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Who Else Is Bucking the Smartphone Trend?

Started by Ned Weasel, March 26, 2021, 06:43:45 PM

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Scott5114

#125
One thing that bothers me is people who only use smartphones and won't use a regular computer. There are some things that you straight up can't do on a phone, either because it's just not the right tool for the job (too small, not precise enough), or the smartphone botches some aspect of what it's trying to do (like the GSV bug where links are zoomed in on the pavement instead of what you were pointing the camera at, and apparently you can't see historical GSV imagery on mobile). But despite this they just insist on using a phone instead of a computer, preferring to half-ass whatever it is they were trying to do instead of taking the time to do it right. In the worst cases, they make this your problem ("sorry this post is an incomprehensible mess, I'm on mobile. maybe you can spend 20 minutes thinking about what typos are close to the words I was trying to type and what autocorrect might have changed them to").

My wife is one of these people–she recently really wanted to apply for a job, but the application was glitching out on her phone so she could never submit it. I created a user account for her on my laptop, but instead of using that she just gave up on the job.

It's a lot like watching someone with a power screwdriver that periodically shocks them trying to use it on a nail.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef


Ned Weasel

Quote from: Scott5114 on April 03, 2021, 05:00:32 PM
One thing that bothers me is people who only use smartphones and won't use a regular computer. There are some things that you straight up can't do on a phone, either because it's just not the right tool for the job (too small, not precise enough), or the smartphone botches some aspect of what it's trying to do (like the GSV bug where links are zoomed in on the pavement instead of what you were pointing the camera at, and apparently you can't see historical GSV imagery on mobile). But despite this they just insist on using a phone instead of a computer, preferring to half-ass whatever it is they were trying to do instead of taking the time to do it right. In the worst cases, they make this your problem ("sorry this post is an incomprehensible mess, I'm on mobile. maybe you can spend 20 minutes thinking about what typos are close to the words I was trying to type and what autocorrect might have changed them to").

My wife is one of these people–she recently really wanted to apply for a job, but the application was glitching out on her phone so she could never submit it. I created a user account for her on my laptop, but instead of using that she just gave up on the job.

It's a lot like watching someone with a power screwdriver that periodically shocks them trying to use it on a nail.

I don't understand this phenomenon either.  If we're comparing one-time purchase prices, a low-end smartphone is probably half the price of a low-end laptop.  But a basic broadband internet subscription costs about as much as a data plan (although I'm sure this varies a lot from place to place and from plan to plan).  And a low-end smartphone is most likely going to become unbearably slow and borderline obsolete in half the time the low-end laptop will.  So I don't know why anyone would prefer the smartphone, unless that person just really, really wants to take it everywhere.  Also, typing on a real, full keyboard with real keys is so much easier and more enjoyable than trying to type anything on a smartphone touchscreen.
"I was raised by a cup of coffee." - Strong Bad imitating Homsar

Disclaimer: Views I express are my own and don't reflect any employer or associated entity.

ZLoth

Quote from: stridentweasel on April 03, 2021, 11:59:27 PMSo I don't know why anyone would prefer the smartphone, unless that person just really, really wants to take it everywhere.  Also, typing on a real, full keyboard with real keys is so much easier and more enjoyable than trying to type anything on a smartphone touchscreen.
You do realize that they do sell BlueTooth Keyboards that interface with your tablet and/or smartphone. I do pull oit out occasionally.

