N.Y. Times: New Jersey's Low Gas Tax to Rise 23¢ Under Deal (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/01/nyregion/new-jersey-gas-tax-23-cents.html)
QuoteNew Jersey's political leaders said on Friday afternoon that they had reached an agreement to raise the state's gasoline tax by 23 cents a gallon to pay for improvements to roads, bridges and transit systems.
QuoteGov. Chris Christie said he reached a compromise with the Democratic leaders in the State Legislature after an impasse that had lasted for months and that had stalled hundreds of transportation projects. In exchange for Mr. Christie's agreement on what he said was the first tax increase of his two terms in Trenton, the Democrats agreed to lower the state's sales tax by less than half a penny and to phase out the estate tax by 2018.
QuoteMr. Christie, a Republican, said the sales tax rate would decrease next year to 6.875 percent, from 7 percent, and then in 2018 to 6.625 percent.
6.875%? What a compromise... Meanwhile, it'll cost me more to fill up, but thankfully my Civic gets an average of 34 MPG.
Quote from: Zeffy on October 02, 2016, 10:16:38 AM
6.875%? What a compromise... Meanwhile, it'll cost me more to fill up, but thankfully my Civic gets an average of 34 MPG.
Yeah...for a $10 purchase you save a penny...$100 you save a dime. Its not much at all...but 6(something)% sounds better than 7% so thsts probably what they were aiming for.
Well, the gas tax hike hit hard overnight. Prices of what were around $1.94 in my area have risen to about $2.23. Thank god for my fuel efficient Civic which gets 34 MPG combined. Now the question becomes what will that tax hike be used for... Despite them saying for transportation improvements, I am highly skeptical in these funds not being used elsewhere.
Well, it was nice being the 2nd lowest gas tax in the nation. Now we're the 6th highest. Woo.
Quote from: Zeffy on November 01, 2016, 08:39:44 AMNow the question becomes what will that tax hike be used for... Despite them saying for transportation improvements, I am highly skeptical in these funds not being used elsewhere.
According to this Burlington County Times article (http://www.burlingtoncountytimes.com/news/local/election/ballot-question-no-being-linked-to-gas-tax-increase/article_c289f92e-9f9f-11e6-a2f2-0bf864eaeda9.html), there will be ballot referendum (Question No. 2) on the matter.
While the referendum will
not repeal the gas tax; its intended goal is to make sure that the revenue indeed goes to the transportation fund and not the general fund.
Quote from: Burlington County Times article"What voter approval of Question No. 2 will do is ensure that every single cent of that increase goes towards improving the transportation infrastructure of New Jersey, and not for any other purpose."
Some opponents of the gas tax hike also agree that the dedication is sound policy.
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 01, 2016, 08:59:56 AM
Quote from: Zeffy on November 01, 2016, 08:39:44 AMNow the question becomes what will that tax hike be used for... Despite them saying for transportation improvements, I am highly skeptical in these funds not being used elsewhere.
According to this Burlington County Times article (http://www.burlingtoncountytimes.com/news/local/election/ballot-question-no-being-linked-to-gas-tax-increase/article_c289f92e-9f9f-11e6-a2f2-0bf864eaeda9.html), there will be ballot referendum (Question No. 2) on the matter.
While the referendum will not repeal the gas tax; its intended goal is to make sure that the revenue indeed goes to the transportation fund and not the general fund.
Quote from: Burlington County Times article"What voter approval of Question No. 2 will do is ensure that every single cent of that increase goes towards improving the transportation infrastructure of New Jersey, and not for any other purpose."
Some opponents of the gas tax hike also agree that the dedication is sound policy.
If I read the question correctly on my sample ballot, the proposal is to use all of the *diesel* tax for transportation (currently something like 2% of it does not). The regular gas tax already goes into the trust fund, 100%
Will there be more pressure for allowing self service gasoiline in NJ if it will lowere the price?
LGMS428
Quote from: jwolfer on November 01, 2016, 01:34:45 PM
Will there be more pressure for allowing self service gasoiline in NJ if it will lowere the price?
LGMS428
Historically, no. It hasn't even been considered. And there's been some debate if it would actually reduce the price.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 01, 2016, 01:43:03 PM
Quote from: jwolfer on November 01, 2016, 01:34:45 PM
Will there be more pressure for allowing self service gasoiline in NJ if it will lowere the price?
LGMS428
Historically, no. It hasn't even been considered. And there's been some debate if it would actually reduce the price.
The big oil companies will have a lower cost for sure.. .. They spread some money around to legislators and it will pass. Maybe lower the price a penny or 2 for a time
Its not that difficult to pump gas, contrary to what many in NJ think. And in my experience many Self serve is usually faster. No need to wait for one dude to pump gas in multiple cars and handle payments.
How do the prices compare to PA, NY and DE now?
LGMS428
Quote from: jwolfer on November 01, 2016, 01:54:06 PM
How do the prices compare to PA, NY and DE now?
LGMS428
DE has the lowest prices in the region now.
Quote from: bzakharin on November 01, 2016, 10:01:30 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 01, 2016, 08:59:56 AM
Quote from: Zeffy on November 01, 2016, 08:39:44 AMNow the question becomes what will that tax hike be used for... Despite them saying for transportation improvements, I am highly skeptical in these funds not being used elsewhere.
According to this Burlington County Times article (http://www.burlingtoncountytimes.com/news/local/election/ballot-question-no-being-linked-to-gas-tax-increase/article_c289f92e-9f9f-11e6-a2f2-0bf864eaeda9.html), there will be ballot referendum (Question No. 2) on the matter.
While the referendum will not repeal the gas tax; its intended goal is to make sure that the revenue indeed goes to the transportation fund and not the general fund.
Quote from: Burlington County Times article"What voter approval of Question No. 2 will do is ensure that every single cent of that increase goes towards improving the transportation infrastructure of New Jersey, and not for any other purpose."
Some opponents of the gas tax hike also agree that the dedication is sound policy.
If I read the question correctly on my sample ballot, the proposal is to use all of the *diesel* tax for transportation (currently something like 2% of it does not). The regular gas tax already goes into the trust fund, 100%
Here's a better link (and non-paywalled) showing the full text of the question/interpretive statement. The regular motor vehicle fuel tax does not fully go into the TTF, a yes vote would dedicate that.
Interestingly enough, our lieutenant governor opposes it because she believes some conspiracy mentioned by a 101.5 radio host about bonding and misuse of funds (the latter will happen whether it's yes or no). I think there's also a little bit of "I wanna be governor next time and if Mr. 21%-approval is for it, I'm automatically against it" and counting on the votes of stupid people who think it's only a public vote on the gas tax.
What about pressure to get people to refuel in NJ? I'm sure there are many people who would refuel in NJ that are now avoiding it because the price no longer offsets the inconvenience of having to deal with a gas jockey. And that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
Quote from: vdeane on November 01, 2016, 06:17:54 PM
What about pressure to get people to refuel in NJ? I'm sure there are many people who would refuel in NJ that are now avoiding it because the price no longer offsets the inconvenience of having to deal with a gas jockey. And that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
You say that, but there are a bunch of people, mainly older, who specifically search out full-service stations. Look at the uproar in Huntington whenever anyone suggests removing the self-service ban.
