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Author Topic: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway  (Read 184824 times)

ILRoad55

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #450 on: September 27, 2017, 04:22:25 PM »

Sounds awesome.

I did the 355 event when I was a kid. My father and I walked across the Des Plaines River Bridge, it was freezing cold that day but I enjoyed it.
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edwaleni

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #451 on: September 27, 2017, 10:22:26 PM »

I wouldn't rule out talk on extending the EOE westward picking up around 2025 when the current improvement program wraps up, especially if the IL 53 extension dies out.

I bet you it will be needed within the next decade or two. A link from Elgin to O'Hare without the use of I-90, and a nice in-between highway corridor between I-90 and I-88 serving the West/Northwest suburbs

I believe the western extension of IL-390 to North Ave/Lake Street will be an IDOT project, since it will be an arterial rather than a freeway. So ISTHA won't have anything to do with it.

I do wonder how they will get traffic to slow down between the existing western terminus of IL-390 and County Farm Road if the CFR intersection will be a stoplight. There does not seem to be a lot of space between the roads.

IL-390/US-20 was designed to have CFR go over it with a urban style exit layout. That is why IDOT didn't amass any excess dirt at the end like they typically do.  The plan was to trench 2 ponds on each side of CFR to supply fill for the rise over.  If and when they decide to extend it, they will probably use the same idea.  Since the ROW west of CFR is wetlands, there are several more drainage ponds that will be trenched to supply fill as the ROW turns NW back to the original US20.

As you can see IDOT not having any money was a killer when the parcel in black was sold to the local school district.



I don't believe there was ever a plan to buy that property. The EOE was suppose to follow the existing US 20 west of North Ave, and it wasn't going to be full access control, more of a parkway-style with a mixture of at-grades and grade separations.

Yes, in the FAP-6 Environmental Review Report, there are notes about a meeting with the City of Bartlett officials on the extension of Bartlett Road south of the current US20 and work an intersection with Oak Street (now Oak Lane) due to a high accident rate at Oak Street (Lane) and US 20. There were also concerns that the then Eastview Junior High (now Bartlett Middle School) was going to be too close to the ROW even though there were no frontage roads planned. They had already decided a cloverleaf was impractical and a diamond would have to be used. 

This was in 1971/1972. When Eastview was expanded north by the Bartlett School District in the 1980's, they took up the buffer space the ROW expected to acquire and today IDOT would have to condemn all the retail property between the school and US20 to make it work.

Here is a closer view of the Elgin-O'Hare/Bartlett Road Exit was supposed to look like.

The light blue is the ROW
The green line is IDOT owned property
The purple lines are proposed water retention ponds
The redline was the proposed Bartlett Road to Oak Lane extension with the diamond ramps.
It also shows how Oak Lane was going to dead end into a circle drive for the school and north of the EOH it would be a service road for the retail strip center.
The dotted light yellow shows what happened when the school expanded north.

The EOH was supposed to go below grade between US20 on the right all the way past the school to keep road noise down and then rise as it meets Bartlett Road and then move north back to the current US20 alignment.

\

You can even see where IDOT bought land from the developer across Oak Lane from the Junior High. The grading for the streets and cul-de-sac are still visible.
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ET21

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #452 on: September 28, 2017, 08:14:16 AM »

Took a look at the 390/290 interchange for the first time in probably a year. Looks awesome
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Henry

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #453 on: September 28, 2017, 09:43:45 AM »

Seems to me that they'll keep it IL 390 until I-490 is completed around the west side of O'Hare, and I will bet that I-390 signs will go up in Chicagoland before I-394's do!
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ET21

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #454 on: September 28, 2017, 10:35:38 AM »

Seems to me that they'll keep it IL 390 until I-490 is completed around the west side of O'Hare, and I will bet that I-390 signs will go up in Chicagoland before I-394's do!

