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New proposal would extend Suncoast Parkway to Georgia

Started by afguy, May 02, 2019, 10:31:09 AM

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sparker

Quote from: DeaconG on September 26, 2020, 05:20:34 PM
Quote from: sparker on September 25, 2020, 02:47:21 AM
Quote from: Plutonic Panda on September 24, 2020, 03:55:48 PM
Here's and update regarding this and the other toll roads proposed. At the very least they should provide the ROW needed to build them in the future.

https://www.tallahassee.com/story/news/local/state/2020/09/23/still-no-answers-task-forces-looking-into-proposed-florida-toll-roads/5864388002/

From Crystal River northward, any new-terrain facility, tolled or not, would have to traverse miles and miles of swampland, which would pose (a) exceptionally high construction costs, and (b) environmental issues due to destruction of the wetlands or, at minimum, interruption of the natural swamp ebb and flow.  The only reason US 19/98 is there is that it followed a now-defunct railroad grade from Chiefland to Perry; the only reason it's a divided 4-lane is that it used that RR grade for expansion from the original 2 lanes.  The only practical path toward Tallahassee is via an upgrade of the present US 19 facility with town bypasses -- and applying tolls to an existing facility, upgrades or not, probably wouldn't fly politically in FL.   The Suncoast has probably gone as far as it will go in its current configuration; any northward facilities will likely be freeway upgrades of US 19.  As far as actually getting to Tallahassee, the vocal opposition in Jefferson County will likely mean any toll facility will likely parallel US 19 from US 27 up to I-10 and on to the GA state line.  But I don't foresee any toll facility extending south of Perry in any case; a freeway along US 19/98 from Perry to Crystal Springs would connect that to the Suncoast northern terminus.  Putting a toll facility in to augment an existing facility might be a politically feasible idea, but tolling an upgraded existing facility, particularly one that functions as the "lifeline" of a region, has a minimal if any chance of being implemented.  If indeed a tolled facility is in the initial planning stages, it'll probably be reconfigured as an extension of FL 589 up to the Crystal River area,  along with a north FL limited-access facility north of Perry.  What's in between those facilities will probably be upgraded a mile or two at a time as FDOT budgets allow. 

US 19/98 is already underutilized, a toll facility would go unused as folks stay on 19/98. This is why there's been a long-standing proposal to extend Florida's Turnpike to just south of Perry (and I wish they'd get on it!), so I don't think extending the Suncoast is going to gain any traction.

Any Florida Turnpike northwest extension proposal would invariably merge with the Suncoast concept somewhere around Lake Rousseau in any case, so it would encounter the same obstacles that an extended Suncoast would -- which is why north of that point a tolled facility isn't really a practical option.  New-terrain facilities will have to scoot over to 19/98 at some point and "piggyback" on that ROW at least as far north as Perry just to avoid swamp issues.  North of there it would be simply a matter of choosing the most feasible political option toward I-10 and/or Tallahassee.


RoadPelican

There was a proposed toll road about 15-20 years ago that would do a lot of good for Florida, it would run from Fort Pierce to Tampa and give Central Florida a viable needed alternate to I-4, but I think that one is off the agenda. (I think the name might be Heartland Pkwy)

The SW proposal from Lakeland to Fort Myers does not make much sense considering the state just finished widening US 17 a few years ago.

Also, US 19 from Crystal River to the GA state line runs at only 20% capacity (per the recent posted article)

Build a couple of bypasses around Perry and Chiefland, and it can be at least 65 MPH the whole way.  Maybe a local .25 quarter cent sales tax can help pay for it, if FDOT can't find the money.

Why can't FDOT build toll roads in places that actually need toll roads?

Life in Paradise

Quote from: RoadPelican on September 27, 2020, 10:14:20 AM
There was a proposed toll road about 15-20 years ago that would do a lot of good for Florida, it would run from Fort Pierce to Tampa and give Central Florida a viable needed alternate to I-4, but I think that one is off the agenda. (I think the name might be Heartland Pkwy)

The SW proposal from Lakeland to Fort Myers does not make much sense considering the state just finished widening US 17 a few years ago.

Also, US 19 from Crystal River to the GA state line runs at only 20% capacity (per the recent posted article)

Build a couple of bypasses around Perry and Chiefland, and it can be at least 65 MPH the whole way.  Maybe a local .25 quarter cent sales tax can help pay for it, if FDOT can't find the money.

Why can't FDOT build toll roads in places that actually need toll roads?

