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Author Topic: New Hampshire  (Read 91615 times)

yakra

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #275 on: September 17, 2021, 10:31:53 AM »

Well, y'know, ya go to Massachusetts, yah gonna haveta pay SALES TAX!
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kramie13

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #276 on: October 18, 2021, 02:35:59 PM »

I was in New Hampshire a couple of weeks ago and drove up I-93.  I noticed some oddities with the exit numbering:

-Both interchanges for I-293 and I-89 don't have exit numbers.  Why?
-There was an "exit 9N" and an "exit 9S" in the Manchester area.  Why are they signed N-S instead of A-B?
-Why is there no exit 21?  For a state that doesn't want to convert to mile-based exit numbering, this perplexes me.
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froggie

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #277 on: October 18, 2021, 03:06:05 PM »

Quote
-Why is there no exit 21?  For a state that doesn't want to convert to mile-based exit numbering, this perplexes me.

"Exit 21" was intended for a proposed but never-built freeway connection between Franklin and Laconia which would have been (depending on the plan and the year) a mile or two north of Exit 20.
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Alps

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #278 on: October 18, 2021, 06:17:42 PM »

I was in New Hampshire a couple of weeks ago and drove up I-93.  I noticed some oddities with the exit numbering:

-Both interchanges for I-293 and I-89 don't have exit numbers.  Why?
-There was an "exit 9N" and an "exit 9S" in the Manchester area.  Why are they signed N-S instead of A-B?
Both of these are artifacts of how states originally designated exits. In many states, Interstate-Interstate junctions were unnumbered and N/S E/W were used.

shadyjay

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #279 on: October 18, 2021, 06:26:39 PM »

I was in New Hampshire a couple of weeks ago and drove up I-93.  I noticed some oddities with the exit numbering:

-Both interchanges for I-293 and I-89 don't have exit numbers.  Why?
-There was an "exit 9N" and an "exit 9S" in the Manchester area.  Why are they signed N-S instead of A-B?
Both of these are artifacts of how states originally designated exits. In many states, Interstate-Interstate junctions were unnumbered and N/S E/W were used.

An even earlier iteration of numbering exits in a cloverleaf interchange was to give them two separate numbers.  The Merritt Parkway in CT had a few cases of this, with one case remaining, for Rt 34 in Orange (what would have been either E/W or A/B is given two separate numbers). 

Back to I-93...
the Everett Tpke predates I-93 in this area, so there originally was no interchange where I-89 comes in. 
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PurdueBill

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #280 on: October 27, 2021, 10:47:56 AM »

I was in New Hampshire a couple of weeks ago and drove up I-93.  I noticed some oddities with the exit numbering:

-Both interchanges for I-293 and I-89 don't have exit numbers.  Why?
-There was an "exit 9N" and an "exit 9S" in the Manchester area.  Why are they signed N-S instead of A-B?
Both of these are artifacts of how states originally designated exits. In many states, Interstate-Interstate junctions were unnumbered and N/S E/W were used.

An even earlier iteration of numbering exits in a cloverleaf interchange was to give them two separate numbers.  The Merritt Parkway in CT had a few cases of this, with one case remaining, for Rt 34 in Orange (what would have been either E/W or A/B is given two separate numbers). 

Back to I-93...
the Everett Tpke predates I-93 in this area, so there originally was no interchange where I-89 comes in. 

Exits 15E-15W are also still kicking in Concord, and the Everett Turnpike has a couple including my very favorite, 5E-5W-5A.  They even mix and match directional suffixes with "regular" letters!

PA was another notable example of I-I junctions not getting exit numbers until they renumbered everything in 2000.  Vermont was another example although not consistently (no number on 89 for 91, but used to be 10S-10N on 91 for 89 (half-assed, not on every sign), now 10A-B, to be changed eventually to mileage numbers.
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SectorZ

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #281 on: October 27, 2021, 04:09:20 PM »

I was in New Hampshire a couple of weeks ago and drove up I-93.  I noticed some oddities with the exit numbering:

-Both interchanges for I-293 and I-89 don't have exit numbers.  Why?
-There was an "exit 9N" and an "exit 9S" in the Manchester area.  Why are they signed N-S instead of A-B?
Both of these are artifacts of how states originally designated exits. In many states, Interstate-Interstate junctions were unnumbered and N/S E/W were used.

An even earlier iteration of numbering exits in a cloverleaf interchange was to give them two separate numbers.  The Merritt Parkway in CT had a few cases of this, with one case remaining, for Rt 34 in Orange (what would have been either E/W or A/B is given two separate numbers). 

Back to I-93...
the Everett Tpke predates I-93 in this area, so there originally was no interchange where I-89 comes in. 