Quote from: bzakharin on November 01, 2016, 10:01:30 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 01, 2016, 08:59:56 AM
Quote from: Zeffy on November 01, 2016, 08:39:44 AMNow the question becomes what will that tax hike be used for... Despite them saying for transportation improvements, I am highly skeptical in these funds not being used elsewhere.
According to this Burlington County Times article (http://www.burlingtoncountytimes.com/news/local/election/ballot-question-no-being-linked-to-gas-tax-increase/article_c289f92e-9f9f-11e6-a2f2-0bf864eaeda9.html), there will be ballot referendum (Question No. 2) on the matter.
While the referendum will not repeal the gas tax; its intended goal is to make sure that the revenue indeed goes to the transportation fund and not the general fund.
Quote from: Burlington County Times article"What voter approval of Question No. 2 will do is ensure that every single cent of that increase goes towards improving the transportation infrastructure of New Jersey, and not for any other purpose."
Some opponents of the gas tax hike also agree that the dedication is sound policy.
If I read the question correctly on my sample ballot, the proposal is to use all of the *diesel* tax for transportation (currently something like 2% of it does not). The regular gas tax already goes into the trust fund, 100%
That's what I thought at first. Actually, the tax increase is to the
petroleum products tax,
not the gas tax at the pump. And if you read the question, that tax is clearly included. Please vote yes.
Quote from: vdeane on November 01, 2016, 06:17:54 PM
What about pressure to get people to refuel in NJ? I'm sure there are many people who would refuel in NJ that are now avoiding it because the price no longer offsets the inconvenience of having to deal with a gas jockey. And that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
Living near the Delaware River; I can tell you that much of that (driving to NJ
just to refuel) is overblown. Largely because whatever savings one is gaining at the pump price; they lose while driving to/from the station and at the toll booths (at crossings south of the Scudder Falls Bridge) upon return... E-ZPass or no E-ZPass.
If one is frequently crosses the Delaware (due to job, family, etc.); the increase
may cause them to rethink (although PA's prices are usually still higher). However, if one is not crossing the river that often; they usually
don't go out of their way to NJ for the sole purpose of refueling.
Quote from: vdeane on November 01, 2016, 06:17:54 PM
What about pressure to get people to refuel in NJ? I'm sure there are many people who would refuel in NJ that are now avoiding it because the price no longer offsets the inconvenience of having to deal with a gas jockey. And that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
It won't affect a lot of limo and black car drivers and stuff from the City who take a lot of trips to EWR or Teterboro, for sure. Not only are there not a lot of stations in the City anymore, it is still a savings for them if they have to come to this side of the Hudson.
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 02, 2016, 11:41:08 AM
Quote from: vdeane on November 01, 2016, 06:17:54 PM
What about pressure to get people to refuel in NJ? I'm sure there are many people who would refuel in NJ that are now avoiding it because the price no longer offsets the inconvenience of having to deal with a gas jockey. And that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
Living near the Delaware River; I can tell you that much of that (driving to NJ just to refuel) is overblown. Largely because whatever savings one is gaining at the pump price; they lose while driving to/from the station and at the toll booths (at crossings south of the Scudder Falls Bridge) upon return... E-ZPass or no E-ZPass.
If one is frequently crosses the Delaware (due to job, family, etc.); the increase may cause them to rethink (although PA's prices are usually still higher). However, if one is not crossing the river that often; they usually don't go out of their way to NJ for the sole purpose of refueling.
Similar to our liquor/beer prices. You'll see a lot of PA cars at NJ liquor stores around holidays when people are purchasing cases of wine and beer, but people aren't going out of their way on a normal basis to save a few bucks.
Remember the hoards of people at the gas stations near the NY/PA/DE borders? Neither do I. Have I seen fairly long lines on summer weekends at the Flying J just before the Delaware Memorial Bridge? Yep. Maybe they won't be as long next summer. But we're not talking a huge hit. Those extra vehicles made up a fraction of a fraction of a percent of the tax revenue brought in to the state.
Quote from: Mr. Matté on November 01, 2016, 05:18:29 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on November 01, 2016, 10:01:30 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 01, 2016, 08:59:56 AM
Quote from: Zeffy on November 01, 2016, 08:39:44 AMNow the question becomes what will that tax hike be used for... Despite them saying for transportation improvements, I am highly skeptical in these funds not being used elsewhere.
According to this Burlington County Times article (http://www.burlingtoncountytimes.com/news/local/election/ballot-question-no-being-linked-to-gas-tax-increase/article_c289f92e-9f9f-11e6-a2f2-0bf864eaeda9.html), there will be ballot referendum (Question No. 2) on the matter.
While the referendum will not repeal the gas tax; its intended goal is to make sure that the revenue indeed goes to the transportation fund and not the general fund.
Quote from: Burlington County Times article"What voter approval of Question No. 2 will do is ensure that every single cent of that increase goes towards improving the transportation infrastructure of New Jersey, and not for any other purpose."
Some opponents of the gas tax hike also agree that the dedication is sound policy.
If I read the question correctly on my sample ballot, the proposal is to use all of the *diesel* tax for transportation (currently something like 2% of it does not). The regular gas tax already goes into the trust fund, 100%
Here's a better link (and non-paywalled) showing the full text of the question/interpretive statement. The regular motor vehicle fuel tax does not fully go into the TTF, a yes vote would dedicate that.
Interestingly enough, our lieutenant governor opposes it because she believes some conspiracy mentioned by a 101.5 radio host about bonding and misuse of funds (the latter will happen whether it's yes or no). I think there's also a little bit of "I wanna be governor next time and if Mr. 21%-approval is for it, I'm automatically against it" and counting on the votes of stupid people who think it's only a public vote on the gas tax.
This is interesting. Am I missing something though, because even after reading the opposition arguments, the ballot seems like it's saying more money goes into the TTF, which this state needs badly. Yet Kim G seems to think it will just lead to more borrowing of money against the TTF?
I'm sure you got people from Rockland County, NY crossing just to refuel. No toll there. No bridges, either. Some attendees of the Tuxedo Roadmeet did just that. And the Vince Lombardi Service Area on the Turnpike is always full of out of state travelers who top off before heading into New York.
If some people feel so strongly about having full service, change the law from a ban on self service to requiring stations to have a certain minimum percentage of their pumps be full service. Don't ban it for those of us who don't want it. I hate having to wait for a jockey and having him drop the gas cap onto the side of my car instead of using the thing on my Civic to hold it while refueling. I put up with it to save some money, but now, I'm going to avoid gassing up in NJ as much as I can. People who feel even stronger about self service have already been doing so.
No doubt there's some people that won't fuel up in Jersey that formerly did so. But as mentioned, I don't think it's going to be a noticeable dent. Those gas stations up there don't have lines into the street of NYers. In the grand scheme of things, there's thousands of gas stations throughout the state, and millions of New Jerseyans that are going to fill up in the state. Those that came into the state just to full up, or fueled up specifically to avoid higher prices elsewhere on their travels, was just a little gravy.
