Still love your landline? Phone service providers are getting closer to phasing

[ZLoth]

From CNN:

Still love your landline? Phone service providers are getting closer to phasing it out

More people who are still using telephone landlines will soon need to decide if they want to finally hang up on their service.

Just last week, AT&T applied for a waiver that would allow it to stop servicing traditional landlines in California. AT&T and Verizon previously stated they want to be fully operational on newer infrastructure within the next few years.

That's part of a sweeping move by phone service providers to replace older copper wire-based telephone systems lines, also known as Plain Old Telephone Service (POTS), with faster and more advanced technology that doesn't work with landlines.

FULL ARTICLE HERE

[brad2971]

From CNN:

Still love your landline? Phone service providers are getting closer to phasing it out

More people who are still using telephone landlines will soon need to decide if they want to finally hang up on their service.

Just last week, AT&T applied for a waiver that would allow it to stop servicing traditional landlines in California. AT&T and Verizon previously stated they want to be fully operational on newer infrastructure within the next few years.

That's part of a sweeping move by phone service providers to replace older copper wire-based telephone systems lines, also known as Plain Old Telephone Service (POTS), with faster and more advanced technology that doesn't work with landlines.

FULL ARTICLE HERE

The CA PUC, before it even considers ATT's request, needs to subpoena ATT for information on how many of their CA landline customers have either just POTS, or POTS combined with slow DSL. If it's at least 500K, the CA PUC needs to mandate a service conversion plan.

[epzik8]

In one way, I still have sentimental feelings for landlines attached to cords, but practically speaking, I'm happy to leave them behind.

[Rothman]

I kind of like the idea of seeing old telephone wires and poles come down.  But, like the article points out, copper's pretty essential in rural areas outside the reach of fiber optic and cell coverage.

[MikieTimT]

When fiber is ubiquitous everywhere that copper traditionally reached, then I'd say it's time.  There are still some holdouts in some areas, but generally it's the areas that are underserved by cell and fiber providers.  We're nearing the point in which we could mandate that in order for them to shut off service, but they need to pay into a fund that enables the remainder of those not feasibly served by fiber and cell service to get something like Starlink with a cell base station connected to their Internet service.  This should only be for pre-existing copper customers, not those choosing to live offgrid somewhere remote.  They can connect on their own dime with Starlink or something comparable.

[ZLoth]

I want mobile-only with my phone service back in December, 2003, and when we moved five years ago, my mother imovied to mobile only. Part of the reason why the telcos want to move away from copper lines is because of the costs associated with such a aging infrastruction and the regulations/tariffs associated with traditional phone lines verses providing phone service via a VoIP adapter.

[Brandon]

I kind of like the idea of seeing old telephone wires and poles come down.  But, like the article points out, copper's pretty essential in rural areas outside the reach of fiber optic and cell coverage.

Those poles carry more than just phone lines.  They probably won't be going anywhere as they tend to carry electric lines and fiber optic lines.

[SectorZ]

Anyone I know (self included) that has a landline it is fiber, which technically isn't a landline but for functional purposes it is the same.

[Mr_Northside]

I kind of like the idea of seeing old telephone wires and poles come down

As was just noted, the poles themselves probably carry more than just the old copper (POTS) lines.   In many places where fiber has been installed, it seems that if the old copper was above-ground, then the fiber is probably also strung above ground as well - needing the poles, even if they are not shared with any other utility.  It is possible they could remove unused/de-activated copper trunks from poles, but if no one (PUC, gov't entities) forces them to, I doubt they'd spend the money on the labor to do that.
Actually, with the FiOS that Verizon has strung in the Pittsburgh metro region, they lashed a lot of it to an existing copper run (though some got new aerial conduit), so even if the copper can be turned off at some point, I doubt they'll restring the fiber to it's own messenger wire.
Of course, some companies in Western PA have done Fiber-To-The-Home stringing fiber to brand new messenger wire, so while they'll obviously still need the poles, at some point they could rip all the copper down.

[ZLoth]

While copper is a recyclable item that does bring in some money, the labor costs don't make it worthwhile.

[kkt]

Anyone I know (self included) that has a landline it is fiber, which technically isn't a landline but for functional purposes it is the same.

Power blackouts.  If you have a plain old telephone it will get enough power to operate from the battery power at the exchange.  But your fiber to voice adapter needs grid power, and your cell phone needs a tower that has power to connect to.

[ZLoth]

But your fiber to voice adapter needs grid power, and your cell phone needs a tower that has power to connect to.

The cell tower is often equipped with battery backups, and a UPS for that VoIP adapter and associated Internet gateway isn't that much.

[Rothman]

You say there's my retirement copper just hanging out on poles, now?

[SectorZ]

But your fiber to voice adapter needs grid power, and your cell phone needs a tower that has power to connect to.

The cell tower is often equipped with battery backups, and a UPS for that VoIP adapter and associated Internet gateway isn't that much.

I have 12 hrs backup battery for my Fios landline. Any power outage I've had hasn't resulted in my cell service going out. I do miss the convenience of copper phone lines not going out with the power, but the last time I had a lengthy power outage (Fitchburg MA Dec. 2008 with the ice storm) my copper landline was out longer than my electricity.