Having said that, yes, there is some tasks that are better on a smart phone, and some tasks that are better on a computer. Consider:

  • When looking at Google Maps, the map view is much bigger on the computer screen than it is on my mobile phone. However, I can still send a particular destination from my computer to my smartphone.
  • I can set up a particular contact initially on my smart phone, then add additional details at home through through the computer. The same with my calendar.
  • Some time back, Google released an update to their text messenger app. By going to https://messages.google.com/web/ on any computer, I can scan a QR code, then read/reply to text messages from my computer.
  • If I'm shopping and something interests me, I can scan the bar code to check the price against Amazon. I can then look at the browsing history of Amazon on my computer to research a product more.
  • I got pulled into a critical meeting, but had some errands to run. I joined the online meeting from my phone while listening to the audio, then hopped onto my computer when I got home.
If the User eXperience (UX) is designed well, the web site and and the phone app will compliment each other. Yes, I'm mildly irritated that I can only access my Blink security camera videos from my mobile phone, but it allows me to check my home while I'm away. I was able to access my sprinkler system controller when collaborating with my neighbor on a possible water leak issue instead of having to walk from the front sidewalk to my back garage, turn on that zone, check the front sprinkler heads, then walk back to turn off the zone. (It was the neighbor's sprinkler system, but right at the property line.) I'm also able to verify that yes, my garage door is closed, and not turn around, drive back 10 minutes, just to verify. (The opener I have now also has a timer to close the door automatically after five minutes).

It bothers me when people dismiss technology immediately because of one or two aspects of it, such as looking at smartphones for only the social media, gaming, or watching videos. It can be a very powerful tool to help make your life easier and better, but it sometimes requires that you reframe your mind to look at things differently, and format the data properly. Sometimes, that requires that you sit down and spend the time learning the application. You can't just go in and say "Doctor's appointment at 3 PM", you have to enter it in as "Doctor XXX from 3-4 PM".  You can supplement your paper maps with Google Map data. Technology helped me discover some good local businesses to patronize both locally and when I'm traveling.
I'm an Engineer. That means I solve problems. Not problems like "What is beauty?", because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of philosophy. I solve practical problems and call them "paychecks".

wanderer2575

Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 01, 2021, 10:18:15 AM
Semi on-topic, The 8-Bit Guy just released a video talking about electronics stores (Radio Shack, Circuit City, most recently Fry's, etc.) going bust. In the video, he opens up an old Radio Shack catalog to see how much of it has been replaced by smartphones, and lo and behold, it's just about all of it.



It's a bit depressing to see all these old gadgets become replaced by one super gadget. It makes sense; after all that's what technological progress is. But still, I can't remember life pre-smartphone since I was too young, so it would be cool to actually go back to those days where if you wanted to do all these different things, you needed to carry around a bunch of different tools for the job.

You could say I'm nostalgic for an era in which I did not live.

The smartphone may do it all.  But does it do them better? Or is that the majority of people are willing to accept "jack of all trades, master of none" in exchange for the convenience of one device?  Sadly, I think the latter is the general answer.

vdeane

Having a bunch of tabs open is also much easier on a computer than a phone.  It would be hard to imagine doing my main forum trawls on a phone for this reason, even if the display were modified to play nice with mobile Chrome.  It is nice if I want to do some reading while waiting somewhere, though.  Thankfully, Chrome has features that make sharing links between my desktop, laptop, and phone very easy.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

zachary_amaryllis

Quote from: vdeane on April 04, 2021, 12:33:03 PM
Having a bunch of tabs open is also much easier on a computer than a phone.  It would be hard to imagine doing my main forum trawls on a phone for this reason, even if the display were modified to play nice with mobile Chrome.  It is nice if I want to do some reading while waiting somewhere, though.  Thankfully, Chrome has features that make sharing links between my desktop, laptop, and phone very easy.

and this site is not particularly mobile-friendly. its readable, but there's a lot of pinching and ... [whats the opposite of pinching] and swiping around to do to view stuff.

nothing personal, creators. still a fun and interesting site.
clinched:
I-64, I-80, I-76 (west), *64s in hampton roads, 225,270,180 (co, wy)

interstatefan990

Quote from: wanderer2575 on April 04, 2021, 09:49:49 AM
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 01, 2021, 10:18:15 AM
Semi on-topic, The 8-Bit Guy just released a video talking about electronics stores (Radio Shack, Circuit City, most recently Fry's, etc.) going bust. In the video, he opens up an old Radio Shack catalog to see how much of it has been replaced by smartphones, and lo and behold, it's just about all of it.



