Wisconsin notes

[20160805]

Mike--thanks for all the updates about incorporation efforts.  You answered several questions that I've had for awhile. 

I also agree with your point about consolidating governmental units.  In the interest of providing comprehensive and more efficient services, it makes sense to have a metropolitan perspective.  In Fox Crossing 's case, how many people live, work and shop exclusively within it? ( I think the name is silly too, even something like Little Butte des Morts would have made more sense). I suspect that most households within it have a daily interaction with Appleton or Neenah, Menasha, or Grand Chute. 

I grew up in an very old incorporated Wisconsin suburb, and on an emotional level, I would hate to see it merge with the surrounding city, but I realize that it can't be as efficient anymore and is increasingly sharing services with adjacent communities.

I agree.  Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

[mgk920]

Mike--thanks for all the updates about incorporation efforts.  You answered several questions that I've had for awhile. 

I also agree with your point about consolidating governmental units.  In the interest of providing comprehensive and more efficient services, it makes sense to have a metropolitan perspective.  In Fox Crossing 's case, how many people live, work and shop exclusively within it? ( I think the name is silly too, even something like Little Butte des Morts would have made more sense). I suspect that most households within it have a daily interaction with Appleton or Neenah, Menasha, or Grand Chute. 

I grew up in an very old incorporated Wisconsin suburb, and on an emotional level, I would hate to see it merge with the surrounding city, but I realize that it can't be as efficient anymore and is increasingly sharing services with adjacent communities.

I agree.  Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.  I wonder if it's anything like 'Deer Crossing'.   

Mike

[20160805]

Mike--thanks for all the updates about incorporation efforts.  You answered several questions that I've had for awhile. 

I also agree with your point about consolidating governmental units.  In the interest of providing comprehensive and more efficient services, it makes sense to have a metropolitan perspective.  In Fox Crossing 's case, how many people live, work and shop exclusively within it? ( I think the name is silly too, even something like Little Butte des Morts would have made more sense). I suspect that most households within it have a daily interaction with Appleton or Neenah, Menasha, or Grand Chute. 

I grew up in an very old incorporated Wisconsin suburb, and on an emotional level, I would hate to see it merge with the surrounding city, but I realize that it can't be as efficient anymore and is increasingly sharing services with adjacent communities.

I agree.  Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.  I wonder if it's anything like 'Deer Crossing'.   

Mike

Those would work too. 

Either way, I still think Bridgeview would have been a better name.

[tchafe1978]

At least they didn't go the Pewaukee route and end up with two different municipalities with the same name (City of and Village of). That should be illegal.

[triplemultiplex]

Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.

I thought it sounded like a golf course in McHenry, IL.

In my fictional maps, I went with a name uninspired in a different direction.  East of the lake, I glommed most of the township on to the city (with a few parcels for Appleton), then incorporated the area west of the lake as, get this, "West Menasha".  Brilliant.

[mgk920]

Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.

I thought it sounded like a golf course in McHenry, IL.

In my fictional maps, I went with a name uninspired in a different direction.  East of the lake, I glommed most of the township on to the city (with a few parcels for Appleton), then incorporated the area west of the lake as, get this, "West Menasha".  Brilliant.

That's similar to what I was advocating - barring a full municipal amalgamation of the metro area, I would have ceded the township's entire east side to the City of Menasha (remember that Appleton has no further territorial interests in Winnebago County) and incorporate its west side, with its development interest being westward along US 10.

Interestingly, the township that is immediately to the west (Clayton Township) officially opposed that incorporation and testified against it.  They are worried about just that.

Mike

[JMAN_WiS&S]

Big news coming for Clairemont Ave in Eau Claire, "signal head per lane" coming by 2018. Not sure if this means monotube mast arm or more trombone arms.
News article: http://www.weau.com/content/news/Critical-Crossroads-413900123.html

As for Clairemont Ave. in Eau Claire, Helgeson said a big change in store for 2018, with a concept called 'signal head per lane' stretching from Otter Rd. to Cameron Rd.

