News:

The AARoads Wiki is live! Come check it out!

Main Menu

Pennsylvania

Started by Alex, March 07, 2009, 07:01:05 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

MNHighwayMan

Quote from: ixnay on April 15, 2018, 08:10:08 AM
Quote from: MNHighwayMan on April 14, 2018, 11:49:14 PM
Quote from: Nanis on April 14, 2018, 11:34:39 PM
oh no
Oh yes. Mother Nature has decided you're no longer deserving of US-30. Now go sit in the corner and think about what you've done.
What's the over/under on days/weeks/months before http://www.pahighways.com/us/US30.html is updated to mention this near tragedy?  That page was last updated on 11.27.2015.

My god, that is a webpage straight out of the late 90s. I'm surprised that its last update was only 2½ years ago.


Gnutella

Quote from: ixnay on April 15, 2018, 08:07:05 AM
Quote from: Gnutella on April 15, 2018, 04:44:09 AM
What a lot of people don't realize is that many of the "hills" in the Pittsburgh area aren't actually hills. They're escarpments, which are much steeper and more unstable geologically. Landslides are a major problem in the Pittsburgh area because of them.

IOW the PGH area has the North and South Escarpments, not Hills. :) As for landslides, I remember hearing about them in the wake of winter snow and rain storms this past winter, via KDKA, which I can get in my car during the winter in the region where I live, due in part to my evening commuting schedule most nights.

How frequent are Pittsburgh area landslides?  And are they a common occurrence in, say, West Virginia or anyplace else east of the Great Plains?

ixnay

They're frequent enough to be a pain in the ass. It seems like a major non-Interstate highway gets buried by them every five years or so. When I was looking up the various landslides on PA 28 over the years, these were the search results I got. To get another idea, here's a look at PA 28 passing near the Allegheny River in Harmar Township. What makes the U.S. 30 landslide different is that the land fell out from under it, and the highway collapsed. That doesn't seem to happen as often as a landslide coming down on top of a highway.

I imagine that the worst-case scenario in the Pittsburgh area would be if there was a landslide that collapses the Boulevard of the Allies down onto I-376 east of downtown Pittsburgh. Getting into Pittsburgh from the east would only be possible via PA 28 or various surface streets like Penn Avenue, Liberty Avenue, Bigelow Boulevard, Fifth Avenue and Forbes Avenue. I would say that a landslide over the Fort Pitt Tunnel on the Fort Pitt Bridge side would be even worse, but the tunnel appears to protrude on that side, so it seems less susceptible.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: MNHighwayMan on April 15, 2018, 11:37:04 AM
Quote from: ixnay on April 15, 2018, 08:10:08 AM
Quote from: MNHighwayMan on April 14, 2018, 11:49:14 PM
Quote from: Nanis on April 14, 2018, 11:34:39 PM
oh no
Oh yes. Mother Nature has decided you're no longer deserving of US-30. Now go sit in the corner and think about what you've done.
What's the over/under on days/weeks/months before http://www.pahighways.com/us/US30.html is updated to mention this near tragedy?  That page was last updated on 11.27.2015.

My god, that is a webpage straight out of the late 90s. I'm surprised that its last update was only 2½ years ago.

Many webpages like that were started well before Facebook existed; well before this forum existed.  They are home-grown pages, done by dedicated people with their own time and money.

You want flashy, splashy and updated daily?  Build your own website.

MNHighwayMan

Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 16, 2018, 06:19:05 AM
Quote from: MNHighwayMan on April 15, 2018, 11:37:04 AM
Quote from: ixnay on April 15, 2018, 08:10:08 AM
What's the over/under on days/weeks/months before http://www.pahighways.com/us/US30.html is updated to mention this near tragedy?  That page was last updated on 11.27.2015.
My god, that is a webpage straight out of the late 90s. I'm surprised that its last update was only 2½ years ago.
Many webpages like that were started well before Facebook existed; well before this forum existed.  They are home-grown pages, done by dedicated people with their own time and money.

You want flashy, splashy and updated daily?  Build your own website.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking it whatsoever. It was more just a simple observation than anything else–I know that maintaining a good-looking website is difficult. ;-)

seicer

I had to drive through Pennsylvania last night and I was impressed with how the new New Stanton (I-70, Exit 57) has turned out. It hasn't killed off the business in town and Sheetz was practically overflowing at around 10 PM.

