What roads are out there that never were part of a Signed Route but yet are signed as such by a local authority? One that comes to mind is Santa Clara County signing California State Route 130 east from the terminus at Mount Hamilton. Specifically Santa Clara County signs an extension of California State Route 130 from it's actual eastern terminus to the Stanisulaus County line via San Antonio Valley Road and Del Puerto Road.
CA 130 has never been maintained by Caltrans nor the Division of Highways east of Mount Hamilton. I believe the rogue signage comes from the legislative definition of CA 130 which has an unbuilt continuation to CA 33 in Patterson. San Antonio Valley Road and Del Puerto Road are the traversable existing right of way which would connect Mount Hamilton to Patterson.
The Santa Clara County sourced CA 130 shields are easy to spot given they are very different to anything that would be Caltrans spec:
(https://live.staticflickr.com/4756/25108644957_aa83b50812_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/EfLnnF)130CAh (https://flic.kr/p/EfLnnF) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
(https://live.staticflickr.com/4657/26106647298_5d235cdae6_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/FLXoGA)130CAf (https://flic.kr/p/FLXoGA) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
(https://live.staticflickr.com/4741/26106654348_5e441632de_4k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/FLXqN9)130CAg (https://flic.kr/p/FLXqN9) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
(https://live.staticflickr.com/3929/32737678424_0a342cc142_3k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/RSVaes)130CAc (https://flic.kr/p/RSVaes) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
(https://live.staticflickr.com/2864/33540043926_41b9e33e69_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6Puxq)130CAb (https://flic.kr/p/T6Puxq) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
(https://live.staticflickr.com/2942/33540044946_13649fd47e_3k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/T6PuR1)130CAa (https://flic.kr/p/T6PuR1) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
CO2 by the Rocky Mountain Arsenal. The road itself is named Highway 2, but the state designation was taken off a while ago. There are still signs at intersecting state highways in addition.
Was MA 44A ever signed?
NC 105 Bypass in Boone is not an actual route, and even if it were designated as "NC 105 Bypass" it would not actually be a bypass route for NC 105. The road is simply locally named as such by the county and signed as such by the Town of Boone (on street blades).
Despite this, some NCDOT maps have erroneously recognized the route as an NC highway, such as this one:
(https://i.imgur.com/I7ljAho.png)
Norfolk has a couple of these. VA 403 runs from US 58 south to VA 165, but is posted to continue north of US 58. VA 407 also has postings west of its western endpoint.
Quote from: index on February 18, 2023, 04:53:56 PM
NC 105 Bypass in Boone is not an actual route, and even if it were designated as "NC 105 Bypass" it would not actually be a bypass route for NC 105. The road is simply locally named as such by the county and signed as such by the Town of Boone (on street blades).
Despite this, some NCDOT maps have erroneously recognized the route as an NC highway, such as this one:
(https://i.imgur.com/I7ljAho.png)
This reminds me that MA 114 Truck is signed in I believe Peabody.
Quote from: index on February 18, 2023, 04:53:56 PM
NC 105 Bypass in Boone is not an actual route, and even if it were designated as "NC 105 Bypass" it would not actually be a bypass route for NC 105. The road is simply locally named as such by the county and signed as such by the Town of Boone (on street blades).
Despite this, some NCDOT maps have erroneously recognized the route as an NC highway, such as this one:
(https://i.imgur.com/I7ljAho.png)
That road is signed as US 321/412 Truck. Its state designation is SR 1107.
Quote from: index on February 18, 2023, 04:53:56 PM
NC 105 Bypass in Boone is not an actual route, and even if it were designated as "NC 105 Bypass" it would not actually be a bypass route for NC 105. The road is simply locally named as such by the county and signed as such by the Town of Boone (on street blades).
Despite this, some NCDOT maps have erroneously recognized the route as an NC highway, such as this one:
(https://i.imgur.com/I7ljAho.png)
Quote from: dfilpus on February 18, 2023, 06:16:47 PM
That road is signed as US 321/421 Truck. Its state designation is SR 1107.
