Vermont

[jcroyer80]

Before everyone gets all bent out of shape, just remember that this is the beginning of the legislative session.  That means that almost anyone in the VT House or Senate can propose a bill.  Many (most?) of which will go nowhere and never leave the committee they are assigned to.  Even if by some crazy reason any of these bills pass committee and pass both chambers, there is zero chance our Republican governor would sign them.  The cell phone bill was made as a "joke" to prove a point.  The 55 mph bill and the others mentioned were simply proposals and for some reason the press picked them up and ran with them as serious proposals that had a chance of becoming law.

Ok. Rant over.

The 55 bill isn't even the craziest thing to come out of the legislative session. There's a bill to legalize prostitution and another to ban cell phone use by people under 21.

[roadman]

The legislator who introduced the bill banning cell phone use by people under 21 has admitted it is unlikely to pass and that he filed it merely to make a point.

[roadman65]

Heard on FB that Vermont is considering lowering the interstate maximum speed limit back to ole 55.  Do not know how true it is or not, does anyone know if this is true?

Considering neighboring NH has 70 mph written in to their law and I believe is posted along rural parts of I-93, it seems so odd, but then again VT still uses mainly 50 mph on off freeway rural roads as the max with only a few select routes at a 55 mph maximum speed.

[deathtopumpkins]

Heard on FB that Vermont is considering lowering the interstate maximum speed limit back to ole 55.  Do not know how true it is or not, does anyone know if this is true?

Read the posts immediately above yours.

[roadman65]

I only read the cell phone one, lol!  Did not see the one above it!  Anyway, it is still a good subject to inquire about as it was on Facebook and ole Bernie is from that particular state who believes in socialism, and having a 55 again would indeed be that.

Anyway, the way the pages went from one to the other here it is kind of hard to go through em all one by one.  Sounds though promising that it won't happen from that post.

[froggie]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

[Alps]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55mph has nothing to do with socialism... Don't feed the roadman65.

[PHLBOS]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55 mph has nothing to do with socialism.

I wouldn't necessarily go that far with that statement.  It's more than just a mere coincidence that those (in Vermont or elsewhere) seeking to propose a reinstatement of the 55 mph maximum speed limit have political views that are, at a minimum, very left of center.

[sprjus4]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55 mph has nothing to do with socialism.

I wouldn't necessarily go that far with that statement.  It's more than just a mere coincidence that those (in Vermont or elsewhere) seeking to propose a reinstatement of the 55 mph maximum speed limit have political views that are, at a minimum, very left of center.

And also one of the main drivers for the proposal is to help "reduce emissions" and "help with climate change".

[roadman65]

We all know too well there are not enough cops to enforce speed laws these days.  Come down to Florida and if you can do 90 mph from Tampa to Daytona Beach on I-4 ( a big if cause Orlando traffic is a big issue) chances are you will not get caught going over the various speed limits ranging from 55 to 70 along the 132 miles of freeway.

So lowering the speed limit in a rural state that has a small fraction of the global auto traffic is like pulling one strand of hay out of a big bail to reduce its size.

[PHLBOS]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55 mph has nothing to do with socialism.

I wouldn't necessarily go that far with that statement.  It's more than just a mere coincidence that those (in Vermont or elsewhere) seeking to propose a reinstatement of the 55 mph maximum speed limit have political views that are, at a minimum, very left of center.

And also one of the main drivers for the proposal is to help "reduce emissions" and "help with climate change".

Which, as previously mentioned up-thread, is flat-out bogus (or at least obsolete) given the advances in vehicle transmissions since the 70s.  It's not like everyone's currently still driving around with 3-speed non-overdrive automatics let alone GM's 2-speed Power Glide transmission. 

Long story short: if vehicles' maximium fuel economy is now obtained at a higher speed range; then reducing the highway speed limits as a means to save fuel/reduce emissions actually increases consumption & emissions.

[sprjus4]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55 mph has nothing to do with socialism.

I wouldn't necessarily go that far with that statement.  It's more than just a mere coincidence that those (in Vermont or elsewhere) seeking to propose a reinstatement of the 55 mph maximum speed limit have political views that are, at a minimum, very left of center.

