https://www.google.com/maps/@44.9198532,-92.8829296,3a,75y,291.19h,64.99t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s7P-PenY89nHr0g540cnwhA!2e0
I guess Cottage Grove Drive used to come through to here, but what was the point of keeping this stop sign? The trail on the right is on private property, so it gets very little use, and I doubt very many people walk from the left either...
"Well, the City Council did vote to put a road in there. But so far, we've only raised enough money to put in the Stop sign."
Sheriff Andy Taylor - Town of Mayberry, NC.
At least they decided to still warn you about it (http://goo.gl/maps/6Zu1r). Leave it for cheap speed control?
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blogcdn.com%2Fwww.urlesque.com%2Fmedia%2F2010%2F01%2Fstopdefacing.jpg&hash=0c317a5194a32705f2350a4b086f5c5d88bd6ac3)
If you think that's bad; feel free to stop by in southeastern PA. There's plenty of illogically-placed STOP signs there.
Green Lane in Upper Darby Twp., Delaware County, PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915612,-75.299113&sspn=0.005884,0.009377&vpsrc=0&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.91553,-75.29922&spn=0.000066,0.037508&z=15&layer=c&cbll=39.915592,-75.299111&panoid=tOtChLyXNJN9kNahUjt3_Q&cbp=12,232.83,,0,13.7)
Wynnbrooke Road, same town; for a pedestrian path that does not continue across the street (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915661,-75.299091&sspn=0.023535,0.037508&vpsrc=6&t=h&g=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.914155,-75.305368&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.914258,-75.305291&panoid=FNQgLh1J_N6F0DNykb2O3A&cbp=12,233.33,,0,13.7)
Is it me or does those crosswalk stripes lead to a curbed-drainage inlet and grass strip between the street & sidewalk?
Those are two examples right off the top of my head. There are others.
Here's one for a planned development that never happened (to it's full potential, at least) in Port St. Joe, FL:
https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=29.869366,-85.342682&spn=0.000002,0.002064&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=29.869337,-85.342781&panoid=WzHw0UDCHwFZgMlvUg_l0A&cbp=12,74.15,,0,-2.11
Still like that today.
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 18, 2014, 05:57:47 PM
Wynnbrooke Road, same town; for a pedestrian path that does not continue across the street (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915661,-75.299091&sspn=0.023535,0.037508&vpsrc=6&t=h&g=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.914155,-75.305368&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.914258,-75.305291&panoid=FNQgLh1J_N6F0DNykb2O3A&cbp=12,233.33,,0,13.7)
Is it me or does those crosswalk stripes lead to a curbed-drainage inlet and grass strip between the street & sidewalk?
That's ADA accessible, right?
Even worse, here's where the path comes out on the other end, with the crosswalk connecting two curb inlets:
https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.913523,-75.304737&spn=0.001053,0.669479&cbll=39.913523,-75.304737&layer=c&panoid=a9wbQURQ_A5QgVNqj8LPpA&cbp=12,207.46,,0,7.82&t=m&z=11 (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.913523,-75.304737&spn=0.001053,0.669479&cbll=39.913523,-75.304737&layer=c&panoid=a9wbQURQ_A5QgVNqj8LPpA&cbp=12,207.46,,0,7.82&t=m&z=11)
In the neighborhood where I grew up, there's a T junction where the lone stop sign is not on the ending street as expected but on one direction of the main street. I can only conclude that it's there for speed control.
Quote from: vdeane on September 18, 2014, 07:13:44 PM
In the neighborhood where I grew up, there's a T junction where the lone stop sign is not on the ending street as expected but on one direction of the main street. I can only conclude that it's there for speed control.
Sounds like the stop sign's purpose is to give the stopping vehicle a front row seat to watch a car coming out of the ending street get t-boned making a left.
The road takes a sharp turn and had a stop sign at both approaches of the turn: https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4961139,-88.0799189,3a,75y,201.51h,82.64t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s40pb2648GIsGCxlWHC7ZyQ!2e0
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on September 18, 2014, 07:46:27 PM
Quote from: vdeane on September 18, 2014, 07:13:44 PM
In the neighborhood where I grew up, there's a T junction where the lone stop sign is not on the ending street as expected but on one direction of the main street. I can only conclude that it's there for speed control.
Sounds like the stop sign's purpose is to give the stopping vehicle a front row seat to watch a car coming out of the ending street get t-boned making a left.
I wouldn't assume it's necessarily for speed control (or for nefarious purposes). If the majority of traffic makes a 90-degree turn at this intersection, it's reasonable to assign precedence to that 90-degree turn in both directions and have the through street stop or yield when approaching the intersection from the less-traveled side.
Consider this example, but note that the less-traveled approach from the through street is controlled by a yield sign instead of a stop sign:
Approach from ending street:
https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=38.963794,-95.22389&spn=0.000846,0.001321&t=k&z=20&layer=c&cbll=38.963796,-95.224007&panoid=m2i6ock3XdHGI4SdnwQfJA&cbp=12,94.01,,0,5.48
Yielding approach from through street:
https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=38.963986,-95.223513&spn=0.000846,0.001321&t=k&z=20&layer=c&cbll=38.963986,-95.223513&panoid=elyPWnGZbv3RJYBJhdhI2g&cbp=12,182.49,,0,-4.48
Prioritized approach from through street:
https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=38.963456,-95.223514&spn=0.000846,0.001321&t=k&z=20&layer=c&cbll=38.963546,-95.223515&panoid=DzYD9OC8mmg7nbmwQFxciQ&cbp=12,359.06,,0,14.53
I believe the order of precedence is as follows:
NB Haskell Ave. to WB 11th Street = EB 11th Street to SB Haskell Ave. = NB Haskell Ave. to NB Haskell Ave. > EB 11th Street to NB Haskell Ave. > SB Haskell Ave. to SB Haskell Ave. = SB Haskell Ave. to WB 11th Street
I believe this holds regardless of whether there is a "Left Turn Yield" sign on the approach from the ending street, and regardless of whether the sign controlling the less-traveled approach from the through street is a stop sign or a yield sign.
I can think of two examples on roads that I use on occasion. Unfortunately, there's no GSV for either one of them :-(
The one is on Flora Ave. in Hopatcong, NJ. The other is on Forge Rd, transitioning on to Lincoln Ave in East Stroudsburg, PA. I'll try to remember to get photographs of them the next time I drive on those roads.
Stop signs are not supposed to be used for speed control.
Having said that, PA loves their stop signs, especially thru residential neighborhoods. Many of them are questionable as to their legality; some are absolutely illegal, as they are clearly being used for speed control. And in a few of the examples above, if they try to claim it's for pedestrian safety, then they are afoul of ADA accessibility too.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 19, 2014, 04:50:44 AM
Stop signs are not supposed to be used for speed control.
Having said that, PA loves their stop signs, especially thru residential neighborhoods. Many of them are questionable as to their legality; some are absolutely illegal, as they are clearly being used for speed control. And in a few of the examples above, if they try to claim it's for pedestrian safety, then they are afoul of ADA accessibility too.
Here's the thing (and I agree w/your above-statement BTW); the way local law enforcement agencies gets around that is that many of the tickets issued are for
"failing to heed a traffic-control device" rather than
"failing to stop at a STOP sign"; the latter carries a more severe penalty.
It's almost as if they're indirectly admitting that the erections of those particular STOP signs do not meet the criteria & protocol for such.
As far as the noncompliant ADA issues are concerned; many of these were erected/striped either prior to the implementation of the original ADA of 1991 or prior to its subsequent ammendments/upgrades. If the sidewalk & roadway are redone/reconfigured;
then such need to be built to the latest ADA standards. The only way those would get changed, outside of what's outlined above, would be if a disabled person filed a lawsuit against the township where the issue exists. The roads in question are all local roads not county or state roads.
Here's another illogical set of
STOP signs placed at a T-intersection where the minor road is a one-way street heading
away from the main road traffic.
Academy Ave. & Hutchinson Ter. in Ridley Twp., PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Holmes,+PA&aq=0&oq=holmes,+&sll=40.002498,-75.118033&sspn=0.376076,0.600128&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Holmes,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.901335,-75.309456&spn=0.000012,0.004689&z=18&layer=c&cbll=39.901335,-75.309456&panoid=g9GeQu6PW489UOZyVAN6ew&cbp=12,83.79,,0,17.09) Stupid! Stupid! Stupid! :banghead:
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 18, 2014, 05:57:47 PM
If you think that's bad; feel free to stop by in southeastern PA. There's plenty of illogically-placed STOP signs there.