I think some of the issues have to do with 1.  Hurricane exit routes and 2.  Reducing traffic on I-75, I-4, and I-95.  My in-laws have a place down in Ft. Myers, and they had been using I-75 on their trip from Indiana, but most recently had moved over to I-65 and then coming down through Dothan and then US 19 through Tampa.  They said that the US 19 drive is a good one without too much traffic (which they would move over to the Suncoast north of Tampa).  I think that some people get scared of traffic (stop and start) when they see a 4-lane go into metro area, but an interstate (think I-65 reroute) or a toll road expressway redo for the road would get some of that I-75 traffic moved over.

sprjus4

^

At minimum, the Suncoast Pkwy should be extended north to seamless tie back into US-19 in a rural area, then town bypasses built along the rest of the corridor to create a free-flowing 65 mph expressway.


sparker

Quote from: sprjus4 on September 27, 2020, 06:59:21 PM
^

At minimum, the Suncoast Pkwy should be extended north to seamless tie back into US-19 in a rural area, then town bypasses built along the rest of the corridor to create a free-flowing 65 mph expressway.

Wouldn't be at all surprised to see some variation on the above suggestion eventually implemented.  The tolled portion likely wouldn't include anything overlaying US 19; unless it were simply adding tolled lanes to an existing facility, converting a previously free 4-lane arterial to a toll road wouldn't be politically feasible.  Once somewhere around Perry, a toll facility either to Tallahassee or simply a junction with I-10 could conceivably be developed on a separate alignment. 

edwaleni

Quote from: Life in Paradise on September 27, 2020, 03:58:16 PM
Quote from: RoadPelican on September 27, 2020, 10:14:20 AM
There was a proposed toll road about 15-20 years ago that would do a lot of good for Florida, it would run from Fort Pierce to Tampa and give Central Florida a viable needed alternate to I-4, but I think that one is off the agenda. (I think the name might be Heartland Pkwy)

The SW proposal from Lakeland to Fort Myers does not make much sense considering the state just finished widening US 17 a few years ago.

Also, US 19 from Crystal River to the GA state line runs at only 20% capacity (per the recent posted article)

Build a couple of bypasses around Perry and Chiefland, and it can be at least 65 MPH the whole way.  Maybe a local .25 quarter cent sales tax can help pay for it, if FDOT can't find the money.

Why can't FDOT build toll roads in places that actually need toll roads?

I think some of the issues have to do with 1.  Hurricane exit routes and 2.  Reducing traffic on I-75, I-4, and I-95.  My in-laws have a place down in Ft. Myers, and they had been using I-75 on their trip from Indiana, but most recently had moved over to I-65 and then coming down through Dothan and then US 19 through Tampa.  They said that the US 19 drive is a good one without too much traffic (which they would move over to the Suncoast north of Tampa).  I think that some people get scared of traffic (stop and start) when they see a 4-lane go into metro area, but an interstate (think I-65 reroute) or a toll road expressway redo for the road would get some of that I-75 traffic moved over.

Agreed on #1. Excess capacity to support hurricane routing, while expensive, has value. Charge tolls for daily use, waive tolls for evacuation use.
Agreed on #2. Safety on I-75 between Lake City and Ocala has been an ongoing issue. While the periodic smoke event causes pileups (like snow whiteouts cause them in the north). The volume of traffic makes it more susceptible to accidents.

There are only 3 high capacity routes for Florida traffic. (10, 95 and 75)

While some of this is supplemented by lesser secondary routes (98, 41, 17, 1, 301)

Of the 3 high capacity routes, only 2 support north-south traffic. That means a majority of south Florida traffic coming from the midwest get channeled to I-75.

An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

Plutonic Panda

Quote from: sparker on October 22, 2020, 02:14:52 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on September 27, 2020, 06:59:21 PM
^

At minimum, the Suncoast Pkwy should be extended north to seamless tie back into US-19 in a rural area, then town bypasses built along the rest of the corridor to create a free-flowing 65 mph expressway.

Wouldn't be at all surprised to see some variation on the above suggestion eventually implemented.  The tolled portion likely wouldn't include anything overlaying US 19; unless it were simply adding tolled lanes to an existing facility, converting a previously free 4-lane arterial to a toll road wouldn't be politically feasible.  Once somewhere around Perry, a toll facility either to Tallahassee or simply a junction with I-10 could conceivably be developed on a separate alignment.
they could do the Texas method and add one way service roads that are free.

sparker

 
Quote from: Plutonic Panda on October 22, 2020, 06:14:07 PM
Quote from: sparker on October 22, 2020, 02:14:52 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on September 27, 2020, 06:59:21 PM
^

At minimum, the Suncoast Pkwy should be extended north to seamless tie back into US-19 in a rural area, then town bypasses built along the rest of the corridor to create a free-flowing 65 mph expressway.