Wrong road. The section of the "NC-105 Bypass" shown on the NCDOT map is signed as NC-105/Truck US-321/Truck US-421 but is not signed as NC-105 Bypass. But you are correct that Truck US-321/Truck US-421 is also posted as "NC-105 Bypass" at a few places. The entire loop between US-321/US-221 and US-321/US-421 is considered as the NC-105 Bypass.
Having driven many times along IA 163 between Oskaloosa and Des Moines on trips to visit relatives in Minnesota, I seem to remember the former routings of the highway through a couple of the towns along the route (namely, Prairie City and Otley) being signed locally by the counties (Jasper and Marion counties, respectively) as "BUS HWY 163" or something like that, despite not being officially designated by the state as business routes (the only such route for IA 163 being the one through Pella).
From what I can tell, this seems to be a somewhat common phenomenon in Iowa - I also recall seeing the former route of US 63 through Ottumwa still being designated on local street signs as "HIGHWAY 63" , even after the bypass was built.
Highway 66 in Estes Park, Colorado is still signed as such (with weird bootleg signs), despite being orphaned from another segment and turned back to the city in 2007.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.3635409,-105.5478857,3a,19.9y,291.41h,91.85t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2fzKPmXoae33GQ6StpVgQw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
This is even more interesting, because the Wikipedia article says that the mile markers on the existing, actual, portion of Colorado 66 are numbered starting in Estes Park, and therefore start in the late 20's at its western terminus.
Quote from: Hobart on February 19, 2023, 12:21:57 AM
Highway 66 in Estes Park, Colorado is still signed as such (with weird bootleg signs), despite being orphaned from another segment and turned back to the city in 2007.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.3635409,-105.5478857,3a,19.9y,291.41h,91.85t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2fzKPmXoae33GQ6StpVgQw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
This is even more interesting, because the Wikipedia article says that the mile markers on the existing, actual, portion of Colorado 66 are numbered starting in Estes Park, and therefore start in the late 20's at its western terminus.
Is it a thing with highways numbered 66 and people not wanting to give up the designation?
Would Charlotte route 4 fall under this topic, or is it an entirely different animal?
Quote from: dfilpus on February 18, 2023, 06:16:47 PM
That road is signed as US 321/421 Truck. Its state designation is SR 1107.
Quote from: Dirt Roads on February 18, 2023, 10:05:33 PM
Wrong road. The section of the "NC-105 Bypass" shown on the NCDOT map is signed as NC-105/Truck US-321/Truck US-421 but is not signed as NC-105 Bypass. But you are correct that Truck US-321/Truck US-421 is also posted as "NC-105 Bypass" at a few places. The entire loop between US-321/US-221 and US-321/US-421 is considered as the NC-105 Bypass.
Perhaps I should also clarify that both
Index and
dfilpus are (somewhat) correct that the local signage for the "NC-105 Bypass" on the Truck US-321/Truck US-421 portion (SR-1107) is not posted as a state route, thus similar to the OP requirements.
It appears that this is the only signage remaining for "NC-105 Bypass" (same signage in the opposite direction on NC-105).
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?action=post;quote=2818392;topic=32923.0;last_msg=2818435#postmodify
I do recall there was another set of identical signs located near the campus on US-321/US-221 at NC-105 before completion of the "NC-105 Extension". I also recall there had been at least one streetblade showing "NC-105 Bypass" along NC-105 in Boone.
Quote from: 6a on February 19, 2023, 05:58:40 AM
Would Charlotte route 4 fall under this topic, or is it an entirely different animal?
QuoteWhat roads are out there that never were part of a Signed Route but yet are signed as such by a local authority? One that comes to mind is Santa Clara County signing California State Route 130 east from the terminus at Mount Hamilton. Specifically Santa Clara County signs an extension of California State Route 130 from it's actual eastern terminus to the Stanisulaus County line via San Antonio Valley Road and Del Puerto Road.
