Railroad crossings tied in with Traffic lights.

[jakeroot]

https://goo.gl/maps/XzNPNnknSiL2

I have no idea how this crossing functions.

They should have aligned the intersection like this... Right now, everyone except right turns from Tyler is screwed.

Awesome clip Arthur. Thanks for sharing. Not sure I've seen a railroad signal operate like that in WA before. I can think of a ton of railroad-actuated signals all over Western Washington, but none that enter any sort of flash mode.

Two questions: Do trains still run down Houser? And if so, does that signal still enter flashing mode? Not sure where that rail line once went, or rather, if it changed following the construction of the Renton Landing development.

Trains still run down Houser, now serving just the Boeing factory.  It used to go to Woodinville, and Sumas, to interchange with Canadian railroads.  (Actually, before the Burlington Northern merger, this line connected with the Milwaukee Road line to Snoqualmie pass, or just went to an interchange yard near the future Gene Coluon Park.)  These lights still flash, although others have more logical modes.  The light at North 3rd and Sunset Blvd N. used to go into red four way flash mode, leading to chaos, especially as traffic backed by the train.  Now Sunset is green the whole time a train goes by, leaving me as a pedestrian stranded on the other side wanting to cross for a closer look.

I would love to have seen that 3rd/Sunset intersection in flash mode, especially with that triple left turn. I'm laughing just thinking about it. Too bad the signal logic doesn't allow a pedestrian-exclusive phase during rail crossings. This signal in Puyallup is pretty smart. When the train approaches, the northern approach (from 5th) gets an exclusive green mode for about 10 seconds. After that, Stewart Ave stays green except when someone approaches the left turn lane from the southern approach (from 4th), or when a pedestrian activates the walk signal for any direction. It does this with regular doghouse signals, which unfortunately results in some yellow traps on occasion.

Awesome clip Arthur. Thanks for sharing. Not sure I've seen a railroad signal operate like that in WA before. I can think of a ton of railroad-actuated signals all over Western Washington, but none that enter any sort of flash mode.

Two questions: Do trains still run down Houser? And if so, does that signal still enter flashing mode? Not sure where that rail line once went, or rather, if it changed following the construction of the Renton Landing development.

You can get a glimpse at how the lights still operate on this newer video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8svKXQ2eaM

I would take a day off work to see that.

What confuses me about the Houser Way tracks is where they connect to the Boeing facility. Looks to me like it has to go towards Gene Coulon Park before reversing.

[Amtrakprod]

https://goo.gl/maps/XzNPNnknSiL2

I have no idea how this crossing functions.

They should have aligned the intersection like this... Right now, everyone except right turns from Tyler is screwed.


Honestly, I think how it is now is fine, I would add some quad arms so left turns and right turns on Tyler can occur while the train is coming

Awesome clip Arthur. Thanks for sharing. Not sure I've seen a railroad signal operate like that in WA before. I can think of a ton of railroad-actuated signals all over Western Washington, but none that enter any sort of flash mode.

Two questions: Do trains still run down Houser? And if so, does that signal still enter flashing mode? Not sure where that rail line once went, or rather, if it changed following the construction of the Renton Landing development.

Trains still run down Houser, now serving just the Boeing factory.  It used to go to Woodinville, and Sumas, to interchange with Canadian railroads.  (Actually, before the Burlington Northern merger, this line connected with the Milwaukee Road line to Snoqualmie pass, or just went to an interchange yard near the future Gene Coluon Park.)  These lights still flash, although others have more logical modes.  The light at North 3rd and Sunset Blvd N. used to go into red four way flash mode, leading to chaos, especially as traffic backed by the train.  Now Sunset is green the whole time a train goes by, leaving me as a pedestrian stranded on the other side wanting to cross for a closer look.

I would love to have seen that 3rd/Sunset intersection in flash mode, especially with that triple left turn. I'm laughing just thinking about it. Too bad the signal logic doesn't allow a pedestrian-exclusive phase during rail crossings. This signal in Puyallup is pretty smart. When the train approaches, the northern approach (from 5th) gets an exclusive green mode for about 10 seconds. After that, Stewart Ave stays green except when someone approaches the left turn lane from the southern approach (from 4th), or when a pedestrian activates the walk signal for any direction. It does this with regular doghouse signals, which unfortunately results in some yellow traps on occasion.

Awesome clip Arthur. Thanks for sharing. Not sure I've seen a railroad signal operate like that in WA before. I can think of a ton of railroad-actuated signals all over Western Washington, but none that enter any sort of flash mode.

Two questions: Do trains still run down Houser? And if so, does that signal still enter flashing mode? Not sure where that rail line once went, or rather, if it changed following the construction of the Renton Landing development.

