Obstinacy of GPS navigation

[wxfree]

I never use GPS to navigate.  If I can't remember every road and turn to get somewhere, then I don't deserve to get there.  But I do sometimes use it on longer drives so I can check how far it is to the next town or turn.  Because I prefer back roads, I often notice how the GPS gets caught up on a certain route, even after I ignore its directions for a long time.  It sticks a pin in a certain route and it takes a long time to get the pin unstuck.  Recently I saw severe examples of this.  This map is the way my GPS was telling me to go.  I was at the starting point and headed toward Hamilton, the ending point.  Google had stuck its pin in Walnut Springs and wanted me to follow this route, even though the way to Hamilton is obvious on the map.  Once it unstuck that pin, my travel time estimation reduced by a half hour.

https://goo.gl/maps/eSMixQLZXS8p5VQYA

In a second example, I got a screenshot.  On the map, you can see a little gray line connecting the turn ahead of me and the road where I was headed, but my navigator wanted me to backtrack severely so I could hit an arbitrary checkpoint.  Once that pin got unstuck, it again reduced my estimated travel time by a half hour.

http://www.patternsandprinciples.com/otherfiles/rs/gpsobs.jpg

These programs were made for people who don't know where they're going, and not people like me who enjoy ignoring their instructions.  But even someone who ends up on the wrong side of nowhere through sheer incompetence doesn't deserved to be punished with unnecessary mileage.  With modern computing abilities, it seems like if it's a few miles to the next road that can get you back on course, it should recalculate the whole route and not just look for a way to make up for a missed turn.

On the other hand, we could turn this into a sport.  We could have a thread called "GPS abuse" and see who can get the most severely backtracked route, while ignoring an obvious better route, with screenshots required, of course.

[hotdogPi]

On the other hand, we could turn this into a sport.  We could have a thread called "GPS abuse" and see who can get the most severely backtracked route, while ignoring an obvious better route, with screenshots required, of course.

I tried that at one point. I triggered Google's "are you a robot" screen from making so many requests.

[jeffandnicole]

The Google maps link appears to be telling us the fastest route, not the route you were shown.

Anytime I want to 'reset' Google Maps, I just go out of the directions mode and reenter my destination. Never a problem.

[CNGL-Leudimin]

I was really confused by that screenshot, as North is not at the top as expected, but at the bottom. That explains the relative positions of US 84 and US 190.

[webny99]

If I can't remember every road and turn to get somewhere, then I don't deserve to get there.

Only a roadgeek would say this. I had very similar thoughts yesterday when trying to circumvent the closure of Whirlpool and 3rd Streets in downtown Niagara Falls. Fortunately, I had browsed Google Maps beforehand and committed my route to memory.

[Max Rockatansky]

If I can't remember every road and turn to get somewhere, then I don't deserve to get there.

I'll have to remember to say that the next time my wife asks me to go to a store I haven't been to.

[wxfree]

The Google maps link appears to be telling us the fastest route, not the route you were shown.

Anytime I want to 'reset' Google Maps, I just go out of the directions mode and reenter my destination. Never a problem.

It's displaying correctly for me.  It wanted me to turn at the next county road, take the FM road back to TX 22, go to Meridian, Walnut Springs, Iredell, Hico, and then to Hamilton.

I didn't want to reset it; I just find the behavior interesting.  I had the option to choose the Highway 22 route from the beginning, knowing I would go that way, but I wanted to see it it would do.  I'd never really paid attention to how stubborn it is, and I was surprised by how stubborn when I looked into it.

[RobbieL2415]

I use GMaps not because I don't know where I'm going, but because it can find me the most efficient way to go depending on road conditions.

[kphoger]

In my experience, the refusal to route along the direct road is often due to one of two things:

1.  Reported road closure, identifiable by turning on the traffic overlay,
2.  An erroneous one-way segment or two segments not quite lining up correctly, implying you can't get there from here.

[Brandon]

In my experience, the refusal to route along the direct road is often due to one of two things:

1.  Reported road closure, identifiable by turning on the traffic overlay,
2.  An erroneous one-way segment or two segments not quite lining up correctly, implying you can't get there from here.

I've found at least one more, due to creator provincialism in the case of Google Maps.  Google Maps will absolutely refuse to have you turn left across two sets of double yellow lines.  Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.  It's not illegal to cross them (an in fact, they're used as center left turn lanes) in most of the rest of the country.  Example: the only way to turn left at this intersection is to cross said two sets of double yellow lines, and it's not just done all the time, but is perfectly legal in Illinois.

[kphoger]

In my experience, the refusal to route along the direct road is often due to one of two things:

1.  Reported road closure, identifiable by turning on the traffic overlay,
2.  An erroneous one-way segment or two segments not quite lining up correctly, implying you can't get there from here.

I've found at least one more, due to creator provincialism in the case of Google Maps.  Google Maps will absolutely refuse to have you turn left across two sets of double yellow lines.  Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.  It's not illegal to cross them (an in fact, they're used as center left turn lanes) in most of the rest of the country.  Example: the only way to turn left at this intersection is to cross said two sets of double yellow lines, and it's not just done all the time, but is perfectly legal in Illinois.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that old discussion.  There could also be the similar case of a crossover on a divided highway missing from the map.  However, this usually doesn't result in routing a completely different way between two towns.