I do wish there was self serve in this state. Hell, even at the same price, I would be happy to use it!
Quote from: vdeane on November 02, 2016, 01:14:50 PMAnd the Vince Lombardi Service Area on the Turnpike is always full of out of state travelers who top off before heading into New York.
Just about
every Service Area along the NJ Turnpike is full of out-of-state travelers. The Turnpike's a major
pass-through highway.
Pretty sure Vince Lombardi has a higher volume of vehicles getting gas there, though. At least all the times I've refueled there, I've had to wait 10 minutes in line. Makes sense: it's the last service area in NJ. I was speaking to raw numbers, not percentage versus other service areas.
Val, my point is travelers using the Lombardi plaza to refuel, as well as any other Service Area/Plaza along the NJ Turnpike, are not just stopping there and then returning from where they came from after refueling; but rather are doing such because those Service Areas are along the way.
In my northbound travels to New England; I typically use either the Joyce Kilmer Service Area or the Montvale Plaza along the Garden State Parkway before leaving NJ. I do not head to those plazas (or even gas stations in Camden, Gloucester City or Bridgeport) just to refuel and then return home.
Here's the thing: Jersey is still cheaper than Pennsylvania (https://www.gasbuddy.com/GasPriceMap?z=8&lng=-73.51085400869141&lat=40.510206325292934) because PA has a flat tax. Jersey will probably always be cheaper than Pennsylvania unless the gas tax in Jersey skyrockets. New York is another story as it's a percentage tax- right now, prices are about equal, but if they rise, you'll see people going back to Jersey to fill up.
And as far as people going out of their way to stop at service plazas for gas, the only one that really gets that is Montvale, which (at least according to local legend) is designed so travelers on the Thruway can pop down and return without paying an additional toll. Helps that it's only 4 miles from the Thruway and a really easy on/off. Back before they raised the gas tax, I would see lines of cars going between that plaza and the Thruway for cheap gas.
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 02, 2016, 03:01:13 PM
Val, my point is travelers using the Lombardi plaza to refuel, as well as any other Service Area/Plaza along the NJ Turnpike, are not just stopping there and then returning from where they came from after refueling; but rather are doing such because those Service Areas are along the way.
In my northbound travels to New England; I typically use either the Joyce Kilmer Service Area or the Montvale Plaza along the Garden State Parkway before leaving NJ. I do not head to those plazas (or even gas stations in Camden, Gloucester City or Bridgeport) just to refuel and then return home.
Don't forget that my point also included people topping off on gas in NJ when they would have otherwise kept on driving. I've done that before too. It seems that most people are ignoring that aspect of my point while fixating on one aspect of it.
Quote from: vdeane on November 02, 2016, 07:29:04 PMIt seems that most people are ignoring that aspect of my point while fixating on one aspect of it.
From your earlier post (reposted below with
bold emphasis added):
Quote from: vdeane on November 01, 2016, 06:17:54 PMAnd that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
I hate to say this but you were the first one on this thread to insinuate that many were driving to NJ
just to get gas and then return.
My reply to your earlier post was based on 26 years of living near the Delaware River (outside of Philly) and from my own observations. If it weren't for the numerous tolled crossings; maybe there would be more people border-hopping into the Garden State
strictly for the purpose of refueling.
And if you think the elected officials may want to consider self-serve...well, it's a consideration dead on arrival: http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2016/11/will_lawmakers_end_the_self-serve_gas_ban_to_ease.html#incart_river_home
And in other road related news, this question (which has been answered many times in the newspaper already) was asked and answered again, regarding traffic light sensors:
http://www.nj.com/traffic/index.ssf/2016/11/are_those_cameras_perched_on_traffic_lights_spying.html#incart_river_home
Someone recently said to me in a conversation about this that full serve is actually cheaper than self serve because the lower insurance charged for having trained professionals pump your gas offsets the extra expense of hiring the attendants. This argument sounds fishy to me. Is there any truth to it?
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 09:04:02 AM
My reply to your earlier post was based on 26 years of living near the Delaware River (outside of Philly) and from my own observations. If it weren't for the numerous tolled crossings; maybe there would be more people border-hopping into the Garden State strictly for the purpose of refueling.
That's different from North Jersey, where people in Rockland, southern Orange and driving on the Thruway would pop over to 17 or Montvale for a cheap fill-up. I know I'm far from the only person who did that because I have seen many get gas and immediately turn around and return to New York.
Quote from: cl94 on November 03, 2016, 01:11:41 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 09:04:02 AM
My reply to your earlier post was based on 26 years of living near the Delaware River (outside of Philly) and from my own observations. If it weren't for the numerous tolled crossings; maybe there would be more people border-hopping into the Garden State strictly for the purpose of refueling.
That's different from North Jersey, where people in Rockland, southern Orange and driving on the Thruway would pop over to 17 or Montvale for a cheap fill-up. I know I'm far from the only person who did that because I have seen many get gas and immediately turn around and return to New York.
That area's one exception. From the metropolitan NYC area and south; the tolled river/border crossings make such cost prohibitive.
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 01:18:18 PM
Quote from: cl94 on November 03, 2016, 01:11:41 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 09:04:02 AM
My reply to your earlier post was based on 26 years of living near the Delaware River (outside of Philly) and from my own observations. If it weren't for the numerous tolled crossings; maybe there would be more people border-hopping into the Garden State strictly for the purpose of refueling.
That's different from North Jersey, where people in Rockland, southern Orange and driving on the Thruway would pop over to 17 or Montvale for a cheap fill-up. I know I'm far from the only person who did that because I have seen many get gas and immediately turn around and return to New York.
That area's one exception. From the metropolitan NYC area and south; the tolled river/border crossings make such cost prohibitive.
Depends on the savings and size of the fill-up. Up near the Canadian border, people cross just for gas all the time, even near Buffalo where it's a $3.50 toll and a long wait at customs.
Quote from: bzakharin on November 03, 2016, 12:34:45 PM
Someone recently said to me in a conversation about this that full serve is actually cheaper than self serve because the lower insurance charged for having trained professionals pump your gas offsets the extra expense of hiring the attendants. This argument sounds fishy to me. Is there any truth to it?
If there was, I would think we'd have a lot more full serve across the rest of the country.
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 09:04:02 AM
Quote from: vdeane on November 02, 2016, 07:29:04 PMIt seems that most people are ignoring that aspect of my point while fixating on one aspect of it.
From your earlier post (reposted below with bold emphasis added):
Quote from: vdeane on November 01, 2016, 06:17:54 PMAnd that's on top of losing the people who only went to NJ to get gas, or were specifically maximizing the amount bought in NJ.
I hate to say this but you were the first one on this thread to insinuate that many were driving to NJ just to get gas and then return.
My reply to your earlier post was based on 26 years of living near the Delaware River (outside of Philly) and from my own observations. If it weren't for the numerous tolled crossings; maybe there would be more people border-hopping into the Garden State strictly for the purpose of refueling.