You can get a glimpse at how the lights still operate on this newer video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8svKXQ2eaM

I would take a day off work to see that.

What confuses me about the Houser Way tracks is where they connect to the Boeing facility. Looks to me like it has to go towards Gene Coulon Park before reversing.

[Brandon]

Very common to tie the signals to the rail crossing signals in Illinois, whether the rails go through the intersection or next to it.

Just a few examples:
LaGrange Road, Downtown LaGrange.
Irving Park Road & Wood Dale Road, Wood Dale.
Ashland Avenue, Blue Island Avenue, & Cermak Road, Chicago.
Pulaski Road & 87th Street, Evergreen Park, next to Southwest Highway.

Of course, tying the signals to the tracks is no guarantee that you'll avoid grade crossing collisions.

[ErmineNotyours]

I would love to have seen that 3rd/Sunset intersection in flash mode, especially with that triple left turn. I'm laughing just thinking about it. Too bad the signal logic doesn't allow a pedestrian-exclusive phase during rail crossings. This signal in Puyallup is pretty smart. When the train approaches, the northern approach (from 5th) gets an exclusive green mode for about 10 seconds. After that, Stewart Ave stays green except when someone approaches the left turn lane from the southern approach (from 4th), or when a pedestrian activates the walk signal for any direction. It does this with regular doghouse signals, which unfortunately results in some yellow traps on occasion.

The flashing mode was when it was a two lane turn.  Now that it's a three lane turn (two plus a split) it would be even more useful for that direction to have a green light on long trains. But it's those pesky few cars that want to go forward towards the train that's the problem.

I would take a day off work to see that.

What confuses me about the Houser Way tracks is where they connect to the Boeing facility. Looks to me like it has to go towards Gene Coulon Park before reversing.

It has to switch in, which is awkward for it being the only train movement there, but it's cheaper than constructing a direct connection.

[jakeroot]

I would love to have seen that 3rd/Sunset intersection in flash mode, especially with that triple left turn. I'm laughing just thinking about it. Too bad the signal logic doesn't allow a pedestrian-exclusive phase during rail crossings. This signal in Puyallup is pretty smart. When the train approaches, the northern approach (from 5th) gets an exclusive green mode for about 10 seconds. After that, Stewart Ave stays green except when someone approaches the left turn lane from the southern approach (from 4th), or when a pedestrian activates the walk signal for any direction. It does this with regular doghouse signals, which unfortunately results in some yellow traps on occasion.

The flashing mode was when it was a two lane turn.  Now that it's a three lane turn (two plus a split) it would be even more useful for that direction to have a green light on long trains. But it's those pesky few cars that want to go forward towards the train that's the problem.

I had no idea how new that triple-left turn was. As usual, Renton forgot to install an extra through head when the second one was removed from the central signal.

Seems to me that they could still allow that triple left to operate, with the understanding that through traffic would quickly run out of room and would be required to wait. The installation of a "don't block the box" sign could help if they went that route.

[wanderer2575]

Right here in Auburn Hills, MI at Joslyn and Brown Roads just off I-75. The same tracks cross Joslyn two more times north of here.

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.7072075,-83.2851637,3a,75y,337.84h,94.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s21mF6eMet3CTmXXVssMZPQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

That's an interesting set-up.

A similar setup at the Wixom Road/Pontiac Trail intersection in Wixom, MI.  As in the Auburn Hills example, the mast arms are all on the near side entering the intersection.

https://goo.gl/maps/EFF9Dk5aZpx

[MNHighwayMan]

Here's one on US-65 in Albert Lea, MN. I don't know how it works, exactly, since the few times I've been through there hasn't been a train.

[PHLBOS]

Delaware County, PA has a few:

Intersection of Providence Rd/North Ave./South Ave. and SEPTA's Media-Elwyn Regional Rail Line at the Secane Station in Secane (Upper Darby Twp.)

PA 420 (Kedron Ave.)/Morton Ave./Yale Ave. and SEPTA's Media-Elwyn Regional Rail Line at the Morton Station in Morton

Springfield Rd./Brookside Rd. and SEPTA' s Route 101 (Media) trolley in Springfield

Baltimore Ave. and SEPTA's Route 102 (Sharon Hill) trolley crossing in Clifton Heights - Baltimore Pike Station

PA 3 (West Chester Pike)/Garrett Rd./Bywood Ave./Terminal Sq. and SEPTA's Route 101 (Media) & 102 (Sharon Hill) trolleys in Upper Darby Twp. near the 69th St. Transportation Center

[davmillar]