Funny thing is they waste all this money for the IL-390 signs, only to put up I-390 signs when it gets ratified. 390 signs I've seen on 290, 90, even 355 and most of the local roads will need to be replaced.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #455 on: September 28, 2017, 05:41:52 PM »

I doubt IL-390 will ever be an interstate, just like IL-394 will never be. Interstate 88 was once IL-190 (and later IL-5), Interstate 90 between Interstate 290 and Interstate 94 was IL-194 until 1978 (and Interstate 190 was IL-594), neither of which were likely intended as Interstate 194 or Interstate 594.
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I-39

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #456 on: September 28, 2017, 07:57:48 PM »

I wouldn't rule out talk on extending the EOE westward picking up around 2025 when the current improvement program wraps up, especially if the IL 53 extension dies out.

I bet you it will be needed within the next decade or two. A link from Elgin to O'Hare without the use of I-90, and a nice in-between highway corridor between I-90 and I-88 serving the West/Northwest suburbs

I believe the western extension of IL-390 to North Ave/Lake Street will be an IDOT project, since it will be an arterial rather than a freeway. So ISTHA won't have anything to do with it.

I do wonder how they will get traffic to slow down between the existing western terminus of IL-390 and County Farm Road if the CFR intersection will be a stoplight. There does not seem to be a lot of space between the roads.

IL-390/US-20 was designed to have CFR go over it with a urban style exit layout. That is why IDOT didn't amass any excess dirt at the end like they typically do.  The plan was to trench 2 ponds on each side of CFR to supply fill for the rise over.  If and when they decide to extend it, they will probably use the same idea.  Since the ROW west of CFR is wetlands, there are several more drainage ponds that will be trenched to supply fill as the ROW turns NW back to the original US20.

As you can see IDOT not having any money was a killer when the parcel in black was sold to the local school district.



I don't believe there was ever a plan to buy that property. The EOE was suppose to follow the existing US 20 west of North Ave, and it wasn't going to be full access control, more of a parkway-style with a mixture of at-grades and grade separations.

Yes, in the FAP-6 Environmental Review Report, there are notes about a meeting with the City of Bartlett officials on the extension of Bartlett Road south of the current US20 and work an intersection with Oak Street (now Oak Lane) due to a high accident rate at Oak Street (Lane) and US 20. There were also concerns that the then Eastview Junior High (now Bartlett Middle School) was going to be too close to the ROW even though there were no frontage roads planned. They had already decided a cloverleaf was impractical and a diamond would have to be used. 

This was in 1971/1972. When Eastview was expanded north by the Bartlett School District in the 1980's, they took up the buffer space the ROW expected to acquire and today IDOT would have to condemn all the retail property between the school and US20 to make it work.

Here is a closer view of the Elgin-O'Hare/Bartlett Road Exit was supposed to look like.

The light blue is the ROW
The green line is IDOT owned property
The purple lines are proposed water retention ponds
The redline was the proposed Bartlett Road to Oak Lane extension with the diamond ramps.
It also shows how Oak Lane was going to dead end into a circle drive for the school and north of the EOH it would be a service road for the retail strip center.
The dotted light yellow shows what happened when the school expanded north.

The EOH was supposed to go below grade between US20 on the right all the way past the school to keep road noise down and then rise as it meets Bartlett Road and then move north back to the current US20 alignment.

\

You can even see where IDOT bought land from the developer across Oak Lane from the Junior High. The grading for the streets and cul-de-sac are still visible.

Those plans must have been pre-1980s, as the last plans did not have the EOE as a freeway west of North Ave.
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edwaleni

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #457 on: September 30, 2017, 10:50:01 PM »

I wouldn't rule out talk on extending the EOE westward picking up around 2025 when the current improvement program wraps up, especially if the IL 53 extension dies out.

I bet you it will be needed within the next decade or two. A link from Elgin to O'Hare without the use of I-90, and a nice in-between highway corridor between I-90 and I-88 serving the West/Northwest suburbs

I believe the western extension of IL-390 to North Ave/Lake Street will be an IDOT project, since it will be an arterial rather than a freeway. So ISTHA won't have anything to do with it.