Green Lane in Upper Darby Twp., Delaware County, PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915612,-75.299113&sspn=0.005884,0.009377&vpsrc=0&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.91553,-75.29922&spn=0.000066,0.037508&z=15&layer=c&cbll=39.915592,-75.299111&panoid=tOtChLyXNJN9kNahUjt3_Q&cbp=12,232.83,,0,13.7)
Wynnbrooke Road, same town; for a pedestrian path that does not continue across the street (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915661,-75.299091&sspn=0.023535,0.037508&vpsrc=6&t=h&g=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.914155,-75.305368&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.914258,-75.305291&panoid=FNQgLh1J_N6F0DNykb2O3A&cbp=12,233.33,,0,13.7)
Is it me or does those crosswalk stripes lead to a curbed-drainage inlet and grass strip between the street & sidewalk?
Those are two examples right off the top of my head. There are others.
PA also has an unhealthy obsession with placing "EXCEPT RIGHT TURN" plates with certain stop signs.
Quote from: stridentweasel on September 19, 2014, 01:40:04 AM
I wouldn't assume it's necessarily for speed control (or for nefarious purposes). If the majority of traffic makes a 90-degree turn at this intersection, it's reasonable to assign precedence to that 90-degree turn in both directions and have the through street stop or yield when approaching the intersection from the less-traveled side.
Consider this example, but note that the less-traveled approach from the through street is controlled by a yield sign instead of a stop sign:
I believe this holds regardless of whether there is a "Left Turn Yield" sign on the approach from the ending street, and regardless of whether the sign controlling the less-traveled approach from the through street is a stop sign or a yield sign.
I've seen a few situations like this with a stop sign (on the ending street) with an "Except Right Turn" sign under it, like the following example (but a T intersection instead):
https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.527778,-75.716776&spn=0.000016,0.010461&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=40.527566,-75.718419&panoid=Z-aIqzg6vPmPPNtphlT4OQ&cbp=12,328.89,,0,1.26 (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.527778,-75.716776&spn=0.000016,0.010461&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=40.527566,-75.718419&panoid=Z-aIqzg6vPmPPNtphlT4OQ&cbp=12,328.89,,0,1.26)
I don't like this type of signage - having a second sign negate the stop sign in certain situations. Stop should mean Stop. A driver on one of the other approach roads will see the back of the stop sign and assume that the other driver has to stop, not knowing about the second sign.
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 19, 2014, 09:03:41 AM
Here's another illogical set of STOP signs placed at a T-intersection where the minor road is a one-way street heading away from the main road traffic.
Academy Ave. & Hutchinson Ter. in Ridley Twp., PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Holmes,+PA&aq=0&oq=holmes,+&sll=40.002498,-75.118033&sspn=0.376076,0.600128&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Holmes,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.901335,-75.309456&spn=0.000012,0.004689&z=18&layer=c&cbll=39.901335,-75.309456&panoid=g9GeQu6PW489UOZyVAN6ew&cbp=12,83.79,,0,17.09) Stupid! Stupid! Stupid! :banghead:
In this case, there shouldn't even be a set of stop signs.
In the case of the one I posted, the stop sign is on the most traveled approach, the one that goes to/from the main road. Local traffic should be evenly split given that the street ends at another that dead ends a couple houses later, but non-locals using the neighborhood as a cut-through around the Winton/Westfall light incorrectly assume that Cohasset is the correct street to use (it's not, due to the sharp turn that takes many by surprise). I've never heard of a severe accident though. It's pretty much impossible to go significantly faster than the posted speed limit of 25 due to curves and intersections.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.1189742,-77.5667863,3a,75y,126.63h,75.22t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1swEJzSsdYxAfcW_9ypleNPA!2e0
Quote from: roadman on September 19, 2014, 09:36:42 AMPA also has an unhealthy obsession with placing "EXCEPT RIGHT TURN" plates with certain stop signs.
At least those are usually located on roads that
actually warrant a
STOP sign in certain instances.
Note: PennDOT roads (identified with small SR XXXX signs) follow MUTCD standards for
STOP signs by the book; it's the local roads in SEPA that go rouge w/
STOP signs.
One road near me, Franklin Ave. in Ridley Township, was once a PennDOT road (either SR 2016 or 2012 prior to 1996 or 1997) but when people wanted
STOP signs erected for traffic calming/speed control; PennDOT said
"No way." As a result, the township took the road back from PennDOT and the
STOP signs went up; 3 originally then a fourth one was added later.
Quote from: Zeffy on September 19, 2014, 10:17:56 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 19, 2014, 09:03:41 AM
Here's another illogical set of STOP signs placed at a T-intersection where the minor road is a one-way street heading away from the main road traffic.
Academy Ave. & Hutchinson Ter. in Ridley Twp., PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Holmes,+PA&aq=0&oq=holmes,+&sll=40.002498,-75.118033&sspn=0.376076,0.600128&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Holmes,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.901335,-75.309456&spn=0.000012,0.004689&z=18&layer=c&cbll=39.901335,-75.309456&panoid=g9GeQu6PW489UOZyVAN6ew&cbp=12,83.79,,0,17.09) Stupid! Stupid! Stupid! :banghead:
In this case, there shouldn't even be a set of stop signs.
You're preaching to the choir here; most if not all of us here would agree with you on that. See above regarding towns in SEPA erecting
STOP signs at will.
Quote from: vdeane on September 19, 2014, 03:22:26 PM
In the case of the one I posted, the stop sign is on the most traveled approach, the one that goes to/from the main road.
Not that much different than one of the fore-mentioned
STOP signs along Franklin Ave.
Franklin Ave. & Greenhouse Lane (a dead-end residential street) (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+PA&aq=0&oq=fraSecane,+PA&sll=39.914001,-75.302131&sspn=0.011768,0.018754&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.912658,-75.311633&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.912703,-75.311507&panoid=95m7lsPha0WQswPyLuJFJQ&cbp=12,94.17,,0,9.68)
While the unwarranted stop signs you guys have mentioned would bother me, even worse is the lack of "ALL-WAY" signage in most of those examples (or, in the case of the "Except Right Turns" set up, indication that other traffic has to give way to people turning right).
How do I know who has to or doesn't yield?
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 19, 2014, 03:52:42 PM
Quote from: vdeane on September 19, 2014, 03:22:26 PM
In the case of the one I posted, the stop sign is on the most traveled approach, the one that goes to/from the main road.
Not that much different than one of the fore-mentioned STOP signs along Franklin Ave.
Franklin Ave. & Greenhouse Lane (a dead-end residential street) (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+PA&aq=0&oq=fraSecane,+PA&sll=39.914001,-75.302131&sspn=0.011768,0.018754&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.912658,-75.311633&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.912703,-75.311507&panoid=95m7lsPha0WQswPyLuJFJQ&cbp=12,94.17,,0,9.68)
But that one is an all-way stop. Mine is an uncontrolled intersection with a random stop sign on one approach.
Let's analyze my intersection: Hollyvale is the street that continues straight. Cohasset ends at Hollyvale at a T junction. Both Cohasset and Hollyvale end at Lynwood further down. Hollyvale starts at Winton Rd (a major arterial) and ends at Lynwood with a bend between Winton and Cohasset. Lynwood starts at Westfall Rd (a minor arterial) and ends at a dead end just past Hollyvale. Cohasset runs between Hollyvale and Lynwood and is unremarkable except for a very sharp curve in the middle. The intersection of Hollyvale and Cohasset is mostly uncontrolled with the only stop sign being on Hollyvale eastbound at Cohasset. Traffic on that approach is roughly evenly split between turning right onto Cohasset or continuing on Hollyvale towards Lynwood. In the approaches from the other two intersections, more traffic comes from Cohasset than Hollyvale (due to non-locals not knowing about the curve, which is not visible from Lynwood, and simply turning left onto the first street they see from Lynwood when they try to evade the traffic light at the Winton/Westfall intersection), and all of it turns left onto Hollyvale. Westbound traffic on Hollyvale at this location goes straight with left turns onto Cohasset being very rare.
Basically, I have no idea what that stop sign could possibly be there for if not speed control. The logical thing to do would be to have either an all-way stop or put the sign on one of the other approaches.