Wouldn't be at all surprised to see some variation on the above suggestion eventually implemented.  The tolled portion likely wouldn't include anything overlaying US 19; unless it were simply adding tolled lanes to an existing facility, converting a previously free 4-lane arterial to a toll road wouldn't be politically feasible.  Once somewhere around Perry, a toll facility either to Tallahassee or simply a junction with I-10 could conceivably be developed on a separate alignment.
they could do the Texas method and add one way service roads that are free.

While that's technically a possibility (albeit a new concept within FL), one would be looking at a 90+ mile stretch of quadruple carriageways along US 19, which itself was carved out of the adjacent swamp after the now-gone parallel RR gave up the ghost, allowing room for a second carriageway for the 4-lane current facility.  I'd thing FDOT would look at what would be required to double that width and simply upgrade what's on the ground right now -- with town bypasses as necessary -- and connect any toll facilities to it while still on the solid ground (not easy to come by in that part of the state) before and past the swampy section.  And there new terrain alignments would obviate the need to plow under existing roadside businesses and residences, which makes any developmental process, toll or free, much more publicly palatable.

sprjus4

^

Texas at one point proposed constructing Interstate 69 with the upgraded rural segments being free, then tolls on the bypasses. Could do a similar concept.

They've changed course and now the whole facility will be toll free.

sparker

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2020, 02:13:03 PM
^

Texas at one point proposed constructing Interstate 69 with the upgraded rural segments being free, then tolls on the bypasses. Could do a similar concept.

They've changed course and now the whole facility will be toll free.

It's doubtful that such a system would, politically, fly in FL.  So far all the toll facilities in the state have been new-terrain types, with "shunpiking" potential over existing adjacent/parallel facilities with an existing "track record" for local service.  To "nickel-and-dime" FL drivers with tolled bypasses every few miles would likely be considered poor form -- requiring drivers to exit the freeway on a regular basis to avoid being subjected to tolls.  Frankly, the TX model cited above is something of a disjointed approach, no doubt prompted by the spate of funding shortfalls stemming from the recession a decade ago -- and DOT's taking a stab at coming up with "innovative" ways to secure funding -- many of which were realistically non-starters.  There's a number of reasons why these approaches never gained traction -- a peer review or two would cull down quite a few of those concepts; some quick ad hoc polling would dispose of some more.  Things that draw a "WTF" reaction from one's cohorts or a similar response from the driving public usually end up buried in a filing cabinet or even given the shredder treatment. 

In the case of TX, when the abortive "Trans-Texas" corridor concept included shoehorning the I-69 project into its folds, several tolling options were explored, with none of them being deemed practical or even feasible; the whole cross-state "master plan" eventually collapsed under its own weight.  In FL, the toll roads seem to hold a particular place within the entire transportation system -- always "add-on" rather than straight replacement facilities, intended to address localized congestion and/or connectivity needs while decidedly keeping the deployment costs within the realm of user fees rather than broadly across the general public, like "free facility" projects.   The Suncoast concept as an artery extending north from Tampa-St. Pete likely reaches its practical limitations somewhere around Lake Rousseau; at that point it either becomes a swamp-bound new-terrain facility that would probably never recoup its construction costs, or it simply segues onto a US 19-based freeway until a point (again likely around Perry) where a stand-alone toll facility again falls within the feasible/practical category.     
 

edwaleni

Quote from: sparker on October 24, 2020, 07:56:25 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2020, 02:13:03 PM
^

Texas at one point proposed constructing Interstate 69 with the upgraded rural segments being free, then tolls on the bypasses. Could do a similar concept.

They've changed course and now the whole facility will be toll free.