I do wonder how they will get traffic to slow down between the existing western terminus of IL-390 and County Farm Road if the CFR intersection will be a stoplight. There does not seem to be a lot of space between the roads.

IL-390/US-20 was designed to have CFR go over it with a urban style exit layout. That is why IDOT didn't amass any excess dirt at the end like they typically do.  The plan was to trench 2 ponds on each side of CFR to supply fill for the rise over.  If and when they decide to extend it, they will probably use the same idea.  Since the ROW west of CFR is wetlands, there are several more drainage ponds that will be trenched to supply fill as the ROW turns NW back to the original US20.

As you can see IDOT not having any money was a killer when the parcel in black was sold to the local school district.



I don't believe there was ever a plan to buy that property. The EOE was suppose to follow the existing US 20 west of North Ave, and it wasn't going to be full access control, more of a parkway-style with a mixture of at-grades and grade separations.

Yes, in the FAP-6 Environmental Review Report, there are notes about a meeting with the City of Bartlett officials on the extension of Bartlett Road south of the current US20 and work an intersection with Oak Street (now Oak Lane) due to a high accident rate at Oak Street (Lane) and US 20. There were also concerns that the then Eastview Junior High (now Bartlett Middle School) was going to be too close to the ROW even though there were no frontage roads planned. They had already decided a cloverleaf was impractical and a diamond would have to be used. 

This was in 1971/1972. When Eastview was expanded north by the Bartlett School District in the 1980's, they took up the buffer space the ROW expected to acquire and today IDOT would have to condemn all the retail property between the school and US20 to make it work.

Here is a closer view of the Elgin-O'Hare/Bartlett Road Exit was supposed to look like.

The light blue is the ROW
The green line is IDOT owned property
The purple lines are proposed water retention ponds
The redline was the proposed Bartlett Road to Oak Lane extension with the diamond ramps.
It also shows how Oak Lane was going to dead end into a circle drive for the school and north of the EOH it would be a service road for the retail strip center.
The dotted light yellow shows what happened when the school expanded north.

The EOH was supposed to go below grade between US20 on the right all the way past the school to keep road noise down and then rise as it meets Bartlett Road and then move north back to the current US20 alignment.

\

You can even see where IDOT bought land from the developer across Oak Lane from the Junior High. The grading for the streets and cul-de-sac are still visible.

Those plans must have been pre-1980s, as the last plans did not have the EOE as a freeway west of North Ave.

1971-1973
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dave069

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #458 on: October 06, 2017, 12:45:14 AM »

Does the tollway have any plans to increase the speed limit above 55 when the road is done?
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inkyatari

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #459 on: October 06, 2017, 10:08:19 AM »



Here is a closer view of the Elgin-O'Hare/Bartlett Road Exit was supposed to look like.

The light blue is the ROW
The green line is IDOT owned property
The purple lines are proposed water retention ponds
The redline was the proposed Bartlett Road to Oak Lane extension with the diamond ramps.
It also shows how Oak Lane was going to dead end into a circle drive for the school and north of the EOH it would be a service road for the retail strip center.
The dotted light yellow shows what happened when the school expanded north.

The EOH was supposed to go below grade between US20 on the right all the way past the school to keep road noise down and then rise as it meets Bartlett Road and then move north back to the current US20 alignment.

\

You can even see where IDOT bought land from the developer across Oak Lane from the Junior High. The grading for the streets and cul-de-sac are still visible.

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
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Joe The Dragon

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #460 on: October 06, 2017, 12:25:36 PM »



Here is a closer view of the Elgin-O'Hare/Bartlett Road Exit was supposed to look like.

The light blue is the ROW
The green line is IDOT owned property
The purple lines are proposed water retention ponds
The redline was the proposed Bartlett Road to Oak Lane extension with the diamond ramps.
It also shows how Oak Lane was going to dead end into a circle drive for the school and north of the EOH it would be a service road for the retail strip center.
The dotted light yellow shows what happened when the school expanded north.