Paxon Hollow Road (http://goo.gl/maps/TqFyh) in Media, PA.
On the walking/bike trail in Highland Village, Texas, there is a 90-degree turn that has stop signs for no reason. It should have sharp turn ahead and arrow signs instead.
https://maps.google.com/?ll=33.086317,-97.048367&spn=0.000002,0.001549&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=33.086317,-97.048367&panoid=-cNg19d8uhXVmLy5h21gRQ&cbp=12,71.8,,2,0
Quote from: vdeane on September 20, 2014, 12:12:27 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 19, 2014, 03:52:42 PM
Quote from: vdeane on September 19, 2014, 03:22:26 PM
In the case of the one I posted, the stop sign is on the most traveled approach, the one that goes to/from the main road.
Not that much different than one of the fore-mentioned STOP signs along Franklin Ave.
Franklin Ave. & Greenhouse Lane (a dead-end residential street) (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+PA&aq=0&oq=fraSecane,+PA&sll=39.914001,-75.302131&sspn=0.011768,0.018754&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.912658,-75.311633&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.912703,-75.311507&panoid=95m7lsPha0WQswPyLuJFJQ&cbp=12,94.17,,0,9.68)
But that one is an all-way stop. Mine is an uncontrolled intersection with a random stop sign on one approach.
Val, for the record, there are
several examples along local (non-PennDOT) roads in SEPA that would place
STOP signs along the main roads but not for the minor roads that intersects w/such. Check out Providence Road in Springfield Twp., Delaware County just west of the Secane train station for one or two examples.
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 22, 2014, 09:36:09 AM
Quote from: vdeane on September 20, 2014, 12:12:27 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 19, 2014, 03:52:42 PM
Quote from: vdeane on September 19, 2014, 03:22:26 PM
In the case of the one I posted, the stop sign is on the most traveled approach, the one that goes to/from the main road.
Not that much different than one of the fore-mentioned STOP signs along Franklin Ave.
Franklin Ave. & Greenhouse Lane (a dead-end residential street) (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+PA&aq=0&oq=fraSecane,+PA&sll=39.914001,-75.302131&sspn=0.011768,0.018754&vpsrc=6&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Franklin+Ave,+Morton,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.912658,-75.311633&spn=0.000016,0.009377&z=17&layer=c&cbll=39.912703,-75.311507&panoid=95m7lsPha0WQswPyLuJFJQ&cbp=12,94.17,,0,9.68)
But that one is an all-way stop. Mine is an uncontrolled intersection with a random stop sign on one approach.
Val, for the record, there are several examples along local (non-PennDOT) roads in SEPA that would place STOP signs along the main roads but not for the minor roads that intersects w/such. Check out Providence Road in Springfield Twp., Delaware County just west of the Secane train station for one or two examples.
I will attest to that. Pennsylvania drives me crazy with their seemingly random stop signs on main roads, both two way (with no stop on the minor roads) and all-way.
Found this one on Reddit last night-
(https://i.imgur.com/FOb4bnH.jpg)
Quote from: TEG24601 on September 22, 2014, 12:11:22 PM
Found this one on Reddit last night-
This seems like a reasonable location.
Someone needs to put up a "beware of falling rocks" sign right after that stop sign.
I detect a "Stop Ahead" sign in the distance in that picture. I suspect the sign crew got it and the stop sign's locations reversed.
This one doesn't make sense since it favors a local street over a highway: https://www.google.es/maps/@41.8332735,-1.5287375,3a,90y,235.02h,81.48t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1skLV4Au59mmzcabLU1DJuBA!2e0. Yes, that is the town of the 'restored' Ecce Homo :sombrero:.
I'd argue that at least some (if not most) of the recent proliferation of stop signs in the US isn't because of "speed control", but moreso a combination of driver stupidity and the legal mess that uncontrolled intersections have become. So, in effect, it's to clarify who has right-of-way instead of speed control. We can, in part, thank our lawsuit-happy society for that.
Quote from: froggie on September 24, 2014, 10:38:44 AM
I'd argue that at least some (if not most) of the recent proliferation of stop signs in the US isn't because of "speed control", but moreso a combination of driver stupidity and the legal mess that uncontrolled intersections have become.
Trust me, the
majority of
STOP erected along local (non-PennDOT) roads in SEPA were clearly erected as a means of speed control. See the fore-mentioned Franklin Ave. example in Ridley Twp., Delaware County. That road went from a PennDOT road (w/out
STOP signs) to a local road (w/
STOP signs) for
that reason and
that reason only.
Quote from: froggie on September 24, 2014, 10:38:44 AM
I'd argue that at least some (if not most) of the recent proliferation of stop signs in the US isn't because of "speed control", but moreso a combination of driver stupidity and the legal mess that uncontrolled intersections have become. So, in effect, it's to clarify who has right-of-way instead of speed control. We can, in part, thank our lawsuit-happy society for that.
Technically, a town can't say they want to install a sign to control speed. They need some other reason to install it. But it's pretty much guaranteed they're installed to control speed.
On the walking/bike trail in Highland Village, Texas, there is a 90-degree turn that has stop signs for no reason. It should have sharp turn ahead and arrow signs instead.
Here it is:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1209.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fcc395%2FBrian5561%2F92414001_zps2490df71.jpg&hash=86a0aa10b193d2915fd47563ff85ec2dfaa0145d) (http://s1209.photobucket.com/user/Brian5561/media/92414001_zps2490df71.jpg.html)
Is it even wide enough to get two cars though there? A stop sign might actually be warranted for that reason.
It made sense years ago before new 30 cut off Kansas Road off to the right of the photo:
http://goo.gl/maps/ssdXt
(on-coming traffic is basically a driveway; give THEM the stop sign)
Um...what (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0803257,-74.8689811,3a,72.3y,66.11h,72.59t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1seDN78mKWo-_DgdeTcTzocw!2e0)? What is the purpose of these exactly (if there is one)?
EDIT: Wait a minute, is this a lift bridge? I just noticed that there's a fence there that looks like it swings forward to block traffic and it looks like a part of the bridge is movable...
Quote from: vdeane on September 24, 2014, 01:09:44 PM
Is it even wide enough to get two cars though there? A stop sign might actually be warranted for that reason.
It's a walk/bike trail. No vehicular traffic.
Quote from: Zeffy on September 24, 2014, 02:07:01 PM
Um...what (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0803257,-74.8689811,3a,72.3y,66.11h,72.59t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1seDN78mKWo-_DgdeTcTzocw!2e0)? What is the purpose of these exactly (if there is one)?
EDIT: Wait a minute, is this a lift bridge? I just noticed that there's a fence there that looks like it swings forward to block traffic and it looks like a part of the bridge is movable...
Yeah that seems pretty obvious.
Quote from: Zeffy on September 24, 2014, 02:07:01 PM
Um...what (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0803257,-74.8689811,3a,72.3y,66.11h,72.59t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1seDN78mKWo-_DgdeTcTzocw!2e0)? What is the purpose of these exactly (if there is one)?
EDIT: Wait a minute, is this a lift bridge? I just noticed that there's a fence there that looks like it swings forward to block traffic and it looks like a part of the bridge is movable...
Yes - the Burlington Bristol is a lift bridge.
Quote from: spooky on September 24, 2014, 02:28:21 PM
Yeah that seems pretty obvious.
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on September 24, 2014, 02:30:38 PM
Yes - the Burlington Bristol is a lift bridge.
My stupidity strikes again. Sorry! :banghead:
Quote from: Zeffy on September 24, 2014, 02:33:23 PM
Quote from: spooky on September 24, 2014, 02:28:21 PM
Yeah that seems pretty obvious.
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on September 24, 2014, 02:30:38 PM
Yes - the Burlington Bristol is a lift bridge.
My stupidity strikes again. Sorry! :banghead:
If it makes you feel any better I don't think they have to lift it that often.
Schmidt Road and Frontage Road, Bolingbrook (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.674462,-88.08678&spn=0.003377,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.674385,-88.08678&panoid=52JbwihMh4z9pqPjXRRsVg&cbp=12,21.99,,0,6.85), and the other way (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.67439,-88.08678&spn=0.0034,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.67487,-88.086468&panoid=8NdHDSwyfoJrXfnIVYYlyQ&cbp=12,232.51,,0,1.28). It's a curve, and it's been that way for a couple of decades now.