It's doubtful that such a system would, politically, fly in FL.  So far all the toll facilities in the state have been new-terrain types, with "shunpiking" potential over existing adjacent/parallel facilities with an existing "track record" for local service.  To "nickel-and-dime" FL drivers with tolled bypasses every few miles would likely be considered poor form -- requiring drivers to exit the freeway on a regular basis to avoid being subjected to tolls.  Frankly, the TX model cited above is something of a disjointed approach, no doubt prompted by the spate of funding shortfalls stemming from the recession a decade ago -- and DOT's taking a stab at coming up with "innovative" ways to secure funding -- many of which were realistically non-starters.  There's a number of reasons why these approaches never gained traction -- a peer review or two would cull down quite a few of those concepts; some quick ad hoc polling would dispose of some more.  Things that draw a "WTF" reaction from one's cohorts or a similar response from the driving public usually end up buried in a filing cabinet or even given the shredder treatment. 

In the case of TX, when the abortive "Trans-Texas" corridor concept included shoehorning the I-69 project into its folds, several tolling options were explored, with none of them being deemed practical or even feasible; the whole cross-state "master plan" eventually collapsed under its own weight.  In FL, the toll roads seem to hold a particular place within the entire transportation system -- always "add-on" rather than straight replacement facilities, intended to address localized congestion and/or connectivity needs while decidedly keeping the deployment costs within the realm of user fees rather than broadly across the general public, like "free facility" projects.   The Suncoast concept as an artery extending north from Tampa-St. Pete likely reaches its practical limitations somewhere around Lake Rousseau; at that point it either becomes a swamp-bound new-terrain facility that would probably never recoup its construction costs, or it simply segues onto a US 19-based freeway until a point (again likely around Perry) where a stand-alone toll facility again falls within the feasible/practical category.     


FL would never 'nickel and dime' drivers.  Just look at the Shingle Creek "toll bridge" on Osceola Parkway or the Poinciana on ramps. Na...never.

DeaconG

Quote from: edwaleni on October 25, 2020, 12:00:10 AM
Quote from: sparker on October 24, 2020, 07:56:25 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 23, 2020, 02:13:03 PM
^

Texas at one point proposed constructing Interstate 69 with the upgraded rural segments being free, then tolls on the bypasses. Could do a similar concept.

They've changed course and now the whole facility will be toll free.

It's doubtful that such a system would, politically, fly in FL.  So far all the toll facilities in the state have been new-terrain types, with "shunpiking" potential over existing adjacent/parallel facilities with an existing "track record" for local service.  To "nickel-and-dime" FL drivers with tolled bypasses every few miles would likely be considered poor form -- requiring drivers to exit the freeway on a regular basis to avoid being subjected to tolls.  Frankly, the TX model cited above is something of a disjointed approach, no doubt prompted by the spate of funding shortfalls stemming from the recession a decade ago -- and DOT's taking a stab at coming up with "innovative" ways to secure funding -- many of which were realistically non-starters.  There's a number of reasons why these approaches never gained traction -- a peer review or two would cull down quite a few of those concepts; some quick ad hoc polling would dispose of some more.  Things that draw a "WTF" reaction from one's cohorts or a similar response from the driving public usually end up buried in a filing cabinet or even given the shredder treatment. 

In the case of TX, when the abortive "Trans-Texas" corridor concept included shoehorning the I-69 project into its folds, several tolling options were explored, with none of them being deemed practical or even feasible; the whole cross-state "master plan" eventually collapsed under its own weight.  In FL, the toll roads seem to hold a particular place within the entire transportation system -- always "add-on" rather than straight replacement facilities, intended to address localized congestion and/or connectivity needs while decidedly keeping the deployment costs within the realm of user fees rather than broadly across the general public, like "free facility" projects.   The Suncoast concept as an artery extending north from Tampa-St. Pete likely reaches its practical limitations somewhere around Lake Rousseau; at that point it either becomes a swamp-bound new-terrain facility that would probably never recoup its construction costs, or it simply segues onto a US 19-based freeway until a point (again likely around Perry) where a stand-alone toll facility again falls within the feasible/practical category.     


FL would never 'nickel and dime' drivers.  Just look at the Shingle Creek "toll bridge" on Osceola Parkway or the Poinciana on ramps. Na...never.
Goldenrod Extension anyone?
Dawnstar: "You're an ape! And you can talk!"
King Solovar: "And you're a human with wings! Reality holds surprises for everyone!"
-Crisis On Infinite Earths #2

codyg1985

Quote from: edwaleni on October 22, 2020, 03:46:04 PM
An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

A Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa corridor would indeed be a nice relief for I-75 traffic. I do wish Alabama would get on board with such a proposal, but Alabama doesn't seem t have the appetite to build many new freeway corridors anymore, except for the Birmingham Northern Beltline. Widening I-65 north of Montgomery would need to be in the cards too.
Cody Goodman
Huntsville, AL, United States