The EOH was supposed to go below grade between US20 on the right all the way past the school to keep road noise down and then rise as it meets Bartlett Road and then move north back to the current US20 alignment.

\

You can even see where IDOT bought land from the developer across Oak Lane from the Junior High. The grading for the streets and cul-de-sac are still visible.

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.
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Brandon

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #461 on: October 06, 2017, 09:46:10 PM »

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.
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Finrod

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #462 on: October 08, 2017, 03:11:01 PM »

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.

Agreed.  My ex-father-in-law lives in Long Grove and he would actually like to see SR 53 extended, but the vast majority in Long Grove are the NIMBY types that are so proud of their covered bridge (which made me laugh, because Parke County, Indiana has something like 20 of them) and don't give a flying leap that traffic around them is getting worse every year.
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Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #463 on: October 08, 2017, 03:56:42 PM »

Signs on the EOE indicate that cashless tolling will begin Nov 1.  I'm assuming this is when the new section will open up.
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I-39

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #464 on: October 08, 2017, 04:52:00 PM »

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.

Agreed.  My ex-father-in-law lives in Long Grove and he would actually like to see SR 53 extended, but the vast majority in Long Grove are the NIMBY types that are so proud of their covered bridge (which made me laugh, because Parke County, Indiana has something like 20 of them) and don't give a flying leap that traffic around them is getting worse every year.

I don't think IL-53 will ever be extended, it has been dragged out too long and the costs keep rising. I have given up hope on it happening.
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Joe The Dragon

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #465 on: October 08, 2017, 09:59:31 PM »

Signs on the EOE indicate that cashless tolling will begin Nov 1.  I'm assuming this is when the new section will open up.
event on 28 and 29-31 as free days? I think they would want it open Monday morning
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johndoe780

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #466 on: October 09, 2017, 07:49:36 AM »

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.

Agreed.  My ex-father-in-law lives in Long Grove and he would actually like to see SR 53 extended, but the vast majority in Long Grove are the NIMBY types that are so proud of their covered bridge (which made me laugh, because Parke County, Indiana has something like 20 of them) and don't give a flying leap that traffic around them is getting worse every year.

I don't think IL-53 will ever be extended, it has been dragged out too long and the costs keep rising. I have given up hope on it happening.

I think it will get extended sooner rather than later. Once this generation from Long Grove and Hawthorne Woods dies off, the newer generation will want this damn road built.
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Joe The Dragon

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #467 on: October 09, 2017, 12:58:09 PM »

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.

Agreed.  My ex-father-in-law lives in Long Grove and he would actually like to see SR 53 extended, but the vast majority in Long Grove are the NIMBY types that are so proud of their covered bridge (which made me laugh, because Parke County, Indiana has something like 20 of them) and don't give a flying leap that traffic around them is getting worse every year.

I don't think IL-53 will ever be extended, it has been dragged out too long and the costs keep rising. I have given up hope on it happening.

I think it will get extended sooner rather than later. Once this generation from Long Grove and Hawthorne Woods dies off, the newer generation will want this damn road built.
and it be may better then a mass upgrade to us-12
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I-39

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #468 on: October 09, 2017, 08:54:38 PM »

More current plans call for this to be a parkway of some sort.

WTF is with all the parkways these days? They won't help at all. Not at least in this situation, nor in the IL-53 extension plans.
if trump can kill the EPA then this parkway shit can go away. The tollway has the funds to do a real IL-53 tollway.

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.

Agreed.  My ex-father-in-law lives in Long Grove and he would actually like to see SR 53 extended, but the vast majority in Long Grove are the NIMBY types that are so proud of their covered bridge (which made me laugh, because Parke County, Indiana has something like 20 of them) and don't give a flying leap that traffic around them is getting worse every year.

I don't think IL-53 will ever be extended, it has been dragged out too long and the costs keep rising. I have given up hope on it happening.