I hate mid-block pedestrian crosswalk stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.526805,-88.137653&spn=0.003408,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.526805,-88.137653&panoid=miR48nutI0qgMn8UyIoVLg&cbp=12,17.99,,0,0.55). A simple yield or stop for pedestrians in crosswalk sign would make more sense.
Roundabouts and stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.532419,-88.098378&spn=0.004819,0.010568&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=41.532396,-88.099038&panoid=arDxtdRrF2-7JcAUSzRM1Q&cbp=12,92.03,,0,2.38) like drinking and driving, don't mix.
Quote from: Brandon on September 26, 2014, 01:50:47 PM
Schmidt Road and Frontage Road, Bolingbrook (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.674462,-88.08678&spn=0.003377,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.674385,-88.08678&panoid=52JbwihMh4z9pqPjXRRsVg&cbp=12,21.99,,0,6.85), and the other way (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.67439,-88.08678&spn=0.0034,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.67487,-88.086468&panoid=8NdHDSwyfoJrXfnIVYYlyQ&cbp=12,232.51,,0,1.28). It's a curve, and it's been that way for a couple of decades now.
I hate mid-block pedestrian crosswalk stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.526805,-88.137653&spn=0.003408,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.526805,-88.137653&panoid=miR48nutI0qgMn8UyIoVLg&cbp=12,17.99,,0,0.55). A simple yield or stop for pedestrians in crosswalk sign would make more sense.
Roundabouts and stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.532419,-88.098378&spn=0.004819,0.010568&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=41.532396,-88.099038&panoid=arDxtdRrF2-7JcAUSzRM1Q&cbp=12,92.03,,0,2.38) like drinking and driving, don't mix.
I hate the mid-block ped crossing stop signs too. But at some level, I know that without the sign, most drivers would not stop, even if a pedestrian were present and ready to cross the street. The mid-block stop sign assigns right of way to the cross-traffic, it just happens that the cross-traffic is entirely pedestrian.
Quote from: mrsman on September 28, 2014, 06:14:19 AM
Quote from: Brandon on September 26, 2014, 01:50:47 PM
I hate mid-block pedestrian crosswalk stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.526805,-88.137653&spn=0.003408,0.005284&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=41.526805,-88.137653&panoid=miR48nutI0qgMn8UyIoVLg&cbp=12,17.99,,0,0.55). A simple yield or stop for pedestrians in crosswalk sign would make more sense.
I hate the mid-block ped crossing stop signs too. But at some level, I know that without the sign, most drivers would not stop, even if a pedestrian were present and ready to cross the street. The mid-block stop sign assigns right of way to the cross-traffic, it just happens that the cross-traffic is entirely pedestrian.
NYC does the stop signs for mid-block crosswalk as seen in this report featuring
Stern Show's Scott the Engineer (kch): http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/07/19/stop-signs-along-midtowns-6-12-avenue-catching-drivers-by-surprise/
Quote from: Brandon on September 26, 2014, 01:50:47 PM
Roundabouts and stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.532419,-88.098378&spn=0.004819,0.010568&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=41.532396,-88.099038&panoid=arDxtdRrF2-7JcAUSzRM1Q&cbp=12,92.03,,0,2.38) like drinking and driving, don't mix.
Oh gosh, and they had to put an "ALL-WAY" sign below it, which is NOT how a roundabout works...
Here's another stop sign at roundabout, in Flower Mound, Texas
https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985352,-97.064861&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985352,-97.064861&panoid=UIDYKPx4fhcq_UYdIoeEZA&cbp=12,323.83,,0,0 (https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985352,-97.064861&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985352,-97.064861&panoid=UIDYKPx4fhcq_UYdIoeEZA&cbp=12,323.83,,0,0)
The other approach has yield signs:
https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985843,-97.064502&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985843,-97.064502&panoid=WxVeE4kf2htFhGtsp65zaw&cbp=12,269.19,,0,0 (https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985843,-97.064502&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985843,-97.064502&panoid=WxVeE4kf2htFhGtsp65zaw&cbp=12,269.19,,0,0)
Quote from: Brian556 on September 28, 2014, 08:28:20 PM
Here's another stop sign at roundabout, in Flower Mound, Texas
https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985352,-97.064861&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985352,-97.064861&panoid=UIDYKPx4fhcq_UYdIoeEZA&cbp=12,323.83,,0,0 (https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985352,-97.064861&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985352,-97.064861&panoid=UIDYKPx4fhcq_UYdIoeEZA&cbp=12,323.83,,0,0)
The other approach has yield signs:
https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985843,-97.064502&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985843,-97.064502&panoid=WxVeE4kf2htFhGtsp65zaw&cbp=12,269.19,,0,0 (https://maps.google.com/?ll=32.985843,-97.064502&spn=0.000009,0.006196&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=32.985843,-97.064502&panoid=WxVeE4kf2htFhGtsp65zaw&cbp=12,269.19,,0,0)
That makes a bit more sense -- there's no deflection to slow people down on the approach, so you'd need a stop sign to make sure people slow down and yield. But still, that kinda eliminates the point of a roundabout.
I know I've run across STOPs at roundabouts in Portland, OR before. I don't think this is the same one I ran across, but here's one I was able to find on street view:
https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5080671,-122.6488643,3a,75y,319.09h,73.63t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1siL4tjVgXph3SrwAYAWEYBQ!2e0
That one's a bit of an unconventional roundabout, but Bend has something almost the same, except with the proper yield signs:
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.0588815,-121.3524115,3a,75y,112.4h,82.57t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1spvTYHqE0a_NTk8KvhNeaZQ!2e0.
Even the minor streets in this one have yields: https://www.google.com/maps/@44.057913,-121.3510988,3a,75y,7.59h,75.47t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sHFyqHztduAmrgb-iojaZHA!2e0
Another one in Portland:
https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5264078,-122.6236875,3a,75y,88.62h,80.4t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sX88lMW9nqnxvx0aVlUkFhQ!2e0
I also recall these weird mini-roundabouts in Portland. They make a bit more sense to have stops, but due to low traffic and speed limits, I think a Yield would work here too:
https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5136328,-122.6513591,3a,75y,265.98h,72.67t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sYrZJmZ9LVpY8vlDhsQZYVQ!2e0
Bend also has those, except this one is a two way stop (EDIT: Okay, my Portland example was also a two way), with one street having the right of way in this case, which seems even weirder:
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.0578245,-121.2915499,3a,75y,3.45h,75.66t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sS9u9V-G1qzeujKmycbQlkw!2e0
It makes me wonder if the City of Portland has any properly signed roundabouts. I can't think of any off the top of my head.
EDIT: I think this counts: https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5779273,-122.5599738,3a,75y,126.77h,73.72t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1shp652eJLXzKstrU6PGGSwg!2e0
I'm pretty sure that's a city street, and not private (though it's close enough to the airport to make me question it)
Quote from: doorknob60 on October 02, 2014, 06:51:51 PM
I know I've run across STOPs at roundabouts in Portland, OR before. I don't think this is the same one I ran across, but here's one I was able to find on street view:
https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5080671,-122.6488643,3a,75y,319.09h,73.63t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1siL4tjVgXph3SrwAYAWEYBQ!2e0
That one's a bit of an unconventional roundabout, but Bend has something almost the same, except with the proper yield signs:
https://www.google.com/maps/@44.0588815,-121.3524115,3a,75y,112.4h,82.57t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1spvTYHqE0a_NTk8KvhNeaZQ!2e0.
Even the minor streets in this one have yields: https://www.google.com/maps/@44.057913,-121.3510988,3a,75y,7.59h,75.47t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sHFyqHztduAmrgb-iojaZHA!2e0
Neither of those examples are roundabouts, but rather they are traffic circles. The big parks in the middle of the circle is the biggest giveaway, and the fact that not all entry points are deflected.
Quote
It makes me wonder if the City of Portland has any properly signed roundabouts. I can't think of any off the top of my head.
EDIT: I think this counts: https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5779273,-122.5599738,3a,75y,126.77h,73.72t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1shp652eJLXzKstrU6PGGSwg!2e0
I'm pretty sure that's a city street, and not private (though it's close enough to the airport to make me question it)
That's the only "traditional" roundabout of your examples. It's mostly correctly signed from the traffic control standpoint (not counting the blue guide signs), except that they use a single yellow chevron under one way arrows, where now the MUTCD has a black on white roundabout chevron sign design for this purpose.
