OceanGate Titan submersible vehicle and crew presumed lost near Titanic wreckage

[Billy F 1988]

I don't know about you, but, I smell lawsuits coming fast and furious. Was it really worth the risk of life and vehicle to trod the depth of the Titanic wreckage? This dive was extremely life threatening and extremely dangerous from the very start of the dive. Now, the reports (though many unconfirmed), indicate a possible implosion near the bow of the Titanic, some 1,600 feet nearby after the vessel lost contact with the mothership that deployed the vehicle. It is very sad for the five families of the presumed deceased to hear this tragic discovery, but, at the same time, $250,000 for a deep dive to view Titanic is absolutely the worst kind of business. There are 3D and 4D renderings of the famed ship at various museums that you can go view. You can't go 2 miles below the Atlantic Ocean's surface and expect to come back up alive and well when passing 5,000 feet below the surface. The wreckage is about 12,500 feet, which is well beyond the point of no return. The design of the submersible is suspect. The construction of the vessel's onboard systems is suspect. The very business, OceanGate, is suspect. As far as I'm concerned, OceanGate should not be in operation near any body of water, I don't care if it's the Mississippi River or the Dead Sea or Flathead Lake to be quite honest. It is, indeed, sad the five crew members are presumed lost, but, the spirit of Titanic doesn't fool around.

[Max Rockatansky]

Wasn't one of the people who died the CEO?  My knowledge of these events came mostly from social media memes about the Logitech control submarine. 

[Billy F 1988]

Sadly, the CEO is among the five who are presumed lost.

[kurumi]

Their tour page is still up: https://oceangateexpeditions.com/tour/titanic-expedition/. Scroll down to the FAQ.

The main page also promotes the tour, with a small disclaimer "Limited Space Available". That doesn't read well right now.

They might as well convert it into a memorial website, to honor the lives that were lost.

[Scott5114]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[Rothman]

I don't see how rich people wanting to pay to see the Titanic affects me. 

You could also say roadgeek clinching of road mileage and counties and whatever else is also a dangerous activity, supported by our paying of support services --- gas, lodging, eating, car maintenance, etc., etc.

[Billy F 1988]

I don't see how rich people wanting to pay to see the Titanic affects me. 

Okay, if you were an employee of OceanGate, if you were a family member of one of the five OceanGate employees, CEO included, you're at home base. They're 900 miles from the nearest seaport. They're trodding two miles of deep ocean. Almost two hours into their dive, all contact is lost. And you now are wondering, "Where could my friends and loved ones be?" Days pass by. The vessel loses oxygen with every passing minute. The water temperature is very cold. Then, you get the terrible news from the rest of OceanGate's board of directors that all crew members are presumed lost. Would that affect you?

[hotdogPi]

The company name says it all.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_-gate_scandals_and_controversies

[WillWeaverRVA]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

[Max Rockatansky]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

I find the presumption that the four billionaire adults were default assholes by larger society to be odd.  Perhaps they are, but I've never heard of any of the four before this whole affair.  Does anyone have an actual synopsis on the four adults involved to make a determination on their character?

[kalvado]

Coming up next: submarine Tit visits Titan and Titanic on the bottom of Atlantic.

[LilianaUwU]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

I find the presumption that the four billionaire adults were default assholes by larger society to be odd.  Perhaps they are, but I've never heard of any of the four before this whole affair.  Does anyone have an actual synopsis on the four adults involved to make a determination on their character?

The CEO, who was one of the four billionaires on the sub, said safety wasn't important back in 2018 when an inspector raised concerns.

Sadly, the CEO is among the five who are presumed lost.

Boohoo, a billionaire CEO who laughed at the safety of his submarine died in his submarine. So sad.

[Big John]

The company name says it all.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_-gate_scandals_and_controversies

First thing I thought of was the cult Heaven's Gate and it was not listed.

[Max Rockatansky]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

I find the presumption that the four billionaire adults were default assholes by larger society to be odd.  Perhaps they are, but I've never heard of any of the four before this whole affair.  Does anyone have an actual synopsis on the four adults involved to make a determination on their character?

The CEO, who was one of the four billionaires on the sub, said safety wasn't important back in 2018 when an inspector raised concerns.

Sadly, the CEO is among the five who are presumed lost.

Boohoo, a billionaire CEO who laughed at the safety of his submarine died in his submarine. So sad.

Okay, so confirmation one of the four adults was an asshole.