It's a bit depressing to see all these old gadgets become replaced by one super gadget. It makes sense; after all that's what technological progress is. But still, I can't remember life pre-smartphone since I was too young, so it would be cool to actually go back to those days where if you wanted to do all these different things, you needed to carry around a bunch of different tools for the job.

You could say I'm nostalgic for an era in which I did not live.

The smartphone may do it all.  But does it do them better? Or is that the majority of people are willing to accept "jack of all trades, master of none" in exchange for the convenience of one device?  Sadly, I think the latter is the general answer.

In the technological world, ease-of-access always prevails over all else.
Multi-lane roundabouts are an abomination to mankind.

Scott5114

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on April 04, 2021, 04:41:23 PM
Quote from: vdeane on April 04, 2021, 12:33:03 PM
Having a bunch of tabs open is also much easier on a computer than a phone.  It would be hard to imagine doing my main forum trawls on a phone for this reason, even if the display were modified to play nice with mobile Chrome.  It is nice if I want to do some reading while waiting somewhere, though.  Thankfully, Chrome has features that make sharing links between my desktop, laptop, and phone very easy.

and this site is not particularly mobile-friendly. its readable, but there's a lot of pinching and ... [whats the opposite of pinching] and swiping around to do to view stuff.

nothing personal, creators. still a fun and interesting site.

We'll be able to fix this with the next forum software update. Whenever SMF gets around to releasing it.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

vdeane

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on April 04, 2021, 04:41:23 PM
Quote from: vdeane on April 04, 2021, 12:33:03 PM
Having a bunch of tabs open is also much easier on a computer than a phone.  It would be hard to imagine doing my main forum trawls on a phone for this reason, even if the display were modified to play nice with mobile Chrome.  It is nice if I want to do some reading while waiting somewhere, though.  Thankfully, Chrome has features that make sharing links between my desktop, laptop, and phone very easy.

and this site is not particularly mobile-friendly. its readable, but there's a lot of pinching and ... [whats the opposite of pinching] and swiping around to do to view stuff.

nothing personal, creators. still a fun and interesting site.
That's what I meant by not mobile friendly.  Do note, however, my wider point, where even fixing that wouldn't make the way I do my full-size checks of the forum the forum (as opposed to the "I'm bored, is anything interesting happening there" checks that I do in incognito tabs and signed out) - opening every subforum with new posts into a separate tab, then going through them and opening every thread with new posts I want to read into their own tabs - would still be extraordinarily inconvenient on a phone simply as a matter of the small screen size and how mobile apps are designed.  Display issues can be fixed (when SMF gets around to it).  Issues with usability of having a ton of tabs is fundamental to how the device is designed.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

snowc

Quote from: Scott5114 on April 04, 2021, 08:36:50 PM
Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on April 04, 2021, 04:41:23 PM
Quote from: vdeane on April 04, 2021, 12:33:03 PM
Having a bunch of tabs open is also much easier on a computer than a phone.  It would be hard to imagine doing my main forum trawls on a phone for this reason, even if the display were modified to play nice with mobile Chrome.  It is nice if I want to do some reading while waiting somewhere, though.  Thankfully, Chrome has features that make sharing links between my desktop, laptop, and phone very easy.

and this site is not particularly mobile-friendly. its readable, but there's a lot of pinching and ... [whats the opposite of pinching] and swiping around to do to view stuff.

nothing personal, creators. still a fun and interesting site.

We'll be able to fix this with the next forum software update. Whenever SMF gets around to releasing it.
Thanks for letting us know that mobile first strategy is now being implemented.

