home he pulled off at the first service area we reached and then I drove the rest of the way.

Yeah, I'm stumped by that too.  I grew up 12 miles from one state line and 55 miles from another one–in a part of Kansas where towns are 30 miles apart.  Just going to orthodontist appointments required driving out of state.  Shoot, we drove out of state in driver's education just to experience "city driving" in a town of 7800 people (incidentally, our car was rear-ended at a stop sign there).  I drove in Denver rush hour on a learner's permit with my parents also, because that's where the malls were.  Plus a camping trip with my dad to Big Bend, Texas.

[vdeane]

NYC bans ALL permit-holders from driving in the city on freeways and when not in a driver's ed car with an instructor 21 years or older.  Doesn't matter where the permit came from.  It's just NYC being NYC.

[1995hoo]

NYC bans ALL permit-holders from driving in the city on freeways and when not in a driver's ed car with an instructor 21 years or older.  Doesn't matter where the permit came from.  It's just NYC being NYC.

We know that. It doesn't answer the question about why a New York permit-holder would not drive out-of-state prior to getting a license (assuming, of course, he's properly accompanied as required by the permit).

[vdeane]

NYC bans ALL permit-holders from driving in the city on freeways and when not in a driver's ed car with an instructor 21 years or older.  Doesn't matter where the permit came from.  It's just NYC being NYC.

We know that.

RobbieL2415 doesn't.

[signalman]

NYC bans ALL permit-holders from driving in the city on freeways and when not in a driver's ed car with an instructor 21 years or older.  Doesn't matter where the permit came from.  It's just NYC being NYC.

We know that.

RobbieL2415 doesn't.

None of us know for sure what RobbieL2415 does or does not know unless he chimes in.  I believe he's just under the assumption that no one with a learner's permit will drive out of state until obtaining a license, regardless of the state that issued said permit.  IMO, that's a fair assumption.  I did not drive outside of my home state of NJ until I obtained a driver's license.  I believe many, if not most fall into this category.

[kphoger]

NYC bans ALL permit-holders from driving in the city on freeways and when not in a driver's ed car with an instructor 21 years or older.  Doesn't matter where the permit came from.  It's just NYC being NYC.

We know that.

RobbieL2415 doesn't.

None of us know for sure what RobbieL2415 does or does not know unless he chimes in.  I believe he's just under the assumption that no one with a learner's permit will drive out of state until obtaining a license, regardless of the state that issued said permit.  IMO, that's a fair assumption.  I did not drive outside of my home state of NJ until I obtained a driver's license.  I believe many, if not most fall into this category.

Well, 1995hoo and I certainly drove out of state with learner's permits, and I'm sure there must be others on the forum like us.  It never even occurred to me that someone would avoid driving out of state on a learner's permit–until someone told me once that some states don't honor out-of-state permits as a valid license, that is.

[jeffandnicole]

NYC bans ALL permit-holders from driving in the city on freeways and when not in a driver's ed car with an instructor 21 years or older.  Doesn't matter where the permit came from.  It's just NYC being NYC.

We know that.

RobbieL2415 doesn't.

None of us know for sure what RobbieL2415 does or does not know unless he chimes in.  I believe he's just under the assumption that no one with a learner's permit will drive out of state until obtaining a license, regardless of the state that issued said permit.  IMO, that's a fair assumption.  I did not drive outside of my home state of NJ until I obtained a driver's license.  I believe many, if not most fall into this category.

Neither did I, and I could've sworn at the time (26 years ago...sigh...) that I wasn't permitted to drive out of state with just a permit anyway. 

Then again, my mom especially was pretty freaked out of the thought of me driving, so I think my parents desperately wanted to limit my driving anyway.  Even the day I went for my test - my 17th Birthday (which is the first day you could get a license in NJ), and passed the test perfectly, my mom simply wanted to go home to make dinner, rather than go to the DMV with me to get my license.  Most parents are very happy to see their kids move on to this next stage in life.  My mom greatly struggled with that.

I don't remember all my driving permit driving...and I have a feeling I did more with my dad than my mom...but I know I never drove out of state with the permit.

[signalman]

Well, 1995hoo and I certainly drove out of state with learner's permits, and I'm sure there must be others on the forum like us.  It never even occurred to me that someone would avoid driving out of state on a learner's permit–until someone told me once that some states don't honor out-of-state permits as a valid license, that is.

I never said I avoided driving out of state while I had my permit, nor did I express or try to imply that others refrain from doing so.  In fact, that was not the case, as I recall.  This was over 20 years ago, but to the best of my memory, the need just never arose.  You and 1995hoo are merely a small sample of the roadgeeking community and an ever smaller piece of the entire driving population.  I'm sure there are others besides you two (both roadgeeks and not) who have driven across state lines with a learner's permit, but I'm sticking to my belief that the vast majority do not.