"In other words, based on the number of lanes, each lane gets its own signal head. So, rather than having just two far side signal indications - one on the right and one of the left - we will actually put the signal indications overhead - one for each lane."

I am kind of surprised they didn't do this with the 4 section FYA upgrade last summer, they could have installed extended reverse-left mounted trombone arms for the left 2 lanes. I think this indicates monotube masts.
Unfortunately I will be in College down in Platteville during this time period, so I won't get to see changes.

[jakeroot]

"concept called 'signal head per lane'"... they make it sound like it's a foreign concept (though I know it is in Wisconsin).

I'm okay with this as long as the auxiliary signal heads on the left and right remain. I know some newer signals in Eau Claire do away with the near side signal. Are near side signals still installed in Wisconsin?

[Big John]

Are near side signals still installed in Wisconsin?

Outside of Eau Claire, they are.

[20160805]

Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.

I thought it sounded like a golf course in McHenry, IL.

In my fictional maps, I went with a name uninspired in a different direction.  East of the lake, I glommed most of the township on to the city (with a few parcels for Appleton), then incorporated the area west of the lake as, get this, "West Menasha".  Brilliant.

That's similar to what I was advocating - barring a full municipal amalgamation of the metro area, I would have ceded the township's entire east side to the City of Menasha (remember that Appleton has no further territorial interests in Winnebago County) and incorporate its west side, with its development interest being westward along US 10.

Interestingly, the township that is immediately to the west (Clayton Township) officially opposed that incorporation and testified against it.  They are worried about just that.

Mike

Then you would have hundreds if not thousands of people who would now be in the City of Menasha, despite having Appleton addresses (unless the ZIP code lines are modified too).

Personally, the dividing line I would have used would have coincided with the ZIP code line; that seems to be about where the line is culturally as well, if you know what I mean.

I could actually get behind the amalgamation of the entire metro area; can you think of another metro area of similar size with as many different municipalities in it?

As such, I present to you:
The Unified City of Metro Appleton!  (Accepting all suggestions for names.)

[JMAN_WiS&S]

Are near side signals still installed in Wisconsin?

Outside of Eau Claire, they are.

Near side signals were reinstalled for both of the signal projects along river prairie Dr in neighboring Altoona, so for some reason, the city of Eau Claire doesn't mount them like that anymore. I am unaware or any city signal changes in the near future, but now quite a large signal project along Clairemont Ave. That is 13 intersections, and not even all along Claremont! (These all were upgraded to FYA this past summer except Otter Rd, which still has a 5 stack for for an unknown reason. One-yEar were upgraded to FYA in 2013 however that is all 2 lane each way. Luckily, Clairemont Ave, 312/North crossing, 93 are all DOT maintained. Bus 53 Hastings is city maintained hence the new signals, but no near right signals south of birch st. Birch and Seymour were completed before the rest of the Hastings way rehab so they have near signals mounted on the mast.

[peterj920]

I could actually get behind the amalgamation of the entire metro area; can you think of another metro area of similar size with as many different municipalities in it?

Green Bay is right up there.  Years ago, the Town of Preble was absorbed the the City of Green Bay, something that is extremely rare.  Green Bay's mayor has said that he would like surrounding communities to join with Green Bay.  I personally think it's a bad idea since Green Bay is run poorly compared to surrounding communities and has the roughest streets by far in the area. 

[mgk920]

I could actually get behind the amalgamation of the entire metro area; can you think of another metro area of similar size with as many different municipalities in it?

Green Bay is right up there.  Years ago, the Town of Preble was absorbed the the City of Green Bay, something that is extremely rare.  Green Bay's mayor has said that he would like surrounding communities to join with Green Bay.  I personally think it's a bad idea since Green Bay is run poorly compared to surrounding communities and has the roughest streets by far in the area.

