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Overpowered Interchanges

Started by Janko Dialnice, November 21, 2013, 10:16:13 AM

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roadman65

Near Altoona, PA where US 22 and PA 764 interchange it has a double trumpet connecting the freeway with the arterial just like a toll road has.  This was opened to traffic in 1985, as I remember visiting Horseshoe Curve in 1984 where the US 22 freeway ended at PA 764 because the US 220 (now  I-99) was not yet completed north of Claysburg.  I am guessing that US 22 freeway over the Allegheny Mountain had to be opened in 1982 or 1983 as the concrete looked fresh in 84 when I was there.

This has to be be overpowering  considering the era it was built.
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Hollidaysburg,+PA&hl=en&ll=40.441199,-78.435946&spn=0.02123,0.035706&sll=27.698638,-83.804601&sspn=6.319638,9.140625&oq=Holidaysburg,+PA&t=h&hnear=Hollidaysburg,+Blair,+Pennsylvania&z=14
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe


SteveG1988

Roads Clinched

I55,I82,I84(E&W)I88(W),I87(N),I81,I64,I74(W),I72,I57,I24,I65,I59,I12,I71,I77,I76(E&W),I70,I79,I85,I86(W),I27,I16,I97,I96,I43,I41,

NE2

Quote from: SteveG1988 on November 25, 2013, 11:50:18 PM
http://goo.gl/maps/KNw1U

I-95 at exit 40 in Pennslyvania for SR413
Currently the connection to the Turnpike, and was planned to have I-895.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

PHLBOS

Quote from: NE2 on November 26, 2013, 12:09:07 AM
Quote from: SteveG1988 on November 25, 2013, 11:50:18 PM
http://goo.gl/maps/KNw1U

I-95 at exit 40 in Pennslyvania for SR413
Currently the connection to the Turnpike, and was planned to have I-895.
It's worth noting that the fly-over ramp from I-95 South is a recent add-on from roughly a decade ago.

With regards to it being a connection to the PA Turnpike; in theory, it presenlty serves as a Breezewood of sorts;  prior to NJ cancelling I-95, the connector road was originally planned to extend beyond PA 413 in a northeasterly direction and directly connect to the Turnpike near or at the current Delaware Valley (Exit 358/US 13) interchange.

The original plan, to the surprise of many Bristol residents and businesses that were cleared out of the connector's path (right-of-way aquisitions), was dropped in favor of the current I-95/PA Turnpike interchange design due to the projected higher traffic volume counts.  In PTC/PennDOT's mind, the original twin trumpets w/a connector road wouldn't have been able to handle the thru-I-95 traffic loads/movements.
GPS does NOT equal GOD

NE2

Quote from: PHLBOS on November 26, 2013, 08:41:07 AM
The original plan, to the surprise of many Bristol residents and businesses that were cleared out of the connector's path (right-of-way aquisitions),
Where would it have gone? The only obvious corridor has power lines, and probably did back then.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

PHLBOS

Quote from: NE2 on November 26, 2013, 09:31:19 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 26, 2013, 08:41:07 AM
The original plan, to the surprise of many Bristol residents and businesses that were cleared out of the connector's path (right-of-way aquisitions),
Where would it have gone? The only obvious corridor has power lines, and probably did back then.
It would've likely crossed them perpendicular. 

Though not ideal, highways crossing overhead power lines have done before:

I-95/MA 128 in Burlington just north of Exits 33A-B (US 3 South/MA 3A North)

http://goo.gl/maps/cTXRt
GPS does NOT equal GOD

Strider

Should have still used that I-95/PA 413 interchange. It would save Penn DOT/PTC money instead of having to build a new interchange between I-95 and I-278.

PHLBOS

Quote from: Strider on November 26, 2013, 12:26:26 PM
Should have still used that I-95/PA 413 interchange. It would save Penn DOT/PTC money instead of having to build a new interchange between I-95 and I-278.

I-95 & I-278 interchange ?

http://goo.gl/maps/IGFsf

:sombrero:
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Lol, I knew you meant to say I-95 and I-276.

Anyway, one needs to keep in mind that the decision to go with the soon-to-be constructed-interchange design circa the mid-1980s long predates any existence of EZ Pass.  The thinking was that a toll plaza along the connector link during peak periods would have run the risk of causing traffic jams at both of the interchanges to the highways; especially if the connector is designated as part of a through-Interstate.



