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Author Topic: I-49 in Arkansas  (Read 1095052 times)

Bobby5280

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3150 on: September 18, 2021, 02:04:26 PM »

It's starting to look like much of the I-57 extension could be finished well before any big projects on I-49 in the Fort Smith area are completed. Get the cheaper "low hanging fruit" handled first, kick the can down the road on the more expensive projects (like that Alma-Barling I-49 project).
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3151 on: September 18, 2021, 02:13:04 PM »


I-49: MO holds up the new construction BVB for a long while, focusing more on upgrading the existing US 71 Expressway, but heh, better later than never!


MODOT was ready to roll on 49 construction, but Arkansas didn't have the money. Then Arkansas had the money and MODOT doesn't. . Plus there was talk of making the connector a toll road, but that idea failed. It seemed like ARDOT and MODOT couldn't get their s#it together.
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abqtraveler

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3152 on: September 18, 2021, 04:19:08 PM »

View from afar: I-49 vs I-57 seems like a tale of two new interstates

I-49: MO holds up the new construction BVB for a long while, focusing more on upgrading the existing US 71 Expressway, but heh, better later than never!

I-57: MO already has funding authorized and construction scheduled for the 2-lane US 67 upgrade south of Poplar Bluff to the AR state line, leaving the existing US 60 Expressway upgrades as the ďfinalĒ box to check for 57

About 10 years ago, MO had the money to finish their part of the BVB, but they redirected those funds to other projects when Arkansas was struggling to secure funding for its portion. And a few years later, we found ourselves in the opposite situation where AR had found money and MO didn't have any for their respective sections of the BVB. It was only when the NW Arkansas Council of Governments obtained approval for a federal grant did the MO portion of the BVB see its funding restored and allowing construction to proceed.
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mvak36

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3153 on: September 18, 2021, 06:40:26 PM »

View from afar: I-49 vs I-57 seems like a tale of two new interstates

I-49: MO holds up the new construction BVB for a long while, focusing more on upgrading the existing US 71 Expressway, but heh, better later than never!

I-57: MO already has funding authorized and construction scheduled for the 2-lane US 67 upgrade south of Poplar Bluff to the AR state line, leaving the existing US 60 Expressway upgrades as the ďfinalĒ box to check for 57

It probably helped that Poplar Bluff has had a little political pull in Jefferson City over the years. I think they've been making upgrades to US67/US60 over the years (before the interstate designation effort got legs).

At least the terrain won't be as bad as it was for the BVB whenever it comes time for them to meet Arkansas at the border.
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jbnv

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3154 on: September 20, 2021, 10:32:14 AM »

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

Sorry for the diversion, but I feel that Arkansas should see having *both* I-49 and I-57 complete to the Gulf as beneficial to them. And they need to remember how the three-state effort is what gave them I-49 in the first place.
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3155 on: September 20, 2021, 10:38:19 AM »

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

Sorry for the diversion, but I feel that Arkansas should see having *both* I-49 and I-57 complete to the Gulf as beneficial to them. And they need to remember how the three-state effort is what gave them I-49 in the first place.

Well, 57 is supposed to terminate at I-40, so no trip to the Gulf for it.

69 is , IMO, some politician's wet dream. I don't understand it or see the need.

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jbnv

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3156 on: September 20, 2021, 11:41:42 AM »

Well, 57 is supposed to terminate at I-40, so no trip to the Gulf for it.

According to which indelible and irrevocable decree?
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3157 on: September 20, 2021, 12:03:35 PM »

Well, 57 is supposed to terminate at I-40, so no trip to the Gulf for it.

According to which indelible and irrevocable decree?

FOR NOW, it's supposed to end at I-40. I have heard nothing about extending it unless you know something different, in which case share it with the rest of us.
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Bobby5280

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3158 on: September 20, 2021, 12:15:46 PM »

This forum is the only place where I've seen any mention made of a southern extension of I-57 into Louisiana or previous ideas like extending I-530 down into Louisiana. For now, they can't even get the basics of AR-530 finished South of Poplar Bluff to US-278. That's only a Super-2 with at-grade intersections. Yet they can't fill the gap between AR-35 and AR-11.
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jbnv

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3159 on: September 20, 2021, 02:34:31 PM »

Who said anything about it being anything more than an idea? The entire interstate system was nothing more than someone's idea at some point.
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bassoon1986

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3160 on: September 20, 2021, 02:38:50 PM »

I just donít see the purpose of extending 57 over I-530 and then into Louisiana. It doesnít make sense as a long distance corridor to go SW into Little Rock, SE into Louisiana, then SW again to Lake Charles.

I-530 extended (some) as itís own 4 lane corridor? Sure, maybe. I donít see a huge need to have it go all the way to Monroe. In Louisiana, our 4 lane corridors like US 165/US 425 and US 167 serve us fine.