[tmoore952]

We have no telephone poles in our immediate area. All of that was buried when they built my neighborhood in the mid '90s. That didn't mean we didn't get power failures from time to time when trees (or a small airplane, about 14 months ago) fell on the above-ground lines that feed us.

Our local power company did a good job over the years of paring back the older trees, and we get power failures far less often than 10-20 years ago.

Yes we still have a landline. No I don't love it, but it comes in handy when I don't want to give people my cell phone number (people who would legitimately need to get ahold of me).

[Pink Jazz]

While copper is a recyclable item that does bring in some money, the labor costs don't make it worthwhile.

Why not use that copper in jewelry and use it to make some rose gold? Rose gold is an alloy of gold and copper.

[MikeTheActuary]

Power blackouts.  If you have a plain old telephone it will get enough power to operate from the battery power at the exchange.  But your fiber to voice adapter needs grid power, and your cell phone needs a tower that has power to connect to.

A POTS telephone will get powered from the exchange only if it's landline all the way back to the exchange.

I was under the impression that increasingly, the landline providers are using fiber, and then converting to traditional copper for the last stretch to the customer.   The power is coming from the point where the transition from fiber to copper is made.

I assume that there are backup batteries at those transition points, but....

FWIW, I made the switch from landline to VOIP several years ago.  Cell reception at my house is lousy, and I was WFH before pandemic lockdowns shifted business calls to Teams and Zoom, so when I discovered that VOIP was so much cheaper than landline....

[mgk920]

While copper is a recyclable item that does bring in some money, the labor costs don't make it worthwhile.

Why not use that copper in jewelry and use it to make some rose gold? Rose gold is an alloy of gold and copper.

Also use the copper a part of the alloys that are needed to make new $2 and $5 coins, as well as enough $1 coins, to replace the same denominations of banknotes that are now in circulation, whenever the current inflation is brought under control.

Mike

[ZLoth]

From Ars Technica:

"Don't let them drop us!" Landline users protest AT&T copper retirement plan
California hears protests as AT&T seeks end to Carrier of Last Resort obligation.

AT&T's application to end its landline phone obligations in California is drawing protest from residents as state officials consider whether to let AT&T off the hook.

AT&T filed an application to end its Carrier of Last Resort (COLR) obligation in March 2023. The first of several public hearings on the application is being held today by the California Public Utilities Commission (CPUC), which is considering AT&T's request. An evidentiary hearing has been scheduled for April, and a proposed decision is expected in September.

AT&T has said it won't cut off phone service immediately, but ending the COLR obligation would make it easier for AT&T to drop its phone lines later on. AT&T's application said it would provide basic phone service in all areas for at least six months and indefinitely in areas without any alternative voice service.

FULL ARTICLE HERE

[1995hoo]

There are definitely places, even in highly populated areas, where it's not feasible to use a mobile phone as your primary phone because of signal issues. My mother, for example, lives here in Fairfax County a short distance west of the Beltway (that is, not in the more rural-feeling areas further out), but cellular service (voice or data) is almost nonexistent at her house. You can't get a cellular signal indoors for some reason—if you want to make a phone call on a mobile phone, you need to go outside and you might then get one bar. No idea whether it's because she lives at the bottom of a hill or what. But if someone in a heavily populated area like Fairfax County has an issue like that, surely it's considerably more of an issue in other places.

My mother does have Verizon fiber-optic service for her home phone, Internet, and TV, though, so it's not like she's one of the copper-line users. I cite her situation just to emphasize that there are very good practical reasons, unrelated to simple personal preference, why going "mobile-only" is not always viable.

[GaryV]

While copper is a recyclable item that does bring in some money, the labor costs don't make it worthwhile.

I don't know, thieves in Detroit somehow made money off of stealing copper from street light poles. While the power was live.

[02 Park Ave]

Loss of a landline means loss of FAX capability.

[kalvado]

While copper is a recyclable item that does bring in some money, the labor costs don't make it worthwhile.

I don't know, thieves in Detroit somehow made money off of stealing copper from street light poles. While the power was live.

Because they effectively got less than minimum wage, without benefits, insurance, or proper safety precautions.

[ZLoth]

There are definitely places, even in highly populated areas, where it's not feasible to use a mobile phone as your primary phone because of signal issues. My mother, for example, lives here in Fairfax County a short distance west of the Beltway (that is, not in the more rural-feeling areas further out), but cellular service (voice or data) is almost nonexistent at her house. You can't get a cellular signal indoors for some reason—if you want to make a phone call on a mobile phone, you need to go outside and you might then get one bar. No idea whether it's because she lives at the bottom of a hill or what. But if someone in a heavily populated area like Fairfax County has an issue like that, surely it's considerably more of an issue in other places.

One option here is to go into the settings of the mobile phone and activate the "WiFi Calling" option. In addition, she may want to call her carrier and ask if they can supply her with a device that acts as a mobile access point for mobile devices.

[nexus73]

POTS is way more reliable than cellphone service where I live.  That is why I keep it.