An argument can be made for another adult given it was certainly a dick move to drag his 19 year old son into this.  All the same, do we know what "bag of goods"  regarding safety was sold on this expedition?  Granted, the Logitech controller probably would have a been a good indicator about the questionable nature of the OceanGate operation.

[WillWeaverRVA]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

I find the presumption that the four billionaire adults were default assholes by larger society to be odd.  Perhaps they are, but I've never heard of any of the four before this whole affair.  Does anyone have an actual synopsis on the four adults involved to make a determination on their character?

Three billionaires. The other, nonbillionaire passenger was a French Navy veteran and a veteran undersea explorer.

[LilianaUwU]

Coming up next: submarine Tit visits Titan and Titanic on the bottom of Atlantic.

After Dicks Out for Harambe, how about Tits Out for Titan?

[Max Rockatansky]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

I find the presumption that the four billionaire adults were default assholes by larger society to be odd.  Perhaps they are, but I've never heard of any of the four before this whole affair.  Does anyone have an actual synopsis on the four adults involved to make a determination on their character?

Three billionaires. The other, nonbillionaire passenger was a French Navy veteran and a veteran undersea explorer.

Okay, were down to three people who the masses don't like by default.  Does anyone care to break down the lives of the two billionaires who weren't the OceanGate CEO?

[Scott5114]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

It sucks that he didn't learn at a younger age that doing what your dad says isn't always a great idea. (But then if I had fully internalized this lesson at age 19, it would have saved me a lot of grief, so who am I to talk?)

Okay, were down to three people who the masses don't like by default.  Does anyone care to break down the lives of the two billionaires who weren't the OceanGate CEO?

They were rich enough they could have paid someone to do due diligence and didn't.

[Rothman]

I don't see how rich people wanting to pay to see the Titanic affects me. 

Okay, if you were an employee of OceanGate, if you were a family member of one of the five OceanGate employees, CEO included, you're at home base. They're 900 miles from the nearest seaport. They're trodding two miles of deep ocean. Almost two hours into their dive, all contact is lost. And you now are wondering, "Where could my friends and loved ones be?" Days pass by. The vessel loses oxygen with every passing minute. The water temperature is very cold. Then, you get the terrible news from the rest of OceanGate's board of directors that all crew members are presumed lost. Would that affect you?

Well, of course.  But I don't have a personal connection with anyone involved, so it doesn't affect me.

Not sure what your point is.

[thspfc]

I don't believe in fate, but visiting the Titanic wreckage via a submarine called Titan crosses the line even for me.

[Max Rockatansky]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

It sucks that he didn't learn at a younger age that doing what your dad says isn't always a great idea. (But then if I had fully internalized this lesson at age 19, it would have saved me a lot of grief, so who am I to talk?)

Okay, were down to three people who the masses don't like by default.  Does anyone care to break down the lives of the two billionaires who weren't the OceanGate CEO?

They were rich enough they could have paid someone to do due diligence and didn't.

I mean hey, I enjoy the memes online and find this an incredibly stupid way to die given the cartoonish levels of poor safety standards involved.  All the same, people die stupid ways every day without near universal vilification.  The driving source of that vilification solely seems to be the earnings of three of the individuals onboard the sub.  All I ask is if the income alone enough to merit how so many people are reacting to this? 

The only one I'm fully sure at present moment is deserving of vilification is Stockton Rush.  Maybe the "fuck billionaires" crowd can actually try to find a case argument for how they feel?  I just find this pretty fascinating contrast in the levels of sympathy displayed online, it tends to be one extreme or the other. 

[Hobart]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

I find the presumption that the four billionaire adults were default assholes by larger society to be odd.  Perhaps they are, but I've never heard of any of the four before this whole affair.  Does anyone have an actual synopsis on the four adults involved to make a determination on their character?

The CEO, who was one of the four billionaires on the sub, said safety wasn't important back in 2018 when an inspector raised concerns.

Sadly, the CEO is among the five who are presumed lost.

Boohoo, a billionaire CEO who laughed at the safety of his submarine died in his submarine. So sad.

Okay, so confirmation one of the four adults was an asshole.

An argument can be made for another adult given it was certainly a dick move to drag his 19 year old son into this.  All the same, do we know what "bag of goods"  regarding safety was sold on this expedition?  Granted, the Logitech controller probably would have a been a good indicator about the questionable nature of the OceanGate operation.