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jbnv

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3161 on: September 20, 2021, 02:43:38 PM »

I laid out why in my post.

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.
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mvak36

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3162 on: September 20, 2021, 03:24:41 PM »

I laid out why in my post.

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

It's not a bad idea. I doubt I'll see it in my lifetime.

How much of the route is 4 lanes south of Monticello (or wherever I-530 is supposed to meet with I-69)?
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bassoon1986

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3163 on: September 20, 2021, 04:29:34 PM »

I laid out why in my post.

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

It's not a bad idea. I doubt I'll see it in my lifetime.

How much of the route is 4 lanes south of Monticello (or wherever I-530 is supposed to meet with I-69)?
AR 530 is completely 2-laned south of where it departs from I-530 in Pine Bluff. And thereís a gap in between 2 parts near the southern end.


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mvak36

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3164 on: September 20, 2021, 04:33:04 PM »

I laid out why in my post.

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

It's not a bad idea. I doubt I'll see it in my lifetime.

How much of the route is 4 lanes south of Monticello (or wherever I-530 is supposed to meet with I-69)?
AR 530 is completely 2-laned south of where it departs from I-530 in Pine Bluff. And thereís a gap in between 2 parts near the southern end.


iPhone

My bad. I was asking about the US 425 and US165 highways south of Monticello which I assume is the route jbnv was talking about in his post (please correct me if I'm wrong).
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jbnv

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3165 on: September 20, 2021, 05:21:49 PM »

My bad. I was asking about the US 425 and US165 highways south of Monticello which I assume is the route jbnv was talking about in his post (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Yes. US 425 is four-laned in Louisiana. My idea of "Interstate 57 to the Gulf" would make use of the four-laned sections of US 425 to Bastrop and US 165 to Iowa, LA.
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bassoon1986

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3166 on: September 20, 2021, 07:47:30 PM »

I laid out why in my post.

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

It's not a bad idea. I doubt I'll see it in my lifetime.

How much of the route is 4 lanes south of Monticello (or wherever I-530 is supposed to meet with I-69)?
AR 530 is completely 2-laned south of where it departs from I-530 in Pine Bluff. And thereís a gap in between 2 parts near the southern end.


iPhone

My bad. I was asking about the US 425 and US165 highways south of Monticello which I assume is the route jbnv was talking about in his post (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Oh sorry, I didnít realize what you were asking. South of Monticello itís 2 lanes in Arkansas. And 4 lanes in Louisiana. The 425 to 165 combo is completely 4 lanes. 425 going southeast isnít 4 lanes again until Rayville.


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mvak36

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3167 on: September 20, 2021, 10:30:52 PM »

I laid out why in my post.

If I were Arkansas, I'd ditch I-69 and pitch a dual-corridor I-49/57 effort to Louisiana. Now that all of south Louisiana has experienced a major hurricane within one calendar year, it should be *very* easy to sell an extension of I-57 all the way to Iowa-Lake Charles. I-69 is practically DOA in Louisiana anyway. And I-57 and I-49 complete to I-10 opens up a lot of Arkansas and Missouri for coastal evacuees (much more than the current routes open them to travelers who only look at interstates) as well as tourists. I-57 to the Gulf makes the Lake Charles area more attractive as a port and gives Louisiana more port redundancy.

It's not a bad idea. I doubt I'll see it in my lifetime.

How much of the route is 4 lanes south of Monticello (or wherever I-530 is supposed to meet with I-69)?
AR 530 is completely 2-laned south of where it departs from I-530 in Pine Bluff. And thereís a gap in between 2 parts near the southern end.


iPhone

My bad. I was asking about the US 425 and US165 highways south of Monticello which I assume is the route jbnv was talking about in his post (please correct me if I'm wrong).

Oh sorry, I didnít realize what you were asking. South of Monticello itís 2 lanes in Arkansas. And 4 lanes in Louisiana. The 425 to 165 combo is completely 4 lanes. 425 going southeast isnít 4 lanes again until Rayville.


iPhone

So if the 425/165 is all 4 lanes, does that mean they just have to limit access on certain parts and build bypasses around towns to make it a freeway? Or is there going to have to be a lot of new terrain construction?
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MikieTimT

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3168 on: September 21, 2021, 12:10:27 AM »

OT, is there any overhead light on any stretch of 49 in NWA? IMO, it should have overhead lighting from the Boston mountains up to the Missouri line. With the amout of deer and fog in the winter months from Alma to Springdale. This should have been implemented 20+ years ago
Pretty sure there isnít


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The ends of the Hopper Tunnel and inside the tunnel itself.  Otherwise, no lighting whatsoever on I-49 in Arkansas north of I-40 other than what leaks downward from overpasses in Rogers with their decorative street lights.
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Tomahawkin