My question with that project and others is why a wider left shoulder wasn't implemented? And why a taller barrier wasn't used throughout? It was either a 4' left shoulder with a low Jersey barrier or a 4' left shoulder with a high Jersey barrier. And either asphalt or concrete - the latter only seemingly used at New Stanton.

Additionally, what will happen with the Monongahela River crossing? Will it be dualised? It's not out of the realm of possibilities - after all, the I-64 bridge over the Kanawha River near Nitro, West Virginia will be twinned and is of a similar type of facility.

I can't wait for the remainder of I-70 to be rebuilt. It was anxiety inducing in the rain, with hydroplaning an issue throughout. Being up against the left barrier, there was no margin of error.

roadman65

What is the connector called near Holidaysburg and Duncansville where both US 22 and I-99 are connected?  I know  tat someday US 22 is to go further east to bypass Holidaysburg so the road is left signed TO I-99 on the US 22 end where it leaves at the turnpike style exit for PA 764 and for unidirectional US 22 from I-99.  PennDOT will never assign temporary route numbers for partially built freeways, so how does the public identify these referenced number freeways or how does Altoona area residents reference this?
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

Mr_Northside

Quote from: seicer on April 16, 2018, 01:58:57 PM
My question with that project and others is why a wider left shoulder wasn't implemented? And why a taller barrier wasn't used throughout?

I'd guess right-of-way, and money to buy more of it (and possibly a genuine desire to not take/displace property as much as possible)  As for the barrier height.... I've wondered that myself, and am not sure what their guidelines are for how tall they build it in any given place.

QuoteAdditionally, what will happen with the Monongahela River crossing? Will it be dualised? It's not out of the realm of possibilities - after all, the I-64 bridge over the Kanawha River near Nitro, West Virginia will be twinned and is of a similar type of facility.

They just got done with a fairly major rehab with it just a year or so ago... so I wouldn't expect anything even more major like a dualization or complete replacement anytime soon.  What you see is what you get for probably the next 2 decades or so. 
Though if they ever want to do anything more significant, I am curious as to what solution they would come up with. In addition to the bridge itself, the freeway on either side of the river is crapped in a pretty tight, developed corridor.
I don't have opinions anymore. All I know is that no one is better than anyone else, and everyone is the best at everything

Gnutella

Quote from: seicer on April 16, 2018, 01:58:57 PM
I had to drive through Pennsylvania last night and I was impressed with how the new New Stanton (I-70, Exit 57) has turned out. It hasn't killed off the business in town and Sheetz was practically overflowing at around 10 PM.

My question with that project and others is why a wider left shoulder wasn't implemented? And why a taller barrier wasn't used throughout? It was either a 4' left shoulder with a low Jersey barrier or a 4' left shoulder with a high Jersey barrier. And either asphalt or concrete - the latter only seemingly used at New Stanton.

Additionally, what will happen with the Monongahela River crossing? Will it be dualised? It's not out of the realm of possibilities - after all, the I-64 bridge over the Kanawha River near Nitro, West Virginia will be twinned and is of a similar type of facility.

I can't wait for the remainder of I-70 to be rebuilt. It was anxiety inducing in the rain, with hydroplaning an issue throughout. Being up against the left barrier, there was no margin of error.

PennDOT likely would have had to spend a shitload of money to buy all the properties necessary to give I-70 full interior shoulders. There's also the issue of undermining, with a lot of abandoned mines in the area, and a wider highway being a heavier highway that makes mine subsidence more likely. As for asphalt versus concrete, there could have been multiple contractors on the project, or the cost of concrete spiked, or something like that.

briantroutman

Forgive me if this was already posted, but I couldn't find it anywhere.

On March 1st, The Express of Lock Haven reported that PennDOT applied for a $43 million INFRA grant to be used toward the $200 million cost of constructing a complete, high-speed interchange between I-80 and I-99. The article described PennDOT, the regional planning commission, and state and U.S. legislators as being unified in their support of allocating the resources for construction if the federal grant is approved.

LeftyJR

I figured this was about to happen.  I posted last year that PennDOT had cleared several acres of trees near the I-80/99 interchange.  The article is a little vague though, it says that the plan is still being pursued - not really a confirmation?

Hot Rod Hootenanny

Quote from: LeftyJR on April 24, 2018, 05:18:02 PM
I figured this was about to happen.  I posted last year that PennDOT had cleared several acres of trees near the I-80/99 interchange.  The article is a little vague though, it says that the plan is still being pursued - not really a confirmation?