Quote from: busman_49 on September 24, 2014, 01:16:45 PM
It made sense years ago before new 30 cut off Kansas Road off to the right of the photo:
http://goo.gl/maps/ssdXt
(on-coming traffic is basically a driveway; give THEM the stop sign)
On my recent trip back up that way, I found that the stop sign has been replaed with a yield sign.
2 lanes of traffic have to stop for a shopping center driveway (cross traffic does not stop): https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0 (https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0)
Quote from: Big John on September 18, 2014, 11:59:36 PM
The road takes a sharp turn and had a stop sign at both approaches of the turn: https://www.google.com/maps/@44.4961139,-88.0799189,3a,75y,201.51h,82.64t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s40pb2648GIsGCxlWHC7ZyQ!2e0
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.980029,-78.7418192,3a,75y,100.09h,77.55t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sf1DM2RSL2Q4IgT2ElmKuLA!2e0
Amherst, NY
Quote from: Thing 342 on December 02, 2014, 06:27:42 PM
2 lanes of traffic have to stop for a shopping center driveway (cross traffic does not stop): https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0 (https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0)
Typical mall/plaza. They always favor entering shoppers vs. leaving ones.
Quote from: Thing 342 on December 02, 2014, 06:27:42 PM
2 lanes of traffic have to stop for a shopping center driveway (cross traffic does not stop): https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0 (https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0)
From the aerial view you can see why: There's very little storage room for that traffic that needs to turn left into the shopping plaza. Better to make people wait on that thru street leaving the plaza area rather than potentially bottlenecking traffic back into the main intersection.
Quote from: wisvishr0 on September 28, 2014, 09:06:23 AM
Quote from: Brandon on September 26, 2014, 01:50:47 PM
Roundabouts and stop signs (https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=41.532419,-88.098378&spn=0.004819,0.010568&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=41.532396,-88.099038&panoid=arDxtdRrF2-7JcAUSzRM1Q&cbp=12,92.03,,0,2.38) like drinking and driving, don't mix.
Oh gosh, and they had to put an "ALL-WAY" sign below it, which is NOT how a roundabout works...
Yeah, they've got one just like that in downtown Lansing, Michigan, a couple blocks east to the state Capital building. I think the STOP signs are there to protect pedestrians.
Denmark, S.C., at the intersections of LEE ST and TRADE ST. I first saw this sign in September 2010, when I had late classes at Denmark Technical College, which is roughly 200 yards from where this is located. Still there the last time I went through about nine months ago. SCDOT is usually really good at ridding these nonsensical STOP signs, but they dropped the ball here.
https://goo.gl/maps/wz1Vj
Quote from: jeffandnicole on December 03, 2014, 01:11:53 PM
Quote from: Thing 342 on December 02, 2014, 06:27:42 PM
2 lanes of traffic have to stop for a shopping center driveway (cross traffic does not stop): https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0 (https://www.google.com/maps/@37.1102031,-76.4960908,3a,75y,285.44h,78.13t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1se3syIEEfXXtOwkui1wHfOw!2e0)
From the aerial view you can see why: There's very little storage room for that traffic that needs to turn left into the shopping plaza. Better to make people wait on that thru street leaving the plaza area rather than potentially bottlenecking traffic back into the main intersection.
Agreed. All the traffic patterns in that area are very unusual. It's a bit far from us, but we're beginning to have been there often enough to have figured out how to get from Point A to Point B around there, without left turns onto and off of Jefferson to get from a restaurant we like to the Barnes & Noble.
Found a poorly placed stop sign. It would make more sense if the road was extended.
http://goo.gl/maps/TmvhT
Quote from: SignGeek101 on February 15, 2015, 11:33:00 PM
Found a poorly placed stop sign. It would make more sense if the road was extended.
http://goo.gl/maps/TmvhT
To be fair, one has to wonder if it was erected due to the sharp angle of the right turn.
Similar was done here (http://goo.gl/maps/6DegE).
Quote from: PHLBOS on February 16, 2015, 12:33:44 PM
Quote from: SignGeek101 on February 15, 2015, 11:33:00 PM
Found a poorly placed stop sign. It would make more sense if the road was extended.
http://goo.gl/maps/TmvhT
To be fair, one has to wonder if it was erected due to the sharp angle of the right turn.
Similar was done here (http://goo.gl/maps/6DegE).
That still wouldn't be a reason for a stop sign. They should use a sharp right turn sign with an advisory speed limit instead. That turn also doesn't look that sharp, surely not sharp enough to require one to come to a stop.
Quote from: UCFKnights on February 17, 2015, 06:17:10 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on February 16, 2015, 12:33:44 PM
Quote from: SignGeek101 on February 15, 2015, 11:33:00 PM
Found a poorly placed stop sign. It would make more sense if the road was extended.
http://goo.gl/maps/TmvhT
To be fair, one has to wonder if it was erected due to the sharp angle of the right turn.
Similar was done here (http://goo.gl/maps/6DegE).
That still wouldn't be a reason for a stop sign. They should use a sharp right turn sign with an advisory speed limit instead. That turn also doesn't look that sharp, surely not sharp enough to require one to come to a stop.
The Island Ave./Enterprise Ave. example I posted gets a sizable chunk of truck traffic (mainly UPS trucks). The
STOP signs weren't there originally but were erected due to accidents involving trucks taking the turn too fast. Mind you, I don't agree with the city's response; but I'm just giving you the reasoning for such.
https://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=33.522694,-112.402919&spn=0.005913,0.008256&t=h&z=18&vpsrc=6&layer=c&cbll=33.522694,-112.402919&panoid=HBK3Xf-uEuQY2nK_jLE0Ww&cbp=12,92.57,,0,5.44 (https://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=33.522694,-112.402919&spn=0.005913,0.008256&t=h&z=18&vpsrc=6&layer=c&cbll=33.522694,-112.402919&panoid=HBK3Xf-uEuQY2nK_jLE0Ww&cbp=12,92.57,,0,5.44)
The only conflict that I can see is with the dirt side road to the left, but the only logical place that I can think of for that stop sign would be on said side road. :confused:
Quote from: pumpkineater2 on March 24, 2015, 10:52:31 PM
https://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=33.522694,-112.402919&spn=0.005913,0.008256&t=h&z=18&vpsrc=6&layer=c&cbll=33.522694,-112.402919&panoid=HBK3Xf-uEuQY2nK_jLE0Ww&cbp=12,92.57,,0,5.44 (https://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=33.522694,-112.402919&spn=0.005913,0.008256&t=h&z=18&vpsrc=6&layer=c&cbll=33.522694,-112.402919&panoid=HBK3Xf-uEuQY2nK_jLE0Ww&cbp=12,92.57,,0,5.44)
The only conflict that I can see is with the dirt side road to the left, but the only logical place that I can think of for that stop sign would be on said side road. :confused:
Looks like there may have been a road here:
https://www.google.com/maps/@33.522694,-112.402919,21z
They might've never bothered to remove the sign after the road was removed. The street changing names supports this theory too.
Here's one in Selma, AL that doesn't make any sense (yes, the traffic lights do cycle!):
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.4136789,-87.0054066,20z/data=!3m1!1e3?authuser=0&hl=en
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.4136789,-87.0054066,20z/data=!3m1!1e3?authuser=0&hl=en
Since an octagon always means "stop," this item from a misguided sign vendor makes no sense (and is actually dangerous from the standpoint that oncoming traffic will always assume the octagon means you have a stop sign):
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.roadtrafficsigns.com%2Fimg%2Flg%2FK%2FGo-Sign-K-6933.gif&hash=f9867b444116a3ef8268b40a8ac0e2ba379d4312)
Quote from: freebrickproductions on April 22, 2015, 02:05:32 PM
Here's one in Selma, AL that doesn't make any sense (yes, the traffic lights do cycle!):
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.4136789,-87.0054066,20z/data=!3m1!1e3?authuser=0&hl=en
What's the AADT here? 75?
Can't recall seeing a traffic light on roads where there aren't really any center lines to speak of!
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 22, 2015, 02:54:58 PM
Quote from: freebrickproductions on April 22, 2015, 02:05:32 PM
Here's one in Selma, AL that doesn't make any sense (yes, the traffic lights do cycle!):
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.4136789,-87.0054066,20z/data=!3m1!1e3?authuser=0&hl=en
What's the AADT here? 75?