[1995hoo]

Well, 1995hoo and I certainly drove out of state with learner's permits, and I'm sure there must be others on the forum like us.  It never even occurred to me that someone would avoid driving out of state on a learner's permit–until someone told me once that some states don't honor out-of-state permits as a valid license, that is.

I never said I avoided driving out of state while I had my permit, nor did I express or try to imply that others refrain from doing so.  In fact, that was not the case, as I recall.  This was over 20 years ago, but to the best of my memory, the need just never arose.  You and 1995hoo are merely a small sample of the roadgeeking community and an ever smaller piece of the entire driving population.  I'm sure there are others besides you two (both roadgeeks and not) who have driven across state lines with a learner's permit, but I'm sticking to my belief that the vast majority do not.

I'm sure part of that depends on where you live. I grew up in Northern Virginia about 20 minutes from where I live now, and around here it's pretty routine that you'd drive into the District of Columbia or Maryland at some point on a learner's permit. If I had grown up in, I don't know, I'll pick a more extreme example here, say Bangor in Maine, it might be a very different situation because it's much further from a state line. I didn't mean to say it's routine that someone with a permit would drive from Virginia to the New York area (my father felt it was good experience for me in terms of highway driving), but at the same time, as I said before, I was responding to the specific wording tckma used:

Not that someone who has a learner's permit from NYS is going to go driving out of state until they have a driver's license... ....

This implies to me that someone with a learner's permit either cannot or should not drive out of his home state until he has a regular license, and my question was simply "why not?" In other words, my point was not to say something like, "Everyone does that," or something like, "Because I did that everyone has to have done it." My point was simply to ask why one would assume people with learner's permits would not drive out of state.

[signalman]

I could've sworn at the time (26 years ago...sigh...) that I wasn't permitted to drive out of state with just a permit anyway. 
I don't remember all my driving permit driving...and I have a feeling I did more with my dad than my mom...but I know I never drove out of state with the permit.

That could have been a stipulation of a NJ learner's permit, I honestly don't remember.  It wouldn't surprise me, it is NJ after all 

One thing I have wondered....Does NJ honor out of state licenses if the license holder is under the legal driving age by NJ's standards?  I suppose the same could be asked about out of state permit holders.  Although since this came up, I had honestly never considered that one would drive out of state with only a learner's permit.  I know NYC doesn't allow anyone under 18 to drive, even if you're licensed.

[cl94]

I know NYC doesn't allow anyone under 18 to drive, even if you're licensed.

NYC is 17 AND full license. Only way to get a full license at 17 in NY is by taking driver's ed, else it's 18.

[jeffandnicole]

I could've sworn at the time (26 years ago...sigh...) that I wasn't permitted to drive out of state with just a permit anyway. 
I don't remember all my driving permit driving...and I have a feeling I did more with my dad than my mom...but I know I never drove out of state with the permit.

That could have been a stipulation of a NJ learner's permit, I honestly don't remember.  It wouldn't surprise me, it is NJ after all 

One thing I have wondered....Does NJ honor out of state licenses if the license holder is under the legal driving age by NJ's standards?  I suppose the same could be asked about out of state permit holders.  Although since this came up, I had honestly never considered that one would drive out of state with only a learner's permit.  I know NYC doesn't allow anyone under 18 to drive, even if you're licensed.

I've never heard of that being an issue, and especially in the summer, 16 year olds from PA drove to the Jersey shore all the time.  I think you simply need to be a licensed driver to drive in the state regardless of age.

[signalman]

I'm sure part of that depends on where you live. I grew up in Northern Virginia about 20 minutes from where I live now, and around here it's pretty routine that you'd drive into the District of Columbia or Maryland at some point on a learner's permit. If I had grown up in, I don't know, I'll pick a more extreme example here, say Bangor in Maine, it might be a very different situation because it's much further from a state line. I didn't mean to say it's routine that someone with a permit would drive from Virginia to the New York area (my father felt it was good experience for me in terms of highway driving), but at the same time, as I said before, I was responding to the specific wording tckma used:

Not that someone who has a learner's permit from NYS is going to go driving out of state until they have a driver's license... ....

This implies to me that someone with a learner's permit either cannot or should not drive out of his home state until he has a regular license, and my question was simply "why not?" In other words, my point was not to say something like, "Everyone does that," or something like, "Because I did that everyone has to have done it." My point was simply to ask why one would assume people with learner's permits would not drive out of state.