[ilpt4u]

I've found at least one more, due to creator provincialism in the case of Google Maps.  Google Maps will absolutely refuse to have you turn left across two sets of double yellow lines.  Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.  It's not illegal to cross them (an in fact, they're used as center left turn lanes) in most of the rest of the country.  Example: the only way to turn left at this intersection is to cross said two sets of double yellow lines, and it's not just done all the time, but is perfectly legal in Illinois.

Just don't drive Straight over those segments in IL to reach a marked Left Turn Lane...Naperville PD pulled me over driving thru one of those to reach an empty left turn lane on Ogden Ave (US 34) instead of sitting in the left lane two+ stoplight cycles to reach the actual designated turn lane @ Columbia: https://goo.gl/maps/3aQjwnsF1UxHMKkd6 I got a Warning for Improper Lane Usage...tho ain't gonna lie, I was fully under the impression that as long as you are not running over anyone, that was fair game to reach a left. I was following a VW Bug doing it, but I was in back and got the Officer's attention

[PHLBOS]

I've found at least one more, due to creator provincialism in the case of Google Maps.  Google Maps will absolutely refuse to have you turn left across two sets of double yellow lines.  Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.  It's not illegal to cross them (an in fact, they're used as center left turn lanes) in most of the rest of the country.

I wonder if such was the reason why my friend's GPS a few years ago would not direct him to turn left to go into this small shopping plaza in Brookhaven, PA even though the center lane is striped as an available left turn lane for either direction.  Instead, the GPS was routing him to the first break in the left-turn lane striping at Ridge Blvd.; which ultimately would route him to the back of the building via two side streets.  Such wouldn't have been too bad is the back of the building had available parking as well as a public entrance.

Very odd.

[Throckmorton]

   

Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.

   
See (a) and (d)   

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21460.
   
   

[kphoger]

   

Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.

See (a) and (d)   

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=VEH&sectionNum=21460.

That statute is about a single set of double yellow lines.  What Brandon is referring to is a flush median, delineated by a set of double yellow lines on each side.  That situation is governed by the statute below:

Article 1. Driving on Right Side

21651.

(a) Whenever a highway has been divided into two or more roadways by means of intermittent barriers or by means of a dividing section of not less than two feet in width, either unpaved or delineated by curbs, double-parallel lines, or other markings on the roadway, it is unlawful to do either of the following:

(1) To drive any vehicle over, upon, or across the dividing section.

[Throckmorton]

That statute is about a single set of double yellow lines.  What Brandon is referring to is a flush median, delineated by a set of double yellow lines on each side.

I humbly defer to you and offer apologies to Brandon.

[Michael]

In January 2015, I was part of a group from my church that went to a conference in Atlanta.  One of my friends from that group moved to NC near Raleigh several years ago, so we stayed there to break up the drive.  On the way to Atlanta, Google refused to route us on US 64 through Asheboro.  This is the default routing, and this is what we did.  The current travel time is 1:32 for the default route, and 1:40 (1:34 without traffic) for the route we took.  The route we took is 10.7 miles shorter, so Google thinks it's worth it to go that far out of your way to save 2-8 minutes.

I've had other experiences like this, but this one was the one that sticks out to me the most.  From Auburn, Google likes to send me to Weedsport to get on the Thruway to go to Syracuse instead of having me use NY 5.  It seems to favor freeways to save even a minute or two at the expense of driving several miles longer.

[jeffandnicole]

In January 2015, I was part of a group from my church that went to a conference in Atlanta.  One of my friends from that group moved to NC near Raleigh several years ago, so we stayed there to break up the drive.  On the way to Atlanta, Google refused to route us on US 64 through Asheboro.  This is the default routing, and this is what we did.  The current travel time is 1:32 for the default route, and 1:40 (1:34 without traffic) for the route we took.  The route we took is 10.7 miles shorter, so Google thinks it's worth it to go that far out of your way to save 2-8 minutes.

I've had other experiences like this, but this one was the one that sticks out to me the most.  From Auburn, Google likes to send me to Weedsport to get on the Thruway to go to Syracuse instead of having me use NY 5.  It seems to favor freeways to save even a minute or two at the expense of driving several miles longer.

Not necessarily a bad thing though.  At what point is the cut off?  Saving a minute...saving 10 minutes...saving an hour?   My normal route is 2 or 3 miles longer than the absolute shortest route...but 20 minutes and a whole lotta traffic lights longer.  You can indicate that you don't want to drive highways at all, but then you'll be on non-interstate roads the whole time.

Google normally offers a few options.  And it depends on the overall distance.  If it's going to be an hour or longer, it'll try looking for long-distance routes.  If you're about 10 or 20 miles out, it may detect shorter, more local routes. 

