New York

[astralentity]

The Hutchinson River Parkway converted to mileage-based exits in 2021. As for the CT 15 Merritt Parkway, Wikipedia says it will happen in 2025, but when it actually happens is anyone's guess. I think the Connecticut Department of Transportation should have implemented mileage-based exits statewide in a much faster fashion. The reason why it is happening so slowly is likely because Connecticut is converting their exit numbers reluctantly.

As is New York.

I can't wait for that fight discussion between DOT, NYSTA, and FHWA.

NYSTA: Either fund it or get lost
FHWA: 0_o

Either way, the Thruway can't have its own set of numbers and expect to remain compliant.

So?  No consequences can be exerted on NYSTA.

I'm guessing its "NYSTA can do whatever it wants and to heck with FHWA and NYSDOT"?

Well, yes.  NYSTA is a public authority, a rogue entity that exists outside of State government, with the exception of Governor recommendations for leadership appointments.  Although it may receive pennies in federal funding through NYSDOT for certain, specific tasks (e.g., striping and bridges over the Thruway), the fact of the matter is federal and state funding are not large parts of their available funding, the bulk of which is toll revenues.

So, FHWA and NYSDOT don't have any pull over them.

FHWA: "You're non-compliant with the MUTCD!"
NYSTA: "So?"
FHWA: "You have to be compliant!"
NYSTA: "Or what?"
FHWA: "..."
FHWA: "We'll pull your federal funding...?"
NYSTA: BWAAAAH-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!  Go pound sand.

And now we see the benefits of Masspike getting folded into MassDOT.

[RobbieL2415]

The FHWA could go nuclear and revoke all the Interstate designations for the Thruway system.

[kalvado]

The Hutchinson River Parkway converted to mileage-based exits in 2021. As for the CT 15 Merritt Parkway, Wikipedia says it will happen in 2025, but when it actually happens is anyone's guess. I think the Connecticut Department of Transportation should have implemented mileage-based exits statewide in a much faster fashion. The reason why it is happening so slowly is likely because Connecticut is converting their exit numbers reluctantly.

As is New York.

I can't wait for that fight discussion between DOT, NYSTA, and FHWA.

NYSTA: Either fund it or get lost
FHWA: 0_o

Either way, the Thruway can't have its own set of numbers and expect to remain compliant.

So?  No consequences can be exerted on NYSTA.

I'm guessing its "NYSTA can do whatever it wants and to heck with FHWA and NYSDOT"?

Well, yes.  NYSTA is a public authority, a rogue entity that exists outside of State government, with the exception of Governor recommendations for leadership appointments.  Although it may receive pennies in federal funding through NYSDOT for certain, specific tasks (e.g., striping and bridges over the Thruway), the fact of the matter is federal and state funding are not large parts of their available funding, the bulk of which is toll revenues.

So, FHWA and NYSDOT don't have any pull over them.

FHWA: "You're non-compliant with the MUTCD!"
NYSTA: "So?"
FHWA: "You have to be compliant!"
NYSTA: "Or what?"
FHWA: "..."
FHWA: "We'll pull your federal funding...?"
NYSTA: BWAAAAH-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!  Go pound sand.

Well, Cuomo's ads were pulled off the Thruway somehow due to FHWA intervention - but I assume it wasn't NYSTA thing to begin with...

[astralentity]

The FHWA could go nuclear and revoke all the Interstate designations for the Thruway system.

Oh, ouch.

[Rothman]

The Hutchinson River Parkway converted to mileage-based exits in 2021. As for the CT 15 Merritt Parkway, Wikipedia says it will happen in 2025, but when it actually happens is anyone's guess. I think the Connecticut Department of Transportation should have implemented mileage-based exits statewide in a much faster fashion. The reason why it is happening so slowly is likely because Connecticut is converting their exit numbers reluctantly.

As is New York.

I can't wait for that fight discussion between DOT, NYSTA, and FHWA.

NYSTA: Either fund it or get lost
FHWA: 0_o

Either way, the Thruway can't have its own set of numbers and expect to remain compliant.

So?  No consequences can be exerted on NYSTA.

I'm guessing its "NYSTA can do whatever it wants and to heck with FHWA and NYSDOT"?

Well, yes.  NYSTA is a public authority, a rogue entity that exists outside of State government, with the exception of Governor recommendations for leadership appointments.  Although it may receive pennies in federal funding through NYSDOT for certain, specific tasks (e.g., striping and bridges over the Thruway), the fact of the matter is federal and state funding are not large parts of their available funding, the bulk of which is toll revenues.

So, FHWA and NYSDOT don't have any pull over them.

FHWA: "You're non-compliant with the MUTCD!"
NYSTA: "So?"
FHWA: "You have to be compliant!"
NYSTA: "Or what?"
FHWA: "..."
FHWA: "We'll pull your federal funding...?"
NYSTA: BWAAAAH-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!  Go pound sand.