OTOH, if the entire Green Bay metro area joined the city, the present-day suburbs would control the resulting city's city council and mayor's office (about 45% city/55% suburbs).

That number is more stark here in the Appleton area - a full metro amalgamation (Kaukauna through Neenah and Sherwood through Greenville) would have the present-day City of Appleton controlling about 35% of the resulting city's city council and mayor's office.

A Milwaukee metro-wide amalgamation would have the present-day City of Milwaukee controlling about 40% of it.

Mike

[mgk920]

Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.

I thought it sounded like a golf course in McHenry, IL.

In my fictional maps, I went with a name uninspired in a different direction.  East of the lake, I glommed most of the township on to the city (with a few parcels for Appleton), then incorporated the area west of the lake as, get this, "West Menasha".  Brilliant.

That's similar to what I was advocating - barring a full municipal amalgamation of the metro area, I would have ceded the township's entire east side to the City of Menasha (remember that Appleton has no further territorial interests in Winnebago County) and incorporate its west side, with its development interest being westward along US 10.

Interestingly, the township that is immediately to the west (Clayton Township) officially opposed that incorporation and testified against it.  They are worried about just that.

Mike

Then you would have hundreds if not thousands of people who would now be in the City of Menasha, despite having Appleton addresses (unless the ZIP code lines are modified too).

Personally, the dividing line I would have used would have coincided with the ZIP code line; that seems to be about where the line is culturally as well, if you know what I mean.

In fact, there are parts of the City of Appleton that are served by other Post Offices, most notably the Schindler Place area (near US 10/WI 441/Oneida St) - those apartment buildings get their mail from the Menasha Post Office.  I wouldn't be surprised at all if some of those residents think that they are in Menasha, to the point of trying to vote in their city elections.

I could actually get behind the amalgamation of the entire metro area; can you think of another metro area of similar size with as many different municipalities in it?

As such, I present to you:
The Unified City of Metro Appleton!  (Accepting all suggestions for names.)

My vision (I'd call it 'City of Fox Valley') also includes the Sherwood area and the entirety of the Harrison, Greenville, Clayton and Vanden Broek Townships plus the built-up Winchester area.  I would also seriously consider including the built up Mackville area in it.

To make such a transition easier, one thought that I've been having over the past few years is to find a way to 'grandfather' the differences in property tax rates until individual properties change owners.

Mike

[20160805]

Fox Crossing sounds like a retirement community.

I've always thought that it sounds like the name of either a C-grade commercial strip center or a cheap pressboard subdivision.

I thought it sounded like a golf course in McHenry, IL.

In my fictional maps, I went with a name uninspired in a different direction.  East of the lake, I glommed most of the township on to the city (with a few parcels for Appleton), then incorporated the area west of the lake as, get this, "West Menasha".  Brilliant.

That's similar to what I was advocating - barring a full municipal amalgamation of the metro area, I would have ceded the township's entire east side to the City of Menasha (remember that Appleton has no further territorial interests in Winnebago County) and incorporate its west side, with its development interest being westward along US 10.

Interestingly, the township that is immediately to the west (Clayton Township) officially opposed that incorporation and testified against it.  They are worried about just that.

Mike

Then you would have hundreds if not thousands of people who would now be in the City of Menasha, despite having Appleton addresses (unless the ZIP code lines are modified too).

Personally, the dividing line I would have used would have coincided with the ZIP code line; that seems to be about where the line is culturally as well, if you know what I mean.

In fact, there are parts of the City of Appleton that are served by other Post Offices, most notably the Schindler Place area (near US 10/WI 441/Oneida St) - those apartment buildings get their mail from the Menasha Post Office.  I wouldn't be surprised at all if some of those residents think that they are in Menasha, to the point of trying to vote in their city elections.

I could actually get behind the amalgamation of the entire metro area; can you think of another metro area of similar size with as many different municipalities in it?

As such, I present to you:
The Unified City of Metro Appleton!  (Accepting all suggestions for names.)

