Applying Rules of the Road Elsewhere

[webny99]

You know, like sidewalks, and airport terminals, and so on.

Which rules of the road do you think should apply to bikes and pedestrians (and so forth) and to what extent?

[abefroman329]

It should be "walk left, stand right" on escalators and moving sidewalks, everywhere, at all times.  Maybe "walk right, stand left" in countries where they drive on the left side of the road, but people need to not stand two abreast on escalators and moving sidewalks.

[abefroman329]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

[webny99]

I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop

I know you added a clause, but for me personally, this works well just like this, as a standalone statement. 

[jeffandnicole]

You know, like sidewalks, and airport terminals, and so on.

Which rules of the road do you think should apply to bikes and pedestrians (and so forth) and to what extent?

Supermarkets and wherever you would find shopping carts.  In what insane universe do people think it's ok to just park the shopping cart in the middle of the aisle.  And not just once, but multiple times during the grocery trip, and each and every time they shop?

Or people that are walking, and just stop to look at something, completely unaware that there may be other people in the same general area walking as well.  And even worse, when they turn around to walk back, completely ignoring that there were people behind them.

I think about this sort of question sometimes when I see people do stupid shit, and all I can think about is that I hope they have just a few more ounces of common sense when they drive (spoiler alert - they don't).

[abefroman329]

I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop

I know you added a clause, but for me personally, this works well just like this, as a standalone statement. 

Ha!  Which reminds me, I'm also a little fed up with people who assume two-way stops are four-way stops and pull out in front of me because they think I have a stop sign when I don't.

[MisterSG1]

You know the "stand right, walk left" rules on escalators in subway systems people have been talking about.

It's rather funny because on the London Underground, despite traffic being on the other side of the road, to my knowledge it is "stand right, walk left" there.


The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

[oscar]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

Some states have lightened up on that requirement, letting bikes blow through stop signs when it's safe to do so, since it's harder for bicyclists to stop and restart than for pedestrians or operators of motorized vehicles. But not in the situation you describe.

[froggie]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

Some states have lightened up on that requirement, letting bikes blow through stop signs when it's safe to do so, since it's harder for bicyclists to stop and restart than for pedestrians or operators of motorized vehicles. But not in the situation you describe.

The "Idaho Stop" to which you refer to allows bicyclists to treat stop signs as yield signs when there is no intervening traffic.  Which effectively means, slow down on approach...and if there's no traffic already at the intersection, keep going.

But yes, that's not as Abe described.  Though in my experience, the type of cyclist to blow through stop signs in the fashion Abe dscribes is likely a MAMIL (look it up if you don't know) who also has a tendency to treat stop signs the same way when they're in a motor vehicle.

[abefroman329]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

Some states have lightened up on that requirement, letting bikes blow through stop signs when it's safe to do so, since it's harder for bicyclists to stop and restart than for pedestrians or operators of motorized vehicles. But not in the situation you describe.

The "Idaho Stop" to which you refer to allows bicyclists to treat stop signs as yield signs when there is no intervening traffic.  Which effectively means, slow down on approach...and if there's no traffic already at the intersection, keep going.

But yes, that's not as Abe described.  Though in my experience, the type of cyclist to blow through stop signs in the fashion Abe dscribes is likely a MAMIL (look it up if you don't know) who also has a tendency to treat stop signs the same way when they're in a motor vehicle.

*googles MAMIL* Haha, oh dear.

I don't think they do the same thing in motor vehicles, I think the attitude is very much "Fuck you, I'll do what I want because I know you won't pulverize me when I do."

[abefroman329]

The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

WMATA refused to put up similar signs on their escalators because it was their official position that riders shouldn't be walking on escalators.  Seriously.

[oscar]

The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

WMATA refused to put up similar signs on their escalators because it was their official position that riders shouldn't be walking on escalators.  Seriously.

Considering the notorious fragility and unreliability of WMATA's escalators, there's something to that.