Here's another intersection in Michigan. It's in Saginaw and isn't too complex. The train tracks cross Michigan, Fraser and Vermont on an angle and when there is a train present the traffic lights flash red in all directions.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.4073187,-83.9768756,3a,75y,32.82h,89.71t/data=!3m5!1e1!3m3!1s-qQZ9N8Ffwu5FvH1J9sSyQ!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D-qQZ9N8Ffwu5FvH1J9sSyQ%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D182.70222%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100

This one isn't at an intersection with a traffic light but I've had to wait for a train at this crossing before and the degree of the angle the tracks travel at compared to the street make the train pretty much right on top of you as you are waiting for the train to go through.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.408086,-83.9730268,3a,75y,26.88h,83.39t/data=!3m5!1e1!3m3!1seujtynPm0Qp9Tqjcocto4w!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo1.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DeujtynPm0Qp9Tqjcocto4w%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D94.35492%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100

These two views are about two blocks apart.

I grew up in Saginaw and I don't recall them always doing that. I wonder how recently the change was made.

Here's one I pass regularly on my way to work near Fort Worth/Hurst, Texas: https://goo.gl/maps/QXSpgPBayUG2
The lights flash red when the train is coming through. I'm interested to see if/how the configuration changes as the intersection and connection of Texas 121 with I-820 just east of it are under construction. I believe they're redoing the entire contraption adding express lanes on 820 and fixing the odd ramp to 820 South.

[Ian]

Some Maine examples...

• Commercial and Washington Streets in Bath.
• State Street (Business ME 15) at Penobscot Street in Brewer.
• US 2 at the Bangor Water Works in Bangor.
• US 2 at ME 178 in Milford.

[plain]

Here's one at VA 147 & SR 675/711 in Chesterfield County, VA

https://goo.gl/maps/mm42dhUzHhy

[ErmineNotyours]

Now that we're posting trolley signal pictures: at the south end of the South Lake Union Trolley in Seattle, they recently (a few years ago?) filled in a street to enlarge McGraw Square and make the area more pedestrian-friendly.  However, on one side of the closure, they left the pedestrian signal where it was, WAY past the other side of the new narrow cross walk, which now only crosses the trolley line.  Always obey the walk sign!

Street View

Distant ped signal on recently narrowed crossing by Arthur Allen, on Flickr

[jflick99]

A couple in my area:

67th St. and Carter in Merriam, KS.

Pflumm Rd. and Santa Fe Trail Dr. in Lenexa, KS. It's the only one I've seen of this type (tracks only cross one leg) where the traffic signal is beyond the tracks instead of before.

[kphoger]

Does this fit the spirit of the thread?
https://goo.gl/maps/GRuMweimRR52

29th Street North @ Broadway in Wichita, KS

29th crosses a 14-track freight yard that parallels Broadway, so a stoplight and signs instruct drivers to stop before the tracks when Broadway turns red.

Here is a view looking the other way, so you can see how little space there is between the railroad r/o/w and Broadway.

[barcncpt44]

There is this crossing in Alexander City, AL.  Two parallel roads with a railroad track running down the middle.  this intersection comes with right turn protected turns.

https://www.google.com/maps/@32.9428364,-85.9571351,3a,37.5y,79.72h,87.3t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1shS-DcQyYbCmbSn7j_bPJXg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

[6a]

I forgot I had a video of one in Columbus. Lockbourne and Refugee Roads. Apologies for the shaky shot; I was in a rough running diesel that day.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n23h8Qmq2LM

[index]

On a semi-relevant note, this crossing appears to be controlled by signals. I suppose you could say it's tied in.


https://www.google.com/maps/@35.0398955,-85.2824015,3a,49.6y,44.99h,91.14t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sfExTOqX3kab_sAYzFUA0fg!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo1.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DfExTOqX3kab_sAYzFUA0fg%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D330.4194%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

[Amtrakprod]

On a semi-relevant note, this crossing appears to be controlled by signals. I suppose you could say it's tied in.


https://www.google.com/maps/@35.0398955,-85.2824015,3a,49.6y,44.99h,91.14t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sfExTOqX3kab_sAYzFUA0fg!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo1.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DfExTOqX3kab_sAYzFUA0fg%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D330.4194%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

Very interesting! I wonder why they don't just install a crossing system, it seems it would be cheaper

[jeffandnicole]

NJ 129 in Trenton has a parallel line that is mostly used by NJ Transit's Riverline light rail line.  The 3 intersections on 129 all have tie-ins with the railroad, so that 129 traffic can go straight while the train comes by.

As Cass Street, the northbound train activates the crossing prior to getting to the train station, so traffic on Cass St. is stopped while the train is still in the station.

An oddity at these 3 crossings: After the train clears the crossing, the gates start going up, and the light starts to cycle.  By the time the cross street gets the green light, the gates are about 2 seconds from being fully up, and the railroad signals are still flashing red.  Technically, a confliction of signals!