I have expanded the bold emphasis and included underlining to emphasize the rest of my point, which you seem to be ignoring so you can attack me. And yes, I remember people at the Tuxedo roadmeet mentioning dipping into NJ before heading back north to get gas. You may think of the Hudson Valley/Northern NJ area as an exception, but as a lifelong resident of upstate NY, my perspective is of this area, not down south.
And I'm not the first. From a comment on one of the articles jeffandnicole just shared:
QuoteI'm amazed that there's actually a school of thought that people come over from New York or Pennsylvania for the "convenience" of full serve. People drive to NJ to fill up because its cheaper. That's it. Waiting for a gas attendant to finally come over to your car to fill the tank and take your payment, then wander off to another vehicle, then another, then another, then finally come back to your car so you can actually leave is not a convenience.
And yeah, it's not convenient at all to have to deal with a jockey. I intent to never refuel in NJ again if I can avoid it on that count alone. It was one thing when it was cheap. It's another when the price is nearly the same as everywhere else. There are others on this forum who wouldn't get gas in NJ even when it was cheap because of the self-serve ban. If they care so much about having full serve, make it mandatory for gas stations to offer it on at least half the pumps. Don't take away the choice from the rest of us.
Quote from: bzakharin on November 03, 2016, 12:34:45 PM
Someone recently said to me in a conversation about this that full serve is actually cheaper than self serve because the lower insurance charged for having trained professionals pump your gas offsets the extra expense of hiring the attendants. This argument sounds fishy to me. Is there any truth to it?
Pumping gas is VERY difficult and complex.
I am certain gas stations in New Jersey spend a lot on training for their attendants. Sending them off to gas pumping seminars for weekends
Here's an idea, the state could start requiring licenced gas pump attendants. There could be a $250 fee for the licence. And to protect the public there should be $1000 fine for unlicenced gas pumping.
LGMS428
Quote from: vdeane on November 03, 2016, 01:26:58 PMIf they care so much about having full serve, make it mandatory for gas stations to offer it on at least half the pumps. Don't take away the choice from the rest of us.
In southeastern PA, some stations do offer full-serve pumps along with self-serve pumps; but the price for full-serve, on average, is about 30 cents/gallon higher than the adjacent self-serve price.
In eastern MA (North Shore area), stations offering full-service are getting rarer but the prices were comparable to self-serve stations. My mother, who never pumped her own gas in her 60 years of driving, cursed the day that the Salem, MA Prime Energy station expanded but eliminated full-serve. When that happened, I jokingly recommended that she move to NJ or Oregon. Fortunately, for her, there are still a couple of stations in neighboring Swampscott that offer full-serve.
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 01:53:44 PM
Quote from: vdeane on November 03, 2016, 01:26:58 PMIf they care so much about having full serve, make it mandatory for gas stations to offer it on at least half the pumps. Don't take away the choice from the rest of us.
In southeastern PA, some stations do offer full-serve pumps along with self-serve pumps; but the price for full-serve, on average, is about 30 cents/gallon higher than the adjacent self-serve price.
In eastern MA (North Shore area), stations offering full-service are getting rarer but the prices were comparable to self-serve stations. My mother, who never pumped her own gas in her 60 years of driving, cursed the day that the Salem, MA Prime Energy station expanded but eliminated full-serve. When that happened, I jokingly recommended that she move to NJ or Oregon. Fortunately, for her, there are still a couple of stations in neighboring Swampscott that offer full-serve.
Heck, there are even a decent amount of full-serve stations here in Albany. I can think of several within a 10-15 minute drive of my apartment. Buffalo has quite a few as well.
Quote from: jwolfer on November 03, 2016, 01:31:50 PM
...And to protect the public there should be $1000 fine for unlicenced gas pumping.
LGMS428
There is a fine to the gas station if they allow someone to pump their own gas. From anything I can tell, no one has ever been charged with this 'crime'. I don't even know if it's something the police would deal with, or if it's another organization from the state that would be in charge of fining a station.
Quote from: cl94 on November 03, 2016, 01:25:05 PM
Depends on the savings and size of the fill-up. Up near the Canadian border, people cross just for gas all the time, even near Buffalo where it's a $3.50 toll and a long wait at customs.
Why would someone cross the border to save a few dollars ($20 at the most) for gas but yet wait an hour or two in line...wasting that gas?
Again, I can see people fueling up prior to crossing, but I doubt there's very many that would take up their afternoon just to get gas.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 03, 2016, 02:14:54 PM
Why would someone cross the border to save a few dollars ($20 at the most) for gas but yet wait an hour or two in line...wasting that gas?
Again, I can see people fueling up prior to crossing, but I doubt there's very many that would take up their afternoon just to get gas.
Depends on fuel economy, size of tank, exchange rate and whether or not they have NEXUS. It's only about a $9 savings if getting 10 gallons with the current exchange rate, but when things were par, you could save $20, especially if they crossed at the Whirlpool Bridge which never has a wait (NEXUS only).
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 03, 2016, 01:53:44 PM
Quote from: vdeane on November 03, 2016, 01:26:58 PMIf they care so much about having full serve, make it mandatory for gas stations to offer it on at least half the pumps. Don't take away the choice from the rest of us.
In southeastern PA, some stations do offer full-serve pumps along with self-serve pumps; but the price for full-serve, on average, is about 30 cents/gallon higher than the adjacent self-serve price.
In eastern MA (North Shore area), stations offering full-service are getting rarer but the prices were comparable to self-serve stations. My mother, who never pumped her own gas in her 60 years of driving, cursed the day that the Salem, MA Prime Energy station expanded but eliminated full-serve. When that happened, I jokingly recommended that she move to NJ or Oregon. Fortunately, for her, there are still a couple of stations in neighboring Swampscott that offer full-serve.
I remember a Mobil station in Northeast Philly proudly proclaiming "We pump your gas - Sam Price!". Of course, said price was around what other full serve stations in that area charged.
Plenty of people duck into NJ to get fuel and other things that are taxed less, like smokes. The size of the stations on NJ-23 in Montague off of I-84 NY Exit 1 is proof enough. People from PA cross over all the time to go to liquor stores that don't suck and have better hours, the cheap gas is part of the trip.
Quote from: NJRoadfan on November 03, 2016, 04:40:53 PMPlenty of people duck into NJ to get fuel and other things that are taxed less, like smokes.
The varying cigarette taxes, depending on the state, can conceivably create a situation where a pack or carton sold in
State A costing twice as much as the same item sold in
State B. Definitely an incentive to buy outside or across state lines for sure.
However, I don't believe we've gotten to the point yet where the total price per gallon of gas in one state costing twice as much as in a nearby or adjacent state.
BTW, Delaware has lower taxes on cigarettes than PA
and NJ.
Quote from: NJRoadfan on November 03, 2016, 04:40:53 PM
Plenty of people duck into NJ to get fuel and other things that are taxed less, like smokes. The size of the stations on NJ-23 in Montague off of I-84 NY Exit 1 is proof enough.
I see 6 stations there. Not unusual. Using GSV, none of them have all that many cars at the stations.