Notwithstanding, people standing on the left (often tourists) get yelled at by other users trying to pass them.

[abefroman329]

The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

WMATA refused to put up similar signs on their escalators because it was their official position that riders shouldn't be walking on escalators.  Seriously.

Considering the notorious fragility and unreliability of WMATA's escalators, there's something to that.

Notwithstanding, people standing on the left (often tourists) get yelled at by other users trying to pass them.

And rightfully so.  Commuting to work on Metro during tourist season was like trying to drive to work with a parade in front of you.

[jeffandnicole]

The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

WMATA refused to put up similar signs on their escalators because it was their official position that riders shouldn't be walking on escalators.  Seriously.

Airports seem to be the only acceptable place for such signage. 

Likewise, sports stadiums seem to be the only normal place to find people drinking a beer while on an escalator.

[abefroman329]

The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

WMATA refused to put up similar signs on their escalators because it was their official position that riders shouldn't be walking on escalators.  Seriously.

Airports seem to be the only acceptable place for such signage. 

Likewise, sports stadiums seem to be the only normal place to find people drinking a beer while on an escalator.

I bet people do that in Vegas on the escalators that go up to the elevated crosswalks.

[Max Rockatansky]

Some retail stores used to have directional travel lanes or would direct traffic-flow one-way.  Stew Leonard's used to use one-Way traffic control to direct people through the store back in the 1990s when I was living in Connecticut.  I wish some of them big warehouse retailers like Costco would do the same thing, usually getting around is a pain in the ass with all the foot traffic heading in random directions. .

[abefroman329]

Some retail stores used to have directional travel lanes or would direct traffic-flow one-way.  Stew Leonard's used to use one-Way traffic control to direct people through the store back in the 1990s when I was living in Connecticut.  I wish some of them big warehouse retailers like Costco would do the same thing, usually getting around is a pain in the ass with all the foot traffic heading in random directions. .

Costco also needs an express lane for people like me who frequently go just to buy a few items.

[inkyatari]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

It's illegal for a cyclist to just go right through a stop sign in Illinois, as far as I am aware.  I always stop.  In Illinois, it's legal for a bicycle to go through a traffic control signal if they've been waiting for 3 minutes, and it is safe to proceed.

As for the escalator..  My opinion on the subject is probably unpopular, so I'm not going to say it here.

[20160805]

Stay on the right except to pass, don't stop or turn around randomly, don't run out into the middle of an intersection when there's clearly a lot of traffic there.  Just basic stuff like that.  Spatial awareness is key, too (although people with backpacks tend to be horrible at knowing what's behind them as they underestimate the amount of space they take up).  And don't walk side-by-side in groups so wide you end up taking the majority or entirety of the aisle/hallway either, and I don't need to see couples holding hands or making out in public.  Finally, keep a reasonable speed: don't run right through people and trample everyone, but for the love of Pete, don't walk so slowly that a bloody snail could outrun you!!

This is one of the reasons I hated high school so much: just a two-hallway-block commute between periods could take much longer than necessary and cause copious amounts of road (er, hallway) rage; as such, I was known for driving (er, walking) aggressively in those days.    I wanted to get to class on time and nothing more, not just stand there behind four other people who feel the need to walk really slow in front of me!

On that note, at my high school moving traffic speeds on flat hallways would vary anywhere from "acceptably slow" to "cramped and at the speed of a tortoise", but as soon as you got on the stairs, it became a race, with people running down them at 160 steps per minute and many people even taking the steps multiple at a time.  As someone who broke my wrist while running down the stairs once in 3rd grade, it never made sense to me - shouldn't you be going slower down the stairs?  Running down the stairs is even more dangerous when you're carrying 15 lbs of binders in front of you.

[abefroman329]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

It's illegal for a cyclist to just go right through a stop sign in Illinois, as far as I am aware.  I always stop.  In Illinois, it's legal for a bicycle to go through a traffic control signal if they've been waiting for 3 minutes, and it is safe to proceed.