Exits 15E-15W are also still kicking in Concord, and the Everett Turnpike has a couple including my very favorite, 5E-5W-5A.  They even mix and match directional suffixes with "regular" letters!

If you're old enough to remember, 5A is much newer exit that was added within the last 25 years or so.

Who remembers Massachusetts using the N/S, E/W exit suffixes into the 80's?
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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #282 on: October 27, 2021, 04:23:48 PM »

I remember the E/W suffixes on the standalone section of 128. They were there long past the 1980s.
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roadman

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #283 on: October 27, 2021, 05:13:49 PM »

I remember the E/W suffixes on the standalone section of 128. They were there long past the 1980s.

US 3 Burlington to Tyngsborough exit numbers had the N S E W suffixes until the signs were updated in the late 1990s.
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DrSmith

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #284 on: October 28, 2021, 03:46:45 PM »

This is probably a minority opinion, although I prefer the directional suffix. It's a secondary connection between direction of travel and distinguishing exit number. I know it doesn't always work.

Still some around in Connecticut too. Exits 48 E&W and 22 N&S on I-91 as well as Exit 68 N-E and W off the Wilbur Cross Pkwy
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Rothman

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #285 on: October 28, 2021, 04:31:49 PM »

This is probably a minority opinion, although I prefer the directional suffix. It's a secondary connection between direction of travel and distinguishing exit number. I know it doesn't always work.

Still some around in Connecticut too. Exits 48 E&W and 22 N&S on I-91 as well as Exit 68 N-E and W off the Wilbur Cross Pkwy

If it's a minority opinion, the minority's got another member right here.
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ran4sh

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #286 on: October 28, 2021, 04:39:56 PM »

I prefer A-B because with the directional exit numbers you don't necessarily know if your direction is the first or second exit, but with A-B you know that A is first in the increasing direction and last in the decreasing direction.
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vdeane

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #287 on: October 28, 2021, 09:21:29 PM »

I prefer A-B because with the directional exit numbers you don't necessarily know if your direction is the first or second exit, but with A-B you know that A is first in the increasing direction and last in the decreasing direction.
In theory, but that's not always the case (the history: NYSDOT Region 4 tends to flip the A/B order when only the decreasing direction has a split exit; in this case, they later split the increasing direction too, and matched the existing numbers).
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DJ Particle

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #288 on: October 28, 2021, 11:35:33 PM »

Who remembers Massachusetts using the N/S, E/W exit suffixes into the 80's?

I still remember the "Exit 13S" sign on the Orleans Rotary.  Which was weird because the exit was for the *North* MA-28/*West* MA-6A multiplex.  :-D
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froggie

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #289 on: October 29, 2021, 10:27:33 AM »

NHDOT has released their 2023-2032 Ten Year Plan.  Some projects of interest:

  • Conversion of the Everett and Spaulding Turnpikes to AET starting in 2023
  • Construction of a new Exit 4A interchange on I-93, about a mile north of Exit 4, in 2022-23
  • Construction of a new VT/NH 119 bridge over the Connecticut River, about a half mile south of the existing bridge.  I believe construction has already begun.
  • Reconstruction of the I-293 interchanges at Exits 6 and 7, but not expected to begin until 2027.
  • Widening of the Everett Turnpike between Nashua and I-293 to 6 lanes, beginning in 2023.
  • Widening of I-93 through Concord to 6 lanes, anticipated to begin in 2026.
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PurdueBill

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #290 on: October 29, 2021, 08:51:14 PM »

I was in New Hampshire a couple of weeks ago and drove up I-93.  I noticed some oddities with the exit numbering:

-Both interchanges for I-293 and I-89 don't have exit numbers.  Why?
-There was an "exit 9N" and an "exit 9S" in the Manchester area.  Why are they signed N-S instead of A-B?
Both of these are artifacts of how states originally designated exits. In many states, Interstate-Interstate junctions were unnumbered and N/S E/W were used.

An even earlier iteration of numbering exits in a cloverleaf interchange was to give them two separate numbers.  The Merritt Parkway in CT had a few cases of this, with one case remaining, for Rt 34 in Orange (what would have been either E/W or A/B is given two separate numbers). 

Back to I-93...
the Everett Tpke predates I-93 in this area, so there originally was no interchange where I-89 comes in. 

Exits 15E-15W are also still kicking in Concord, and the Everett Turnpike has a couple including my very favorite, 5E-5W-5A.  They even mix and match directional suffixes with "regular" letters!

If you're old enough to remember, 5A is much newer exit that was added within the last 25 years or so.

Who remembers Massachusetts using the N/S, E/W exit suffixes into the 80's?

