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Author Topic: Highest number of lanes in both directions  (Read 12012 times)

agentsteel53

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2013, 07:22:04 PM »

lots of sunny weather

I think 115 degrees is pushing it.
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #26 on: July 23, 2013, 09:49:57 PM »

115 degrees with 2% relative humidity is without question more comfortable than 90 degrees with 80% relative humidity. And yet, Florida is a popular retirement destination as well.
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #27 on: July 24, 2013, 01:00:05 AM »

more and more people will move to the Phoenix area to live.
...why!?

it's hot and filled with SB1070 maniacs.
A combination of low cost of living and lots of sunny weather is attractive to a lot of people. My parents are considering moving to Arizona (although not Phoenix specifically) when they retire for these reasons.

And as for the politics, *shrug* one man's maniac is another man's truth speaker.

But there's not really enough water for everyone there, is there?
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #28 on: July 24, 2013, 02:25:55 AM »

I-895 in Maryland is 14 lanes? Where? It's four lanes for its entire run, if memory serves me correctly. The FHWA page says its tally excludes toll plazas, so what am I missing?
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J N Winkler

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #29 on: July 24, 2013, 11:20:43 AM »

more and more people will move to the Phoenix area to live.

...why!?

it's hot and filled with SB1070 maniacs.

A combination of low cost of living and lots of sunny weather is attractive to a lot of people. My parents are considering moving to Arizona (although not Phoenix specifically) when they retire for these reasons.

And as for the politics, *shrug* one man's maniac is another man's truth speaker.

But there's not really enough water for everyone there, is there?

The rule of thumb is that, regardless of water scarcity in general, water will always be found for city dwellers because they represent the highest-value use of a piped water supply.  And water is not exactly scarce in Arizona in absolute terms right now--in fact, most of the water brought in by the Central Arizona Project is currently dedicated to agricultural purposes.

The textbook example is the Arkansas River valley in Colorado and western Kansas, where distribution of available water in the river is controlled by the prior appropriation doctrine.  Fulfillment of water rights is controlled by their seniority (the older your water rights are, the more likely you are to get your quota of water in a dry year), and water rights in this region are structured so that agricultural users in Kansas are sandwiched between Colorado users near the Front Range, who hold very senior rights, and other Colorado users near the Kansas state line, who hold very junior rights.  The senior rights in Colorado are now largely held by Front Range cities like Pueblo, who bought them from the farmers for whom they were originally decreed, and now use them to secure their municipal tap water supplies.  This means that if you wish to farm with irrigation in this region, you are generally much better off on the Kansas side of the state line.

In regard to SB 1070 and the state's political coloration in general, Arizona is actually a more hospitable place for middle-of-the-road political moderates than a lot of other red states.  SB 1070 was a very visible piece of legislation and as such was very damaging to the state's reputation, but its most obnoxious provisions were ruled unenforceable in 2012 by the US Supreme Court.  Earlier this year the Supreme Court also ruled Arizona's voter citizenship proof law unenforceable as well.  Democrats are very competitive in races for the Arizona legislature, statewide offices, and the US Congress, and many Republican incumbents (such as John McCain) are considered to come from the moderate wing of the party.

There is really no comparison to states like Texas which have been locked up by the Republicans since Ann Richards left office, or Kansas where the Republican faction that now controls the legislature and all statewide offices (except insurance commissioner) is quite far to the right and pushes its agenda on multiple fronts:  TRAP, legislation providing for the arrest of federal officers for enforcing federal firearms laws in-state, continued enforcement of a citizenship proof law despite the Supreme Court ruling and documented disenfrachisement of 12,000 registrants, etc.  Members of this faction now bait moderates and leftists on online forums by saying, "If you don't like it here, why don't you just move out of state?"  My answer is, "It's my state too and my family has roots here that go back more than a century," but if I were actually going to move, Arizona would be quite appealing.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2013, 11:34:24 AM by J N Winkler »
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agentsteel53

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #30 on: July 24, 2013, 12:41:49 PM »

In regard to SB 1070 and the state's political coloration in general, Arizona is actually a more hospitable place for middle-of-the-road political moderates than a lot of other red states.  SB 1070 was a very visible piece of legislation and as such was very damaging to the state's reputation, but its most obnoxious provisions were ruled unenforceable in 2012 by the US Supreme Court.  Earlier this year the Supreme Court also ruled Arizona's voter citizenship proof law unenforceable as well.  Democrats are very competitive in races for the Arizona legislature, statewide offices, and the US Congress, and many Republican incumbents (such as John McCain) are considered to come from the moderate wing of the party.

it must be the case that the anti-immigration 'self-appointed militia' folks are very, very loud.  Tucson just seems like a very hate-filled place. 