As for the escalator..  My opinion on the subject is probably unpopular, so I'm not going to say it here.

I'm sure it's illegal, but if bicyclists were actually getting ticketed for it, they wouldn't be doing it. It's only an issue when the car doesn't see the cyclist and turns the cyclist into Hamburger Helper.

[Scott5114]

Walmart often sets up their main aisles with a "median" of pallets in the center of them. It stresses me out when people don't keep right of them.

Then again, enough about Walmart stresses me out that I rarely set foot in them.

[jeffandnicole]

Cyclists should come to a stop at stop signs.  I'm a little fed up with coming to a four-way-stop before a cyclist traveling perpendicular to my direction of motion and having to wait while they fly through the intersection.

It's illegal for a cyclist to just go right through a stop sign in Illinois, as far as I am aware.  I always stop.  In Illinois, it's legal for a bicycle to go through a traffic control signal if they've been waiting for 3 minutes, and it is safe to proceed.

As for the escalator..  My opinion on the subject is probably unpopular, so I'm not going to say it here.

I’m sure it’s illegal, but if bicyclists were actually getting ticketed for it, they wouldn’t be doing it. It’s only an issue when the car doesn’t see the cyclist and turns the cyclist into Hamburger Helper.

Then the bicyclists and the newspapers all take pity on the bicyclist.  Nary a word will be said about said bicyclist flying thru a stop sign.

[index]

I would love to send people to county jail for a few days for having no spatial awareness. /s, because someone here will probably take that literally


Seriously though, people who have no spatial awareness make my blood boil. Stop in hallways, on sidewalks, or in doorways to have a conversation? Don't do it. Walking with friends and blocking an entire sidewalk or hallway? Don't do it. Sudden stopping is annoying, keep it up people, I don't want to slam into you because you felt the need to have some public display of affection out of nowhere in the middle of the hallway.


What takes the cake for the world's worst spatial awareness is when someone's doing all of this and listening to music. There's someone at my school who stands in the doorway every single morning, waiting for her friend, funneling musical garbage into her ears and staring down at her phone, blissfully unaware of her surroundings. She makes no attempt to check if her friend is there or not, so she'll spend a while standing in the door, unable to hear people yelling at her to please move, over and over. This makes me wonder, if she drives, and if so, how much does she text and drive? If she has spatial awareness that bad, she must be bad at that too.

[hotdogPi]

I'm pretty much the opposite in hallways: get to my destination as fast as I can without slowing down anyone else, even if it means weaving between people.

[1995hoo]

The TTC used to actually place that on the escalators themselves, but have since removed it since the early 2000s as honestly it is dangerous but no one gives a crap anyway.

WMATA refused to put up similar signs on their escalators because it was their official position that riders shouldn't be walking on escalators.  Seriously.

Considering the notorious fragility and unreliability of WMATA's escalators, there's something to that.

Notwithstanding, people standing on the left (often tourists) get yelled at by other users trying to pass them.

And rightfully so.  Commuting to work on Metro during tourist season was like trying to drive to work with a parade in front of you.

Then you have the people, almost always tourists, who come to a stop right at the bottom of the escalator without first moving to one side. Where are the other people coming down the escalator supposed to go if you do that? I say "excuse me"  several times as I approach, but some of them still don't move. Seems to me you don't have much choice other than to push them out of the way in that situation.



Regarding grocery stores, I sometimes joke that Wegmans needs roundabouts at the aisle intersections. I slow down and crane my neck to ensure it's clear when I'm coming out of the end of an aisle. Lots of people (seems like most of them women) don't–they just barrel around the corner. I guess it's inconceivable to them that anyone might be going in a different direction. I suppose this is hardly unique to grocery stores, though–same thing happens with people who plant themselves directly in front of elevator doors or subway car doors to wait to board because obviously nobody could possibly want to get off.