Ned Weasel

I'll admit, some of the contrary viewpoints in this thread contained good points.  I went ahead and switched back to a smartphone (not really because I was persuaded to, but because of a lot of things I'd been thinking about over the past month).  There were two big things I missed: a selfie camera that took good selfies (you can buy cheapo selfie cameras that sound good, but I haven't been able to find a really good one), and being able to text-message friends without fussing with the 10-key and awkward shifting mechanism (it sounds fun until you try to write a full paragraph).  The flip phone is definitely better for using in the car, though: if someone calls, you just flip to answer, instead of dangerously fumbling with the swipe mechanism on the touch screen.  I might switch the SIM card back and forth for that purpose.  And I'm still not getting a big data plan, because $$.  But, this weekend, out of curiosity, I went to the T-Mobile Store (same carrier I've been with ever since it was Voice Stream), and they offered a deal where they'd give me a brand new smartphone for free if I switched to a plan that gives me unlimited talk and text plus limited data for five bucks per month less than what I was paying for my unlimited talk and text plan without data.  And I can always use WiFi when I'm at home, or at a restaurant or motel that offers it.  And, I guess if it becomes annoyingly slow in two to three years, $150 to $200 for a new one isn't entirely unaffordable as long as I still have something vaguely resembling an income.

It's so hard to commit to personal decisions.  Working out/lifting weights every day is about the only thing I know how to stick with.

Quote from: snowc on April 05, 2021, 12:39:55 PM
Thanks for letting us know that mobile first strategy is now being implemented.

I prefer the term "mobile-friendly" over "mobile-first."  "Mobile-first" implies that a mobile device is somehow superior to a PC, which is almost the exact opposite of reality.  PCs are technically superior and easier to type on.  The only advantage of a mobile device is, well, being more mobile.  Before video games became a crazy mess, the at-home console version of a given video game was usually designed to be the "fullest" version, while the portable console version was typically a downsized version, that was fun on its own, but kind of left you feeling like you'd rather be at home playing the console version.

Starting an interface design with the downsized version just seems inherently backwards.
"I was raised by a cup of coffee." - Strong Bad imitating Homsar

Disclaimer: Views I express are my own and don't reflect any employer or associated entity.

vdeane

Quote from: stridentweasel on April 11, 2021, 09:48:16 PM
Starting an interface design with the downsized version just seems inherently backwards.
That's because it's easier to upsize a design to the more capable interface than to downsize it for the less capable one.  Especially with the trend to have one version that adjusts rather than two separate versions.  It does tend to result in less full-featured designs, though.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Scott5114

#137
Quote from: snowc on April 05, 2021, 12:39:55 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 04, 2021, 08:36:50 PM
Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on April 04, 2021, 04:41:23 PM
Quote from: vdeane on April 04, 2021, 12:33:03 PM
Having a bunch of tabs open is also much easier on a computer than a phone.  It would be hard to imagine doing my main forum trawls on a phone for this reason, even if the display were modified to play nice with mobile Chrome.  It is nice if I want to do some reading while waiting somewhere, though.  Thankfully, Chrome has features that make sharing links between my desktop, laptop, and phone very easy.

and this site is not particularly mobile-friendly. its readable, but there's a lot of pinching and ... [whats the opposite of pinching] and swiping around to do to view stuff.

nothing personal, creators. still a fun and interesting site.

We'll be able to fix this with the next forum software update. Whenever SMF gets around to releasing it.
Thanks for letting us know that mobile first strategy is now being implemented.

Bold of you to assume we have a strategy. We have a tactic, of implementing a theme with responsive elements. But it's not part of any overall "strategy" to get people to buy a bunch of AARoads merch or anything, it's just a quality of life improvement for people that need it.

Quote from: vdeane on April 11, 2021, 10:00:11 PM
Quote from: stridentweasel on April 11, 2021, 09:48:16 PM
Starting an interface design with the downsized version just seems inherently backwards.
That's because it's easier to upsize a design to the more capable interface than to downsize it for the less capable one.  Especially with the trend to have one version that adjusts rather than two separate versions.  It does tend to result in less full-featured designs, though.

I don't think it's necessarily easier or harder to do one way or the other. With my website I started with the PC theme and added the mobile theme later when Google started docking points for not being mobile-friendly. The way you do responsive design (the design type that adjusts based on the size of the display device) is you have certain CSS rules that kick in when the resolution of the device is below a certain amount. So you can use those rules to hide portions of the design that don't play well on small-format browsers and show mobile-friendly replacements (which are hidden to large-format browsers by those same rules), or override the large-format rules for ones better suited for smaller devices. In fact, if you resize your browser window, you can see the design shift from one to the other.