And also one of the main drivers for the proposal is to help "reduce emissions" and "help with climate change".

Which, as previously mentioned up-thread, is flat-out bogus (or at least obsolete) given the advances in vehicle transmissions since the 70s.  It's not like everyone's currently still driving around with 3-speed non-overdrive automatics let alone GM's 2-speed Power Glide transmission. 

Long story short: if vehicles' maximium fuel economy is now obtained at a higher speed range; then reducing the highway speed limits as a means to save fuel/reduce emissions actually increases consumption & emissions.

It's just another radical approach to fight "climate change" at all costs.

[Alps]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55 mph has nothing to do with socialism.

I wouldn't necessarily go that far with that statement.  It's more than just a mere coincidence that those (in Vermont or elsewhere) seeking to propose a reinstatement of the 55 mph maximum speed limit have political views that are, at a minimum, very left of center.

And also one of the main drivers for the proposal is to help "reduce emissions" and "help with climate change".

Which, as previously mentioned up-thread, is flat-out bogus (or at least obsolete) given the advances in vehicle transmissions since the 70s.  It's not like everyone's currently still driving around with 3-speed non-overdrive automatics let alone GM's 2-speed Power Glide transmission. 

Long story short: if vehicles' maximium fuel economy is now obtained at a higher speed range; then reducing the highway speed limits as a means to save fuel/reduce emissions actually increases consumption & emissions.

It's just another radical approach to fight "climate change" at all costs.

But that's not socialism. Unless you want to argue all speed limits are socialism. What's the topic here? Vermont?

[VTGoose]

We all know too well there are not enough cops to enforce speed laws these days.  Come down to Florida and if you can do 90 mph from Tampa to Daytona Beach on I-4 ( a big if cause Orlando traffic is a big issue) chances are you will not get caught going over the various speed limits ranging from 55 to 70 along the 132 miles of freeway.

So lowering the speed limit in a rural state that has a small fraction of the global auto traffic is like pulling one strand of hay out of a big bail to reduce its size.

And at what magical time might one be able to actually reach 90 mph on I-4? We did see less traffic on a midnight drive from the Orlando airport to Apollo Beach, but that was a rarity. Now pretty much any part of I-75 (when it isn't choked with traffic from a fender-bender or construction) is wide open and the speed limit is just a suggestion to a lot of drivers.

As to Vermont, why? Lowering the speed limit would require more police and more vehicles, which seems to defeat the purpose of reducing emissions (unless the cops are outfitted with electric patrol cars).

[PHLBOS]

^ The legislative proposals and Bernie being from Vermont have nothing to do with each other.

And 55 mph has nothing to do with socialism.

I wouldn't necessarily go that far with that statement.  It's more than just a mere coincidence that those (in Vermont or elsewhere) seeking to propose a reinstatement of the 55 mph maximum speed limit have political views that are, at a minimum, very left of center.

And also one of the main drivers for the proposal is to help "reduce emissions" and "help with climate change".

Which, as previously mentioned up-thread, is flat-out bogus (or at least obsolete) given the advances in vehicle transmissions since the 70s.  It's not like everyone's currently still driving around with 3-speed non-overdrive automatics let alone GM's 2-speed Power Glide transmission. 

Long story short: if vehicles' maximium fuel economy is now obtained at a higher speed range; then reducing the highway speed limits as a means to save fuel/reduce emissions actually increases consumption & emissions.

It's just another radical approach to fight "climate change" at all costs.

But that's not socialism. Unless you want to argue all speed limits are socialism. What's the topic here? Vermont?

While speed limits in general aren't socialism per se; those pushing for a reinstatement of a national 55 mph speed limit are, more often than not, politicians/advocates that have strong left-wing views.  The socialism part of the issue involves the reasoning for backing/proposing such. 