Can't recall seeing a traffic light on roads where there aren't really any center lines to speak of!
And a Dead End sign erroneously at the end of the "T": https://www.google.com/maps/@32.413467,-87.005586,3a,75y,85.71h,70.44t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sRl33LBfo3VtMzAy9sUAMwQ!2e0?hl=en
The stop sign makes more sense than the traffic light. Why waste the money on the electricity there?
Quote from: PHLBOS on February 16, 2015, 12:33:44 PM
Quote from: SignGeek101 on February 15, 2015, 11:33:00 PM
Found a poorly placed stop sign. It would make more sense if the road was extended.
http://goo.gl/maps/TmvhT
To be fair, one has to wonder if it was erected due to the sharp angle of the right turn.
Similar was done here (http://goo.gl/maps/6DegE).
Here is one in Miami, FL that is a sharp turn that seemingly has no need for a stop sign.
https://www.google.com/maps/@25.968635,-80.155609,3a,75y,270.62h,77.16t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1soPSNuhpNSwhU01bFfsUAwA!2e0
At a T intersection in my town, the stop sign is not a the road ending a the T, but on the through road - both directions. (NOTE TO SELF: don't buy a house in that area - oh shit, too late :( )
Quote from: SSOWorld on April 27, 2015, 08:53:25 AM
At a T intersection in my town, the stop sign is not a the road ending a the T, but on the through road - both directions. (NOTE TO SELF: don't buy a house in that area - oh shit, too late :( )
That reminds me of this intersection here in Huntsville:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.658343,-86.52274,3a,66.8y,4.29h,87.8t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s6tPkqkmKwv1Wva_Ws6IEXQ!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en
Though I think it might have something to do with how steep the hill on the road that ends at the intersection is.
Here's a confusing one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.390222,-86.909595,3a,66.8y,90.17h,82.17t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sutBmO6lg8yw1jHdF-2qLmg!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en
Quote from: freebrickproductions on April 30, 2015, 12:54:42 PM
Here's a confusing one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.390222,-86.909595,3a,66.8y,90.17h,82.17t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sutBmO6lg8yw1jHdF-2qLmg!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en
Making sure drivers are going to be doubly cautious approaching the train tracks?
Anyway, I really have it out for this one (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.458893,-79.945393,3a,75y,225.98h,72.65t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sKB1hRBT7y7fjxLWCyuQvKw!2e0), largely because it's so counter to my expectancy that I legitimately forget it's there and accidentally run it like every other time. The street is one-way down and so lightly trafficked, there's really no reason that just the stop sign from the side street wouldn't be plenty sufficient.
Quote from: wphiii on April 30, 2015, 01:04:38 PMAnyway, I really have it out for this one (https://www.google.com/maps/@40.458893,-79.945393,3a,75y,225.98h,72.65t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sKB1hRBT7y7fjxLWCyuQvKw!2e0), largely because it's so counter to my expectancy that I legitimately forget it's there and accidentally run it like every other time. The street is one-way down and so lightly trafficked, there's really no reason that just the stop sign from the side street wouldn't be plenty sufficient.
So it isn't just southeastern PA that irrationally erects
STOP signs on local roads for speed control purposes; it happens at the other end of the state as well.
Quote from: wphiii on April 30, 2015, 01:04:38 PM
Quote from: freebrickproductions on April 30, 2015, 12:54:42 PM
Here's a confusing one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.390222,-86.909595,3a,66.8y,90.17h,82.17t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sutBmO6lg8yw1jHdF-2qLmg!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en
Making sure drivers are going to be doubly cautious approaching the train tracks?
The thing is is that there are more set-ups like that one in the area (i.e.: 1 (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.701904,-87.529012,3a,66.8y,1.01h,83.34t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sHvL4OV9bgEKZcNJwAb3tjw!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en), 2 (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.606011,-87.034665,3a,66.8y,2.99h,85.29t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sUos9lWXZbiHduI09lwqMCA!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en)), and I believe that they are left-overs from the crossings being just crossbucks crossings, but they don't have the stop signs as far back from them as that one did. Here are some other ones that have rather far back stop signs: 1 (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.675182,-86.037072,3a,66.8y,210.18h,80.76t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sCxHd4zdKpNvWqBCD-9yscw!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en), 2 (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.695565,-86.000573,3a,66.8y,289.14h,90.39t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sPF4Y5mOUQw19uHN8E53BdA!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en), 3 (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.703733,-87.658354,3a,66.8y,304.46h,78.29t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sWHocgooDU_HWqUxOtMWmwA!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en) (not signalized, but it gets the point across).
It's temporary, (new highway being extended west) but still shouldn't be there:
http://goo.gl/maps/kZjVL
Quote from: freebrickproductions on April 27, 2015, 09:14:42 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on April 27, 2015, 08:53:25 AM
At a T intersection in my town, the stop sign is not a the road ending a the T, but on the through road - both directions. (NOTE TO SELF: don't buy a house in that area - oh shit, too late :( )
That reminds me of this intersection here in Huntsville:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.658343,-86.52274,3a,66.8y,4.29h,87.8t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s6tPkqkmKwv1Wva_Ws6IEXQ!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en
Though I think it might have something to do with how steep the hill on the road that ends at the intersection is.
I spoke with a neighbor regarding this and another odd stop sign arrangement on the street and the reasoning make sense. Traffic from the north of the intersections would fly in at 40+ mph (from a rural unicorporated town) into city jurisdiction and it is traffic calming.
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 23, 2015, 06:29:28 AM
Quote from: freebrickproductions on April 27, 2015, 09:14:42 AM
Quote from: SSOWorld on April 27, 2015, 08:53:25 AM
At a T intersection in my town, the stop sign is not a the road ending a the T, but on the through road - both directions. (NOTE TO SELF: don't buy a house in that area - oh shit, too late :( )
That reminds me of this intersection here in Huntsville:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.658343,-86.52274,3a,66.8y,4.29h,87.8t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s6tPkqkmKwv1Wva_Ws6IEXQ!2e0?authuser=1&hl=en
Though I think it might have something to do with how steep the hill on the road that ends at the intersection is.
I spoke with a neighbor regarding this and another odd stop sign arrangement on the street and the reasoning make sense. Traffic from the north of the intersections would fly in at 40+ mph (from a rural unicorporated town) into city jurisdiction and it is traffic calming.
So they use a stop sign as a speed-control device, something MUTCD says you shouldn't do?
ok - you can come and pick up the dead children after the idiots run them over.
Tell that to those who put four-way stops near schools. That is traffic calming as well.
The MUTCD is not the law.
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 23, 2015, 06:06:42 PM
ok - you can come and pick up the dead children after the idiots run them over.
What exactly do dead children have in common with stop signs?
https://youtu.be/RybNI0KB1bg
Quote from: jakeroot on May 25, 2015, 07:19:57 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 23, 2015, 06:06:42 PM
ok - you can come and pick up the dead children after the idiots run them over.
What exactly do dead children have in common with stop signs?
i'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the number of children getting hit by speeding cars dropped significantly after the stop signs were installed.
Quote from: odditude on May 26, 2015, 08:35:15 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on May 25, 2015, 07:19:57 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 23, 2015, 06:06:42 PM
ok - you can come and pick up the dead children after the idiots run them over.
What exactly do dead children have in common with stop signs?
i'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the number of children getting hit by speeding cars dropped significantly after the stop signs were installed.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the number was 0 to begin with.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 26, 2015, 09:49:35 AM
Quote from: odditude on May 26, 2015, 08:35:15 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on May 25, 2015, 07:19:57 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on May 23, 2015, 06:06:42 PM
ok - you can come and pick up the dead children after the idiots run them over.
What exactly do dead children have in common with stop signs?
i'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the number of children getting hit by speeding cars dropped significantly after the stop signs were installed.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the number was 0 to begin with.
Typically the number is 1, which leads to the initial implementation of a misguided attempt at speed control.
It's true that speed bumps are the preferred method of speed control, but stop signs are often used because they are cheaper.
But as far as putting 4-way stops near schools, this may be a good thing, because it provides cars with a control at a position where there is a conflict between pedestrians and cars. Again, stop signs may not always be warranted, but I wouldn't say that it makes no sense, since there is a point of conflict.
Selma, AL:
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.414972,-87.021506,3a,75y,191.32h,81.87t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sGdk0EcRsElS13JjoOi6vpQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
The signal does appear to cycle, which makes me wonder why there are a pair of stop signs here.