GPS does NOT equal GOD

vdeane

Quote from: Strider on November 26, 2013, 12:26:26 PM
Should have still used that I-95/PA 413 interchange. It would save Penn DOT/PTC money instead of having to build a new interchange between I-95 and I-278.
Building an interchange between PA's section of I-95 and I-278 would indeed be expensive.  Fortunately, NJ already built one.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Laura

Quote from: lepidopteran on November 25, 2013, 10:33:15 PM
Did anyone mention the pretzel-like, 3-tiered interchange in Baltimore, between I-83 and Druid Park Lake Dr. (and 28th and 29th Streets on the other side)?  I think a parclo would have been more efficient.

https://www.google.com/maps/preview#!data=!1m4!1m3!1d3444!2d-76.6290929!3d39.3174017!2m1!1e3&fid=7

Having the railyard there in addition to the weird angle of 29th street would make a parclo challenging. Having lived right near this interchange, I don't think it's overpowered, especially since all of the movements are pretty tight.

PurdueBill

Quote from: PHLBOS on November 26, 2013, 10:29:27 AM
I-95/MA 128 in Burlington just north of Exits 33A-B (US 3 South/MA 3A North)
http://goo.gl/maps/cTXRt

Best part of that to me is the famous SOUTH 128 pull-through.  Sad that it was finally removed last year.  (If you inch southbound from the link PHLBOS posted, the street view jumps to a 2012 view with the new signs on a cantilever, with no pull-through as is the new Mass style.)

roadman65

Quote from: vdeane on November 26, 2013, 04:59:02 PM
Quote from: Strider on November 26, 2013, 12:26:26 PM
Should have still used that I-95/PA 413 interchange. It would save Penn DOT/PTC money instead of having to build a new interchange between I-95 and I-278.
Building an interchange between PA's section of I-95 and I-278 would indeed be expensive.  Fortunately, NJ already built one.
You mean I-276!  I know that everyone knows what you mean, but we have a few people in this forum that take note of these types of errors.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

roadman

Quote from: PurdueBill on November 27, 2013, 03:33:51 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on November 26, 2013, 10:29:27 AM
I-95/MA 128 in Burlington just north of Exits 33A-B (US 3 South/MA 3A North)
http://goo.gl/maps/cTXRt

Best part of that to me is the famous SOUTH 128 pull-through.  Sad that it was finally removed last year.  (If you inch southbound from the link PHLBOS posted, the street view jumps to a 2012 view with the new signs on a cantilever, with no pull-through as is the new Mass style.)
Actually, a cantilever was used for the new structure at this location not because the pull-through sign wasn't replaced, but because - per current electric utility safety standards - the proximity of the power lines precluded the installation of an upright in the median, even if the structure were grounded.
"And ninety-five is the route you were on.  It was not the speed limit sign."  - Jim Croce (from Speedball Tucker)

"My life has been a tapestry
Of years of roads and highway signs" (with apologies to Carole King and Tom Rush)

flowmotion

Quote from: TheStranger on November 21, 2013, 12:48:36 PM
I-280 at Cesar Chavez Street (Army Street) in San Francisco has a long flyover ramp with a stub, the only portion of the Southern Crossing project to ever be built.

https://maps.google.com/?ll=37.747881,-122.391579&spn=0.014286,0.019097&t=h&z=16

A better example might be the nearby US-101 / Army / Bayshore / Portero "hairball", which includes a number of flyover ramps in order to avoid a couple stoplights.

http://goo.gl/maps/Y3Agv

(I'm not sure if this overbuilt interchange was planned to be part of the Southern Crossing, but it would have been insufficient for a freeway-to-freeway connection.)

roadman

Quote from: roadman65 on November 25, 2013, 11:03:19 PM
Near Altoona, PA where US 22 and PA 764 interchange it has a double trumpet connecting the freeway with the arterial just like a toll road has.  This was opened to traffic in 1985, as I remember visiting Horseshoe Curve in 1984 where the US 22 freeway ended at PA 764 because the US 220 (now  I-99) was not yet completed north of Claysburg.  I am guessing that US 22 freeway over the Allegheny Mountain had to be opened in 1982 or 1983 as the concrete looked fresh in 84 when I was there.