Life in Paradise

Quote from: codyg1985 on December 23, 2020, 11:09:01 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 22, 2020, 03:46:04 PM
An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

A Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa corridor would indeed be a nice relief for I-75 traffic. I do wish Alabama would get on board with such a proposal, but Alabama doesn't seem t have the appetite to build many new freeway corridors anymore, except for the Birmingham Northern Beltline. Widening I-65 north of Montgomery would need to be in the cards too.
Hopefully, in a few years, opinions might change in Alabama, and they might get some funding going to upgrade US231 down from Montgomery.  The only other way would be to go down the US27 corridor in western Georgia, but that would be much more expensive, since more interstate would be needed.

sparker

Quote from: Life in Paradise on December 23, 2020, 03:16:57 PM
Quote from: codyg1985 on December 23, 2020, 11:09:01 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 22, 2020, 03:46:04 PM
An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

A Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa corridor would indeed be a nice relief for I-75 traffic. I do wish Alabama would get on board with such a proposal, but Alabama doesn't seem t have the appetite to build many new freeway corridors anymore, except for the Birmingham Northern Beltline. Widening I-65 north of Montgomery would need to be in the cards too.
Hopefully, in a few years, opinions might change in Alabama, and they might get some funding going to upgrade US231 down from Montgomery.  The only other way would be to go down the US27 corridor in western Georgia, but that would be much more expensive, since more interstate would be needed.

Much of US 27 has seen improvement under the GRIP program; pretty much the entire route except for the portion paralleling I-185 has been brought out to 4 lanes, with controlled/no private access bypasses of the larger towns.  While it wouldn't be cheap by any means, bringing that corridor up to Interstate standards wouldn't be beyond the realm of possibility.  If it could connect Tallahassee with Columbus, the goal of relieving I-75 south of Atlanta would be reached; if an outer N-S relief route for Atlanta itself were to be considered, then doing the entire corridor north to Chattanooga would fulfill that conceptualization.

The Ghostbuster

Wikipedia's Interstate 185 (Georgia) page says this (see Future section): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_185_(Georgia). So extending 185 is a no-go. Personally, I'd extend 185 south to Interstate 10, and north to connect with Interstate 75 somewhere in northern Georgia. That would make it a decent bypass of Atlanta (in a Fictional Highways sense).

VTGoose

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on December 23, 2020, 10:07:38 PM
Wikipedia's Interstate 185 (Georgia) page says this (see Future section): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_185_(Georgia). So extending 185 is a no-go. Personally, I'd extend 185 south to Interstate 10, and north to connect with Interstate 75 somewhere in northern Georgia. That would make it a decent bypass of Atlanta (in a Fictional Highways sense).

Or (while talking somewhat fictional) extend I-77 south from Columbia or Augusta to I-10/I-75/Suncoast extension to provide a more direct route to the west coast of Florida instead of the I-26/I-95/I-4 (or I-10/US 301) jog.
"Get in the fast lane, grandma!  The bingo game is ready to roll!"

hotdogPi

Quote from: VTGoose on December 24, 2020, 11:41:00 AM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on December 23, 2020, 10:07:38 PM
Wikipedia's Interstate 185 (Georgia) page says this (see Future section): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_185_(Georgia). So extending 185 is a no-go. Personally, I'd extend 185 south to Interstate 10, and north to connect with Interstate 75 somewhere in northern Georgia. That would make it a decent bypass of Atlanta (in a Fictional Highways sense).

Or (while talking somewhat fictional) extend I-77 south from Columbia or Augusta to I-10/I-75/Suncoast extension to provide a more direct route to the west coast of Florida instead of the I-26/I-95/I-4 (or I-10/US 301) jog.

The 78k plan included this corridor, so it's not entirely fictional. However, it doesn't include I-77. I was actually looking for what I think is froggie's 78k map that labels each segment 2, 4, or 6+ lanes, and this segment is one of the few 2-lane corridors east of the Mississippi, but I can't find it.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

planxtymcgillicuddy

Quote from: codyg1985 on December 23, 2020, 11:09:01 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 22, 2020, 03:46:04 PM
An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

A Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa corridor would indeed be a nice relief for I-75 traffic. I do wish Alabama would get on board with such a proposal, but Alabama doesn't seem t have the appetite to build many new freeway corridors anymore, except for the Birmingham Northern Beltline. Widening I-65 north of Montgomery would need to be in the cards too.