From what I saw, this past weekend, PennDot is still clearing trees around I-80 & US 220/PA 26 (I-99).
FWIW, I noticed plenty of trees being cleared away from I-80/79 as well. Not sure if that is harbinger of things to come.
Please, don't sue Alex & Andy over what I wrote above

Mr_Northside

Quote from: Hot Rod Hootenanny on April 24, 2018, 10:01:06 PM
Quote from: LeftyJR on April 24, 2018, 05:18:02 PM
I figured this was about to happen.  I posted last year that PennDOT had cleared several acres of trees near the I-80/99 interchange.  The article is a little vague though, it says that the plan is still being pursued - not really a confirmation?


From what I saw, this past weekend, PennDot is still clearing trees around I-80 & US 220/PA 26 (I-99).
FWIW, I noticed plenty of trees being cleared away from I-80/79 as well. Not sure if that is harbinger of things to come.

I don't think there is any actual plans to do anything, construction wise, with I-80 & 79 - so that might actually just might mean that the I-80/99/US-220 area is just maintenance clearing (especially if they haven't secured the money)
I don't have opinions anymore. All I know is that no one is better than anyone else, and everyone is the best at everything

Roadsguy

Something I noticed in PennDOT's iTMS thing is that, with PennDOT using an SR 6xxx designation for under construction routes, SR 6023 is still in the system in Lancaster County on the Goat Path. It gives an error when you try to view it, though, so I guess something is set up wrong. It doesn't appear on the Type 10 maps or traffic volume maps either. What does appear in the Type 10 and traffic count maps is the bridge over Horseshoe Road, which for some reason has a separate designation of SR 1124. That too gives an error in iTMS.

Since it doesn't seem to appear in any maps, I'm not sure if the SR 6023 designation extends fully from the newer stub at US 30, or if it just exists on the part that was ever graded, from Millcross Road to just past PA 772. There doesn't seem to be an SR 8xxx or SR 9xxx designation set aside for the ramps at PA 772.

The US 219 expressway under construction in Somerset County gives a similar error in iTMS, though the CSVT sections will work, and highlight an invisible road section in the map.
Mileage-based exit numbering implies the existence of mileage-cringe exit numbering.

MASTERNC

Drove US 15 down from New York to Williamsport for the first time in a couple of years and noticed there are now exit numbers for what used to be unnumbered exits.  I assume this is another step towards signing I-99, and I also assume those mileage-based exits are from I-99 mileage and not from US 15 mileage.

Alps

Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 08:17:34 AM
Drove US 15 down from New York to Williamsport for the first time in a couple of years and noticed there are now exit numbers for what used to be unnumbered exits.  I assume this is another step towards signing I-99, and I also assume those mileage-based exits are from I-99 mileage and not from US 15 mileage.
I've heard they're from US 15 mileage.

MASTERNC

Quote from: Alps on July 09, 2018, 08:26:31 AM
Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 08:17:34 AM
Drove US 15 down from New York to Williamsport for the first time in a couple of years and noticed there are now exit numbers for what used to be unnumbered exits.  I assume this is another step towards signing I-99, and I also assume those mileage-based exits are from I-99 mileage and not from US 15 mileage.
I've heard they're from US 15 mileage.

A little silly if they are since they will have to change again when PennDOT decides to sign I-99 (I guess the couple of driveways leading onto the NB side are one impediment from doing a partial sign like NY has).

SGwithADD

Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 10:01:53 AM
Quote from: Alps on July 09, 2018, 08:26:31 AM
Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 08:17:34 AM
Drove US 15 down from New York to Williamsport for the first time in a couple of years and noticed there are now exit numbers for what used to be unnumbered exits.  I assume this is another step towards signing I-99, and I also assume those mileage-based exits are from I-99 mileage and not from US 15 mileage.
I've heard they're from US 15 mileage.

A little silly if they are since they will have to change again when PennDOT decides to sign I-99 (I guess the couple of driveways leading onto the NB side are one impediment from doing a partial sign like NY has).

Just checked with the help of Google Maps.  The exit numbers are for I-99.  For example, the exit for PA 414 is at roughly mile 162 for (future) I-99, and mile 159 for US 15.  PA 414 is signed as Exit 162.

Of course, this is assuming that I-99 will precisely follow the US 220 routing.

ixnay

Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 10:01:53 AMA little silly if they are since they will have to change again when PennDOT decides to sign I-99 (I guess the couple of driveways leading onto the NB side are one impediment from doing a partial sign like NY has).