Basically, there's a bunch of stations off an interstate highway interchange. A sight repeated thousands of times everywhere.
Obviously nobody was driving all day just to get gas in NJ. That would be absurd. But if you live or are passing by the border, I could see people getting gas where they otherwise wouldn't have, which was the whole point, which people seem to miss. Now, NJ 23 is a rural area, so it's mainly going to see people who know that the NY/NJ/PA tripoint is near there. But somewhere more urban, or more obvious (like a highway service plaza)? Sure. But, of course, hoards don't all descent at once; the out of state travelers don't all coordinate with posts like "lets all get gas right when the Google street view car goes by". There's only so far that's economical to divert, or to top off.
I was talking about people who live in Ramapo getting gas in Mahwah, or people with 3/4 tank refueling at the last station in NJ, not people driving dozens of miles just for some gas. Good grief.
They definitely dip down from Rockland, at one point I recall it was $1/gal less to fill up in NJ!
Quote from: vdeane on November 03, 2016, 09:25:23 PM
But, of course, hoards don't all descent at once; the out of state travelers don't all coordinate with posts like "lets all get gas right when the Google street view car goes by". There's only so far that's economical to divert, or to top off.
I know that...but the points of people saying that people come down all the time and pointing out all the gas stations there, combined with a random drive by of the gsv vehicle, shows that there aren't legions of vehicles lining up for gas.
And while I hear your points loud and clear that some people may have gotten gas that otherwise wouldn't have, and now they'll just keep driving...we'll just have to wait and see. Some people may continue to do it out of habit. Then again, I see plenty of people getting gas on 95 In Delaware which has historically been much higher in price. For many people, they simply see that their tank is 1/4 full and it's time to get gas. They don't even see the price on the sign.
I've been to the Citgo at the NY/NJ line off of I-84 Exit 1 from NY. I don't remember what the prices were, but was amazed that the parking lot's north edge was literally only a couple feet from the line. My friend wasn't buying gas. I believe this was back in 2011.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 03, 2016, 09:58:59 PMThen again, I see plenty of people getting gas on 95 In Delaware which has historically been much higher in price. For many people, they simply see that their tank is 1/4 full and it's time to get gas. They don't even see the price on the sign.
Especially if they're paying with plastic (credit or debit card).
9 gallons today cost me $19. Gas price was $2.25 per gallon. That's maybe a $3 increase from what it was last week.
I guess it would have more of an impact on cars that have bigger fuel tanks, but at least for me it's nothing I will complain about.
Quote from: Zeffy on November 04, 2016, 02:04:53 PM
9 gallons today cost me $19. Gas price was $2.25 per gallon. That's maybe a $3 increase from what it was last week.
I guess it would have more of an impact on cars that have bigger fuel tanks, but at least for me it's nothing I will complain about.
It should be about a $2.25 increase. Gas went up 23 cents overnight, along with about 2 +/- cents for daily variations.
9 gallons last week, at about $2.00 a gallon, would've cost you $18.00.
9 gallons this week, at about $2.25 a gallon, would've cost you $20.25.
If you paid $19 at $2.25/gallon, then you got 8.444 gallons, which would've cost you $16.89 last week.
Per Gasbuddy, there still are a few stations under $2 a gallon. And I noticed that the highest priced stations, that charged $2.99 or $2.79 and never changed them previously, appears to still not be changing them and eating the cost increase. Then again, they're probably not trying real hard to sell gas either.
The 8.4 gallons sounds about right. I was rounding everything because I didn't feel like digging out the receipt from this morning.
Quote from: jwolfer on November 03, 2016, 01:31:50 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on November 03, 2016, 12:34:45 PM
Someone recently said to me in a conversation about this that full serve is actually cheaper than self serve because the lower insurance charged for having trained professionals pump your gas offsets the extra expense of hiring the attendants. This argument sounds fishy to me. Is there any truth to it?
Pumping gas is VERY difficult and complex.
So complex, any idiot can do it. Oh, wait, I see it all the time here in Illinois, people pumping their own gasoline without a gas jockey. Oh, the horror! Oh, the humanity!
/And I'm sincerely hoping jwolfer meant his comment as snark.
Quote from: Brandon on November 04, 2016, 02:27:03 PM
Quote from: jwolfer on November 03, 2016, 01:31:50 PM
Quote from: bzakharin on November 03, 2016, 12:34:45 PM
Someone recently said to me in a conversation about this that full serve is actually cheaper than self serve because the lower insurance charged for having trained professionals pump your gas offsets the extra expense of hiring the attendants. This argument sounds fishy to me. Is there any truth to it?
Pumping gas is VERY difficult and complex.
So complex, any idiot can do it. Oh, wait, I see it all the time here in Illinois, people pumping their own gasoline without a gas jockey. Oh, the horror! Oh, the humanity!
/And I'm sincerely hoping jwolfer meant his comment as snark.
Wow.
Quote from: vdeane on November 03, 2016, 01:26:58 PM
....
And yeah, it's not convenient at all to have to deal with a jockey. I intent to never refuel in NJ again if I can avoid it on that count alone. It was one thing when it was cheap. It's another when the price is nearly the same as everywhere else. There are others on this forum who wouldn't get gas in NJ even when it was cheap because of the self-serve ban. If they care so much about having full serve, make it mandatory for gas stations to offer it on at least half the pumps. Don't take away the choice from the rest of us.
I'll concur with the text in boldface. About ten years ago I was up in the Trenton area for a month on business and I drove across to Pennsylvania to buy gas (yes, I paid the toll to do so) because I won't go to full-serve stations unless it's an emergency, partly for reasons similar to the ones you've already mentioned elsewhere in this thread. Annoyed me all the more when the first station I came to in Pennsylvania was full-serve only....the guy was surprised when I said "forget it" and drove away.
I can think of other places I won't buy gas, but those are for price reasons (crazy to buy gas in DC when it's substantially cheaper right across the river in Virginia, for example).
On the other hand, I know someone from Southside Virginia (she lives in McKenney, for those who know the area) who refuses to pump her own gas, regardless of how much cheaper it may be, and will drive 40 miles out of the way if that's necessary to find full-serve.
I'd never even been to a full service gas station before until last month. East of Sault Ste Marie there is an Esso station near the road that goes to St Joseph Island and it was full service. I was pretty surprised when a guy came up to my window and asked me how much gas I wanted.
Once upon a time, full-serve was all there was regardless of location. I only started seeing self-serve stations pop up in (at least eastern) Massachusetts was during the early-to-mid 70s (as a kid while riding w/my parents).
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 07, 2016, 10:45:46 PM
Quote from: vdeane on November 03, 2016, 01:26:58 PM
....
And yeah, it's not convenient at all to have to deal with a jockey. I intent to never refuel in NJ again if I can avoid it on that count alone. It was one thing when it was cheap. It's another when the price is nearly the same as everywhere else. There are others on this forum who wouldn't get gas in NJ even when it was cheap because of the self-serve ban. If they care so much about having full serve, make it mandatory for gas stations to offer it on at least half the pumps. Don't take away the choice from the rest of us.