Alabama with 65 got like North Carolina with 40 and couldnt see the trees for the woods.......Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa-Miami should have been 65, with 75 taking over the FL Turnpike from Wildwood to Kissimmee, then along US-27 to Miami. Extend 85 to Mobile
It's easy to be easy when you're easy...

Quote from: on_wisconsin on November 27, 2021, 02:39:12 PM
Whats a Limon, and does it go well with gin?

hotdogPi

Quote from: planxtymcgillicuddy on December 24, 2020, 05:12:29 PM
Quote from: codyg1985 on December 23, 2020, 11:09:01 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 22, 2020, 03:46:04 PM
An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

A Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa corridor would indeed be a nice relief for I-75 traffic. I do wish Alabama would get on board with such a proposal, but Alabama doesn't seem t have the appetite to build many new freeway corridors anymore, except for the Birmingham Northern Beltline. Widening I-65 north of Montgomery would need to be in the cards too.

Alabama with 65 got like North Carolina with 40 and couldnt see the trees for the woods.......Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa-Miami should have been 65, with 75 taking over the FL Turnpike from Wildwood to Kissimmee, then along US-27 to Miami. Extend 85 to Mobile

It's not their fault; it's the fault of changing population patterns. New Orleans and Mobile have both lost population since the 1960s, while Florida, including Tallahassee, has grown significantly.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

sparker

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on December 23, 2020, 10:07:38 PM
Wikipedia's Interstate 185 (Georgia) page says this (see Future section): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstate_185_(Georgia). So extending 185 is a no-go. Personally, I'd extend 185 south to Interstate 10, and north to connect with Interstate 75 somewhere in northern Georgia. That would make it a decent bypass of Atlanta (in a Fictional Highways sense).

The study that dismissed the Albany/US 19 plan was 11 years ago; since then the GRIP program has deployed bypasses around smaller towns, particularly along US 27 -- so it looks like a case of a state planning agency not "meshing" with the goals and workings of another.   It has appeared that some GRIP improvements largely stick to the rural segments of corridors leaving the in-town segments as is; this doesn't appear to be the case with US 27 from Bainbridge to Cusseta; pretty much every significant town has seen a controlled-access bypass.  Nevertheless, elevation to full Interstate standards may be a bridge too far for some time; while several Atlanta "relief routes" have been proposed over the years (many utilizing GRIP corridors), the critical mass where such a facility (or series thereof) becomes a necessity has yet to be reached.  10-15 years down the line, something along that order might well occur -- we'll all just have to wait and see. 

Plutonic Panda

Quote from: 1 on December 24, 2020, 05:59:49 PM
Quote from: planxtymcgillicuddy on December 24, 2020, 05:12:29 PM
Quote from: codyg1985 on December 23, 2020, 11:09:01 AM
Quote from: edwaleni on October 22, 2020, 03:46:04 PM
An alternate capacity that avoids Atlanta would be preferable, a route south from Montgomery AL to the gulf coast would help take the pressure off I-75.

A Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa corridor would indeed be a nice relief for I-75 traffic. I do wish Alabama would get on board with such a proposal, but Alabama doesn't seem t have the appetite to build many new freeway corridors anymore, except for the Birmingham Northern Beltline. Widening I-65 north of Montgomery would need to be in the cards too.

Alabama with 65 got like North Carolina with 40 and couldnt see the trees for the woods.......Montgomery-Tallahassee-Tampa-Miami should have been 65, with 75 taking over the FL Turnpike from Wildwood to Kissimmee, then along US-27 to Miami. Extend 85 to Mobile

It's not their fault; it's the fault of changing population patterns. New Orleans and Mobile have both lost population since the 1960s, while Florida, including Tallahassee, has grown significantly.
Though New Orleans may have lost population it still sees high demand and I suspect the daytime population of the city is higher than its ever been due to increased tourism. Not sure about Mobile. This presents problems but solvable none the less. I always think of Louisiana being one of the states worst off in terms of their infrastructure and how to fund expansion and preservation. If Louisiana doesn't do something fast, within the decade, I suspect they are going to find themselves in a VERY bad situation, more so than any other state.

Rothman

New Orleans has always proven surprisingly resilient -- not only over the past couple of decades, but over the past couple of centuries.  No matter what natural disasters come its way, people seem to still think a lot of money is to be made at its location one way or the other, despite the hurricanes...
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Plutonic Panda

I personally love New Orleans. It's one of my favorite cities. They just need to figure out how to widen I-10 through the city.



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