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US route on a toll road?

Started by theline, June 01, 2013, 10:06:37 PM

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theline

I was browsing the Oklahoma map in my Rand McNally, following the recent tragic circumstances in the Sooner State, and I noticed an occurrence that I thought was forbidden: a US route (in this case US 412) running on a toll road (Cimarron Turnpike). I recall that there was once a prohibition against tolls on US routes, except for bridges and ferries.

Does anyone else recall such a rule? When was it changed?

If this has been addressed before, forgive me. I couldn't find anything through a search.


route56

The rule is that, for a US route running along a toll road, a toll-free alternative must be made available. For the Cimarron Turnpike, US 64 fulfills this role, as US 412 has a dual designation with US 64 on both sides of the toll section.

US 412 also runs along the Cherokee Turnpike.... the toll-free alternative is designated as US 412 Alternate.
Peace to you, and... don't drive like my brother.

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Revive 755

I thought this was discussed somewhere with the case of US 51 going onto the NW Tollway in the Rockford, IL area?

kphoger

I know we've discussed it before.  Did anyone ever provide an actual reference to such a rule?
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NE2

AASHTO policy: http://www.maine.gov/mdot/csd/mts/usroutedesignation.htm
QuoteAny toll highway facility may be included in the U.S. Numbered System when it meets all the criteria for inclusion, and when the request for the marking originates with the official authority having jurisdiction over the toll facility and the request is directed to AASHTO and supported by the appropriate Member Department. The word "Toll"  shall appear over the official U.S. Route Marker and a toll-free routing between the same termini shall continue to be retained and marked as part of the U.S. Numbered System.
Technically, none of them meet the criteria (they're not bannered 'toll'). Practically, US 51 still fails, since the alternate is IL 251.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

jeffandnicole

What does one consider an alternative?  A road that parallels a toll road within a few hundred feet, for a few hundred miles? 

golden eagle

Would business route US 90 in New Orleans count? It's a toll over the MS River. Another bridge is a bit of a distance away on US 90.

NE2

Quote from: golden eagle on June 02, 2013, 09:24:45 AM
Would business route US 90 in New Orleans count? It's a toll over the MS River. Another bridge is a bit of a distance away on US 90.
No. Toll crossings have always been part of the system.

Though they were discouraged on the mainline if a free alternate was available: http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/highwayhistory/us82.cfm
QuoteAASHO added the reference to privately owned toll bridges because the owners of such bridges had been badgering the Executive Committee of AASHO to add U.S. numbered roads to feed traffic to their privately owned bridges. AASHO had been repulsing such efforts for several years.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

theline

Thanks for the answers. I was surprised to see US routes on toll roads. Now I know.

KEVIN_224

What about short duplexes? While it's not a toll road now, most of I-95 in Connecticut was until the 1980s. I-95 and US Route 1 run together over the Connecticut River between Old Saybrook and Old Lyme:


Picture is from Memorial Day weekend of 2010.

NE2

Quote from: KEVIN_224 on June 02, 2013, 03:00:54 PM
What about short duplexes? While it's not a toll road now, most of I-95 in Connecticut was until the 1980s. I-95 and US Route 1 run together over the Connecticut River between Old Saybrook and Old Lyme:
That was a toll bridge, and predated the turnpike (1948).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raymond_E._Baldwin_Bridge
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

bugo

US 64/169 briefly duplex with a free section of the Creek Turnpike in south Tulsa.

412 is a special case.  I don't think of it as an ordinary US route, but as a "super" US highway that sometimes follows toll roads.

FWIW, Alternate US 412 paralleling the Cherokee Turnpike was Scenic US 412 up until a few months ago.  Before that it was OK 33 and before that OK 11.

jp the roadgeek

US 9 on the Garden State Parkway.  US 3 on the Everett Turnpike.  US 13 on DE 1 Toll Road.
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PurdueBill

Quote from: jp the roadgeek on June 02, 2013, 11:17:20 PM
US 9 on the Garden State Parkway.  US 3 on the Everett Turnpike.  US 13 on DE 1 Toll Road.