In Vermont's case, since you asked what does such have to do with VT/thread topic; state legislators are proposing the 55 mph speed limit legislation as a means to combat climate change; article-links covering such are posted upthread.  That rationale is based on the old 70s notion that 55 Saves Fuel (less fuel burned = less pollution); a rationale that long since no longer applies with respect to today's gasoline/diesel-powered vehicles due to advancements in transmission technology.  Most hybrids OTOH due to their electric/gas engine setup & design get better mileage around town than on the highway.  However, proposing legislation for a maximum 30 mph speed limit and mandating that everybody drive hybrids would automatically die in committee.

[KEVIN_224]

https://www.newscentermaine.com/article/life/wellness/vermont-hopes-to-complete-93-mile-rail-trail-by-mid-decade/97-75efd60b-33cf-4497-80f9-9556dff16026

Linked from NBC of Portland, ME for whatever reason. Something about an unused "rail trail" in northern Vermont.

[shadyjay]

It crossed

https://www.newscentermaine.com/article/life/wellness/vermont-hopes-to-complete-93-mile-rail-trail-by-mid-decade/97-75efd60b-33cf-4497-80f9-9556dff16026

Linked from NBC of Portland, ME for whatever reason. Something about an unused "rail trail" in northern Vermont.

The Lamoille Valley corridor stretches from St Johnsbury, east to the St Albans area.  It passes through classic rural Vermont.  The eastern half has a pretty twisty routing and some good grades... travel US 2 from St J/I-91, west to Danville and you'll climb some pretty steep grades.  I rode part of this railroad, from Morrisville east to the Joe's Pond area back around 1991/92.  It was a nice ride, but just a little "too far north" to tap into the resort business.  Not much industry up there either... not enough to support a 90-mile rail line.  So it's going to rec path status.  That involves not just removing the rails/ties and calling it good.  Washed out bridges need to have some sort of crossing re-established, though doesn't have to be as elaborate.  The ROW needs to be graded.  Not sure if pavement is going in, or more of a hard-packed gravel surface.  They've been working on it for a few years now. 

Unfortunately, this is probably the one line that has been abandoned in recent times where it just simply doesn't have the location/routing to make any $$$, and thus couldn't realistically be saved.  During the 1960s-1970s, it had about a half dozen different operators who all tried to make a go of it, with limited success.  The railroad I work for acquired the 4 passenger cars that were used in this line in the mid 90s and we run them regularly, so a piece of the railroad was saved.  Just wished I saved the hat my parents bought me back from that visit in 1991. 

The Fisher Bridge, east of Morrisville along VT 15, is the last remaining railroad covered bridge in Vermont.  Hit here for my photos of it I took during a 2018 day drive through the area.  You'll see how some work is required in this area to make it safe for regular use by recreationalists. 
https://www.flickr.com/photos/shadyjay/sets/72157705447585414/with/31679770177/

[froggie]

The Lamoille Valley corridor stretches from St Johnsbury, east to the St Albans area.  It passes through classic rural Vermont.  The eastern half has a pretty twisty routing and some good grades... travel US 2 from St J/I-91, west to Danville and you'll climb some pretty steep grades.  I rode part of this railroad, from Morrisville east to the Joe's Pond area back around 1991/92.  It was a nice ride, but just a little "too far north" to tap into the resort business.  Not much industry up there either... not enough to support a 90-mile rail line.  So it's going to rec path status.  That involves not just removing the rails/ties and calling it good.  Washed out bridges need to have some sort of crossing re-established, though doesn't have to be as elaborate.  The ROW needs to be graded.  Not sure if pavement is going in, or more of a hard-packed gravel surface.  They've been working on it for a few years now. 

A few comments:

- The completed segments...Cambridge Junction to Morrisville and West Danville to St. J, have already proven popular.
- St J is not far from Burke, where Kingdom Trails draws numerous bicycle tourists during the non-winter months.
- Most of the ROW is intact and what I've walked does not need to be graded.  The full corridor has been used for 15 years by VAST as part of their snowmobile trail network.
- Right now, the bridges are the biggest impediment...especially between Morrisville and Hardwick.  They'll need to be rehabilitated or replaced, and that is what's driving the remaining cost to finish the trail.
- The surface on the completed segments is basically "hard packed gravel".
- I'm on a Greensboro committee that's looking at how to tie the town center into the trail.  There's a few property owners adjacent to the trail in Greensboro Bend that are opposed to the trail's completion, but most of Greensboro supports the trail.

