Indiana Notes

[monty]

If this bill moves forward, the result will be a statewide impact on all like Indiana highways.  My opinion is that most four lane highways should qualify for plus 5 mph over their current limits. I doubt rural interstates will increase to over 70 mph though. The safety lobby will have a hard time convincing against such a raise. As mentioned, most “improved” four-lane divided highways are built to a higher standard than their actual posted limits. For example, the newer northern US 31 segments are built to 70 mph design standards but are signed for only 65.

[silverback1065]

all new interstates are designed at 70 mph. either way people will go 70 anyway 

[thenetwork]

U.S. highways

A separate speed limit bill in the House would increase the speed limit on certain U.S. highways in the state.

Sponsored by Rep. Dave Heine, R-Fort Wayne, the bill would increase the speed limit on stretches of U.S. 24, 25, and 30 from 55 mph to 70 mph. As written, the change would apply to cars and large trucks.

Affected stretches of highway:

U.S. 24 between Huntington and Logansport.
U.S. 25 between Lafayette and Logansport.
U.S. 24 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
U.S. 30 from the Ohio border to the Interstate 469 interchange.
Heine's bill, HB1077, is in the House Roads and Transportation Committee.

https://landline.media/indiana-bill-would-eliminate-speed-limit-differential/

While I'm not opposed to increasing the speed on non-limited-access highways to 70 mph, this is definitely bias to Fort Wayne.

All of those highways feed into and out of Fort Wayne. What about other four lane highways in the state that can easily handle a 70 mph speed limit? In addition, reading the bill, it adds a specific provision for these highways to be 70 mph. But freeway portions of routes such as US-31 are still limited at 65 mph.

US-25???  That highway never entered Indiana.  That route was once through Ohio.

[tdindy88]

Indiana State Road 25

[hobsini2]

Just my opinion but these are the stretches in Indiana that I would make a 70 zone. Obviously slower zones in higher volume areas.
US 24 - Ind 25/Ind 29 Logansport to Ind 9 Huntington except at Peru (60), Wabash (60)
US 24 - I-469 Ft Wayne to Ohio Line
US 30 - Ind 49 Valparaiso to I-69 Ft Wayne except at Wanatah (65), Plymouth (65), Warsaw (60), Columbia City (65)
US 30 - I-469 Ft Wayne to Ohio Line
US 31 - Keystone Ave Carmel to US 20 South Bend except at Rochester (65)
US 41 - I-64 north of Evansville to Ind 641 Terre Haute except at Vincennes (60), Oaktown (65), Carlisle (65), Sullivan (65), Shelburn (65), Farmersburg (65)
US 41 - Ind 63 Carbondale to US 52 Earl Park except at Ind 26 (65)
US 41 - Iroquois River north of Kentland to Ind 2 west of Lowell
US 50/150 - US 41 Vincennes to I-69 Washington except at Washington (60)
US 52 - US 41 Earl Park to US 231 Montmorenci except at Fowler (60)
US 231 - Kentucky Line to I-64 Dale except at Dale (60)
Indiana 25 - I-65 Lafayette to US 24/Ind 29 Logansport
Indiana 37 - I-69 Bloomington to Ind 58 Avoca except at Bloomington (60)
Indiana 63 - Sanford Rd Terre Haute to US 41 near Carbondale except at Clinton (60), Cayuga (65) and I-74 to US 136 at Foster (60)

[monty]

Any non-divided highways (like super two's) in Indiana worthy of a speed limit boost? 

[PurdueBill]

Indiana State Road 25

They have "U.S. Highway 25" written in the bill...it will have to be corrected before they can do anything with it.

Driving US 30 in from Ohio to 469, then over Lafayette Center Road to US 24 and SR 25 down to Lafayette, I will vouch for 30, 24, and 25 all needing to be increased.  24 may be the most uphill battle with the signals at Huntington, Wabash, and Peru and the intersection at Logansport at US 35--but they can reduce the limit as needed approaching those.  The speed limit of 60 is frustratingly low on sections like the recently-built SR 25 near Lafayette.
Ohio has the similarly designed dual carriageways like US 30 from Mansfield to the Indiana line at 70 mph now; no reason Indiana can't do at least 65.  Dropping from 70 to 60 crossing into Indiana on 30 on a road of the same quality is crazy. 

[tdindy88]

Hope you don't mind me changing the subject as this speed limit stuff is a good discussion but I just saw something recently that I wanted to address involving Indiana and INDOT.