This has to be be overpowering  considering the era it was built.
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Hollidaysburg,+PA&hl=en&ll=40.441199,-78.435946&spn=0.02123,0.035706&sll=27.698638,-83.804601&sspn=6.319638,9.140625&oq=Holidaysburg,+PA&t=h&hnear=Hollidaysburg,+Blair,+Pennsylvania&z=14
1985?!?  Wow, I thought that interchange was at least ten years older than that, given what I considered to be the very poor condition of the BGS panels when I went through the area on my first visit to Horseshoe Curve in the fall of 1993.
"And ninety-five is the route you were on.  It was not the speed limit sign."  - Jim Croce (from Speedball Tucker)

"My life has been a tapestry
Of years of roads and highway signs" (with apologies to Carole King and Tom Rush)

NE2

Quote from: roadman on November 29, 2013, 06:39:05 PM
1985?!?  Wow, I thought that interchange was at least ten years older than that, given what I considered to be the very poor condition of the BGS panels when I went through the area on my first visit to Horseshoe Curve in the fall of 1993.
1982 according to bridge dates.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

mgk920

Another here in Wisconsin is the US 151/WI 26 split on the northeast side of Waupun, WI.

http://goo.gl/maps/W73M4

Had I been designing this one, I would have built *NO* interchange there, rather a simple straight-across street bridge, instead.  Much, much simpler than what WisDOT built.

I also would have eliminated WI 26 from Waupun city streets, rerouting it to follow US 151 around town.

Mike

hotdogPi

Absolute craziness, and neither one is a freeway. Not sure if this can completely be called an interchange though.

http://goo.gl/maps/ZTsBw
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

froggie

QuoteAbsolute craziness, and neither one is a freeway. Not sure if this can completely be called an interchange though.

http://goo.gl/maps/ZTsBw

That one's "craziness" (and an upgrade to an old Jersey traffic circle), but I wouldn't call it overpowered, given the traffic flows geared to/from the west on US 30 towards the Ben Franklin Bridge.  And yes, you could call it an interchange, with the "through route" being US 30 to the west and NJ 38 to the east.

roadman65

#69
The NJ 7 and US 1 & 9 Truck interchange from the St. Paul's Avenue Viaduct replacement project has two ramps leading US 1 & 9 T up from the surface street as seen from Google.  One is a corkscrew loop counterclockwise, and the other is a straight ramp that carry the truck route up grade.

I am guessing that the corkscrew is built mainly for NJ 7 WB access as left turns are prohibited onto NJ 7 directly as well as a temporary fix while the other straight ramp was designed. Also I figure that the complete turn will be removed when the new Wittpenn Bridge opens up as from some GSV images it shows that the straight ramp was under construction from the view of NB US 1 & 9 T while traffic made the loop around.

Also, there is no access now from NB Tonelle Avenue to the Pulaski Syway.  Access to NJ 7 and US 1 & 9 Truck can be made now from St. Paul's Avenue from a new ramp, but Skyway access has been denied as the new Tonnelle Circle entrance ramp has been reconfigured for SB US 1 & 9 exclusively.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

Alps

Quote from: roadman65 on December 18, 2013, 05:21:11 PM
The NJ 7 and US 1 & 9 Truck interchange from the St. Paul's Avenue Viaduct replacement project has two ramps leading US 1 & 9 T up from the surface street as seen from Google.  One is a corkscrew loop counterclockwise, and the other is a straight ramp that carry the truck route up grade.

I am guessing that the corkscrew is built mainly for NJ 7 WB access as left turns are prohibited onto NJ 7 directly as well as a temporary fix while the other straight ramp was designed. Also I figure that the complete turn will be removed when the new Wittpenn Bridge opens up as from some GSV images it shows that the straight ramp was under construction from the view of NB US 1 & 9 T while traffic made the loop around.