My vision (I'd call it 'City of Fox Valley') also includes the Sherwood area and the entirety of the Harrison, Greenville, Clayton and Vanden Broek Townships plus the built-up Winchester area.  I would also seriously consider including the built up Mackville area in it.

To make such a transition easier, one thought that I've been having over the past few years is to find a way to 'grandfather' the differences in property tax rates until individual properties change owners.

Mike

I like it, especially the part about grandfathering in the tax rates. 

And why exactly does the Menasha post office serve that little chunk of Appleton?  That's just weird to me. 

[dvferyance]

I do agree that there are getting to be too many villages in NE Wisconsin. I would combine Combined Locks with either Kimberly or Little Chute. Or better yet might as well combine all 3 as one. I am surprised that Grand Chute hasn't tried to incorporate again. They did try back in the 80's but were denied.  It wouldn't surprise me if you looking at the village of Greenville in the near future. I think if the Town of Ledgeview incorporates than Bellevue should be annexed into Green Bay. I combined Fox Cities is an interesting idea but I doubt that all of them would ever be combined into one city.

[DaBigE]

The entrances to Wisconsin are about to get a little more mundane in the future. Enjoy the I2-1-B signs while they last:

In the past, several different signs have been installed along Department-maintained roadways at state entrances. In some cases, several signs have been installed on the same support. At some state entrances, blue signs with the state outline (I2-1-B) are installed. Based on an interpretation received from FHWA in 2013, the shape of these signs is not in conformance with the 2009 MUTCD.

Source: TGM 2-1-42

At the end of their useful lives, they will be replaced with the I2-1

[SSOWorld]

yawn

At least it doesn't say "Open For Business" underneath


or worse... the Governor's name.

[Revive 755]

The entrances to Wisconsin are about to get a little more mundane in the future. Enjoy the I2-1-B signs while they last:

In the past, several different signs have been installed along Department-maintained roadways at state entrances. In some cases, several signs have been installed on the same support. At some state entrances, blue signs with the state outline (I2-1-B) are installed. Based on an interpretation received from FHWA in 2013, the shape of these signs is not in conformance with the 2009 MUTCD.

Source: TGM 2-1-42

At the end of their useful lives, they will be replaced with the I2-1

I don't suppose that MUTCD interpretation is online somewhere?  I wouldn't mind seeing FHWA's exact words.

Either way, even as a strong supporter of the MUTCD, I think this might be going a little far for a sign used at or shortly after the state line.

[dvferyance]

yawn

At least it doesn't say "Open For Business" underneath


or worse... the Governor's name.

Can we just put the Governor to rest? This is not a political board.

[paulthemapguy]

yawn

At least it doesn't say "Open For Business" underneath


or worse... the Governor's name.

Can we just put the Governor to rest? This is not a political board.

Idk, YOU'RE the one talking about putting him to rest!!   

[Rothman]

Well, that escalated quickly.

[The Ghostbuster]

Transportation and politics are too intertwined IMHO. But then again, this isn't a political board.

[triplemultiplex]

or worse... the Governor's name.

Then you know whose name to curse when you're dodging potholes for the next 50 miles.

[SEWIGuy]

Even WIDOT knows we are taking a penny-wise and pound-foolish approach by delaying major reconstruction in favor of temporary fixes.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/news/politics/2017/03/01/wisconsin-faces-tidal-wave-costly-roadwork-delays/98546080/?utm_source=&utm_medium=&utm_campaign=hs&hootPostID=7a59429daba4028c650ba8fee40d6114

"The plans will also force more money to be spent on temporary repairs as the state puts off major projects because of a funding crunch, according to a Department of Transportation memo written in January.

The situation will only get worse.

"The tidal wave is coming, as this critical work can't be delayed forever,"  the January memo says.

The memo was prepared for Secretary David Ross and Deputy Secretary Bob Seitz to get them up to speed as they took over the Department of Transportation. The memo and other briefing documents were released to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel under the state's open records law."