The Crawfordsville District website has a link to an upcoming rebuild of the Sugar Creek Welcome Center along I-70 eastbound near Terre Haute. It looks like they will have an all new welcome center with extra parking for trucks and stuff. It all looks very good and would be better facility welcoming those along I-70 into the state. But that's not what caught my interest. They also mentioned the state's upcoming welcome center and rest area plan and while I had seen mentions of it before and I know I've talked about it in the past I was able to see what they're actually planning now and I'm not a big fan.

In short, all the Welcome Centers are going to be rebuilt, which is great, I went to the one at Pigeon Creek along I-69 last year and it looked good. What isn't good will be the elimination of nearly all rest areas from the interstates to the general motoring public.

This map shows the general plan.


While the welcome centers will stay most of the rest areas along I-64, I-65, I-70 and I-74 will be converted to truck parking areas ONLY. My impression is that these will not be available for cars at all. Also they will have small restroom facilities at these truck parking areas for truckers. Additional parking for trucks is a very good idea but what about those of us driving cars? I guess they really want us to get off at an exit and use the facilities there and help spur the local economy while we're at it.

So here's a rundown of what's planned on the highways.
I-64 will have the eastbound welcome center and that's it.
I-65 will have one welcome center in each direction and that's it. After Henryville no more rest areas along I-65 in the state. Heading south from Kankakee the next "rest area" will be past Louisville, Kentucky! Also the Wolcott rest area is going bye-bye completely.
I-70's a little better, there will at least be one full-service rest area still in Greenfield.
I-74 will have a welcome center in each direction and that's it.
I-94 has a welcome center at Michigan City but nothing's changed on that route.

I-69 looks to have it a little better. First of all, this is the first I've seen of a planned welcome center around Evansville, probably off one of the exits. If they did this right they could also make it into an Evansville welcome center for southbound I-69 traffic. There's also a planned rest area near the Crane area, probably around the US 231 exit. In addition there's going to be a planned truck parking area around Martinsville. All of this plus the current rest areas north of Muncie and the welcome center/rest area pair north of Fort Wayne. I wonder why I-69 gets a better collection of rest services than I-65's going to get? Obviously the dearth of traveler services south of Indy mean that rest areas and truck parking facilities will actually be needed. I guess the free market economy doesn't work everywhere in this state as services are still pretty sparse south of Bloomington.

I can get the plans for I-70 and I-74, with the shape of the state and the welcome centers and such I'm almost fine with those. But I-65 I don't like. If I needed to use the bathroom heading north from Indianapolis to Chicago I will NOW have to get off at an exit! And heading south toward Louisville it's the same thing. God I hate this state sometimes. The main benefit to INDOT of course is that they don't have to maintain as many buildings as possible. Why can every other state around us maintain basic rest facilities without it ruining them so much but we have, just have to, eliminate as much as possible to save money?

[Rothman]

Rest areas are a known money-suck for DOTs, since the same funding competes for highway and bridge projects.  And, with more and more trucks on the road, it's little surprise that DOTs are picking and choosing which centers to renovate and which ones to demolish and turn into truck parking.

Car drivers aren't under the same regulations as truckers.  Truckers are required to stop every so many hours.  Therefore, cars are seen as more flexible than trucks in that regard.

However, I know in NY, there's been considerable concern to not have truck parking in the same vicinity as private truck stops, not only because the State would be in competition with the truck stop unfairly, but because the State doesn't want to assume the cost of the parking that can be provided privately -- again, it's a money-suck.

[bmeiser]

I can't remember the last time I used a rest area in Indiana. If I need to use the restroom, I'd rather also get gas or something to eat that isn't out of a vending machine. If I just need to pull off to address something in the car, an exit ramp shoulder fills that need. I'd rather that money go elsewhere, personally. I might be in the minority, though.

Pixel 7

[skluth]

It's also relatively easy for car drivers to pull into a restaurant (or Walmart or Target or Costco) and use the facilities. This is what I do normally as many interstate rest stops are often significantly less sanitary than those run by businesses. Not typically a problem when standing, but not so appealing if you need to sit. And this doesn't even get into whether TP is available in rest stop stalls.

[hobsini2]

Other than Welcome Centers to get travel info issued by the state, rest areas should only be along stretches where there is a big gap between exits. Something like more than 15 miles. Otherwise, the general public can easily exit and find a local business. The Oases on the Toll Road makes a ton of sense. Not so much on the freeways.

Also, I am no fan of the current setup for the Lake County Welcome Center for I-80/94 so this is where I would move it and how it is diagramed. This would allow the driver to be directly on the highway instead of exiting off at Kennedy as it currently is.
New Lake County Welcome Center diagram: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1aIOnKoe-O5NBCFY6apGANMw803VtMF8&usp=sharing

[tdindy88]

Other than Welcome Centers to get travel info issued by the state, rest areas should only be along stretches where there is a big gap between exits. Something like more than 15 miles. Otherwise, the general public can easily exit and find a local business. The Oases on the Toll Road makes a ton of sense. Not so much on the freeways.