Well, Cuomo's ads were pulled off the Thruway somehow due to FHWA intervention - but I assume it wasn't NYSTA thing to begin with...

No, it wasn't.  That was pressure exerted upon NYSDOT.

[Rothman]

The FHWA could go nuclear and revoke all the Interstate designations for the Thruway system.

Oh, ouch.

Again, no.  The answer from NYSTA would be, "Um, okay, weirdoes."

It would have an affect on NYSDOT's apportionments, but I doubt much would be made of it in the end.

[kalvado]

No, it wasn't.  That was pressure exerted upon NYSDOT.

So it boils down to "how efficiently the pressure applied to NYSDOT and governor transfers to NYSTA
Hard to believe there is no transfer at all. My impression is that the governor has the upper hand anyway, but also has little reason to play the game.

[seicer]

The Hutchinson River Parkway converted to mileage-based exits in 2021. As for the CT 15 Merritt Parkway, Wikipedia says it will happen in 2025, but when it actually happens is anyone's guess. I think the Connecticut Department of Transportation should have implemented mileage-based exits statewide in a much faster fashion. The reason why it is happening so slowly is likely because Connecticut is converting their exit numbers reluctantly.

As is New York.

I can't wait for that fight discussion between DOT, NYSTA, and FHWA.

NYSTA: Either fund it or get lost
FHWA: 0_o

Either way, the Thruway can't have its own set of numbers and expect to remain compliant.

So?  No consequences can be exerted on NYSTA.

I'm guessing its "NYSTA can do whatever it wants and to heck with FHWA and NYSDOT"?

Well, yes.  NYSTA is a public authority, a rogue entity that exists outside of State government, with the exception of Governor recommendations for leadership appointments.  Although it may receive pennies in federal funding through NYSDOT for certain, specific tasks (e.g., striping and bridges over the Thruway), the fact of the matter is federal and state funding are not large parts of their available funding, the bulk of which is toll revenues.

So, FHWA and NYSDOT don't have any pull over them.

FHWA: "You're non-compliant with the MUTCD!"
NYSTA: "So?"
FHWA: "You have to be compliant!"
NYSTA: "Or what?"
FHWA: "..."
FHWA: "We'll pull your federal funding...?"
NYSTA: BWAAAAH-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!  Go pound sand.

Well, Cuomo's ads were pulled off the Thruway somehow due to FHWA intervention - but I assume it wasn't NYSTA thing to begin with...

No, it wasn't.  That was pressure exerted upon NYSDOT.

And if we are talking about those four closely spaced signs, they were not ads for Cuomo. They were vague, generic signs that did not advertise anything specific. I'm not sure why the administration decided to fight the FHWA on that specific case.

[Rothman]

No, it wasn't.  That was pressure exerted upon NYSDOT.

So it boils down to "how efficiently the pressure applied to NYSDOT and governor transfers to NYSTA
Hard to believe there is no transfer at all. My impression is that the governor has the upper hand anyway, but also has little reason to play the game.

Heh.  I've heard authority directors -- not only the Thruway's, but also DASNY's and others -- just straight-faced say they really don't answer to anyone as heads of public authorities.

Short of it is, unless they really, really, really screw up -- and yes, more than the $200m rest area overage debacle, directors keep their jobs.

We're still the state that created Robert Moses, after all.

[Alps]

Not to overquote: If NYSTA does not change exit numbers, the FHWA could pressure NYS into losing Federal dollars unless they force NYSTA's hand. This has been mentioned for other agencies as well in my experience, but it's all conjecture for now.

[Rothman]

Not to overquote: If NYSTA does not change exit numbers, the FHWA could pressure NYS into losing Federal dollars unless they force NYSTA's hand. This has been mentioned for other agencies as well in my experience, but it's all conjecture for now.

NYSDOT to FHWA: Given that NYSTA isn't even part of State Government in New York State, this treatment is unfair and we're suing.

[machias]

I've never understood why the Thruway Authority has such a grand attachment to their interchange numbering system. There's no toll booths anymore, and it's not like locals say "I live at Exit 34" like they do around the New Jersey Turnpike. I got it back in the day when there were toll booths and tickets and all that, but now it's just another interstate that happens to have tolls.

[RobbieL2415]

I've never understood why the Thruway Authority has such a grand attachment to their interchange numbering system. There's no toll booths anymore, and it's not like locals say "I live at Exit 34" like they do around the New Jersey Turnpike. I got it back in the day when there were toll booths and tickets and all that, but now it's just another interstate that happens to have tolls.

Here's the thing. When I'm on the Thruway, I KNOW where I am and I KNOW which exit I need based on the last city I passed and the city coming next. For example, I know to look for the exit, regardless of number, for I-490 towards Rochester when I'm west of Syracuse. That is Exit 45 right now, but it could be Exit 277 for all I care, but I still know to take that exit.

