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Collin County Outer Loop

Started by MaxConcrete, December 09, 2017, 04:17:56 PM

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MaxConcrete

On December 11, Collin County Commissioners court is scheduled to approve the final alignment of the highway between US 75 and SH 289 (Preston Road)

http://eagenda.collincountytx.gov:8085/agenda_publish.cfm?id=&mt=ALL&get_month=12&get_year=2017&dsp=agm&seq=44146&rev=0&ag=2173&ln=113083&nseq=&nrev=&pseq=&prev=#

The alignment is a horrifically swerving and curving route, but that's par for course these days in Texas. What's most annoying is that the swerves and curves don't appear to be avoiding anything of consequence, with undeveloped land just about everywhere along the route.
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Hurricane Rex

Quote from: MaxConcrete on December 09, 2017, 04:17:56 PM
On December 11, Collin County Commissioners court is scheduled to approve the final alignment of the highway between US 75 and SH 289 (Preston Road)

http://eagenda.collincountytx.gov:8085/agenda_publish.cfm?id=&mt=ALL&get_month=12&get_year=2017&dsp=agm&seq=44146&rev=0&ag=2173&ln=113083&nseq=&nrev=&pseq=&prev=#

The alignment is a horrifically swerving and curving route, but that's par for course these days in Texas. What's most annoying is that the swerves and curves don't appear to be avoiding anything of consequence, with undeveloped land just about everywhere along the route.

If it is undeveloped, logic would say to make it as strait as possible. Curves slow people down and can make the road less safe. I'm sorry to hear its going through like this.
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Road Hog

The land is not completely undeveloped. If you look at the maps linked on the agenda page, there are quite a few residences that the county took great pains to avoid, with one exception: that house where it crosses FM 2478.

The curves are very gentle, too. It's not like they're building a switchback goat path.

compdude787

Doesn't seem insanely curvy to me. At least not as much as I-14 between I-35 and I-45.  :-D

austrini

It's curving to avoid residences, USDA fill ponds, cattle tanks, and elevation changes - (source: I'm a county GIS guy)  - makes it a lot cheaper.
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Road Hog


sparker

Quote from: compdude787 on December 10, 2017, 09:22:08 PM
Doesn't seem insanely curvy to me. At least not as much as I-14 between I-35 and I-45.  :-D

Re I-14: only if it strictly follows the present US 190 alignment will its profile look like the teeth of a circular saw (because US 190's profile looks pretty much like that!).  Chances are there will be more than a little cutoff of the more gratuitous right-angles, but the only town between Temple and Bryan that's almost certain to get close service is Hearne -- primarily because it's at the most feasible point to cross the Brazos River floodplain.

austrini

Quote from: Road Hog on December 12, 2017, 10:05:09 AM
What's the construction timetable?

I dont think its been established yet, I only have a bunch of engineering stuff. It would just be the north frontage road on the 3,000' ROW at first.
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MaxConcrete

Quote from: austrini on December 12, 2017, 05:43:04 PM
I dont think its been established yet, I only have a bunch of engineering stuff. It would just be the north frontage road on the 3,000' ROW at first.

Do you mean 300 foot wide ROW? The 2015 schematics at the official web site show a 500 foot wide right-of-way. I hope they have not trimmed the right-of-way to the bare minimum 300 feet.
http://www.collincountytx.gov/mobility/pages/outerloop.aspx
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aboges26

Quote from: MaxConcrete on December 12, 2017, 07:22:35 PM
Quote from: austrini on December 12, 2017, 05:43:04 PM
I dont think its been established yet, I only have a bunch of engineering stuff. It would just be the north frontage road on the 3,000' ROW at first.

Do you mean 300 foot wide ROW? The 2015 schematics at the official web site show a 500 foot wide right-of-way. I hope they have not trimmed the right-of-way to the bare minimum 300 feet.
http://www.collincountytx.gov/mobility/pages/outerloop.aspx

Your link states the following:

QuoteIn December 2002, Collin County initiated the Outer Loop Alignment Study to develop various alignments within and along a 3,000-foot-wide corridor. The study identified a locally preferred alignment in order to determine right-of-way needs for the road to be built when the time comes.

NE2

Quote from: aboges26 on December 12, 2017, 08:47:49 PM
QuoteIn December 2002, Collin County initiated the Outer Loop Alignment Study to develop various alignments within and along a 3,000-foot-wide corridor. The study identified a locally preferred alignment in order to determine right-of-way needs for the road to be built when the time comes.
Emphasis changed. Read more carefully.
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Bobby5280

Considering how some new toll roads and freeways are being built it would not surprise me if the final ROW for this part of the Collin County Outer Loop was only 300' wide. Hell, the beginning of I-88 in Binghamton, NY is as little as 140' across and that's including the frontage roads.. A 500' wide ROW would certainly be better for any future expansion needs, like going from 2 lanes in each direction to 4 and still maintaining good road and ramp geometry. A 300' ROW is do-able for a super highway with only 2 lanes in each direction flanked by frontage roads, especially if the main lanes of the super highway are butted up against each other, separated only by a concrete Jersey barrier or cable barrier.

austrini

Yeah, sorry, its 500 feet.... I had the 3,000 number stuck in my head because it was right in front of me when I wrote that!


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MaxConcrete

The Dallas Morning News has a report about a large development planned along the Collin County Outer Loop between Preston Road and US 75.

One side of frontage road currently exists from the Dallas North Tollway to Custer Road. This development, generally between Custer and Weston Roads, is east of the existing section. The news report implies that the Collin County Outer Loop is under construction in the development. However, it's not clear if the report is speaking generally about the Outer Loop, or specifically in the development.