Here's the 3 intersections:
Lalor St: https://goo.gl/maps/Zo54PUJQ9uy
Cass St: https://goo.gl/maps/VLeLTCX1nLF2
Hamilton Ave: https://goo.gl/maps/1tyS5tYMNBA2

[Flint1979]

This intersection in Saginaw, MI (corner of W. Genesee and N. Michigan) has the train crossing just east of the intersection not really tied into the intersection but whenever there is a train going through there the traffic gets backed up beyond the intersection. Trains go through this crossing pretty often too. It got so bad that Saginaw's bus system (STARS) had to redesign their bus routes to avoid this train crossing. Instead of using W. Genesee or Johnson like they use to the west side bus routes now use the I-675 overpass in both directions to get between downtown and the west side of the city.

Here's a Google view of it.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.4349712,-83.9484852,111m/data=!3m1!1e3

[Amtrakprod]

This intersection in Saginaw, MI (corner of W. Genesee and N. Michigan) has the train crossing just east of the intersection not really tied into the intersection but whenever there is a train going through there the traffic gets backed up beyond the intersection. Trains go through this crossing pretty often too. It got so bad that Saginaw's bus system (STARS) had to redesign their bus routes to avoid this train crossing. Instead of using W. Genesee or Johnson like they use to the west side bus routes now use the I-675 overpass in both directions to get between downtown and the west side of the city.

Here's a Google view of it.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.4349712,-83.9484852,111m/data=!3m1!1e3

Honestly, try to bring it up at some point because that's awful because they are very close and they should be synced.

[Flint1979]

This intersection in Saginaw, MI (corner of W. Genesee and N. Michigan) has the train crossing just east of the intersection not really tied into the intersection but whenever there is a train going through there the traffic gets backed up beyond the intersection. Trains go through this crossing pretty often too. It got so bad that Saginaw's bus system (STARS) had to redesign their bus routes to avoid this train crossing. Instead of using W. Genesee or Johnson like they use to the west side bus routes now use the I-675 overpass in both directions to get between downtown and the west side of the city.

Here's a Google view of it.

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.4349712,-83.9484852,111m/data=!3m1!1e3

Honestly, try to bring it up at some point because that's awful because they are very close and they should be synced.

That intersection was reconstructed a few years ago. The tracks should go through an underpass at both W. Genesee and Johnson. Actually what I'm calling Johnson is really Davenport but it gets called Johnson instead because the bridge is the Johnson Street bridge. It's actually signed as Davenport and everything too but what people around here know as Davenport is the westbound one way of M-58.

[index]

Another interesting setup:


https://www.google.com/maps/@42.1588828,-77.0919209,3a,40.8y,226.09h,94.63t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFAslP-rV0074wyWVb-xB2w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


This intersection is signalized, but not for the intersection, it's for the crossing only. Traffic from the opposing road is controlled with beacons, while the main road is controlled by the signals in a flasher mode. I would assume they go red when a train comes through. By the looks of this, this would make the green phase at this setup unused. Crossbuck is also mounted on a mast arm which is kind of uncommon.


https://www.google.com/maps/@42.5339401,-78.4241482,3a,60y,82.28h,88.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1swwddpDELuiKlJ18fwQyDbQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


And another signal-controlled railroad crossing, in NYS as well. I've found a few of them in this state before.

[Amtrakprod]

Another interesting setup:


https://www.google.com/maps/@42.1588828,-77.0919209,3a,40.8y,226.09h,94.63t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFAslP-rV0074wyWVb-xB2w!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


This intersection is signalized, but not for the intersection, it's for the crossing only. Traffic from the opposing road is controlled with beacons, while the main road is controlled by the signals in a flasher mode. I would assume they go red when a train comes through. By the looks of this, this would make the green phase at this setup unused. Crossbuck is also mounted on a mast arm which is kind of uncommon.


https://www.google.com/maps/@42.5339401,-78.4241482,3a,60y,82.28h,88.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1swwddpDELuiKlJ18fwQyDbQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656


And another signal-controlled railroad crossing, in NYS as well. I've found a few of them in this state before.

A while ago I visited a crossing like that but it also had gates, here is the video, and here is google maps link:
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.9478071,-74.209307,3a,75y,247.79h,84.69t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQnPCAIo4U1pBFpJO29k1BQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Video: https://youtu.be/8jeJB7tpt7A?t=120
skip to 2:00 in the video for the crossing view

[index]

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.2929548,-83.1121253,3a,75y,81.68h,97.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sM-eX0JupVhP8YQ3_1u8XUw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192


This crossing in Detroit, near Zug Island, appears to be controlled with HAWK signals. Interesting.