Quote
There is really no comparison to states like Texas which have been locked up by the Republicans since Ann Richards left office, or Kansas where the Republican faction that now controls the legislature and all statewide offices (except insurance commissioner) is quite far to the right and pushes its agenda on multiple fronts:  TRAP, legislation providing for the arrest of federal officers for enforcing federal firearms laws in-state, continued enforcement of a citizenship proof law despite the Supreme Court ruling and documented disenfrachisement of 12,000 registrants, etc.  Members of this faction now bait moderates and leftists on online forums by saying, "If you don't like it here, why don't you just move out of state?"  My answer is, "It's my state too and my family has roots here that go back more than a century," but if I were actually going to move, Arizona would be quite appealing.

also: Westboro Baptist Church. 

that said, I've never gotten the "hateful" vibe out of Kansas residents I've interacted with.  maybe it's a veneer of midwestern politeness which is missing from the aforementioned Tucson.
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #31 on: July 24, 2013, 01:53:09 PM »

I've read that sustaining agriculture in the Arizona / Nevada desert actually requires more water than a large city. Most of Phoenix is developed on former agricultural lands.

The Aral Sea in Kazakhstan is an infamous example. It dried up because all water was directed to agriculture.

J N Winkler

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #32 on: July 24, 2013, 03:24:54 PM »

it must be the case that the anti-immigration 'self-appointed militia' folks are very, very loud.  Tucson just seems like a very hate-filled place.

Personally, I have never allowed the Minutemen types to define Tucson for me--and in any case they are more to do with the rangeland near the border (the postage-stamp part of Arizona where it is actually possible to graze animals) than with Tucson proper.  Tucson is an university town, has probably the largest Hispanic population of any large city in Arizona, is represented by two Democrats in Congress, and has a police chief who was outspoken in opposition to SB 1070.  I am less sure about Maricopa County (Phoenix and environs) though, because of Joe Arpaio.

I think in Arizona it is easier in general for people to integrate regardless of political affiliation because the population has been growing so fast for so long that a large share of the population at any given time is in the position of having to build friendships and social networks with other recent arrivals.  Kansas, on the other hand, has had very slow population growth in recent decades, and in Wichita you often hear people complain that it is difficult to reach out and make friends.

Quote
also: Westboro Baptist Church.

Kansans have a different perspective on Westboro Baptist Church.  Since the 1970's it has always been thought of as Fred Phelps' clan, not a proper church, and it is considered a Topeka problem.  If you lived elsewhere in Kansas, then unless you were a lawyer and ran across his disbarment proceedings while keeping up with new appellate decisions, you generally wouldn't have much reason to pay attention to Fred Phelps.  (The only time I ever had to take cognizance of his group's activities was back in the nineties when I helped handle publicity for a lecture series at KSU and we were concerned that his people might drive the 50 miles to Manhattan to picket one of our speakers.)

It was not really until 2003, when Phelps et al. decided to market themselves by picketing the funerals of service personnel killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, that their so-called church attained international notoriety.  This has unfortunately been abetted by media coverage, by doubtfully constitutional attempts to prevent funeral picketing, and by developments such as the British Home Office publishing a list of 16 people who will not, under any circumstances, be admitted to Britain, two of the 16 (of whom five were American) being residents of Topeka.

Quote
that said, I've never gotten the "hateful" vibe out of Kansas residents I've interacted with.  maybe it's a veneer of midwestern politeness which is missing from the aforementioned Tucson.

Politeness is valued here, yes, and people tend to be reserved about expressing their political views because there is just not a lot of room socially for turnover in friendships.  But given a chance to engage in anonymous vox-pop, such as the Wichita Eagle's Opinion Line section (basically, fifty words to have your say on any issue, on the editorial page with an expanded section in the online edition), Kansans say things that are just as nasty, venomous, and bitter as you can find anywhere else.  The comments sections of Wichita Eagle online articles used to be as bad, until the paper started moderating them, which gave reputational mechanisms a chance to kick in.
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #33 on: July 24, 2013, 04:15:32 PM »

Going back to why people would want to live in Phoenix, I know one reason my brother-in-law gave (he's lived there since the 1970s) is that the dry climate gives him relief from various allergies he suffered from when he grew up in Dayton, Ohio.
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #34 on: July 24, 2013, 07:30:12 PM »

I-895 in Maryland is 14 lanes? Where? It's four lanes for its entire run, if memory serves me correctly. The FHWA page says its tally excludes toll plazas, so what am I missing?
That should be I-95 north of the I-895 split up to I-695.

J N Winkler

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #35 on: July 24, 2013, 08:31:52 PM »

Going back to why people would want to live in Phoenix, I know one reason my brother-in-law gave (he's lived there since the 1970s) is that the dry climate gives him relief from various allergies he suffered from when he grew up in Dayton, Ohio.

Yes, it is much drier, which not only helps make the heat more bearable but also helps ease chronic lung conditions such as tuberculosis.  But the flip side is that it is so dry nosebleeds are more frequent.  You do also run a risk of trading one group of allergens for another.  In Kansas I have long been allergic to ragweed, which tends to bloom in late August/early September, but my first visit to Arizona was actually in late March (spring break season), when something was in bloom in the desert that kept me sneezing and sneezing.