QuoteOld Prosper Partners acquired a 2,452-acre property north of McKinney known as The Colmena Ranch. The deal closed Tuesday.

The Collin County Outer Loop roadway, now under construction, will split the tract down the middle. The land was previously owned by BFJ Land LLC, according to county tax records.

Old Prosper Partners' Teague Griffin said he plans for the property to hold millions of square feet of mixed-use space along with thousands of homes and apartments. It's a long-term project, and development will begin in the next two to three years. The property is in the Celina and McKinney school districts.



This pdf has a map with a wider view, but it may be behind a paywall.
Print edition page
www.DFWFreeways.com
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Road Hog

This development is going to set up a fight between McKinney and Weston over city ETJ boundaries, while Celina sits aside and sips tea. But that's another thread. Thanks for exhuming this thread — one of the rare instances where bumping is worthy.

Road Hog

Was driving in the area and saw that the county is dumping fill dirt at the NE corner of the Outer Loop and Coit Road where the main lanes will go. Is that just to get that out of the way, or is the timetable being sped up?

MaxConcrete

#16
There entire path of the Outer Loop between US 75 and the Dallas North Tollway is now visible in Google aerial maps. I think much of this work between FM 2478 and US 75 is very recent because there was nothing in progress immediately east of FM 2478 as of April.

More interestingly, this article includes quotes from a Collin County Commissioner who mentions his interest in "a new east-west highway at the north end of the county". Now is the time to start planning for that route, before residential development reaches north Collin County. However, I think the biggest challenge will be getting financial resources, since Collin County is contributing heavily to the approx. $8 billion US 380 freeway, and also is paying everything on the Outer Loop.

Quote"Planning for continued growth and mobility is going to be what I'll be focused on," Hale said.

While he believes county infrastructure is in a good position, Hale wants to continue to see more roads and highways to address an expanding population. He's interested in studying the potential for a new east-west highway at the north end of the county.

"We're dealing with the problems of growth and expansion, I think, fairly adequately," Hale said. "Our county roads and bridges are the envy of other counties in the state."

Hale pointed to highway infrastructure like Spur 399, U.S. 380 and U.S. 75. He said the county is keeping up on infrastructure with expansions to the jail and other projects, like new facilities for the county's medical examiner and health department.
www.DFWFreeways.com
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Henry

It's nothing short of amazing how the road manages to squeeze through heavy development, especially by a college campus. The real challenge is now ahead, and it's going to be interesting how the freeway/tollway/whatever takes shape.
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05danper42842

Quote from: Road Hog on October 13, 2024, 02:04:06 PMWas driving in the area and saw that the county is dumping fill dirt at the NE corner of the Outer Loop and Coit Road where the main lanes will go. Is that just to get that out of the way, or is the timetable being sped up?
Might be for the widening of Coit Road there are many projects undergoing or starting soon for coit road widening/extension
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Road Hog

Quote from: MaxConcrete on October 22, 2024, 09:28:24 PMThere entire path of the Outer Loop between US 75 and the Dallas North Tollway is now visible in Google aerial maps. I think much of this work between FM 2478 and US 75 is very recent because there was nothing in progress immediately east of FM 2478 as of April.

More interestingly, this article includes quotes from a Collin County Commissioner who mentions his interest in "a new east-west highway at the north end of the county". Now is the time to start planning for that route, before residential development reaches north Collin County. However, I think the biggest challenge will be getting financial resources, since Collin County is contributing heavily to the approx. $8 billion US 380 freeway, and also is paying everything on the Outer Loop.

Quote"Planning for continued growth and mobility is going to be what I'll be focused on," Hale said.

While he believes county infrastructure is in a good position, Hale wants to continue to see more roads and highways to address an expanding population. He's interested in studying the potential for a new east-west highway at the north end of the county.

"We're dealing with the problems of growth and expansion, I think, fairly adequately," Hale said. "Our county roads and bridges are the envy of other counties in the state."

Hale pointed to highway infrastructure like Spur 399, U.S. 380 and U.S. 75. He said the county is keeping up on infrastructure with expansions to the jail and other projects, like new facilities for the county's medical examiner and health department.

Yes, the construction between FM 2478 and US 75 is proceeding nicely. Hopefully it'll be ready by the end of 2025, but that might be pushing it.

The role of the new east-west highway will probably be filled by FM 455. There are plans to reroute it on a six-lane divided major arterial between Dallas Parkway and near Weston. As far as residential development ... it's already here. But fortunately there are at least some thoroughfare plans in place.

BJ59

Do they at least have the ROW for a freeway between the tollway and 75, or only for the single (future) frontage road that they are building?

Chris

They're constructing one frontage road, but it appears to be a wide right-of-way.




Bobby5280

A single frontage road works well enough as a "place holder" for the ROW. They should be taking that approach with a lot more future super highway corridors rather than procrastinating until the land is getting covered up with development.

MaxConcrete

Quote from: BJ59 on October 25, 2024, 10:26:33 AMDo they at least have the ROW for a freeway between the tollway and 75, or only for the single (future) frontage road that they are building?

The minimum right-of-way (ROW) width for the Outer Loop is 500 feet (152m), which is the gold standard for freeway ROW width. All the right-of-way is acquired from SH 121 to the Collin/Denton county line. As mentioned, one side of the frontage roads is being built first.

Based on public meeting info for the Denton County Outer Loop (which connects to the Collin County Outer Loop) and Rockwall County Outer Loop, they are also planned for 500-foot-wide ROW.
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BJ59

Thats good to hear that they are actually acquiring land for a freeway in the far north metro instead of waiting for all the development to overtake everything (even though the suburbs are already starting to overtake these areas)



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