I'll concur with the text in boldface. About ten years ago I was up in the Trenton area for a month on business and I drove across to Pennsylvania to buy gas (yes, I paid the toll to do so) because I won't go to full-serve stations unless it's an emergency, partly for reasons similar to the ones you've already mentioned elsewhere in this thread. Annoyed me all the more when the first station I came to in Pennsylvania was full-serve only....the guy was surprised when I said "forget it" and drove away.
Sounds like you were in Morrisville, PA. I think all the gas stations there are full serve for some reason.
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 07, 2016, 10:45:46 PM
I can think of other places I won't buy gas, but those are for price reasons (crazy to buy gas in DC when it's substantially cheaper right across the river in Virginia, for example).
Though I have found that pump prices for fuel in Northern Virginia are usually several cents cheaper in Prince William County, because fuel sold there is not subject to the NVTC "stealth" sales tax that is collected to subsidize WMATA trains and buses (since there is no WMATA service of any kind in Prince William County).
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 08, 2016, 11:02:37 AM
Once upon a time, full-serve was all there was regardless of location. I only started seeing self-serve stations pop up in (at least eastern) Massachusetts was during the early-to-mid 70s (as a kid while riding w/my parents).
When I got my learner's permit in late 1977, I recall the mix of stations in the Lynn and Salem areas was about 60% full serve and 40% self serve.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 08, 2016, 02:45:02 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 07, 2016, 10:45:46 PM
I can think of other places I won't buy gas, but those are for price reasons (crazy to buy gas in DC when it's substantially cheaper right across the river in Virginia, for example).
Though I have found that pump prices for fuel in Northern Virginia are usually several cents cheaper in Prince William County, because fuel sold there is not subject to the NVTC "stealth" sales tax that is collected to subsidize WMATA trains and buses (since there is no WMATA service of any kind in Prince William County).
Often true, but unless I have a reason to be in Prince William I don't bother. I'd use enough gas roundtrip to cancel out the savings.
I think the reason people from outside of New Jersey (and Oregon) are afraid to refuel in New Jersey is because of the long lines they see at the Turnpike Sunocos. At least that's what keeps me from doing so.
Quote from: epzik8 on November 11, 2016, 04:46:20 PM
I think the reason people from outside of New Jersey (and Oregon) are afraid to refuel in New Jersey is because of the long lines they see at the Turnpike Sunocos. At least that's what keeps me from doing so.
On busy travel periods, yes. It doesn't help when they don't have all the pumps open (a big issue for me because of the full service). But, you're not going to see those long lines until you pull into the service area, and if you need gas, chances are you're not going to get to the next state without fueling up.
True, but one experience like that, and I imagine someone might start refueling in PA/DE/NY near the border specifically to make sure that doesn't happen again.
Quote from: epzik8 on November 11, 2016, 04:46:20 PM
I think the reason people from outside of New Jersey (and Oregon) are afraid to refuel in New Jersey is because of the long lines they see at the Turnpike Sunocos. At least that's what keeps me from doing so.
An advantage of having a vehicle that runs on Diesel fuel. There's seldom a queue at the Diesel pumps at the New Jersey Turnpike's Sunoco stations, though sometimes the service is a little slow.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 12, 2016, 06:47:46 PM
Quote from: epzik8 on November 11, 2016, 04:46:20 PM
I think the reason people from outside of New Jersey (and Oregon) are afraid to refuel in New Jersey is because of the long lines they see at the Turnpike Sunocos. At least that's what keeps me from doing so.
An advantage of having a vehicle that runs on Diesel fuel. There's seldom a queue at the Diesel pumps at the New Jersey Turnpike's Sunoco stations, though sometimes the service is a little slow.
NJ allows self serve for diesel, though the Turnpike doesn't have it.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 12, 2016, 06:47:46 PM
Quote from: epzik8 on November 11, 2016, 04:46:20 PM
I think the reason people from outside of New Jersey (and Oregon) are afraid to refuel in New Jersey is because of the long lines they see at the Turnpike Sunocos. At least that's what keeps me from doing so.
An advantage of having a vehicle that runs on Diesel fuel. There's seldom a queue at the Diesel pumps at the New Jersey Turnpike's Sunoco stations, though sometimes the service is a little slow.
My friend in NJ drives a VW Jetta TDI...at one time when there was a gas shortage...probably post Sandy.. He had some dude get all pissed off at him and the attendant for allowing him to "cut" in front of all those eaiting for gas... The other driver moron did not understand diesel is not the same as gasoiline
LGMS428
To back up what I believe vdeane was trying to say, when I would travel to Long Island to see family, I would quite often stop at one of the NJTP service plazas to get gas even though I could easily make it to my brother's house on the gas that I bought in northern VA, Southern MD. I did this so that I would have enough gas to then get back out of NY for the return trip without having to over pay for gas out on the Island. Putting up with the lines and having someone else pump my gas was worth it to me at the cheaper prices. It won't be worth it now, so I'll go back to refueling at my terminus for the return trip like I do for every other type of trip that I go on.
As for having to have someone else pump my gas for me because it's "complex" I'm not buying it. It's one of the easiest transactions I make on any given day.
1) Park next to pump, drivers side facing it
2) Exit vehicle
3) Swipe card
4) Open fuel door (Mustangs are cap-less now, no cap to remove or lose).
5) Insert nozzle into hole
6) Squeeze handle, lock it so it continues to flow, place hands in pockets when it's cold.
7) Replace nozzle into pump
8) Press NO for car wash, retrieve receipt
9) Go on with the rest of my day.
If I can't figure out how to negotiate those 9 easy steps, then I probably don't need to be operating an almost 2 ton vehicle on the nation's roads to begin with.
Quote from: slorydn1 on December 05, 2016, 08:30:21 AM
6) Squeeze handle, lock it so it continues to flow, place hands in pockets when it's cold.
I HATE gas stations to no end that disable this feature. They're basically giving you a big middle finger by removing the spring that holds it open. Except in MA where I believe it's actually illegal, so I can give it a pass there.
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on December 05, 2016, 10:30:07 AM
Quote from: slorydn1 on December 05, 2016, 08:30:21 AM
6) Squeeze handle, lock it so it continues to flow, place hands in pockets when it's cold.
I HATE gas stations to no end that disable this feature. They're basically giving you a big middle finger by removing the spring that holds it open. Except in MA where I believe it's actually illegal, so I can give it a pass there.
Those pump
clips have been legal since Jan. 1, 2015.
Below
Boston Globe article from Jan. 13, 2015:
Gas pump clips now legal, but may take months to appear (https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2015/01/12/gas-pump-clips-now-legal-but-may-take-months-appear/kqiYuEaOLoGMe4fCUWFzdJ/story.html)
I wish we had the pump clips in NY. I got spoiled on my trip to the Birmingham roadmeet and now I don't want to live without them.
There's one station near my parents house that I almost never wash my windows at (even though I almost always want to) because there's always a HUGE line (it's the cheapest gas in the entire metro area by far) and I feel guilty about taking extra time at the end. Having the clips would solve that. Plus I'd like to be able to put my hands in my pockets when it's cold.