I believe not. It is an official road, I think where you got mixed up is the local authority part. It is signed by a local authority as a road, but it is also designated by a local authority. OP seems to be looking for state/US/etc highways that a local authority has signed where they do not exist.
Quote from: Dirt Roads on February 19, 2023, 02:21:42 PM
Quote from: dfilpus on February 18, 2023, 06:16:47 PM
That road is signed as US 321/421 Truck. Its state designation is SR 1107.
Quote from: Dirt Roads on February 18, 2023, 10:05:33 PM
Wrong road. The section of the "NC-105 Bypass" shown on the NCDOT map is signed as NC-105/Truck US-321/Truck US-421 but is not signed as NC-105 Bypass. But you are correct that Truck US-321/Truck US-421 is also posted as "NC-105 Bypass" at a few places. The entire loop between US-321/US-221 and US-321/US-421 is considered as the NC-105 Bypass.
Perhaps I should also clarify that both Index and dfilpus are (somewhat) correct that the local signage for the "NC-105 Bypass" on the Truck US-321/Truck US-421 portion (SR-1107) is not posted as a state route, thus similar to the OP requirements.
It appears that this is the only signage remaining for "NC-105 Bypass" (same signage in the opposite direction on NC-105).
https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?action=post;quote=2818392;topic=32923.0;last_msg=2818435#postmodify (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?action=post;quote=2818392;topic=32923.0;last_msg=2818435#postmodify)
I do recall there was another set of identical signs located near the campus on US-321/US-221 at NC-105 before completion of the "NC-105 Extension". I also recall there had been at least one streetblade showing "NC-105 Bypass" along NC-105 in Boone.
If I am following your posts correctly, this (https://prnt.sc/dx8vF2biRD09) whole road is the "NC 105 Bypass" and all that remains of its signage is the blades on SR 1107?
This would mean that the local authorities mean "bypass of Boone that mostly uses NC 105" rather than "bypass of NC 105's main route" which is certainly an unusual way to designate a road.
Quote from: index on February 19, 2023, 04:19:00 PM
If I am following your posts correctly, this (https://prnt.sc/dx8vF2biRD09) whole road is the "NC 105 Bypass" and all that remains of its signage is the blades on SR 1107?
This would mean that the local authorities mean "bypass of Boone that mostly uses NC 105" rather than "bypass of NC 105's main route" which is certainly an unusual way to designate a road.
That's exactly what it looks like. Locals might have a different take on this. Except you should insert the word "Truck" before the phrase "bypass of Boone that mostly uses NC 105". But I've used the entire "NC-105 Bypass" several times, both as a bypass for US-321 and as a bypass for US-421 (after completion of the "NC-105 Extension").
Truck M-51 in Dowagiac, Michigan, would fit this. Unlike other special routes like Bus. M-28, it's not a state trunkline highway. It's not marked on the Truck Operator's Map, nor does it get highlighted as a state trunkline when viewing the Control Section layer on MDOT's Next Generation PR Finder.
This little section (https://goo.gl/maps/cTCS4tvwzMcZX97x9) of Old Shetucket Turnpike in Preston, CT, is known locally as Route 165A. There are about 10 properties on that road, and "Route 165A" is the mailing address.
The state has never designated CT 165A (though the road is state-maintained SR 605).
There's little harm done, I guess, because the road isn't signed as 165A. In fact, it isn't signed at all. You just have to know where it is.
Québec doesn't do lettered highways, but that didn't stop Ormstown from creating a Route 138A (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/45.1246195,-74.0019194/45.1115072,-74.1033573/@45.1185029,-74.0887811,13z/data=!4m9!4m8!1m5!3m4!1m2!1d-74.0731336!2d45.1209903!3s0x4cc958d700152af7:0xe72a4c3f4cbcb47!1m0!3e0), which is signed on streetblades (https://goo.gl/maps/hjPq5A6jZokuDKmK6). It also saw actual shields (https://goo.gl/maps/j4PhMJyCDr55bJ7C8) during a detour in 2011.