Also, there is no access now from NB Tonelle Avenue to the Pulaski Syway.  Access to NJ 7 and US 1 & 9 Truck can be made now from St. Paul's Avenue from a new ramp, but Skyway access has been denied as the new Tonnelle Circle entrance ramp has been reconfigured for SB US 1 & 9 exclusively.
All of these are correct. The existing outer loop ramp will disappear and become NB-WB over the new Wittpenn Bridge, leaving the ramp to the right as the through route. There will be a couple more ramps built, allowing 7 EB traffic to get down to Tonnele Circle and the St. Pauls Ave. industrial area. Skyway access will mirror what has been happening during construction - heading NB, you will need to go around the circle to 1/9 Truck and make a right at Broadway.

mrsman

I-805 at 43rd Street in San Diego.  These ramps were supposed to be for a freeway that was never constructed.

mhh

I-696 and Mound Road in Warren, MI (suburban Detroit). It was built that way because the never-completed master plan called for Mound Road to eventually be rebuilt as a new M-53 freeway. In reality, Mound Road remains a county road.

http://goo.gl/maps/NGNjo

akotchi

Quote from: Steve on December 18, 2013, 07:57:06 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on December 18, 2013, 05:21:11 PM
The NJ 7 and US 1 & 9 Truck interchange from the St. Paul's Avenue Viaduct replacement project has two ramps leading US 1 & 9 T up from the surface street as seen from Google.  One is a corkscrew loop counterclockwise, and the other is a straight ramp that carry the truck route up grade.

I am guessing that the corkscrew is built mainly for NJ 7 WB access as left turns are prohibited onto NJ 7 directly as well as a temporary fix while the other straight ramp was designed. Also I figure that the complete turn will be removed when the new Wittpenn Bridge opens up as from some GSV images it shows that the straight ramp was under construction from the view of NB US 1 & 9 T while traffic made the loop around.

Also, there is no access now from NB Tonelle Avenue to the Pulaski Syway.  Access to NJ 7 and US 1 & 9 Truck can be made now from St. Paul's Avenue from a new ramp, but Skyway access has been denied as the new Tonnelle Circle entrance ramp has been reconfigured for SB US 1 & 9 exclusively.
All of these are correct. The existing outer loop ramp will disappear and become NB-WB over the new Wittpenn Bridge, leaving the ramp to the right as the through route. There will be a couple more ramps built, allowing 7 EB traffic to get down to Tonnele Circle and the St. Pauls Ave. industrial area. Skyway access will mirror what has been happening during construction - heading NB, you will need to go around the circle to 1/9 Truck and make a right at Broadway.
The new Wittpenn Bridge mainline will connect directly to the west end of the constructed St. Pauls Ave. viaduct, eliminating the need for WB traffic to make a 360-degree movement to continue on Route 7.  It was originally designed this way as a construction stage, because during design the schedules of the 1&9T and Wittpenn projects were anticipated to include an overlap.

Staging of construction dictated that the corkscrew ramp carried the 1&9T NB movement while the straight ramp was constructed, though this perk was invoked after the final configuration was defined.  It is officially signed as for Route 7 from 1&9T, but does currently provide access from St. Pauls Ave. to Tonnele Ave. and the circle for trucks, without having to cross the railroad and make the left at Tonnele Ave. south of the circle.  After the Wittpenn project is done, St. Pauls Ave. access to the circle and Tonnele Ave. NB (for trucks) would be via the Duffield Ave. ramp and u-turn at a new jughandle ramp at Newark Ave.

Access from NB Tonnele Ave. to the Skyway (via the circle) has been maintained from before construction.  The cross-movement in the top of the circle was restored.
Opinions here attributed to me are mine alone and do not reflect those of my employer or the agencies for which I am contracted to do work.

Tom958

Quote from: Thing 342 on November 22, 2013, 03:32:26 PM
I-75/85 and GA-10/Freedom Parkway in downtown Atlanta. I believe this was  supposed to be for an unbuilt connector to the Stone Mountain Freeway.

It was, originally, and was built as such per early '60's practice. I used to drive it often. The ramp from 75/85 southbound to the freeway stub was especially fun-- straight, but with a roller-coaster profile to obtain vertical clearance as it crossed over and under the other roadways. Wheee!  :D

An earlier version of the current design didn't have the flyover ramps, just a split diamond serving two one-way streets. I'd say the flyovers-- both two lanes-- are overkill, and they lead to confusion as to whether the road is or isn't a freeway.



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