[astralentity]

This post will be two fold.

In my travels through Vermont recently, mostly up and down the VT-22A corridor, I noticed something uniquely out of place in Vermont.  At the Addison/Shoreham line, the Town of Addison sign is traffic facing and looks to be made and placed by VTrans.  I know the traditional town line and county line signs are the blade signs that you almost cause an accident to look at.  Is there a movement to go towards more traffic facing town/county line signs like that?

VT's version of the "little green signs"...  I pretty much figured out that the mileage resets at each town line.  What is the middle line of numbers for?

[cl94]

This post will be two fold.

In my travels through Vermont recently, mostly up and down the VT-22A corridor, I noticed something uniquely out of place in Vermont.  At the Addison/Shoreham line, the Town of Addison sign is traffic facing and looks to be made and placed by VTrans.  I know the traditional town line and county line signs are the blade signs that you almost cause an accident to look at.  Is there a movement to go towards more traffic facing town/county line signs like that?

VT's version of the "little green signs"...  I pretty much figured out that the mileage resets at each town line.  What is the middle line of numbers for?

Town identifier. Reference markers are as follows:
Top line: Route number with 4 digits, leftmost is the hundreds digit. Last digit is a numerical representation of the suffix (1 = A, 2 = B, 3 = C) or 0 if the route has no suffix
Middle line: County code (2 digits) and town code (2 digits)
Bottom line: Town mileage to 1/100 of a mile.

Generally, RMs are placed every 2/10 mile and at intersections, with intersection mileage to the hundredth.

[froggie]

In my travels through Vermont recently, mostly up and down the VT-22A corridor, I noticed something uniquely out of place in Vermont.  At the Addison/Shoreham line, the Town of Addison sign is traffic facing and looks to be made and placed by VTrans.  I know the traditional town line and county line signs are the blade signs that you almost cause an accident to look at.  Is there a movement to go towards more traffic facing town/county line signs like that?

VTrans uses both.  The "blade signs" delineate town and county boundaries on non-freeway routes as well as several Class 2 Town Highways.  The "town of xxx" signs, assuming you're referring to these, are used when entering town centers and hamlets.

[astralentity]

In my travels through Vermont recently, mostly up and down the VT-22A corridor, I noticed something uniquely out of place in Vermont.  At the Addison/Shoreham line, the Town of Addison sign is traffic facing and looks to be made and placed by VTrans.  I know the traditional town line and county line signs are the blade signs that you almost cause an accident to look at.  Is there a movement to go towards more traffic facing town/county line signs like that?

VTrans uses both.  The "blade signs" delineate town and county boundaries on non-freeway routes as well as several Class 2 Town Highways.  The "town of xxx" signs, assuming you're referring to these, are used when entering town centers and hamlets.

I know the difference in the use cases.  I'll see the Town of xx signs on US 7 too.  What I'm seeing is they're using the "Town of xx" signs on surface roads, like my example above at the Shoreham/Addison line on VT 22A.  This is also set up next to the existing blade sign.  It could be a sign placed by Addison, similar to the wooden signs I see placed by towns like Benson, Orwell,  Fair Haven, etc.

[KEVIN_224]

I took this town line sign picture in August 2015:


Going by the little green makers, I'm guessing US Route 5 within Brattleboro is 4.9 miles long? The only part I'm missing of that, whether by foot, car or bus, is the small portion south of Exit 1 to the Guilford town line.

[DJDBVT]

Going by the little green makers, I'm guessing US Route 5 within Brattleboro is 4.9 miles long?

It's 5.49 miles. The bottom line is hundredths of miles.

[KEVIN_224]

OK. Got it! I just know we don't have those markers here in Connecticut. I've walked the distance of US 5 in that town a few times. From the south end Price Chopper plaza and Lipton Mart/Shell station (with Greyhound) until a few feet past that town line sign. Quite the hike. Took just over an hour if I didn't stop to cross the Route 119 bridge into Hinsdale, NH.