Here's another one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.412256,-86.999262,3a,49.8y,168.48h,86.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3D5AbD29ZrNhy1AlOwIX_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Quote from: freebrickproductions on June 27, 2015, 02:06:46 PM
Selma, AL:
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.414972,-87.021506,3a,75y,191.32h,81.87t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sGdk0EcRsElS13JjoOi6vpQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
The signal does appear to cycle, which makes me wonder why there are a pair of stop signs here.
Here's another one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.412256,-86.999262,3a,49.8y,168.48h,86.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3D5AbD29ZrNhy1AlOwIX_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
First one: I guess they want you to stop even on a green light. Maybe to keep people from going through that intersection too fast?
Second one: Pretty much the same as the first one but I guess they don't want people flying through left and right turns? Very strange still.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on June 27, 2015, 03:48:00 PM
Quote from: freebrickproductions on June 27, 2015, 02:06:46 PM
Selma, AL:
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.414972,-87.021506,3a,75y,191.32h,81.87t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sGdk0EcRsElS13JjoOi6vpQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
The signal does appear to cycle, which makes me wonder why there are a pair of stop signs here.
Here's another one:
https://www.google.com/maps/@32.412256,-86.999262,3a,49.8y,168.48h,86.78t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3D5AbD29ZrNhy1AlOwIX_A!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
First one: I guess they want you to stop even on a green light. Maybe to keep people from going through that intersection too fast?
Second one: Pretty much the same as the first one but I guess they don't want people flying through left and right turns? Very strange still.
What's interesting is that both intersections have the same two MUTCD violations.
I wonder if either the stop sign or the traffic signal could be legally enforced in either case.
^^ MUTCD Section 2B.04
Standard:
10 Because the potential for conflicting commands could create driver confusion, YIELD or STOP signs shall not be used in conjunction with any traffic control signal operation, except in the following cases:
If the signal indication for an approach is a flashing red at all times;
If a minor street or driveway is located within or adjacent to the area controlled by the traffic control signal, but does not require separate traffic signal control because an extremely low potential for conflict exists; or
If a channelized turn lane is separated from the adjacent travel lanes by an island and the channelized turn lane is not controlled by a traffic control signal.
Explain this: https://goo.gl/maps/lzOeL
Perhaps it's related to this sign (https://goo.gl/maps/YZaVR), which of course raises the question of what happens to the road when a commercial vehicle enters it, such that it cannot get out. Oddly, I've driven this road several times, and there's no graveyard of commercial vehicles at the far end of it, suggesting none has ever entered the road. (If it had, it would still be there rusting away, since there was no way for it to get out.) Unless it made a local delivery, that is. ;-)
Quote from: empirestate on June 27, 2015, 03:57:30 PM
Explain this: https://goo.gl/maps/lzOeL
Perhaps it's related to this sign (https://goo.gl/maps/YZaVR), which of course raises the question of what happens to the road when a commercial vehicle enters it, such that it cannot get out. Oddly, I've driven this road several times, and there's no graveyard of commercial vehicles at the far end of it, suggesting none has ever entered the road. (If it had, it would still be there rusting away, since there was no way for it to get out.) Unless it made a local delivery, that is. ;-)
There is a pretty strange stop sign with those intentions at a private neighborhood I vacation in but I have no pictures.
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 18, 2014, 05:57:47 PM
Green Lane in Upper Darby Twp., Delaware County, PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915612,-75.299113&sspn=0.005884,0.009377&vpsrc=0&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.91553,-75.29922&spn=0.000066,0.037508&z=15&layer=c&cbll=39.915592,-75.299111&panoid=tOtChLyXNJN9kNahUjt3_Q&cbp=12,232.83,,0,13.7)
That's honestly hilarious. That island is completely unnecessary in the first place.
That being said, there are several others evenly spaced down that street, so it must be for speed control.
Quote from: Signal on July 01, 2015, 03:27:58 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on September 18, 2014, 05:57:47 PM
Green Lane in Upper Darby Twp., Delaware County, PA (https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+PA&aq=0&oq=Primos,+PA&sll=39.915612,-75.299113&sspn=0.005884,0.009377&vpsrc=0&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Primos,+Upper+Darby,+Delaware+County,+Pennsylvania&ll=39.91553,-75.29922&spn=0.000066,0.037508&z=15&layer=c&cbll=39.915592,-75.299111&panoid=tOtChLyXNJN9kNahUjt3_Q&cbp=12,232.83,,0,13.7)
That's honestly hilarious. That island is completely unnecessary in the first place.
That being said, there are several others evenly spaced down that street, so it must be for speed control.
I wasn't disputing the fact that the islands were installed for speed control/traffic calming nor have an issue with such. The issue is that there's
STOP signs installed near these islands as well; unnecessary overkill IMHO.
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjudysvintagefptoys.com%2Fimages%2Fsets%2F131-garage-6.JPG&hash=a7986e4f23a33abf731f693ed586f7ce2eb328cb)
Hey, I remember having one of those!
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjudysvintagefptoys.com%2Fimages%2Fsets%2F131-garage-6.JPG&hash=a7986e4f23a33abf731f693ed586f7ce2eb328cb)
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
Quote from: Big John on June 27, 2015, 03:56:51 PM
^^ MUTCD Section 2B.04
Standard:
10 Because the potential for conflicting commands could create driver confusion, YIELD or STOP signs shall not be used in conjunction with any traffic control signal operation, except in the following cases:
If the signal indication for an approach is a flashing red at all times;
If a minor street or driveway is located within or adjacent to the area controlled by the traffic control signal, but does not require separate traffic signal control because an extremely low potential for conflict exists; or
If a channelized turn lane is separated from the adjacent travel lanes by an island and the channelized turn lane is not controlled by a traffic control signal.
struck out the portion for what applies in Wisconsin as they use stop signs on channelized rights quite often.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjudysvintagefptoys.com%2Fimages%2Fsets%2F131-garage-6.JPG&hash=a7986e4f23a33abf731f693ed586f7ce2eb328cb)
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
iPhone
Quote from: empirestate on July 06, 2015, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
That makes two of us. That toy came out in 1970. How old's your Grandma, Ballistic Wolf?
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:04:02 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 06, 2015, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjudysvintagefptoys.com%2Fimages%2Fsets%2F131-garage-6.JPG&hash=a7986e4f23a33abf731f693ed586f7ce2eb328cb)
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
That makes two of us. That toy came out in 1970. How old's your Grandma, Ballistic Wolf?
Well she is from the late 30s but the toy was bought for her kids I think.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 06:14:12 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:04:02 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 06, 2015, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
That makes two of us. That toy came out in 1970. How old's your Grandma, Ballistic Wolf?
Well she is from the late 30s but the toy was bought for her kids I think.
Oh okay. Your original statement sort of implies that your Grandma was the one using it.
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:16:01 PM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 06:14:12 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:04:02 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 06, 2015, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
That makes two of us. That toy came out in 1970. How old's your Grandma, Ballistic Wolf?
Well she is from the late 30s but the toy was bought for her kids I think.
Oh okay. Your original statement sort of implies that your Grandma was the one using it.
Oh sorry now that I look at it it did imply that :-|
I love how this conversation turned from bad stop sign configurations to an old Fisher Price toy.
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:16:01 PM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 06:14:12 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:04:02 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 06, 2015, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
That makes two of us. That toy came out in 1970. How old's your Grandma, Ballistic Wolf?
Well she is from the late 30s but the toy was bought for her kids I think.
Oh okay. Your original statement sort of implies that your Grandma was the one using it.
I just took it that he was mocking all of us old fogies on here.
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 06, 2015, 06:18:05 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:16:01 PM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 06:14:12 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on July 06, 2015, 06:04:02 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 06, 2015, 08:21:46 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
No statement has ever made me feel more old than that one...
That makes two of us. That toy came out in 1970. How old's your Grandma, Ballistic Wolf?
Well she is from the late 30s but the toy was bought for her kids I think.
Oh okay. Your original statement sort of implies that your Grandma was the one using it.
I just took it that he was mocking all of us old fogies on here.
That's *exactly* what I was thinking... :-D
Here's one that makes no sense... because it's literally right next to a yield sign for the same approach...