In regards to the "bag of safety," I heard that the waiver took eight paragraphs to describe the many horrible ways you could die or become disabled on the submarine. The submarine also wasn't actually regulated by any governing body whatsoever, if you value that.

The CEO is also on record in 2018 saying that safety regulations are the reason the commercial submarine business hasn't evolved in 30 years. He also fired and sued a pilot after they said it wasn't tested thoroughly enough, and blew the whistle on the whole thing.

I also heard that the glass they got was about a third as thick as it should be for a depth that deep... and literally being bolted into the thing honestly doesn't sound like that good of a design choice to begin with.

It's a horrible tragedy, only made worse because there were so many bad omens leading up to the actual incident. This screams case study to me.

[Scott5114]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

It sucks that he didn't learn at a younger age that doing what your dad says isn't always a great idea. (But then if I had fully internalized this lesson at age 19, it would have saved me a lot of grief, so who am I to talk?)

Okay, were down to three people who the masses don't like by default.  Does anyone care to break down the lives of the two billionaires who weren't the OceanGate CEO?

They were rich enough they could have paid someone to do due diligence and didn't.

I mean hey, I enjoy the memes online and find this an incredibly stupid way to die given the cartoonish levels of poor safety standards involved.  All the same, people die stupid ways every day without near universal vilification.  The driving source of that vilification solely seems to be the earnings of three of the individuals onboard the sub.  All I ask is if the income alone enough to merit how so many people are reacting to this? 

A ticket to get on this hunk of junk cost $250,000. That's enough money to buy a pretty nice house where I live, and of course more than enough money to pay off what I owe on my house. That's enough money to change the life of just about anyone reading this for the better, to say nothing of how far it could have gone if it were applied to something like a charity, or say, raffled off to give 25 people $10,000. But instead of spending it on something beneficial for anyone but themselves, they chose to squander it on something any smart person would have realized was likely to kill them. (This wasn't even the first safety incident with this particular tin can.) Oh, and when they went missing a bunch of tax money got blown on having the Coast Guard search for them for three days.

That's before you get into the weeds about whether it's even possible to become a billionaire through ethical means. This will vary based on your moral standards, but there's no way that I would be able to both follow my own ethical code and become a billionaire, because I'd be spending too much money taking care of the people that were making me the money.

[Takumi]

https://youtu.be/UkJehlr1tEw

[Max Rockatansky]

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

One of the people on board was the 19-year-old son of another passenger, who not only did not want to go, but he was terrified and talked about being scared, but ultimately he went because it was important to his father (and it was Father's Day).

It sucks that he didn't learn at a younger age that doing what your dad says isn't always a great idea. (But then if I had fully internalized this lesson at age 19, it would have saved me a lot of grief, so who am I to talk?)

Okay, were down to three people who the masses don't like by default.  Does anyone care to break down the lives of the two billionaires who weren't the OceanGate CEO?

They were rich enough they could have paid someone to do due diligence and didn't.

I mean hey, I enjoy the memes online and find this an incredibly stupid way to die given the cartoonish levels of poor safety standards involved.  All the same, people die stupid ways every day without near universal vilification.  The driving source of that vilification solely seems to be the earnings of three of the individuals onboard the sub.  All I ask is if the income alone enough to merit how so many people are reacting to this? 

A ticket to get on this hunk of junk cost $250,000. That's enough money to buy a pretty nice house where I live, and of course more than enough money to pay off what I owe on my house. That's enough money to change the life of just about anyone reading this for the better, to say nothing of how far it could have gone if it were applied to something like a charity, or say, raffled off to give 25 people $10,000. But instead of spending it on something beneficial for anyone but themselves, they chose to squander it on something any smart person would have realized was likely to kill them. (This wasn't even the first safety incident with this particular tin can.) Oh, and when they went missing a bunch of tax money got blown on having the Coast Guard search for them for three days.

That's before you get into the weeds about whether it's even possible to become a billionaire through ethical means. This will vary based on your moral standards, but there's no way that I would be able to both follow my own ethical code and become a billionaire, because I'd be spending too much money taking care of the people that were making me the money.

So why not get into the weeds?  If some of you are so confident that all three billionaires were as bad you say, it ought to be easy to build a case?  That's all I'm asking for, someone to actually build a case on things these people did.  Resorting not liking someone because of their wallet alone is weak. 

FWIW, I don't see a viable case being built as something difficult to do.  I've just not seen anyone actually attempt to do it aside from Stockton Rush.