Indeed, 5A being added later suggested that 5E/W was the "real" exit 5, like in NJ on the GSP where they would have something like 100-100A-100B instead of A-B-C or 82-82A instead of A-B because you are supposed to be heading to the shore (the "real" unsuffixed one heads there).  :P

It was sad when the ones on MA 128 at 62 and 35 (exits 22W-E and 23N-S formerly) finally went.  20S-N bit the dust so long ago in favor of A-B that it was surprising how long the couple lasted.

If they widen 93 through Concord, mentioned in the 10-year plan, does that put the 15E-W numbering at risk? 
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roadman

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #291 on: October 29, 2021, 10:01:16 PM »

It was sad when the ones on MA 128 at 62 and 35 (exits 22W-E and 23N-S formerly) finally went.

That numbering went away when both interchanges were converted from cloverleafs to diamonds.  The project was in the planning stages for a long time (largely due to local issues) before it was built, which is why the numbers weren't changed to A-B when 20A-B was.
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froggie

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #292 on: October 30, 2021, 09:23:12 AM »

If they widen 93 through Concord, mentioned in the 10-year plan, does that put the 15E-W numbering at risk? 

Yes, and not just because of the MUTCD.  One of the options being considered is reconfiguring Exit 15 as a trumpet, with additional nearby roads/ramps replacing what is now 15W.
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yakra

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #294 on: October 30, 2021, 11:10:46 PM »

^ Talking about the options depicted here? http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Archives/Alternative%20Screening%20Presentation.pdf

I've only just discovered http://www.i93bowconcord.com/ (and skimmed thru the docs there) but it appears most options considered more recently are a variant of
http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Workshop%206-26-19/Exit%2014_15%20Concept%20F3%202.pdf
http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Workshop%206-26-19/Exit%2014_15%20Concept%20F3%20with%20Rail%20Relocation%202.pdf

Not that it would be surprising, but no mention of exit renumbering in the Ten Year plan?
« Last Edit: October 31, 2021, 10:35:44 AM by bob7374 »
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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #295 on: October 31, 2021, 02:02:05 AM »

^ Talking about the options depicted here? http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Archives/Alternative%20Screening%20Presentation.pdf

I've only just discovered http://www.i93bowconcord.com/ (and skimmed thru the docs there) but it appears most options considered more recently are a variant of
http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Workshop%206-26-19/Exit%2014_15%20Concept%20F3%202.pdf
http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Workshop%206-26-19/Exit%2014_15%20Concept%20F3%20with%20Rail%20Relocation%202.pdf

Not surprising, no mention of exit renumbering in the Ten Year plan.

Actually, I found the exit renumbering, but it's under a different wording. It states "EXIT SIGN RENUMBERING ALONG TIER 1
HIGHWAYS TO COMPLY WITH MUTCD." with preliminary engineering in 2023 and construction in 2024. The total cost of this project is $926,804.

So, which highways are under the Tier 1 category?
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bob7374

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #296 on: October 31, 2021, 11:02:02 AM »

^ Talking about the options depicted here? http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Archives/Alternative%20Screening%20Presentation.pdf

I've only just discovered http://www.i93bowconcord.com/ (and skimmed thru the docs there) but it appears most options considered more recently are a variant of
http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Workshop%206-26-19/Exit%2014_15%20Concept%20F3%202.pdf
http://www.i93bowconcord.com/Documents/Workshop%206-26-19/Exit%2014_15%20Concept%20F3%20with%20Rail%20Relocation%202.pdf

Would not be surprising, but no mention of exit renumbering in the Ten Year plan?

Actually, I found the exit renumbering, but it's under a different wording. It states "EXIT SIGN RENUMBERING ALONG TIER 1
HIGHWAYS TO COMPLY WITH MUTCD." with preliminary engineering in 2023 and construction in 2024. The total cost of this project is $926,804.

So, which highways are under the Tier 1 category?
Tier 1 – Interstates, Turnpikes, and Divided Highways
Interstates, Turnpikes, and NH Route 101 between Bedford and Hampton support the
highest traffic volumes and speeds in the entire state. These multi-lane, divided
highways convey the majority of commuter, tourist, and freight traffic throughout the
state.

Exit renumbering was also in the previous 10 year plan, and was taken out by the NH governor.

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #297 on: January 01, 2022, 11:16:15 PM »

https://www.nh.gov/dot/org/projectdevelopment/planning/typ/documents/typ-project-changes-and-updates.pdf

The exit renumbering project on Tier-1 highways has been removed from this 10-year statewide plan (2023-2032). I'm betting that it will show up again on the next plan.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #298 on: January 03, 2022, 05:37:12 PM »

Will New Hampshire have to wait until a new governor is elected in order for the exits to finally be converted from sequential-to-mileage-based?
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BlueOutback7

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Re: New Hampshire
« Reply #299 on: January 03, 2022, 06:26:40 PM »

Governor Sununu is running for a fourth term as governor. As long as he remains in office, the exit numbers aren’t changing.
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