Other than that, it's common-sense design things like try to make important parts of the interface large enough that they're easily selected and avoid placing them too close to one another, both of which benefit desktop users too by virtue of Fitts' Law.

With my website, it's important to me that both mobile and desktop users can easily access everything on the site with no impaired functionality, so I am going to do my very best to ensure that the forum's responsive theme will follow the same philosophy, even if it means I have to write the theme from scratch.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

Ned Weasel

Quote from: Scott5114 on April 11, 2021, 11:36:16 PM
With my website, it's important to me that both mobile and desktop users can easily access everything on the site with no impaired functionality, so I am going to do my very best to ensure that the forum's responsive theme will follow the same philosophy, even if it means I have to write the theme from scratch.

Whatever you do, just please don't make it like Facebook!  Facebook's interface has been crap and crappier, ever since they introduced the "Timeline" so many years ago.

If anything, the one feature that would make this site more mobile-friendly would be to have a system for quoting messages that doesn't rely so much on text editing.  It's easy to mange all those quotation tags when you have a full physical keyboard in front of you, but it's a pain on a mobile device.  Unfortunately, I don't have good ideas off the top of my head for how to better implement this, but probably you and/or other folks do.

Oh, and speaking of Facebook, one of the reasons I don't like the term "mobile-first" is I feel like it corresponds to a philosophy where some platforms design primarily for mobile devices and then don't even include as many features on the PC version.  The biggest offender I know of is Instagram.  With Instagram, if you want to post something, you have to do so from a mobile interface, because it won't let you do it in a PC web browser.  Fortunately, if you don't have a smartphone or tablet, you can just download BlueStacks for Windows and do everything from there, but I feel like you shouldn't have to jump through that hoop just to post photos/art.
"I was raised by a cup of coffee." - Strong Bad imitating Homsar

Disclaimer: Views I express are my own and don't reflect any employer or associated entity.

JayhawkCO

Quote from: stridentweasel on April 12, 2021, 10:09:32 AM
If anything, the one feature that would make this site more mobile-friendly would be to have a system for quoting messages that doesn't rely so much on text editing.  It's easy to mange all those quotation tags when you have a full physical keyboard in front of you, but it's a pain on a mobile device.

Agreed.  If you don't want to have a million inlaid quotes and you start to hold down backspace to get rid of some of them, you inevitably delete the information from the first quote and then have to go back and start all over again.

Chris

hbelkins

I've never found myself in need of using this forum so badly that I resorted to using a mobile device. There's nothing here that can't wait until I'm at a computer.

Facebook in its current form is practically unusable. I detest the new browser version's look. Trying to scroll through a whole bunch of posts on mobile is a chore, especially since it defaults to "top stories" and if you leave the app for any period of time and go back to it, it automatically resets itself even if you have chosen "most recent" as your last view.

Quote from: stridentweasel on April 11, 2021, 09:48:16 PM
There were two big things I missed: a selfie camera that took good selfies (you can buy cheapo selfie cameras that sound good, but I haven't been able to find a really good one)...

I just don't understand selfie culture. Why do people feel the need to take pictures of themselves and post them all over social media? I'm the exact opposite: I try to avoid having my picture out there for the world to see. If I get a notice someone has tagged me in a photo on Facebook, I'll usually remove the tag. It's bad enough that I'm on television often due to my job and I have had random strangers come up to me in meetings or classes and tell me they saw me on TV.

And filters ... I know what some of the people that use filters incessantly on their pictures look like in real life. It's nothing like their photos make them out to be.

I don't think it's my generation or age group, either, that has an aversion to them, as I know people around my age who are constantly posting selfies.


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

Ned Weasel

Quote from: hbelkins on April 12, 2021, 11:52:26 AM
I just don't understand selfie culture.