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on December 05, 2016, 10:30:07 AM
Quote from: slorydn1 on December 05, 2016, 08:30:21 AM
6) Squeeze handle, lock it so it continues to flow, place hands in pockets when it's cold.
I HATE gas stations to no end that disable this feature. They're basically giving you a big middle finger by removing the spring that holds it open. Except in MA where I believe it's actually illegal, so I can give it a pass there.
As of January 1, 2015, the Massachusetts ban on locking gas nozzles was eliminated. However, I'm still trying to figure out what's the issue people have with actually having to
hold a gas nozzle while you're pumping the gas. Seems to be right up there with "OMG, I have to put a license plate on the front of my car. How can I stand this
tyranny!"
Quote from: roadman on December 05, 2016, 01:21:46 PMAs of January 1, 2015, the Massachusetts ban on locking gas nozzles was eliminated. However, I'm still trying to figure out what's the issue people have with actually having to hold a gas nozzle while you're pumping the gas.
One word answer: Time.
Especially at a crowded station (see the Prime Energy station in Salem and/or the Pilot station in Sturbridge as examples).
Those clips allow someone (especially if they're driving alone) to wash their windshield
while refueling.
Quote from: PHLBOS on December 05, 2016, 01:36:32 PM
Quote from: roadman on December 05, 2016, 01:21:46 PMAs of January 1, 2015, the Massachusetts ban on locking gas nozzles was eliminated. However, I'm still trying to figure out what's the issue people have with actually having to hold a gas nozzle while you're pumping the gas.
One word answer: Time.
Especially at a crowded station (see the Prime Energy station in Salem and/or the Pilot station in Sturbridge as examples).
Those clips allow someone (especially if they're driving alone) to wash their windshield while refueling.
Fair point PHLBOS. Guess I'm too used to having grown up in Massachusetts where nozzle clips were illegal for all those years. I've also had a couple of instances where the nozzle didn't automatically shut off. So I guess it's second nature for me to always hold the nozzle down when getting gas.
Don't you people just jam the gas cap in the handle instead??
Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 05, 2016, 01:53:55 PM
Don't you people just jam the gas cap in the handle instead??
Hard to do when your car doesn't have a gas cap.
Quote from: roadman on December 05, 2016, 02:40:38 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 05, 2016, 01:53:55 PM
Don't you people just jam the gas cap in the handle instead??
Hard to do when your car doesn't have a gas cap.
Ford in particular doesn't have them on their newer cars.
As far as the locking nozzles, New York hasn't allowed them on new installs for quite a while and very few stations have them.
Oh wow, I'd hate not having locking nozzles on gas pumps. It's pretty cold here today (i.e. under 40 degrees), and it's nice to be able to go inside my warm car and not freeze my butt off standing outside pumping my gas.
Quote from: PHLBOS on December 05, 2016, 01:36:32 PM
Quote from: roadman on December 05, 2016, 01:21:46 PMAs of January 1, 2015, the Massachusetts ban on locking gas nozzles was eliminated. However, I'm still trying to figure out what's the issue people have with actually having to hold a gas nozzle while you're pumping the gas.
One word answer: Time.
Especially at a crowded station (see the Prime Energy station in Salem and/or the Pilot station in Sturbridge as examples).
Those clips allow someone (especially if they're driving alone) to wash their windshield while refueling.
Another answer: I've refueled in 0 degree weather at places without clips. The gas handle has at least some metal parts. Even with gloves on, that shit gets cold quickly.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 05, 2016, 01:53:55 PM
Don't you people just jam the gas cap in the handle instead??
That sounds like a great way to overfill the tank.
Quote from: Alps on December 05, 2016, 08:35:36 PM
That sounds like a great way to overfill the tank.
Just to point out, it's hardly me that thought of the idea. Large stickers on the pumps show that this has been going on for quite a while...
http://archive.boston.com/news/local/blogs/starts-and-stops/2014/01/06/the-life-hack-that-major-gas-caps-for-hands-free-fueling/BbCvpVuR3tQv39ns0KFPiL/blog.html
Quote from: Alps on December 05, 2016, 08:35:36 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on December 05, 2016, 01:36:32 PM
Quote from: roadman on December 05, 2016, 01:21:46 PMAs of January 1, 2015, the Massachusetts ban on locking gas nozzles was eliminated. However, I'm still trying to figure out what's the issue people have with actually having to hold a gas nozzle while you're pumping the gas.
One word answer: Time.
Especially at a crowded station (see the Prime Energy station in Salem and/or the Pilot station in Sturbridge as examples).
Those clips allow someone (especially if they're driving alone) to wash their windshield while refueling.
Another answer: I've refueled in 0 degree weather at places without clips. The gas handle has at least some metal parts. Even with gloves on, that shit gets cold quickly.
And another: I am tall enough, and the fueling port on vehicles I typically drive is low enough, that if I need to bend over in order to hold the handle on the pump down. If I can lock it, I can stand up straight while the gas is pumping, reducing back strain.
As for jamming the nozzle using the gas cap, I would not do this because unlike a proper lock it will not automatically shut off when the tank is full, inevitably leading to an incomplete fill or spillage. Meanwhile, my fiancée's car does not have a gas cap and since this feature has become increasingly common in new vehicles there is a good chance my next one won't either.
Quote from: Duke87 on December 05, 2016, 11:22:11 PM
As for jamming the nozzle using the gas cap, I would not do this because unlike a proper lock it will not automatically shut off when the tank is full, inevitably leading to an incomplete fill or spillage. Meanwhile, my fiancée's car does not have a gas cap and since this feature has become increasingly common in new vehicles there is a good chance my next one won't either.
Ditto. Besides, my gas cap is attached to the car.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 05, 2016, 10:34:10 PM
Quote from: Alps on December 05, 2016, 08:35:36 PM
That sounds like a great way to overfill the tank.
Just to point out, it's hardly me that thought of the idea. Large stickers on the pumps show that this has been going on for quite a while...
http://archive.boston.com/news/local/blogs/starts-and-stops/2014/01/06/the-life-hack-that-major-gas-caps-for-hands-free-fueling/BbCvpVuR3tQv39ns0KFPiL/blog.html
Two things worth noting, especially when one clicks and reads the linked-article:
1. It was written in Massachusetts nearly 3 years ago, when nozzle clips were still illegal in that state.
2. It's stating that the very act of jamming the fuel cap to hold the nozzle open is illegal. I'm guessing that such hasn't changed when the nozzle clip ban was lifted almost 2 years ago.
Quote from: vdeane on December 06, 2016, 01:12:40 PM
Quote from: Duke87 on December 05, 2016, 11:22:11 PM
As for jamming the nozzle using the gas cap, I would not do this because unlike a proper lock it will not automatically shut off when the tank is full, inevitably leading to an incomplete fill or spillage. Meanwhile, my fiancée's car does not have a gas cap and since this feature has become increasingly common in new vehicles there is a good chance my next one won't either.
Ditto. Besides, my gas cap is attached to the car.