Are those driveways discernable on Google Satellite?  Where are they?

ixnay
The Washington/Baltimore/Arlington CSA has two Key Bridges, a Minnesota Avenue, and a Mannasota Avenue.

MASTERNC

Quote from: ixnay on July 09, 2018, 09:18:44 PM
Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 10:01:53 AMA little silly if they are since they will have to change again when PennDOT decides to sign I-99 (I guess the couple of driveways leading onto the NB side are one impediment from doing a partial sign like NY has).

Are those driveways discernable on Google Satellite?  Where are they?


ixnay

Yes.  It's actually a township road, according to Google Maps

https://goo.gl/maps/7n6qzQdy63U2

Roadsguy

Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 09:26:17 PM
Quote from: ixnay on July 09, 2018, 09:18:44 PM
Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 10:01:53 AMA little silly if they are since they will have to change again when PennDOT decides to sign I-99 (I guess the couple of driveways leading onto the NB side are one impediment from doing a partial sign like NY has).

Are those driveways discernable on Google Satellite?  Where are they?


ixnay

Yes.  It's actually a township road, according to Google Maps

https://goo.gl/maps/7n6qzQdy63U2

Doesn't seem to be a dead end. Should be easy enough to just block it off.
Mileage-based exit numbering implies the existence of mileage-cringe exit numbering.

ixnay

#795
Quote
Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 09:26:17 PM
Quote from: ixnay on July 09, 2018, 09:18:44 PM
Quote from: MASTERNC on July 09, 2018, 10:01:53 AMA little silly if they are since they will have to change again when PennDOT decides to sign I-99 (I guess the couple of driveways leading onto the NB side are one impediment from doing a partial sign like NY has).

Are those driveways discernable on Google Satellite?  Where are they?


ixnay

Yes.  It's actually a township road, according to Google Maps

https://goo.gl/maps/7n6qzQdy63U2

Brings back memories of my vacation in the Finger Lakes in the fall of 2012 when I went up into the region via U.S. 15, I-86, and and NY 414.

ixnay

Quote from: seicer on July 10, 2018, 07:20:11 PM
It looks to be more of a utility access road, which could remain open but gated.

seicer, you seem to be right as Google Sat shows it to access small mountaintop utilities.

ixnay
The Washington/Baltimore/Arlington CSA has two Key Bridges, a Minnesota Avenue, and a Mannasota Avenue.

seicer

It looks to be more of a utility access road, which could remain open but gated.

qguy

#797


Took this picture about a week ago, facing westbound on Tunnel Hill Road just beyond the northwest corner of Lebanon, Pennsylvania. The cut in the bottom half of the picture is an abandoned railroad ROW that is being converted into a trail (an extension of the Lebanon Valley Rail Trail).

The rail line was abandoned sometime after it suffered severe damage from Hurricane Agnes in 1972. (Many rail lines in the region suffered the same fate.) Sometime in the late 1980s PennDOT removed the bridge over the railroad ROW and replaced it with fill. (One less bridge on which to spend money inspecting and maintaining.) PennDOT is now excavating the fill and installing a large concrete box culvert (composed of precast segments, I believe) to allow for an extension of the trail along the old rail line north from its current terminus and trailhead in town.

What's interesting about all of this is that the excavation has revealed that when PennDOT converted the bridge to fill, it did not remove the bridge abutments but merely buried them. They've now been exposed by the excavation. You can see the western abutment in the middle of the image.

The project calls for fill over the box culvert. I don't know whether the old abutments will be removed or reburied. I'll observe and re-post later.

BTW, Tunnel Hill Road is called that because the Union Canal Tunnel passes beneath it (a few hundred yards to the east of the above pic). Constructed from 1825—1827, it was part of a system of canals and a portage railroad that connected Philadelphia with Pittsburgh over the Allegheny Mountains. It's listed National Historic Landmark and National Historic Civil Engineering Landmark. It's now part of a park which includes a section of the canal. On Sundays during the summer one can take boat tours through it. Here's a pic:



Tunnel Hill Road is just over the crest of the hill atop the canal tunnel.


[Edited to remove typo.]

jemacedo9

^^ That's quite interesting on multiple levels - thanks for the post!!

steviep24

Interesting video about the abandoned PA Turnpike tunnels

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKGgMM9pilA



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.