I wasn't into it at all until I started committing myself to working out harder.  Now, I like to show off.  Call me shallow, but it's something I've been able to commit myself to all these years, when things art and music weren't things I was good at making myself stick with.
"I was raised by a cup of coffee." - Strong Bad imitating Homsar

Disclaimer: Views I express are my own and don't reflect any employer or associated entity.

vdeane

Quote from: Scott5114 on April 11, 2021, 11:36:16 PM
I don't think it's necessarily easier or harder to do one way or the other. With my website I started with the PC theme and added the mobile theme later when Google started docking points for not being mobile-friendly. The way you do responsive design (the design type that adjusts based on the size of the display device) is you have certain CSS rules that kick in when the resolution of the device is below a certain amount. So you can use those rules to hide portions of the design that don't play well on small-format browsers and show mobile-friendly replacements (which are hidden to large-format browsers by those same rules), or override the large-format rules for ones better suited for smaller devices. In fact, if you resize your browser window, you can see the design shift from one to the other.

Other than that, it's common-sense design things like try to make important parts of the interface large enough that they're easily selected and avoid placing them too close to one another, both of which benefit desktop users too by virtue of Fitts' Law.
With the case of my site, the mobile version is a bit of a kludge because the CSS design was done back in 2012 and didn't have mobile as so much as a thought, and hasn't been significantly modified since aside from bug fixes and adding in some mobile code to adjust things like text size, spacing, and image size to make things work (and get the Google site optimization analysis to stop complaining).  Even the recent upgrade to HTML5 didn't disturb it (though the photo gallery code now uses Lightbox... incidentally, this is the reason why I finally upgraded to HTML5!).

I remember when it was possible to set rules based on device screen width rather than window size.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Scott5114

Quote from: jayhawkco on April 12, 2021, 10:36:26 AM
Quote from: stridentweasel on April 12, 2021, 10:09:32 AM
If anything, the one feature that would make this site more mobile-friendly would be to have a system for quoting messages that doesn't rely so much on text editing.  It's easy to mange all those quotation tags when you have a full physical keyboard in front of you, but it's a pain on a mobile device.

Agreed.  If you don't want to have a million inlaid quotes and you start to hold down backspace to get rid of some of them, you inevitably delete the information from the first quote and then have to go back and start all over again.

This is just a function of the way forum software works (posts stored as BBcode which are then parsed to produce HTML when a thread is accessed) so I don't foresee it changing meaningfully. If you need a quick and dirty quoting method on mobile, just copy and paste the post you want to quote and surround it by quote tags. It won't include the fancy link back to the original post, but unless you're quoting something from pages back, most people should be able to understand what you're replying to.

Quote from: hbelkins on April 12, 2021, 11:52:26 AM
Facebook in its current form is practically unusable. I detest the new browser version's look. Trying to scroll through a whole bunch of posts on mobile is a chore, especially since it defaults to "top stories" and if you leave the app for any period of time and go back to it, it automatically resets itself even if you have chosen "most recent" as your last view.

Well, yeah..."top stories" makes Facebook money (because companies have to pay to be considered a "top story") and "most recent" doesn't! The only way to fix this is to stop using Facebook.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

renegade

Don’t ask me how I know.  Just understand that I do.

Rothman

Quote from: hbelkins on April 12, 2021, 11:52:26 AM
I've never found myself in need of using this forum so badly that I resorted to using a mobile device. There's nothing here that can't wait until I'm at a computer.

Facebook in its current form is practically unusable. I detest the new browser version's look. Trying to scroll through a whole bunch of posts on mobile is a chore, especially since it defaults to "top stories" and if you leave the app for any period of time and go back to it, it automatically resets itself even if you have chosen "most recent" as your last view.

Quote from: stridentweasel on April 11, 2021, 09:48:16 PM
There were two big things I missed: a selfie camera that took good selfies (you can buy cheapo selfie cameras that sound good, but I haven't been able to find a really good one)...