Also, I am no fan of the current setup for the Lake County Welcome Center for I-80/94 so this is where I would move it and how it is diagramed. This would allow the driver to be directly on the highway instead of exiting off at Kennedy as it currently is.
New Lake County Welcome Center diagram: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1aIOnKoe-O5NBCFY6apGANMw803VtMF8&usp=sharing

Holy crap! That would be an awesome idea for the Borman Expressway.

I guess people are fine with less rest areas? Sorry for ranting on that earlier. I guess I just like not having to get off at an exit for a restroom break. I have no problem stopping a gas station for a drink or somewhere for a bit to eat. My experience with Walmarts and the traffic they generate is that I'd rather avoid those places unless I was buying something specifically there.

When I visit a friend up in Fort Wayne I will generally get a drink at some gas station on my way out of town and then make a pitstop at the rest areas near Muncie for the restroom. After that I can generally head straight for my home without any more stops. I guess I just like doing that sort of thing.

Back on New Years Day my father and I drove down to Evansville and he needed the restroom so we got off at the Countrymark station off the US 231 exit near Crane. Only the gas station was closed. I mean it was Sunday and a holiday, but completely closed? So we had to drive eight miles north to Bloomfield to use the gas station (I had suggested carrying on to Washington but he couldn't wait that long.) But INDOT is planning something along that stretch of roadway so they must know how sparse services are along that stretch.

[hobsini2]

Other than Welcome Centers to get travel info issued by the state, rest areas should only be along stretches where there is a big gap between exits. Something like more than 15 miles. Otherwise, the general public can easily exit and find a local business. The Oases on the Toll Road makes a ton of sense. Not so much on the freeways.

Also, I am no fan of the current setup for the Lake County Welcome Center for I-80/94 so this is where I would move it and how it is diagramed. This would allow the driver to be directly on the highway instead of exiting off at Kennedy as it currently is.
New Lake County Welcome Center diagram: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1aIOnKoe-O5NBCFY6apGANMw803VtMF8&usp=sharing

Holy crap! That would be an awesome idea for the Borman Expressway.

I guess people are fine with less rest areas? Sorry for ranting on that earlier. I guess I just like not having to get off at an exit for a restroom break. I have no problem stopping a gas station for a drink or somewhere for a bit to eat. My experience with Walmarts and the traffic they generate is that I'd rather avoid those places unless I was buying something specifically there.

When I visit a friend up in Fort Wayne I will generally get a drink at some gas station on my way out of town and then make a pitstop at the rest areas near Muncie for the restroom. After that I can generally head straight for my home without any more stops. I guess I just like doing that sort of thing.

Back on New Years Day my father and I drove down to Evansville and he needed the restroom so we got off at the Countrymark station off the US 231 exit near Crane. Only the gas station was closed. I mean it was Sunday and a holiday, but completely closed? So we had to drive eight miles north to Bloomfield to use the gas station (I had suggested carrying on to Washington but he couldn't wait that long.) But INDOT is planning something along that stretch of roadway so they must know how sparse services are along that stretch.

Yeah that stretch of 69 between I-64 and Bloomington does need at least one rest area if not 2 due to the lack of towns.

[Great Lakes Roads]

Honestly, I am okay with what INDOT is planning on doing with the rest areas... And yes, I do agree that there should be more truck parking on the interstates!

[Life in Paradise]

Honestly, I am okay with what INDOT is planning on doing with the rest areas... And yes, I do agree that there should be more truck parking on the interstates!

I'm of the opposite opinion.  If I'm driving along the interstate, I would rather pull into a rest area than get off at an exit.  I look at it as a service that the state can provide, especially in those cases that they already have the land purchased.  It would also be a good place to put some of those charging stations that the states are supposed to be installing and make some money back over time.  I've hated the fact that they closed the I-64 welcome center near Lanesville (west of the Louisville KY metro). 

[FixThe74Sign]

Put me in the camp of pro rest stops. They tore down the rest stop on 74 Eastbound near the Ohio border last year, and I've noticed lots of trucks parking at the SR 101 exit overnight, resulting in shoulder damage and trash everywhere. And that rest stop was only 10 years old or so...

I also like using rest stops if I need a quick bathroom break, as I know it's an easy in and easy out, and I generally don't have to gamble and hope I picked a good gas station.

At least they are going to re-do the Welcome Centers. I know Indiana generally isn't prime road trip country, but I like how the states out West usually have a nice welcome center where you can take a picture of a welcome sign to document your trip.