The southern segment of California SR 160 on the south side of Sacramento is signed as if it begins at I-5 Exit 512, runs east along Pocket Road, and then turns south along Freeport Blvd. When SR 160 was decommissioned through Sacramento, the southern segment was defined to end at the south city line. Pre-downloading, SR 160 used Freeport Blvd north to around US 50; it never ran along Pocket Road.
Quote from: cl94 on February 20, 2023, 11:51:53 PM
The southern segment of California SR 160 on the south side of Sacramento is signed as if it begins at I-5 Exit 512, runs east along Pocket Road, and then turns south along Freeport Blvd. When SR 160 was decommissioned through Sacramento, the southern segment was defined to end at the south city line. Pre-downloading, SR 160 used Freeport Blvd north to around US 50; it never ran along Pocket Road.
The signage on I-5 SB says "To CA 160", as if Pocket Rd. was just a connector to CA 160, with no implication that it ever was part of CA 160.
The part of Freeport Blvd. south of its explicit End CA 160 signage starts just north of Cosumnes River Blvd., which has its own exit from I-5 (exit 510). Caltrans perhaps could have used Cosumnes River as the signed link to CA 160. But it might've felt the signage at exit 512 was close enough, and there wasn't much use to changing the signage from exit 512 to exit 510.
Quote from: Hobart on February 19, 2023, 12:21:57 AM
Highway 66 in Estes Park, Colorado is still signed as such (with weird bootleg signs), despite being orphaned from another segment and turned back to the city in 2007.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.3635409,-105.5478857,3a,19.9y,291.41h,91.85t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2fzKPmXoae33GQ6StpVgQw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
The exisiting portion of 66 ends one mile from where CO 7 begins which runs to....Estes Park! 66 could have been extended along 7 replacing it and 66 would still make sense.
This is even more interesting, because the Wikipedia article says that the mile markers on the existing, actual, portion of Colorado 66 are numbered starting in Estes Park, and therefore start in the late 20's at its western terminus.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on February 18, 2023, 04:43:53 PM
CO2 by the Rocky Mountain Arsenal. The road itself is named Highway 2, but the state designation was taken off a while ago. There are still signs at intersecting state highways in addition.
This is kinda neat, actually. It's not 'officially' CO 2, but the name of the street by way of (Adams CO - Aurora ??) is "Highway 2"?
That's ... AWESOME.
Would the temporary winter alternate US 50 near Tahoe count as this? Except aren't all the signs (and the designation) CalTrans-provided, even though the road is not signed regularly and not signed on maps...
Quote from: TheStranger on February 21, 2023, 12:22:47 PM
Would the temporary winter alternate US 50 near Tahoe count as this? Except aren't all the signs (and the designation) CalTrans-provided, even though the road is not signed regularly and not signed on maps...
Counterfeit, Caltrans never asked AASHTO for it.
Not sure if it counts, but many signs for Old Route 24 in Morris County were never taken down after it reverted to county maintenance.
Are there any in NY or PA?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on February 21, 2023, 04:56:34 PM
Quote from: TheStranger on February 21, 2023, 12:22:47 PM
Would the temporary winter alternate US 50 near Tahoe count as this? Except aren't all the signs (and the designation) CalTrans-provided, even though the road is not signed regularly and not signed on maps...
Counterfeit, Caltrans never asked AASHTO for it.
It being a winter alternate would also require them to plow Mormon Emigrant Trail. That's a seasonal road, but Carson Pass has been closed due to snow every time 50 flooded this winter, so...
Quote from: cl94 on February 21, 2023, 09:44:04 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on February 21, 2023, 04:56:34 PM
Quote from: TheStranger on February 21, 2023, 12:22:47 PM
Would the temporary winter alternate US 50 near Tahoe count as this? Except aren't all the signs (and the designation) CalTrans-provided, even though the road is not signed regularly and not signed on maps...