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.796867,-76.286978,3a,15y,18.14h,85.99t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sr_U3q_RjcrM3FZOi41aoGQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
How about this example (https://goo.gl/maps/J4u5U), where at an intersection with three approaches, one has a STOP sign, one a YIELD sign, and one has nothing at all. How is that supposed to work?
^^ It's not supposed to work
MUTCD section 2B.04:
11 Except as provided in Section 2B.09, STOP signs and YIELD signs shall not be installed on different approaches to the same unsignalized intersection if those approaches conflict with or oppose each other.
And the provisions in 2B.09 don't apply here.
Quote from: empirestate on July 08, 2015, 10:56:18 PM
How about this example (https://goo.gl/maps/J4u5U), where at an intersection with three approaches, one has a STOP sign, one a YIELD sign, and one has nothing at all. How is that supposed to work?
One traffic way has ROW while the other doesn't.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 08, 2015, 11:27:51 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 08, 2015, 10:56:18 PM
How about this example (https://goo.gl/maps/J4u5U), where at an intersection with three approaches, one has a STOP sign, one a YIELD sign, and one has nothing at all. How is that supposed to work?
One traffic way has ROW while the other doesn't.
Which is which? And what about the third? And what happens when two motorists approach the STOP and YIELD signs simultaneously (which happened to me yesterday)?
Quote from: empirestate on July 09, 2015, 08:32:21 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 08, 2015, 11:27:51 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 08, 2015, 10:56:18 PM
How about this example (https://goo.gl/maps/J4u5U), where at an intersection with three approaches, one has a STOP sign, one a YIELD sign, and one has nothing at all. How is that supposed to work?
One traffic way has ROW while the other doesn't.
Which is which? And what about the third? And what happens when two motorists approach the STOP and YIELD signs simultaneously (which happened to me yesterday)?
Mexican standoff!
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsadhillnews.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F08%2Fgood_bad_ugly_11.jpg&hash=f10dcf51d8381fd9978a5d1454787aa659fed4e2)
Quote from: empirestate on July 09, 2015, 08:32:21 AM
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 08, 2015, 11:27:51 PM
Quote from: empirestate on July 08, 2015, 10:56:18 PM
How about this example (https://goo.gl/maps/J4u5U), where at an intersection with three approaches, one has a STOP sign, one a YIELD sign, and one has nothing at all. How is that supposed to work?
One traffic way has ROW while the other doesn't.
Which is which? And what about the third? And what happens when two motorists approach the STOP and YIELD signs simultaneously (which happened to me yesterday)?
Growing up, there was a 3-way intersection with this very configuration we would go thru all the time on the way to my Grandparent's house. It was basically a Y intersection. Think of the Y as 6:00 at the bottom, 10:00 to the left, and 2:00 to the right. The main movement went between 6 & 10. 10 had no sign, and 6 had a yield sign, and the only real purpose of yielding was to turn left if traffic coming from 10 was turning left. The traffic coming from 2:00 had the stop sign. Honestly, I always thought it worked well.
This was all wiped out years ago when they reconfigured the intersection and put in a traffic light.
(Edited to say: I just looked it up on Historic Aerials and it was actually more of a T intersection than a Y intersection. It still worked well though!
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjudysvintagefptoys.com%2Fimages%2Fsets%2F131-garage-6.JPG&hash=a7986e4f23a33abf731f693ed586f7ce2eb328cb)
Hey, I remember having one of those!
Me too. That was one of my favorite toys, before I grew up to Hot Wheels cars and Matchbox road sets...
Here's a good one in Macon (https://www.google.com/maps/@32.868596,-83.759274,3a,75y,314.2h,90.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sakXBpj0HoM7_7g_ko7nALQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656): two legs controlled by a stop sign, one by a yield sign, and one by nothing at all.
One presumes that the yield sign is there to remind people turning left that they have to yield to traffic coming from the right on the through route, but I don't believe it's a valid use of the sign.
Quote from: lordsutch on July 10, 2015, 12:41:44 AM
Here's a good one in Macon (https://www.google.com/maps/@32.868596,-83.759274,3a,75y,314.2h,90.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sakXBpj0HoM7_7g_ko7nALQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656): two legs controlled by a stop sign, one by a yield sign, and one by nothing at all.
One presumes that the yield sign is there to remind people turning left that they have to yield to traffic coming from the right on the through route, but I don't believe it's a valid use of the sign.
If they removed the yield sing altogether it would probably work fine.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 10, 2015, 09:26:10 AM
Quote from: lordsutch on July 10, 2015, 12:41:44 AM
Here's a good one in Macon (https://www.google.com/maps/@32.868596,-83.759274,3a,75y,314.2h,90.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sakXBpj0HoM7_7g_ko7nALQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656): two legs controlled by a stop sign, one by a yield sign, and one by nothing at all.
One presumes that the yield sign is there to remind people turning left that they have to yield to traffic coming from the right on the through route, but I don't believe it's a valid use of the sign.
If they removed the yield sing altogether it would probably work fine.
That's what I thought. I don't it needs to be there, even if it's for the need to remind people turning left to yield to the people approaching on the through route.
Quote from: iBallasticwolf2 on July 06, 2015, 01:41:45 AM
Quote from: myosh_tino on July 06, 2015, 01:07:12 AM
Quote from: Roadrunner75 on July 05, 2015, 02:42:02 PM
From the Fisher Price parking garage, of course:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjudysvintagefptoys.com%2Fimages%2Fsets%2F131-garage-6.JPG&hash=a7986e4f23a33abf731f693ed586f7ce2eb328cb)
Hey, I remember having one of those!
My grandmother had one too.
As did I....
I would stage multi-vehicle crashes at the gore point where the ramps from the first and second deck merged with multitudes of Matchbox and Hot Wheels cars!
Then I had to use the ladder from my Tonka fire truck to rescue the "people" by pulling the other cars off the first one, LOL. No wonder I am in the line of work I am now.
This stop sign on Big Cove Road in Huntsville, AL near Huntsville Hospital is probably the most useless stop sign in the city, if not the world. Traffic turning right here is supposed to do so without stopping (due to the sign underneath the stop sign) and if traffic were to turn left, they'd just reach a useless stub that leads to an empty lot.
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5728/23446917899_1dae900242.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/BHVzPa)Pointless Stop Sign (https://flic.kr/p/BHVzPa) by freebrickproductions (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96431468@N06/), on Flickr
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5685/23706453262_58ee8c2043.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/C7RLCN)Pointless Stop Sign (https://flic.kr/p/C7RLCN) by freebrickproductions (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96431468@N06/), on Flickr
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/613/23788771996_abaebf156d.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Cf8F8j)Pointless Stop Sign (https://flic.kr/p/Cf8F8j) by freebrickproductions (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96431468@N06/), on Flickr
The stub:
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5803/23186747884_de4807ccc5.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/BjW9kf)Pointless Stop Sign (https://flic.kr/p/BjW9kf) by freebrickproductions (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96431468@N06/), on Flickr
Other approaches:
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/651/23706453022_fbbe5a2378.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/C7RLyE)Pointless Stop Sign (https://flic.kr/p/C7RLyE) by freebrickproductions (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96431468@N06/), on Flickr
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/664/23519182180_b33acdd1c1.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/BQiXt3)Pointless Stop Sign (https://flic.kr/p/BQiXt3) by freebrickproductions (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96431468@N06/), on Flickr
And here it is on Google Maps:
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.7198997,-86.5726838,3a,75y,275.61h,90.72t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1slSQsWcJVHRJcMQTz4-qtbg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Yeah, that is useless, and completely devalues the stop sign. If anything ever goes in where that stub is, and the full stop is needed on this end of the T, the stop sign will likely be ignored for a while...
A bit of a bump, but here's a pretty unnecessary stop sign in Okeechobee, FL:
https://www.google.com/maps/@27.2493104,-80.8141523,3a,50.7y,201.44h,80.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWkDdwWrn3veWXnrW9f_fow!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Quote from: freebrickproductions on July 19, 2018, 07:29:12 PM
A bit of a bump, but here's a pretty unnecessary stop sign in Okeechobee, FL:
https://www.google.com/maps/@27.2493104,-80.8141523,3a,50.7y,201.44h,80.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWkDdwWrn3veWXnrW9f_fow!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en
Stupid sign placement too. Really awkward turn as well.
In Orlando we have a full stop sign on WB Carrier Drive just west of Kirkman Road that could really use a yield sign. Its on a shallow angle and no sight distance issue.