Doesn't US 3 duck off the Everett Turnpike for its old surface alignment, leaving the Turnpike without any route number in the tolled area?  You can use the US 3 part of the Everett for free.  (Same for US 4 and the Spaulding...US 4 leaves just before a toll.  US 202 joins and exits without a toll at the other end as well.)  I think US 13 joins and exits DE 1 without a toll being necessary as well.

roadman65

US 9 is only tolled across the Great Egg Harbor Bay, as the former crossing of US 9: The Beeslys Point Bridge was a toll bridge, and will not be reopening ever again.

I believe the exception was made, because the mainline Parkway toll acts like a defacto toll bridge, rather than US 9 aligned on a toll road. 

Also, US 9 at New Gretna and Toms River are on free sections of the roadway.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

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deathtopumpkins

#15
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on June 02, 2013, 11:17:20 PM
US 9 on the Garden State Parkway.

Just a bridge. As mentioned above US 9 has always used a toll bridge in the past, and bridges are an exception anywa.

QuoteUS 3 on the Everett Turnpike.

The Everett Turnpike is unnumbered, except for the northern end which is I-93/293, and the southern few miles that bypass Nashua, which, while signed as both US 3 and the Everett Turnpike, are untolled.

QuoteUS 13 on DE 1 Toll Road.

DE 1 is a bypass of US 13. The only place where they overlap is southwest of New Castle, where between two exits DE 1 was built on top of old US 13. This stretch is untolled.
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US71

 I think the US 169/ Broadway Bridge in Kansas City was tolled at one time.  So was the old US 82 bridge over the Mississippi River between Greenville, MS and Lake Village, AR. Ditto the US 49 bridge at Helena-West Helena, AR.

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Mapmikey

Quote from: jp the roadgeek on June 02, 2013, 11:17:20 PM
US 9 on the Garden State Parkway. 

None of the 3 brief segments of the GSP with US 9 on it has a toll booth...

Mapmikey

jeffandnicole

Quote from: Mapmikey on June 03, 2013, 06:30:14 AM
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on June 02, 2013, 11:17:20 PM
US 9 on the Garden State Parkway. 

None of the 3 brief segments of the GSP with US 9 on it has a toll booth...

Mapmikey

As previously discussed: South of Ocean City, US 9 had a toll booth on a bridge.  That bridge is now closed. US 9 now uses the GSP, and still has a toll southbound.  Northbound is untolled.

roadman

Since the 1974(?) rerouting, US 1 in Boston crosses the Tobin Bridge, which is a toll facility (southbound only).  While MA 16 west to I-93 south is a toll-free alternative for southbound traffic, it is a) not a US route, b) is a very indirect alternate route, and c) commercial vehicles are restricted on part of MA 16.
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deathtopumpkins

Quote from: roadman on June 03, 2013, 02:23:47 PM
Since the 1974(?) rerouting, US 1 in Boston crosses the Tobin Bridge, which is a toll facility (southbound only).  While MA 16 west to I-93 south is a toll-free alternative for southbound traffic, it is a) not a US route, b) is a very indirect alternate route, and c) commercial vehicles are restricted on part of MA 16.

The alternate route here is probably 95/93.
Disclaimer: All posts represent my personal opinions and not those of my employer.

Clinched Highways | Counties Visited

PHLBOS

#21
Quote from: roadman on June 03, 2013, 02:23:47 PM
Since the 1974(?) rerouting, US 1 in Boston crosses the Tobin Bridge, which is a toll facility (southbound only).  While MA 16 west to I-93 south is a toll-free alternative for southbound traffic, it is a) not a US route, b) is a very indirect alternate route, and c) commercial vehicles are restricted on part of MA 16.
To add, one-way tolls for the Tobin and the tunnels (Sumner & Callahan) didn't happen until about 1983; so between 1971 & 1983, both directions for US 1 in Boston involved a tolled crossing.  From 1971-1974/5; US 1 was routed via the Sumner & Callahan Tunnels.

Prior to 1971, US 1 had no tolled crossings in Boston; the tunnels were originally designated as Route C1.
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Kacie Jane

Toll crossings are exceptions.  Otherwise, what's the toll-free alternate for US 1 & 9 over the George Washington Bridge?

NE2

Quote from: Kacie Jane on June 03, 2013, 02:51:25 PM
Toll crossings are exceptions.  Otherwise, what's the toll-free alternate for US 1 & 9 over the George Washington Bridge?
9W :bigass:
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

Kacie Jane

Fair enough, I suppose that works for one of the two. :P



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