Counterfeit, Caltrans never asked AASHTO for it.
It being a winter alternate would also require them to plow Mormon Emigrant Trail. That's a seasonal road, but Carson Pass has been closed due to snow every time 50 flooded this winter, so...
Really it is my primary argument as to why CA 88/NV 88 ought to be a X95 US Route. That highway has a lot of utility given it is open all-year provided Caltrans keeps up with the plowing of snow.
Quote from: cl94 on February 21, 2023, 09:44:04 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on February 21, 2023, 04:56:34 PM
Quote from: TheStranger on February 21, 2023, 12:22:47 PM
Would the temporary winter alternate US 50 near Tahoe count as this? Except aren't all the signs (and the designation) CalTrans-provided, even though the road is not signed regularly and not signed on maps...
Counterfeit, Caltrans never asked AASHTO for it.
It being a winter alternate would also require them to plow Mormon Emigrant Trail. That's a seasonal road, but Carson Pass has been closed due to snow every time 50 flooded this winter, so...
I kept it in Travel Mapping despite concerns about whether it belonged, considering all the trouble I went to clinch it (including one failed attempt foiled by snow on the MET in early July -- the Forest Service believes in "solar snow removal"). What convinced me to remove it in February 2021 was Caltrans' planned detour route for its latest prolonged closure of US 50 was entirely on state routes, avoiding the MET. So for whatever reason, Caltrans gave up on the alternate route.
The route markers on US 50 Alternate were usually covered up, except one BGS on the MET.
I think the original alternate route was rarely, if ever, used as a US 50 closure detour during the winter.
Quote from: oscar on February 21, 2023, 09:56:41 PM
Quote from: cl94 on February 21, 2023, 09:44:04 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on February 21, 2023, 04:56:34 PM
Quote from: TheStranger on February 21, 2023, 12:22:47 PM
Would the temporary winter alternate US 50 near Tahoe count as this? Except aren't all the signs (and the designation) CalTrans-provided, even though the road is not signed regularly and not signed on maps...
Counterfeit, Caltrans never asked AASHTO for it.
It being a winter alternate would also require them to plow Mormon Emigrant Trail. That's a seasonal road, but Carson Pass has been closed due to snow every time 50 flooded this winter, so...
I added it to Travel Mapping, considering all the trouble I went to clinch it (including one failed attempt foiled by snow on the MET in early July -- the Forest Service believes in "solar snow removal"). What convinced me to remove it was Caltrans' planned detour route for its latest prolonged closure of US 50 was entirely on state routes, avoiding the MET. So for whatever reason, Caltrans gave up on the alternate route.
The route markers on US 50 Alternate were usually covered up, except one BGS on the MET.
I think the original alternate route was rarely, if ever, used as a US 50 closure detour during the winter.
A lot of the markers were taken out by the 2021 Caldor Fire and not replaced, so Caltrans likely considers the alternate dead. A couple of covered markers remain near the west end of the 88/89 concurrency, but that's it. One of the covered markers is on a BGS along SR 88. This doesn't mean MET isn't worth driving, since the Caldor Fire cleared out the overgrowth and it currently has some of the best views of any road in the region. The recent flood closures have all been during storm events where both 80 and 88 were impassable, so no reason to consider activating a long-term detour.
This is in stark contrast to the permanent DETOUR US 395 along NV 208-829-338 and CA 182, which still has plenty of signs (all on rotating posts similar to the chain control signs and mostly in Nevada) and is used as an official detour quite frequently in the winter due to rockfall or flooding along the West Fork Walker River.
NJ 24 after truncation to Morristown was still called Route 24 after its truncation through parts of Morris and Mendham and even Chester and Long Valley.
I don't know if it's still done today, but NJ 3 was still called by many on NJ 495 decades after NJ 3 got truncated to North Bergen.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on February 18, 2023, 04:28:17 PM
What roads are out there that never were part of a Signed Route but ...
