Types of School Zone signs

Started by tolbs17, July 16, 2021, 09:26:51 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

tolbs17

This sign here looks clumsy.

Does this sign tell you to slow down even when school is not in session? There are no flashers here. Compared to here.


hotdogPi

Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 09:26:51 PM
Does this sign tell you to slow down even when school is not in session? There are no flashers here. Compared to here.

There are times posted. While there is the problem that it won't be obvious when school days are, it's definitely not meant to be all the time.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 09:26:51 PM
This sign here looks clumsy.

Does this sign tell you to slow down even when school is not in session? There are no flashers here. Compared to here.

The sign saying school days seems pretty clear you don't need to reduce speed when school isn't in session.

tolbs17

#3
But Farmville Central, and Ayden Grifton, don't have the speed drop.

Mapmikey

Quote from: jeffandnicole on July 16, 2021, 09:32:34 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 09:26:51 PM
This sign here looks clumsy.

Does this sign tell you to slow down even when school is not in session? There are no flashers here. Compared to here.

The sign saying school days seems pretty clear you don't need to reduce speed when school isn't in session.

Yes but if I'm from out of state I have no idea what the school year schedule is and what if summer school is using that particular school?

Big John

Does "When children are present" apply to non school times?

tolbs17

Quote from: Big John on July 16, 2021, 10:04:06 PM
Does "When children are present" apply to non school times?

Never seen that here so I guess yes?

US71


Foreman, AR


Mount Olive, IL


Mt Vernon, Missouri
Like Alice I Try To Believe Three Impossible Things Before Breakfast

Mapmikey

Quote from: Big John on July 16, 2021, 10:04:06 PM
Does "When children are present" apply to non school times?


Per this article after school activities was one of the purposes of this wording. OTOH it was difficult to enforce
https://www.heraldnet.com/news/what-when-children-are-present-means-in-a-school-zone/

SkyPesos

Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2

tolbs17

Quote from: SkyPesos on July 16, 2021, 11:11:20 PM
Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2
Never seen them overhead.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: Big John on July 16, 2021, 10:04:06 PM
Does "When children are present" apply to non school times?


In NJ, "When Children Are Present" is defined as 30 minutes before school, 30 minutes after school, and during recess.  Yes...it's very vague.

fwydriver405

Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on July 16, 2021, 11:11:20 PM
Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2
Never seen them overhead.

There are two near my area that are overhead on the same state highway (236)... one is installed on a mast arm at one facility... and a little bit down the road... the second one is mounted on span wires.

tolbs17

Quote from: fwydriver405 on July 16, 2021, 11:58:26 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on July 16, 2021, 11:11:20 PM
Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2
Never seen them overhead.

There are two near my area that are overhead on the same state highway (236)... one is installed on a mast arm at one facility... and a little bit down the road... the second one is mounted on span wires.
I mean I've never seen them overhead here in North Carolina.

roadfro

#14
Some Nevada examples

School Zone in effect during certain times:
Reno-area example

School Zone in effect when children are present
Vegas-area example - Much of the Vegas area has gone to this instead of listing specific times.

School Zone in effect when beacons are flashing
Post-mounted - newer Vegas-area example
Overhead - newer Vegas-area example
Overhead - older Vegas-area example
Post-mounted - older Reno-area example
Overhead - older Reno-area example
Overhead - newer Reno-area example
Roadfro - AARoads Pacific Southwest moderator since 2010, Nevada roadgeek since 1983.

roadfro

Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 09:26:51 PM
This sign here looks clumsy.

Does this sign tell you to slow down even when school is not in session? There are no flashers here. Compared to here.

These are clumsy installations.

The first might not even be enforceable, because it is using an advisor speed placard (meant to accompany a warning sign) instead of an actual speed limit regulatory sign.

The second isn't too bad. Although the time regulations typically shouldn't be posted with an advance warning sign like this, and should just be displayed with the actual school speed limit sign at the start of the zone.

The third one with flashers also has times listed, which is odd. Either list the time and don't have the flashing beacons, or use flashing beacons and say "when flashing" instead of the times.

Quote from: fwydriver405 on July 16, 2021, 11:58:26 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on July 16, 2021, 11:11:20 PM
Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2
Never seen them overhead.

There are two near my area that are overhead on the same state highway (236)... one is installed on a mast arm at one facility... and a little bit down the road... the second one is mounted on span wires.

Several of these are awkward to me. I don't get the reason for having the speed limit numbers on a separate light-up display instead of putting the numbers on the static portion of the sign–it's one more thing that can go wrong and for public works to maintain.

Similarly, why do they put the beacons inside the borders of the sign?

Lots of custom sign designing when it'd be a whole lot easier to use the standard signs and affix beacons around them...
Roadfro - AARoads Pacific Southwest moderator since 2010, Nevada roadgeek since 1983.

tolbs17


tolbs17

Quote from: roadfro on July 18, 2021, 04:13:53 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 09:26:51 PM
This sign here looks clumsy.

Does this sign tell you to slow down even when school is not in session? There are no flashers here. Compared to here.
The third one with flashers also has times listed, which is odd. Either list the time and don't have the flashing beacons, or use flashing beacons and say "when flashing" instead of the times.
We don't have any sign such saying "WHEN FLASHING" as far as I know in this area.

mrsman

In my experience, there are usually three types of driving restrictions that are conditioned by the presence of schools: speed, turning, and parking.