Basically, Google can read minds, but it can't read every little detail in your head.  While you may have that extra knowledge of a way to save 10 miles, your other drivers and passengers may have been scratching their heads, wondering why you want to get off the highway.  If everyone knew where they were going, you wouldn't have needed to rely on Google in the first place!  What's more important...the mileage or the time.  Google doesn't know if you have to be there at a specific time or how long you will spend there.  Wasting 8 minutes of time is more crucial if you have a 20 minute meeting at a specific timeframe than spending the night somewhere.  And from an economical standpoint, at today's gas prices...that's about $1 in extra gas used for saving 8 minutes of time.

[Michael]

Some of the out of the way routings make sense to me based on a time/distance balance, but some are really out there.  Using this option is both longer and takes more time than the routing I forced, so why suggest it at all?  My only guess is that it's because it uses freeways as much as possible.

When I'm driving, I sometimes prefer taking 5-10 more minutes to save a couple miles.  For example, I sometimes take the default routing to Destiny USA in Syracuse, and sometimes I take this routing.  At night, when I come home on West Genesee St, there's little traffic, I get a green wave, and it's pretty quick.  During rush hour, the same road is pretty congested.  Even with congestion, the lights are timed and coordinated fairly well.

[yand]

I prefer sticking to the interstate even if the shorter more direct route is also faster. Safety is more important to me than distance or time.

Its pretty simple to use the multi stop feature to add waypoints if you see that the default route isn't the one you want.

[vdeane]

It seems to be location dependent.  Google tends to avoid PA's I-180, even if going from Williamsport to points east.  It prefers US 15.

[michravera]

In my experience, the refusal to route along the direct road is often due to one of two things:

1.  Reported road closure, identifiable by turning on the traffic overlay,
2.  An erroneous one-way segment or two segments not quite lining up correctly, implying you can't get there from here.

I've found at least one more, due to creator provincialism in the case of Google Maps.  Google Maps will absolutely refuse to have you turn left across two sets of double yellow lines.  Apparently it's illegal to cross those in California.  It's not illegal to cross them (an in fact, they're used as center left turn lanes) in most of the rest of the country.  Example: the only way to turn left at this intersection is to cross said two sets of double yellow lines, and it's not just done all the time, but is perfectly legal in Illinois.

Two-way turn ("suicide") lanes are marked with broken lines on the insides in California. How does the book say they should be striped?

[Verlanka]

It seems to be location dependent.  Google tends to avoid PA's I-180, even if going from Williamsport to points east.  It prefers US 15.

Probably done to save milage, even I-180 may be faster.

[kphoger]

Two-way turn ("suicide") lanes are marked with broken lines on the insides in California. How does the book say they should be striped?

↓  As shown below  ↓

ARTICLE 3. Offenses Relating to Traffic Devices

21460.

(a) The Department of Transportation and local authorities in their respective jurisdictions may designate a two-way left-turn lane on a highway. A two-way left-turn lane is a lane near the center of the highway set aside for use by vehicles making left turns in both directions from or into the highway.

(b) Two-way left-turn lanes shall be designated by distinctive roadway markings consisting of parallel double yellow lines, interior line dashed and exterior line solid, on each side of the lane. The Department of Transportation may determine and prescribe standards and specifications governing length, width, and positioning of the distinctive pavement markings. All pavement markings designating a two-way left-turn lane shall conform to the Department of Transportation's standards and specifications.

(c) A vehicle shall not be driven in a designated two-way left-turn lane except when preparing for or making a left turn from or into a highway or when preparing for or making a U-turn when otherwise permitted by law, and shall not be driven in that lane for more than 200 feet while preparing for and making the turn or while preparing to merge into the adjacent lanes of travel. A left turn or U-turn shall not be made from any other lane where a two-way left-turn lane has been designated.

(d) This section does not prohibit driving across a two-way left-turn lane.

(e) Raised pavement markers may be used to simulate the painted lines described in this section when those markers are placed in accordance with standards established by the Department of Transportation.

[webny99]

Google normally offers a few options.  And it depends on the overall distance.  If it's going to be an hour or longer, it'll try looking for long-distance routes.  If you're about 10 or 20 miles out, it may detect shorter, more local routes. 

I absolutely confirm and endorse this.
From home just east of Rochester, to Montreal, a trip of about 5 hours, Google usually recommends the Thruway to I-81 to the Thousand Islands border crossing. Adds 27 miles vs. taking NY 104, but it's all freeway.
Now, what if I cut the trip short and go to Pulaski, NY (just picking a town at random that's not too far away)?
The trip is now about 1h50 using either route, but Google now recommends that I use NY 104, even though the exact same fundamentals are at play, and I would be passing right by Pulaski to get to Montreal, but having taken an entirely different route.

So there you have it. Google doesn't like to serve you non-freeways on long trips if at all possible, especially if it's within a few minutes.
Which is a good thing if you ask me. Keep the tired drivers away from the local traffic braking, turning in and out of driveways, etc.

But then there are weird exceptions, like the aversion to I-180. I guess the difference is, any trip involving I-180 is going to have non-freeway segments all over the place anyways, so what's 15 more miles of two-lane if it will save five minutes? Unlike Rochester to Montreal, where it's much more clear cut: Either all freeway, or else 2/3 freeway and 1/3 on backroads. No switching back and forth.