*sigh* ...
I'm now super intrigued by Alt US 50 (given that I've been on the Route 88 portion, but not really the rest of it yet), after the discussion in this thread.
There isn't a map of it on Cahighways, only a text description, but I wanted to clarify what the routing was:
1. Sly Park Road starting at US 50 Exit 60 in Pollock Pines, heading southwest towards Sly Park itself (so eastbound Alt 50 was essentially heading southwest for a few miles there)
2. Mormon Emigrant Trail east from Sly Park east to Route 88 at Iron Mountain Sno-Park
3. Route 88 east from Iron Mountain Sno-Park east to Route 89 at Picketts Junction
4. Route 89 north to US 50 in Meyers
Is that correct?
There are a number of routes signed with route markers and "Truck Route" designations, some with very funky-looking markers, in Birmingham, Ala. They're probably city-designated routes and aren't officially blessed by Alabama DOT.
Would those count?
Quote from: TheStranger on February 22, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
I'm now super intrigued by Alt US 50 (given that I've been on the Route 88 portion, but not really the rest of it yet), after the discussion in this thread.
There isn't a map of it on Cahighways, only a text description, but I wanted to clarify what the routing was:
1. Sly Park Road starting at US 50 Exit 60 in Pollock Pines, heading southwest towards Sly Park itself (so eastbound Alt 50 was essentially heading southwest for a few miles there)
2. Mormon Emigrant Trail east from Sly Park east to Route 88 at Iron Mountain Sno-Park
3. Route 88 east from Iron Mountain Sno-Park east to Route 89 at Picketts Junction
4. Route 89 north to US 50 in Meyers
Is that correct?
Correct. Until the 2021 Caldor Fire, the portion along SR 88 was very clearly signed, even if signs were usually covered. Several signs also existed near the 50/89 intersection in Meyers before that was rebuilt in 2019.
With one exception (this BGS along Mormon Emigrant Trail (https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/294811415_5829078173771493_7832699565935852780_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_ohc=YRWUHCLyG5AAX_ssYmP&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=00_AfB5GA7G4YJ-Pg44djVo090DWGLlVqtJZNa9OmUvdynlRQ&oe=63FB3A0E)), every remaining sign is at/near Picketts Junction.
I cannot believe no one has mentioned the true bootleg highway yet: US 377 between Madill and Stroud, Oklahoma :bigass:
Does this count as a "Counterfeit" highway?
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49939399258_f5ff8b9d9f_w.jpg)
Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on April 09, 2023, 08:26:22 AM
I cannot believe no one has mentioned the true bootleg highway yet: US 377 between Madill and Stroud, Oklahoma :bigass:
I don't think that really counts–it exists because a US Congressman wrote it into federal law because AASHTO kept rejecting Oklahoma's applications for it. So that was basically AASHTO getting overruled by the federal government. Out of the normal process, sure, but the U.S. government considers it legit.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:25:02 PM
Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on April 09, 2023, 08:26:22 AM
I cannot believe no one has mentioned the true bootleg highway yet: US 377 between Madill and Stroud, Oklahoma :bigass:
I don't think that really counts–it exists because a US Congressman wrote it into federal law because AASHTO kept rejecting Oklahoma's applications for it. So that was basically AASHTO getting overruled by the federal government. Out of the normal process, sure, but the U.S. government considers it legit.
Taking a strict interpretation of the OP's criteria, it wouldn't count anyway because pre-US 377 it was still a
Signed Route.
Quote from: TheGrassGuy on February 21, 2023, 07:27:48 PM
Are there any in NY or PA?
NY had I-695 before it actually became a real route
There are 5 in China's national expressway system, and 12 former ones. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_auxiliary_NTHS_Expressways#Provincial_expressways_with_incorrect_use_of_NTHS_codes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_auxiliary_NTHS_Expressways#Provincial_expressways_with_incorrect_use_of_NTHS_codes)