I think it will get extended sooner rather than later. Once this generation from Long Grove and Hawthorne Woods dies off, the newer generation will want this damn road built.

No, the millennial generation wants more mass transit and sustainable development. They don't want more roads like IL-53. I'm sorry to say, but I really think it's dead in the water.
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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #469 on: October 09, 2017, 09:03:53 PM »

The problem isn't the USEPA, it's Long Fucking Grove and Hawthorn Fucking Woods.

Good grief, are they still sniveling over this?  It's been close to 40 years now, if not more.  I remember both towns fighting this when I moved to Palatine in 1979!  :no:  :crazy: :rolleyes:  :wow: :pan:
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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #470 on: October 09, 2017, 09:18:15 PM »

No, the millennial generation wants more mass transit and sustainable development. They don't want more roads like IL-53. I'm sorry to say, but I really think it's dead in the water.

That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've seen in a while.  Certain people in the media love to push it, but it doesn't pan out in reality.
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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #471 on: October 09, 2017, 10:02:34 PM »

No, the millennial generation wants more mass transit and sustainable development. They don't want more roads like IL-53. I'm sorry to say, but I really think it's dead in the water.

That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've seen in a while.  Certain people in the media love to push it, but it doesn't pan out in reality.

Not saying I agree with it, but there is some truth behind that. Why do you think companies are moving to big cities and there is more and more push for "liveable" communities (i.e, with lots of pedestrian-friendly streets, bike paths, walking distance to stores, etc).

I'm not saying I don't think IL-53 is needed, I definitely think it's needed, but unless there is a drastic change of attitude soon, I don't think it will happen.
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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #472 on: October 09, 2017, 11:31:30 PM »

No, the millennial generation wants more mass transit and sustainable development. They don't want more roads like IL-53. I'm sorry to say, but I really think it's dead in the water.

That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've seen in a while.  Certain people in the media love to push it, but it doesn't pan out in reality.

Not saying I agree with it, but there is some truth behind that. Why do you think companies are moving to big cities and there is more and more push for "liveable" communities (i.e, with lots of pedestrian-friendly streets, bike paths, walking distance to stores, etc).

I'm not saying I don't think IL-53 is needed, I definitely think it's needed, but unless there is a drastic change of attitude soon, I don't think it will happen.

Your logic is flawed. No millineal in their damn mind would want to live in Long Grove let alone afford it.
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quickshade

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #473 on: October 10, 2017, 12:37:24 AM »

They can fight over it all they want, and i'm all for more mass transit options, but until we get mass transit systems that not only work, but don't cost an arm and a leg and can't ever seem to run on time it won't happen. People hate being stuck and not in control of the situation when it happens and thats why mass transit hasn't taken off in this country like in others. We like the freedom of being in control of our own car. Japan has an excellent transit system that would be great for here but until we clear out Madigan, the cook county board and a few other problems we have it'll never happen. 53 does need to happen, and it is only a matter of time before it does.
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cabiness42

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Re: Elgin-O'Hare Tollway
« Reply #474 on: October 10, 2017, 09:16:43 AM »

No, the millennial generation wants more mass transit and sustainable development. They don't want more roads like IL-53. I'm sorry to say, but I really think it's dead in the water.

That's the biggest bunch of horse shit I've seen in a while.  Certain people in the media love to push it, but it doesn't pan out in reality.

I'm currently looking out my office window at the headquarters of the world's second largest private employer, which is in the process of a move from Oak Brook to the West Loop primarily because they are having trouble getting millenials to work in Oak Brook.  Places that aren't close to good mass transit options (the lot of Pace buses criss-crossing Oak Brook doesn't really count), are going to have trouble attracting top companies.

Now, I'm fairly certain that other companies will come in and fill the voids in places like Oak Brook, and there will still be enough traffic to justify the EOT, the Tri-State expansion, and the Route 53 extension, but it's not because millenials don't prefer mass transit because they do.
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