The goal behind the speed and turning restrictions is obviously the safety of children.  For the most part, they aim to provide a safety restriction when children are present.  If the sign says "when children are present" then it is absolutely so restricted that if you see children on the street in the area, you need to slow down or not turn.  This is true regardless of whether school is in session.  To be frank, children are more likely to be present in the immediate periods before and after school.  In the middle of the day, they are in the classroom, not in the street.  Of course, to the extent that chldren can play in the playugrounds and ballparks on school grounds at any time, perhaps one should be on watch for children even during breaks and weekends. 

The flahsing lights are a great addition to this.  If done right, they can put the restriction in place during times when the children are more likely to be present.  Similarly for the specific time restrictions.

The hard thing is to define precisely what is a school day.  How would one get a school calendar to check?  Would the sign only be in force during district hours, even if the sign is in front of a private school that may have a different schedule?  I don't like the uncertainty.

My gut behind most of the signs is to basically treat the signs as Mon-Fri.  The turn restrictions (usually NTOR when children present) and speed limits are usually no big deal.  Just drive a little slower for a few blocks.  The parking restrictions are a bigger hassle, because  often a school may be the only place you can park in busy neighborhoods.

tolbs17


roadfro

Quote from: tolbs17 on July 25, 2021, 07:07:31 PM
This is what roadfro is referring to and it makes more sense. This sign is very nice!

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.7677468,-75.5855658,3a,15y,173.59h,97.87t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sao0wJh9pHPgsJlWMYngoeA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Tolbs17, it would be better if you gave some context in your posts, instead of randomly referring to something posted days ago with intervening discussion. For example, had you quoted this info below, people would know exactly what you were referring to when you mentioned what I was referring to...

Quote from: roadfro on July 18, 2021, 04:13:53 PM
Quote from: fwydriver405 on July 16, 2021, 11:58:26 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on July 16, 2021, 11:11:20 PM
Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2
Never seen them overhead.

There are two near my area that are overhead on the same state highway (236)... one is installed on a mast arm at one facility... and a little bit down the road... the second one is mounted on span wires.

Several of these are awkward to me. I don't get the reason for having the speed limit numbers on a separate light-up display instead of putting the numbers on the static portion of the sign–it's one more thing that can go wrong and for public works to maintain.

Similarly, why do they put the beacons inside the borders of the sign?

Lots of custom sign designing when it'd be a whole lot easier to use the standard signs and affix beacons around them...
Roadfro - AARoads Pacific Southwest moderator since 2010, Nevada roadgeek since 1983.

tolbs17

Quote from: roadfro on July 26, 2021, 11:08:09 AM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 25, 2021, 07:07:31 PM
This is what roadfro is referring to and it makes more sense. This sign is very nice!

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.7677468,-75.5855658,3a,15y,173.59h,97.87t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sao0wJh9pHPgsJlWMYngoeA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Tolbs17, it would be better if you gave some context in your posts, instead of randomly referring to something posted days ago with intervening discussion. For example, had you quoted this info below, people would know exactly what you were referring to when you mentioned what I was referring to...

Quote from: roadfro on July 18, 2021, 04:13:53 PM
Quote from: fwydriver405 on July 16, 2021, 11:58:26 PM
Quote from: tolbs17 on July 16, 2021, 11:24:02 PM
Quote from: SkyPesos on July 16, 2021, 11:11:20 PM
Here's a type that's pretty common in my area, with light up numbers and flashing lights:
- Example 1
- Example 2
Never seen them overhead.

There are two near my area that are overhead on the same state highway (236)... one is installed on a mast arm at one facility... and a little bit down the road... the second one is mounted on span wires.

Several of these are awkward to me. I don't get the reason for having the speed limit numbers on a separate light-up display instead of putting the numbers on the static portion of the sign–it's one more thing that can go wrong and for public works to maintain.

Similarly, why do they put the beacons inside the borders of the sign?

Lots of custom sign designing when it'd be a whole lot easier to use the standard signs and affix beacons around them...
Yes, I probably forgot to do that.

tolbs17

Signs like these mean you don't have to slow down to 45 mph. These are just advisory signs so these are not speed traps. The same ones I showed off at North Pitt and Ayden Grifton.

However if you see signs like these, you DO have to slow down during those hours.

And you'll see a warning sign like this as well.

Topsail schools in Hampstead used to have regulatory speed limit signs for school zones but they've changed to advisory. Speed limit on that stretch used to be 55 mph and it was lowered to 45 mph.

2007 Google Street View - https://www.google.com/maps/@34.3970107,-77.6738251,3a,75y,258.39h,81.8t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s1m76sFBcSmRYanKNaWz51Q!2e0!7i3328!8i1664

2019 Google Street View - https://www.google.com/maps/@34.397102,-77.6737199,3a,75y,240.77h,86.53t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sHx0ydo_hnTvq6-etp7cziQ!2e0!5s20190401T000000!7i13312!8i6656

I do believe North Pitt High School did have regulatory speed limit signs before NC 11 was widened to four lanes.



tolbs17

This is rare and it's part of the Greensboro Urban Loop but these could be just temporary until they install a side mounted flashing beacon.

https://goo.gl/maps/GtTPuEwv3uR5t7TSA

US71

Quote from: tolbs17 on January 19, 2022, 03:03:42 AM
This is rare and it's part of the Greensboro Urban Loop but these could be just temporary until they install a side mounted flashing beacon.

https://goo.gl/maps/GtTPuEwv3uR5t7TSA

I've seen similar elsewhere.
Like Alice I Try To Believe Three Impossible Things Before Breakfast



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.