[skluth]

I understand the desire for a quick break at an interstate rest stop but that means the state needs to keep them sanitary which doesn't always happen. Most of you are also approaching this from a male viewpoint, that is your rest stop needs only require a urinal instead of a clean toilet with toilet paper. Those with families, especially with female members of the family, will know you can't just pull off at any exit and expect them to use any old toilet.

[bmeiser]

I understand the desire for a quick break at an interstate rest stop but that means the state needs to keep them sanitary which doesn't always happen. Most of you are also approaching this from a male viewpoint, that is your rest stop needs only require a urinal instead of a clean toilet with toilet paper. Those with families, especially with female members of the family, will know you can't just pull off at any exit and expect them to use any old toilet.

Exactly right. My wife would only use the restroom at a rest stop if it were a dire emergency. We tend to stop at truck stops as they seem to keep their bathrooms the cleanest, especially Love's.

Now if we had rest stops like Ontario with food courts, small shops, and gas that would be a different story.

Pixel 7

[ITB]

According to the map posted above, there are currently nine Welcome Centers and three Rest Stops. When the I-69 facilities are built, the total will jump to 10 and four, respectively. Just four Rest Stops. Not a large number by any measure, but one has to wonder why can't INDOT devote some temporary parking at the Rest Stops for non-truck vehicles. Perhaps there's a legitimate explanation, but it escapes me.

[thenetwork]

A lot of the interstate Rest Areas have been improving to add "alternative" rooms when the main Men's or Women's room is closed for cleaning, which I see as a big plus compared to getting off an exit and finding a public restroom, only to find a sign on the door saying, Temporarily Closed For Cleaning" or "Out of order".

Very rarely have I seen an open state-owned rest area that doesn't have an alternative for a closed Men's or Women's restroom.  It may be a single-seater Unisex or Family bathroom, but it is still an alternative.

[ITB]

On another topic, INDOT will be hosting meetings (one in-person, one virtual) later this month on the expansion of I-70 and associated interchange and bridge improvements in Wayne County. The in-person meeting will take place January 23, 2023, on the IU East campus in Richmond. The announcement can be accessed here.

Of note, the announcement states construction is anticipated to commence in the Fall of 2024, with a completion date dependent on "project development, construction phasing and future funding."

[silverback1065]

the SR 37 Project in Fishers has gotten better. they restriped the lanes going southbound to line up correctly and warned you of the right lane being exit only. they have turn 141st into a 1st for me at seeing at least, a signalized RIRO. fishers says that the 141st interchange is still on schedule to be built later this year or early next. this appears to be an ok bandaid in the interim

[silverback1065]

indot has closed the 56th st ramp to 465 nb for a year to alleviate weaving issues and to give construction workers room to work on clear path.

[PurdueBill]

Put me in the camp of pro rest stops. They tore down the rest stop on 74 Eastbound near the Ohio border last year, and I've noticed lots of trucks parking at the SR 101 exit overnight, resulting in shoulder damage and trash everywhere. And that rest stop was only 10 years old or so...

I also like using rest stops if I need a quick bathroom break, as I know it's an easy in and easy out, and I generally don't have to gamble and hope I picked a good gas station.

At least they are going to re-do the Welcome Centers. I know Indiana generally isn't prime road trip country, but I like how the states out West usually have a nice welcome center where you can take a picture of a welcome sign to document your trip.

Rest Areas are important as private businesses come and go, change their hours, etc. and while the services off a highway may have restrooms, it isn't really their job to provide them to every traveler including those who buy nothing but have to "go". 
Driving semi-frequently from NE Ohio to Lafayette, IN via I-71, US 30, I-469, US 24, and IN 25, it is amazing the difference between Ohio and Indiana in rest areas.  On US 30 in Ohio alone, you have 4 rest areas between Mansfield and the Indiana line.  Plus another on I-71.  It has really made a difference when many times, due to necessity, I am making the trip late at night and some businesses are closed mostly overnight that used to be open then.  I used to use the Owens store (now Kroger) in Huntington as a de facto rest area (to use the restroom, walk/stretch a minute before the final 90 minutes of the westbound trip) but they are no longer open 24 hours.  There are fast food and gas places that aren't open overnight either--the new Casey's stations in Huntington and Peru close by 12am if not earlier.  I suppose you could pull in to the Hampton Inn in Wabash and beg to use the restroom or something.  At least Ohio has a number of rest areas and they are well-maintained.  The first sign entering Ohio on US 30 EB from Indiana is "Rest Area 9 miles" so they must be aware that people coming in from Indiana may need it!