I just don't understand selfie culture. Why do people feel the need to take pictures of themselves and post them all over social media? I'm the exact opposite: I try to avoid having my picture out there for the world to see. If I get a notice someone has tagged me in a photo on Facebook, I'll usually remove the tag. It's bad enough that I'm on television often due to my job and I have had random strangers come up to me in meetings or classes and tell me they saw me on TV.

And filters ... I know what some of the people that use filters incessantly on their pictures look like in real life. It's nothing like their photos make them out to be.

I don't think it's my generation or age group, either, that has an aversion to them, as I know people around my age who are constantly posting selfies.
Your reign as King Curmudgeon continues.  All hail the King!
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Rothman

Quote from: stridentweasel on April 12, 2021, 12:19:58 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on April 12, 2021, 11:52:26 AM
I just don't understand selfie culture.

I wasn't into it at all until I started committing myself to working out harder.  Now, I like to show off.  Call me shallow, but it's something I've been able to commit myself to all these years, when things art and music weren't things I was good at making myself stick with.
Hello, Shallow.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Ned Weasel

Quote from: Scott5114 on April 12, 2021, 01:38:53 PM
This is just a function of the way forum software works (posts stored as BBcode which are then parsed to produce HTML when a thread is accessed) so I don't foresee it changing meaningfully. If you need a quick and dirty quoting method on mobile, just copy and paste the post you want to quote and surround it by quote tags. It won't include the fancy link back to the original post, but unless you're quoting something from pages back, most people should be able to understand what you're replying to.

I hate to be that guy who asks for website features, but--  Is there any chance you could change the quoting tool to automatically collapse a quotation box that exceeds a predetermined length (five lines or so, perhaps) and add a "Click to Expand" link at the bottom of the box?  That would reduce the messiness of nested quotations, and it would take the text-editing burden off of mobile users.  It works well in this forum: http://forums.sonicretro.org , and it manages to look nice on a mobile device.  Just a thought.  I'm not sure how easy or difficult that is, or whether it requires some tool that costs a lot of money.
"I was raised by a cup of coffee." - Strong Bad imitating Homsar

Disclaimer: Views I express are my own and don't reflect any employer or associated entity.

Scott5114

In HTML5, collapsible boxes are really easy to make, since you just have to surround them by the new <details> tag. However, that tag would most likely need to be inserted into the page as part of the parser routine (i.e. whenever you use the quote tag that would need to be translated to also include a <details> tag). That means that we'd have to go in and tinker with the details of the parser routine to get it to emit the tags. The example forum you linked to is running totally different forum software than we are, so that is probably behavior that is built into their forum and not ours.

There is a way to do collapsible boxes in CSS only but I don't know if the forum gives us enough HTML to hook onto that and style it with CSS. CSS handles only presentational details like "make this type of box this big or this color" and is much simpler for us to customize because if it breaks the forum looks ugly for a bit, but it's still usable.

Everyone who is interested in feature requests should know that we don't respond to most of them because any change we make to the internals of the forum software risks breaking the normal output of the forum for everyone. (Or opening a security hole we're not aware of.) And then the next time we update the forum to a new version, we'd have to merge our edit back in and hope that something didn't change elsewhere in the forum code that causes it to break again. Also, that assumes we can even get so far as to understand the way the forum currently works well enough to add something on that plays nice with what's already there, which is not a given, since we didn't write the underlying code ourselves.

It would be much better for feature requests to be directed to the Simple Machines Forum devs, since they actually know how the forum software works and the most technically-sound way of building onto the existing code. Also they would be able to update the code whenever they update other parts of the forum software, and the change would propagate to every SMF forum and not just us.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

kkt

Quote from: renegade on April 12, 2021, 03:11:29 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 12, 2021, 01:38:53 PM
...  stop using Facebook.
Done!  And a long time ago, I might add!

:clap:

I haven't seen the redesigned interface you're all talking about.  I didn't like the old one, maybe I'd like the new one better?  But probably not if it's made primarily for portable devices.



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