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3169 on: September 21, 2021, 12:50:28 AM »

It's no fun, seeing deer near both sides of the Hopper Tunnel at night, and on days where it's foggy. I don't know why anyone local there hasn't brought that issue up?
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3170 on: September 21, 2021, 01:37:34 AM »

Though I don't remember the details offhand, I seem to recall AHTD/ArDOT's lighting policy is suitably insane that it's been the subject of repeated rounds of criticism here in the pastóI think someone even confronted the AHTD rep here over it when they were around.
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Anthony_JK

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3171 on: September 21, 2021, 06:34:23 AM »

I just donít see the purpose of extending 57 over I-530 and then into Louisiana. It doesnít make sense as a long distance corridor to go SW into Little Rock, SE into Louisiana, then SW again to Lake Charles.

I-530 extended (some) as itís own 4 lane corridor? Sure, maybe. I donít see a huge need to have it go all the way to Monroe. In Louisiana, our 4 lane corridors like US 165/US 425 and US 167 serve us fine.


iPhone

From Little Rock to Monticello to Monroe is more S than SE, so an extension of I-57 southward to Bastrop, and eventually to Monroe and Alexandria/Lake Charles would be OK as a diagonal route.  Though, personally, I'd prefer I-51 or I-53 to match the grid better.

Also, you can justify a freeway extension along US 165/US 425 to Monticello independently of an I-69 routing.


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jbnv

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3172 on: September 21, 2021, 09:24:04 AM »

Also, you can justify a freeway extension along US 165/US 425 to Monticello independently of an I-69 routing.

My point is that Louisiana has no incentive to build its part of I-69, but it has incentive to seek an interstate designation for US 165. If Louisiana doesn't build its part of I-69, Arkansas's part becomes a road to nowhere. So I believe that Arkansas should abandon I-69 and focus on the north-south corridors that it *already* has: I-49 and US 165/425/I-530/US 67 which will or could be Interstate 57. If Arkansas focuses on these two, then it can ask Louisiana and Missouri for an alliance to get them done. Which is far more likely to get either project finished than holding onto I-69.
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3173 on: September 21, 2021, 09:45:51 AM »

I'd disagree, because Shreveport has a really BIG incentive to build out I-69: access to the Port of Shreveport-Bossier and "completing" the Inner Loop/LA 3132 (which would use portions of the segment of proposed I-69 between I-49 and I-20). It may be second fiddle right now to the I-49 ICC, but it's not pushed back that far in the basement either.

Arkansas, OTOH, probably doesn't have the money to even do the bridge across the Mississippi, let alone finish their segment of I-69, and the same goes with Mississippi.

If AR and MS do decide to bail out on I-69, and TX decides to call it a decade and simply build to Texarkana and use I-30/I-40/I-55/I-155 (or I-30/I-57/upgraded US 60) to declare I-69 "finished", then a Lake Charles/Alex/Monroe/Bastrop/Monticello/Pine Bluff freeway becomes that much more viable. It's needed anyway for LA just to finish the freeway system off with a SW/NE connection that would seriously renew Lake Charles and provide an added evac route for the new "major hurricane a year" reality.

All I'm saying is that regardless of what happens with I-69, a SW/NE freeway upgrade of US 165/425 is more than needed. Only issue is how to get it through Alexandria/Pineville.
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abqtraveler

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #3174 on: September 21, 2021, 12:43:36 PM »

I'd disagree, because Shreveport has a really BIG incentive to build out I-69: access to the Port of Shreveport-Bossier and "completing" the Inner Loop/LA 3132 (which would use portions of the segment of proposed I-69 between I-49 and I-20). It may be second fiddle right now to the I-49 ICC, but it's not pushed back that far in the basement either.

Arkansas, OTOH, probably doesn't have the money to even do the bridge across the Mississippi, let alone finish their segment of I-69, and the same goes with Mississippi.

If AR and MS do decide to bail out on I-69, and TX decides to call it a decade and simply build to Texarkana and use I-30/I-40/I-55/I-155 (or I-30/I-57/upgraded US 60) to declare I-69 "finished", then a Lake Charles/Alex/Monroe/Bastrop/Monticello/Pine Bluff freeway becomes that much more viable. It's needed anyway for LA just to finish the freeway system off with a SW/NE connection that would seriously renew Lake Charles and provide an added evac route for the new "major hurricane a year" reality.

All I'm saying is that regardless of what happens with I-69, a SW/NE freeway upgrade of US 165/425 is more than needed. Only issue is how to get it through Alexandria/Pineville.

I would suspect that completing the loop around Shreveport and Bossier City I-49(S) to I-20(E) would be LA's #1 priority for I-69, with the remainder of the route falling lower in priority since there will be no immediate utility for the sections outside of the Shreveport-Bossier area.
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