Chronic lung conditions aside, I personally think it is better to master the technique of sinus cleaning before basing a relocation decision on the presence or otherwise of airborne allergens.  I have been cleaning my sinuses with a neti pot for over four years, and in that time I have never had to use allergy medication (previously I had had to use a triamcinolone acetonide nasal spray to deal with my ragweed/hogweed allergy).
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Revive 755

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #36 on: July 24, 2013, 09:05:14 PM »

Quote from: FHWA list
Illinois    Chicago (IL-IN)    I-90    12
Seems they are counting the lanes at toll plazas; I only see a short stretch of 8 lanes on the Indiana Toll Road otherwise. EDIT:  Ok, I see the IL-IN refers to the metro area, not the section of highway, may this one refers to the Dan Ryan.

Somehow these folks managed to miss the 14 lane wide Dan Ryan Expressway (I-94) in Chicago.

Same could be said for the 12 lane wide I-290/IL-53 between Woodfield and I-90

IL 53 is on the list; it is 22nd from the top.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2013, 09:07:37 PM by Revive 755 »
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #37 on: July 24, 2013, 09:33:00 PM »

Quote from: FHWA list
Illinois    Chicago (IL-IN)    I-90    12
Seems they are counting the lanes at toll plazas; I only see a short stretch of 8 lanes on the Indiana Toll Road otherwise. EDIT:  Ok, I see the IL-IN refers to the metro area, not the section of highway, may this one refers to the Dan Ryan.

Somehow these folks managed to miss the 14 lane wide Dan Ryan Expressway (I-94) in Chicago.

Same could be said for the 12 lane wide I-290/IL-53 between Woodfield and I-90

IL 53 is on the list; it is 22nd from the top.

Ahhh I see it. I was looking for 290/53
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Clinched:
IL: I-88, I-180, I-190, I-290, I-294, I-355, IL-390
IN: I-80, I-94
SD: I-190
WI: I-90, I-94
MI: I-94, I-196
MN: I-90

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #38 on: July 24, 2013, 09:37:14 PM »

Quote from: FHWA list
Illinois    Chicago (IL-IN)    I-90    12
Seems they are counting the lanes at toll plazas; I only see a short stretch of 8 lanes on the Indiana Toll Road otherwise. EDIT:  Ok, I see the IL-IN refers to the metro area, not the section of highway, may this one refers to the Dan Ryan.

Somehow these folks managed to miss the 14 lane wide Dan Ryan Expressway (I-94) in Chicago.

Same could be said for the 12 lane wide I-290/IL-53 between Woodfield and I-90

IL 53 is on the list; it is 22nd from the top.

Ahhh I see it. I was looking for 290/53

Who the hell calls that section I-290?  It's "Route 53"!  WBBM told me so.  :spin:
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #39 on: July 24, 2013, 09:47:47 PM »

Where does I-895 in Baltimore have 14 lanes?
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #40 on: July 24, 2013, 09:50:19 PM »

Quote from: FHWA list
Illinois    Chicago (IL-IN)    I-90    12
Seems they are counting the lanes at toll plazas; I only see a short stretch of 8 lanes on the Indiana Toll Road otherwise. EDIT:  Ok, I see the IL-IN refers to the metro area, not the section of highway, may this one refers to the Dan Ryan.

Somehow these folks managed to miss the 14 lane wide Dan Ryan Expressway (I-94) in Chicago.

Same could be said for the 12 lane wide I-290/IL-53 between Woodfield and I-90

IL 53 is on the list; it is 22nd from the top.

Ahhh I see it. I was looking for 290/53

Who the hell calls that section I-290?  It's "Route 53"!  WBBM told me so.  :spin:

I call it 290 till 90 lol. Don't care bout 53 till I past the Adams :P
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Clinched:
IL: I-88, I-180, I-190, I-290, I-294, I-355, IL-390
IN: I-80, I-94
SD: I-190
WI: I-90, I-94
MI: I-94, I-196
MN: I-90

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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #41 on: July 24, 2013, 09:57:51 PM »

Yes, it is much drier, which not only helps make the heat more bearable but also helps ease chronic lung conditions such as tuberculosis.  But the flip side is that it is so dry nosebleeds are more frequent.  You do also run a risk of trading one group of allergens for another.  In Kansas I have long been allergic to ragweed, which tends to bloom in late August/early September, but my first visit to Arizona was actually in late March (spring break season), when something was in bloom in the desert that kept me sneezing and sneezing.

Some folks land up with Valley Fever instead. I know someone who moved there and started suffering from allergies when they never had a problem in the Northeast. Turns out they were allergic to cactus pollen!
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #42 on: July 24, 2013, 10:20:59 PM »

Who the hell calls that section I-290?  It's "Route 53"!  WBBM told me so.  :spin:

Which really gets annoying when they refer to Route 53 somewhere south of Biesterfield Road so one has to guess if they are referring to I-290 or Rohlwing Road.
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Re: Highest number of lanes in both directions
« Reply #43 on: July 25, 2013, 07:10:24 PM »

Where does I-895 in Baltimore have 14 lanes?
I-895 in Maryland is 14 lanes? Where? It's four lanes for its entire run, if memory serves me correctly. The FHWA page says its tally excludes toll plazas, so what am I missing?
That should be I-95 north of the I-895 split up to I-695.

 


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