The number is irrelevant to me.

[The Ghostbuster]

Somehow, I feel the New Jersey Turnpike will get mileage-based exits before the New York State Thruway does. Since the NJT will likely never get mileage-based exits, I have a feeling neither will the NYST.

[SignBridge]

Not to overquote: If NYSTA does not change exit numbers, the FHWA could pressure NYS into losing Federal dollars unless they force NYSTA's hand. This has been mentioned for other agencies as well in my experience, but it's all conjecture for now.

If I recall a while back, isn't that what happened with the NJ Turnpike Authority to force compliance with BGS design practices?

[Rothman]

I've never understood why the Thruway Authority has such a grand attachment to their interchange numbering system. There's no toll booths anymore, and it's not like locals say "I live at Exit 34" like they do around the New Jersey Turnpike. I got it back in the day when there were toll booths and tickets and all that, but now it's just another interstate that happens to have tolls.

In NY, the big fear is business blowback due to their having to change advertising.  Even the cost of changing signage is secondary to that fear in NY in my experience.

[The Ghostbuster]

Did businesses cause "blowback" in other states when exits were renumbered? I have a feeling that is just an excuse to keep the numbers unchanged.

[Alps]

Not to overquote: If NYSTA does not change exit numbers, the FHWA could pressure NYS into losing Federal dollars unless they force NYSTA's hand. This has been mentioned for other agencies as well in my experience, but it's all conjecture for now.

If I recall a while back, isn't that what happened with the NJ Turnpike Authority to force compliance with BGS design practices?

No. They wanted to improve MUTCD compliance.

[SignBridge]

Not to overquote: If NYSTA does not change exit numbers, the FHWA could pressure NYS into losing Federal dollars unless they force NYSTA's hand. This has been mentioned for other agencies as well in my experience, but it's all conjecture for now.

If I recall a while back, isn't that what happened with the NJ Turnpike Authority to force compliance with BGS design practices?

No. They wanted to improve MUTCD compliance.

Alps, I'm not sure I understand. It sounds like we're saying the same thing.

[Rothman]

Did businesses cause "blowback" in other states when exits were renumbered? I have a feeling that is just an excuse to keep the numbers unchanged.

Ah, no.  It's really a big fear at NYSDOT and is the first thing anyone brings up in a discussion.

(personal opinion emphasized)

[astralentity]

Did businesses cause "blowback" in other states when exits were renumbered? I have a feeling that is just an excuse to keep the numbers unchanged.

Ah, no.  It's really a big fear at NYSDOT and is the first thing anyone brings up in a discussion.

(personal opinion emphasized)

Given how the renumbering went down in PA, that seems to be a cop out to me.  IIRC it was viewed as a generally positive move and they did put a lot of press and presoaking out there to prepare the public for the change.

[Rothman]

Did businesses cause "blowback" in other states when exits were renumbered? I have a feeling that is just an excuse to keep the numbers unchanged.

Ah, no.  It's really a big fear at NYSDOT and is the first thing anyone brings up in a discussion.

(personal opinion emphasized)

Given how the renumbering went down in PA, that seems to be a cop out to me.  IIRC it was viewed as a generally positive move and they did put a lot of press and presoaking out there to prepare the public for the change.

PA isn't NY.  There are a myriad of reasons unique to NY as to why NY is one of the last states to convert

[machias]

Did businesses cause "blowback" in other states when exits were renumbered? I have a feeling that is just an excuse to keep the numbers unchanged.

Ah, no.  It's really a big fear at NYSDOT and is the first thing anyone brings up in a discussion.

(personal opinion emphasized)

Given how the renumbering went down in PA, that seems to be a cop out to me.  IIRC it was viewed as a generally positive move and they did put a lot of press and presoaking out there to prepare the public for the change.

PA isn't NY.  There are a myriad of reasons unique to NY as to why NY is one of the last states to convert

I've always heard that NY has a unique situation with the interchange spacing, especially in the boroughs and on Long Island. The thing is, Chicago and other metro areas handle interchange spacing issues just fine, so I don't know why NY has always thought they were special in this regard.

I used to think sequential numbering was really no big deal when I lived in The Empire State (though I wish the longer non-Interstate freeways like US 219 had interchange numbering), but now that I don't live there, it's just downright weird to drive I-90 from PA to NY and come across a random "Exit 61" as the first interchange, after seeing an exit 1 (or something close) at every other state border since coming in from far flung places like South Dakota.

[RobbieL2415]

NYSTA: We don't want to convert the numbers, so we'll just get rid of exit numbers in general.

[kalvado]

NYSTA: We don't want to convert the numbers, so we'll just get rid of exit numbers in general.

NYSTA a week later: We'll keep the numbers, but we're getting rid of all exits.