I hadn't considered those that live close to the border of their state.  I suppose there's plenty who frequently cross state borders for various reasons.  I also assumed that a permit was only valid in the state it was issued.  I suppose that too varies from state to state.  I'm sure it also varies what other states will honor said permit.  As long as it was legal, I agree that the highway driving (VA to NY and back) was an excellent opportunity for you to get experience with that.  I wasn't so lucky in that regard.  My family rarely went out of state aside from vacation or perhaps for a toy train show (my dad and I are both into trains).  If we did go out of state while I had a permit, I doubt my dad would've let me drive anyway.  I honestly don't remember if we did though.

NYC is 17 AND full license.

My mistake.  I thought it was a blanket 18 in the city.

[Duke87]

For what it's worth, when I went to drivers' ed in CT we were explicitly told that we're not supposed to drive out of state with our learners' permits.

[vdeane]

None of us know for sure what RobbieL2415 does or does not know unless he chimes in.  I believe he's just under the assumption that no one with a learner's permit will drive out of state until obtaining a license, regardless of the state that issued said permit.  IMO, that's a fair assumption.  I did not drive outside of my home state of NJ until I obtained a driver's license.  I believe many, if not most fall into this category.

His post specifically mentioned NYC.  Plus I resent 1995hoo's implication that there was only one legitimate thing to reply/comment on in the entire thread and his condescending "we know that".

Out of state permit holders aren't allowed to drive within the limits of NYC or on surrounding parkways.

[RobbieL2415]

None of us know for sure what RobbieL2415 does or does not know unless he chimes in.  I believe he's just under the assumption that no one with a learner's permit will drive out of state until obtaining a license, regardless of the state that issued said permit.  IMO, that's a fair assumption.  I did not drive outside of my home state of NJ until I obtained a driver's license.  I believe many, if not most fall into this category.

His post specifically mentioned NYC.  Plus I resent 1995hoo's implication that there was only one legitimate thing to reply/comment on in the entire thread and his condescending "we know that".

Out of state permit holders aren't allowed to drive within the limits of NYC or on surrounding parkways.

I take no offense.

I drove in MA, VA and NC with my permit following my state's rules for passengers.  All states except AZ, HI, NH, PA, SC, VT and DC accept OOS permits under either the issuing state's laws or both the issuing state and the driving state's laws.

http://www.oprfhs.org/driver-education/documents/State_Permit_Restrictions.pdf

[1995hoo]

None of us know for sure what RobbieL2415 does or does not know unless he chimes in.  I believe he's just under the assumption that no one with a learner's permit will drive out of state until obtaining a license, regardless of the state that issued said permit.  IMO, that's a fair assumption.  I did not drive outside of my home state of NJ until I obtained a driver's license.  I believe many, if not most fall into this category.

His post specifically mentioned NYC.  Plus I resent 1995hoo's implication that there was only one legitimate thing to reply/comment on in the entire thread and his condescending "we know that".

Out of state permit holders aren't allowed to drive within the limits of NYC or on surrounding parkways.

I'm not going to apologize to you because it wasn't clear you were responding to RobbieL2415–you didn't quote his post, nor anyone else's for that matter, and your comment could just as easily have been a reply to kphoger's reply to me that appears in the post directly before your comment in question (which is how I interpreted it when I read it and made the reply that's apparently bothered you).

[jeffandnicole]

I drove in MA, VA and NC with my permit following my state's rules for passengers.  All states except AZ, HI, NH, PA, SC, VT and DC accept OOS permits under either the issuing state's laws or both the issuing state and the driving state's laws.

http://www.oprfhs.org/driver-education/documents/State_Permit_Restrictions.pdf

Never knew such a list existed.  Thank you for that!  For me, when I was 16, the most likely state I would've driven in would have been PA (Philly, specifically), so I wouldn't have been permitted to do so anyway.

[froggie]

That list is not correct when it comes to Vermont.  Per Vermont DMV, an out of state permit is allowable in Vermont for "a period of 30 days for vacation purposes."  In other words, if you're vacationing or just passing through, you can use an out of state drivers permit in Vermont, provided of course that you have a licensed driver in the passenger seat.

[kphoger]

your comment could just as easily have been a reply to kphoger's reply to me that appears in the post directly before your comment in question

Well, let's all just assume that's true.  So I should be the only one offended.  Since I'm not offended in the slightest, then we're all good here.

[02 Park Ave]

I was shocked when I saw 1995hoo's comment.  I thought that it was rude and uncalled for.

[cl94]

I was shocked when I saw 1995hoo's comment.  I thought that it was rude and uncalled for.

Agreed. I'm not PC in the slightest, but there's no reason to be uncivil.

[kphoger]

Can't we all just get along?

[Roadgeekteen]

I was shocked when I saw 1995hoo's comment.  I thought that it was rude and uncalled for.

Agreed. I'm not PC in the slightest, but there's no reason to be uncivil.

This thread is so off topic now that it might as well just be locked.