Mine too, so that's not an option. If the pump doesn't have one, so be it. But having one and disabling it irks me as much as having to pay 6 cents more a gallon to use a debit card, and even moreso when it's 0 degrees.
Quote from: vdeane on December 06, 2016, 01:12:40 PM
Quote from: Duke87 on December 05, 2016, 11:22:11 PM
As for jamming the nozzle using the gas cap, I would not do this because unlike a proper lock it will not automatically shut off when the tank is full, inevitably leading to an incomplete fill or spillage. Meanwhile, my fiancée's car does not have a gas cap and since this feature has become increasingly common in new vehicles there is a good chance my next one won't either.
Ditto. Besides, my gas cap is attached to the car.
Mine is as well (on the car I drive most, anyway), but the tether isn't so short as to prohibit jamming the cap in the handle. I've done that once only–we were at Mont-Tremblant and the wind chill was —30°C or lower and the pump didn't have the hold-open thing (I believe I read somewhere they're illegal in Canada).
Quote from: 1995hoo on December 07, 2016, 10:02:58 PM
Quote from: vdeane on December 06, 2016, 01:12:40 PM
Quote from: Duke87 on December 05, 2016, 11:22:11 PM
As for jamming the nozzle using the gas cap, I would not do this because unlike a proper lock it will not automatically shut off when the tank is full, inevitably leading to an incomplete fill or spillage. Meanwhile, my fiancée's car does not have a gas cap and since this feature has become increasingly common in new vehicles there is a good chance my next one won't either.
Ditto. Besides, my gas cap is attached to the car.
Mine is as well (on the car I drive most, anyway), but the tether isn't so short as to prohibit jamming the cap in the handle. I've done that once only–we were at Mont-Tremblant and the wind chill was —30°C or lower and the pump didn't have the hold-open thing (I believe I read somewhere they're illegal in Canada).
This short article is two years old, but I'm assuming they're still illegal in Canada (http://www.ontariomutuals.com/blog/why-you-wont-find-trigger-locks-at-canadas-gas-stations (http://www.ontariomutuals.com/blog/why-you-wont-find-trigger-locks-at-canadas-gas-stations)). I've never used one before.
Only a week after my last post, I found a gas handle lock at the Canadian Tire Gas Bar at the Trenton ONRoute (401 EB). So now I'm not sure if they're still illegal in Canada, or if I found an exception.
I checked the gas station I usually use in Kitchener and it didn't have a gas handle lock.
Well, PA just hiked its gas tax again (last phase of Act 89); so prices in NJ are once again likely cheaper than they are across the Delaware.
Looks like they are, according to Gas Buddy. PA is more expensive than NY, though. Never thought NY would be less expensive than one of its US neighbors. NJ, once an island of green/yellow, now blends in with its neighbors, and PA is now an island of red.
Quote from: vdeane on January 03, 2017, 08:53:10 PM
Looks like they are, according to Gas Buddy. PA is more expensive than NY, though. Never thought NY would be less expensive than one of its US neighbors. NJ, once an island of green/yellow, now blends in with its neighbors, and PA is now an island of red.
PA has been more expensive than NY since at least mid-summer. When I got gas heading to the Birmingham meet, for example, I paid 20 cents more than I did in Albany. Ditto for my clinchfest in PA and the Southern Tier right before Christmas, except that was 20 cents more than
Buffalo. Never thought I'd see the day when prices in PA are more expensive than Westchester and NYC, though.
Recent trip: MD is slightly cheaper than NJ, DE is slightly more expensive. Probably varies with the tides.
Recent trip: NC is more expensive then NJ, esp. for premium grades of fuel (NC's gas tax is about the same as NJ's now). Same goes for areas of VA.
Quote from: NJRoadfan on January 04, 2017, 04:51:12 PM
Recent trip: NC is more expensive then NJ, esp. for premium grades of fuel (NC's gas tax is about the same as NJ's now). Same goes for areas of VA.
Because of local transportation districts in some (urban and suburban areas) of Virginia impose taxes above and beyond what the Commonwealth charges, which causes prices to vary a fair amount.
Weekend trip to VA:
Give or take a dime, NJ, DE, MD & VA are all about the same - $2.25 to $2.40 or so. Per Gasbuddy some nearby stations were in the $2.teens in Virginia, but I never passed by them on my travels.
Drove into DC just to ride around; saw one station at $3.05 for Regular there!
Left Saturday at 2pm; I-295 here in NJ was horrible with the ever-increasing snowfall amounts. Delaware's I-95 was much better, and by MD we were traveling at normal highway speeds.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on January 09, 2017, 12:09:19 PM
Drove into DC just to ride around; saw one station at $3.05 for Regular there!
Cheapest prices for gas in D.C. are usually to be found at the Costco on New York Avenue, N.E. (U.S. 50) just east of South Dakota Avenue (if you have a Costco card). That Costco is often 30¢ or more less than other stations for unleaded regular (unfortunately, it does not sell Diesel fuel).
It is difficult to reach if you do not know the streets, and to exit, nearly all traffic has to use South Dakota Avenue, N.E., which means going there in the P.M. peak period is a major mistake.
I happened to be in Delaware yesterday (in the span of 4 hours...NJ, Ikea in Philly, meeting in Delaware a mile from MD, and back to NJ)...and needed gas. I looked up Gasbuddy.
The Pilot, Flying J, and a newly opened Wawa, all in NJ just off the Delaware Memorial Bridge were at $2.25. In Delaware, I don't think there was a single station under $2.30 anywhere along my 2 possible routes back (95 & 40), and most were in the $2.35 - $2.40 range.
While the $2.25 was lower than average throughout much of NJ, it's not incredible lower.
In the past, NJ would be about a dime or 15 cents cheaper than DE. With the 23c tax hike, it would stand to reason DE would now be slightly cheaper. Instead, I'm starting to consistently find them more expensive!
Quote from: jeffandnicole on January 10, 2017, 02:26:46 PM
I happened to be in Delaware yesterday (in the span of 4 hours...NJ, Ikea in Philly, meeting in Delaware a mile from MD, and back to NJ)...and needed gas. I looked up Gasbuddy.
The Pilot, Flying J, and a newly opened Wawa, all in NJ just off the Delaware Memorial Bridge were at $2.25. In Delaware, I don't think there was a single station under $2.30 anywhere along my 2 possible routes back (95 & 40), and most were in the $2.35 - $2.40 range.
While the $2.25 was lower than average throughout much of NJ, it's not incredible lower.
The cheapest gas in NJ moves around significantly over time. Just along my commute, the following places had the cheapest gas at on point in the last 3+ years: Cherry Hill, Marlton, Turnersville, Berlin, Winslow, and Egg Harbor Township. There are times when Carneys Point is cheaper than all of them (like right now), and there are times it's actually the most expensive.
Quote
In the past, NJ would be about a dime or 15 cents cheaper than DE. With the 23c tax hike, it would stand to reason DE would now be slightly cheaper. Instead, I'm starting to consistently find them more expensive!
They were slightly cheaper for the first few weeks. Don't know what happened. Supply and demand?