AARoads Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: I-95 apparently completely shut down in parts of NC  (Read 4543 times)

kalvado

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 2296
  • Location: upstate NY
  • Last Login: Today at 01:48:48 PM
Re: I-95 apparently completely shut down in parts of NC
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2017, 10:19:30 AM »

Here's one of NJDOT's Incident Guideline manuals.  It frequently mentions the needs of emergency responders, along with the needs to keep traffic moving.  Section 7 is specifically devoted to traffic control: http://cait.rutgers.edu/system/files/u10/way_Incident_Traffic_Safety_Guidelines_Final.pdf
Maybe I am blind.. but I don't see the message. I can see one phrase which can be interpreted as encouragement to sort things out, but that is it.
Logged

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 9105
  • Age: 43
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: Today at 02:20:51 PM
Re: I-95 apparently completely shut down in parts of NC
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2017, 10:43:01 AM »

Not limited to the below, all of the following touch on keeping traffic flowing.  Note, at no time does it say "Just close the entire highway because you feel like it", which is the point of the sub-thread going on here...

Quote
1 INTRODUCTION
...Additionally, it provides maximum protection and safety for all emergency responders operating at limited access highway incidents. These guidelines also identify the need to provide mobility for the motoring public...

Quote
6.1 Standard practice will be to position emergency response vehicles in such a manner that best protects the incident space and passing motorists.

Quote
6.5 Emergency responders should always be aware of their visibility to oncoming traffic and take measures to move the traffic incident as far off the traveled roadway as possible or to provide for appropriate warning. Emergency vehicles should be safe-positioned in such a manner as to optimize traffic flow through the incident scene. All subsequent arriving emergency vehicles should be positioned as to not interfere with the established temporary traffic flow.

Quote
6.8 Unit operators shall cancel any warning lights which impair the vision of approaching traffic (i.e., headlights, spotlights, clear warning lights).

Quote
7.8 If State Police arrive on scene and determine that a previously closed lane must be opened to traffic, State Police will order lanes reopened in consultation with the fire department and/or EMS at the scene.

Quote
7.10 The closing of additional lanes not affected by the accident, to include on and off ramps, shall require the approval of the State Police, transportation, and highway authorities.

Quote
8.7 Once the incident has been stabilized and traffic control measures are in place, consideration should be given to time of day, traffic concerns, and traffic back-ups, etc. Based on these factors, when conditions permit, consideration should be given to reopening a blocked traffic lane to improve the flow of traffic.

Quote
9.1 Demobilization of the incident must be managed with the same aggressiveness as initial actions. Apparatus and equipment should be removed from the highway promptly to reduce exposure to moving traffic and minimize traffic congestion.

Logged

kalvado

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 2296
  • Location: upstate NY
  • Last Login: Today at 01:48:48 PM
Re: I-95 apparently completely shut down in parts of NC
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2017, 02:29:37 PM »

Not limited to the below, all of the following touch on keeping traffic flowing.  Note, at no time does it say "Just close the entire highway because you feel like it", which is the point of the sub-thread going on here...

Quote
1 INTRODUCTION
...Additionally, it provides maximum protection and safety for all emergency responders operating at limited access highway incidents. These guidelines also identify the need to provide mobility for the motoring public...

Quote
6.1 Standard practice will be to position emergency response vehicles in such a manner that best protects the incident space and passing motorists.

Quote
6.5 Emergency responders should always be aware of their visibility to oncoming traffic and take measures to move the traffic incident as far off the traveled roadway as possible or to provide for appropriate warning. Emergency vehicles should be safe-positioned in such a manner as to optimize traffic flow through the incident scene. All subsequent arriving emergency vehicles should be positioned as to not interfere with the established temporary traffic flow.

Quote
6.8 Unit operators shall cancel any warning lights which impair the vision of approaching traffic (i.e., headlights, spotlights, clear warning lights).

Quote
7.8 If State Police arrive on scene and determine that a previously closed lane must be opened to traffic, State Police will order lanes reopened in consultation with the fire department and/or EMS at the scene.

Quote
7.10 The closing of additional lanes not affected by the accident, to include on and off ramps, shall require the approval of the State Police, transportation, and highway authorities.

Quote
8.7 Once the incident has been stabilized and traffic control measures are in place, consideration should be given to time of day, traffic concerns, and traffic back-ups, etc. Based on these factors, when conditions permit, consideration should be given to reopening a blocked traffic lane to improve the flow of traffic.

Quote
9.1 Demobilization of the incident must be managed with the same aggressiveness as initial actions. Apparatus and equipment should be removed from the highway promptly to reduce exposure to moving traffic and minimize traffic congestion.

I would say this all is still a very generic "just be good" wording. Some of that doesn't even cover lane closure decisions...

And to put things in perspective... last year we had 2 fatal accidents on the highway between area namesake city and major suburb cluster. Only other road to bypass highway is a state road with bunch of traffic lights - nowhere close to handling 100k+ traffic on a highway.
In both cases one direction of highway was closed for 4 hours. Outside of commute hours  - but yet daytime with major traffic backups, probably thousands vehicles.
It wasn't the case of spilled load or such - looking at the pictures, highway could be cleaned up pretty fast. But state police insisted they need all 3 lanes + all shoulders for evidence collection.
I don't see anything in posted text that would affect such a situation.... It was an action of state troopers taken with full understanding of consequences.
Logged

jeffandnicole

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 9105
  • Age: 43
  • Location: South Jersey
  • Last Login: Today at 02:20:51 PM
Re: I-95 apparently completely shut down in parts of NC
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2017, 03:15:08 PM »

Well, the report is titled a 'Guideline' for a reason.  Situations are different.  And maybe you are trying to find too-specific wording when it comes to lane closure decisions, as I certainly highlighted them.  I mean, Section 7.10 - does it really get any clearer than that?

All I can say is, based on personal experience driving the highways down here on a daily basis, you see the actual results of these guidelines: Lanes that aren't impacted remain open; the police, fire and EMS do a pretty good job of keeping out of the way.  Vehicles that can be moved off the road are moved off the road.  Lanes truly are kept open. 

Fatals are a very minor part of the total accidents - generally, fewer than 2 per day statewide.  I think I've driven past 2 in my nearly 19 years of commuting to/from work here in the state.  And note..."driven past two".  One was during a cold winter; a car crossed from the SB to NB lanes, hitting and killing someone.  Traffic on the NB side was lead into the frozen median dirt to get around the scene.  Certainly a major delay.  but traffic kept moving.  In your case you cited, maybe there were reasons for keeping the road closed.  It would be impossible to know, and certainly depends on the circumstances.  I've seen highways and intersections closed as well.
Logged

kalvado

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 2296
  • Location: upstate NY
  • Last Login: Today at 01:48:48 PM
Re: I-95 apparently completely shut down in parts of NC
« Reply #29 on: May 03, 2017, 03:55:54 PM »

Well, the report is titled a 'Guideline' for a reason.  Situations are different.  And maybe you are trying to find too-specific wording when it comes to lane closure decisions, as I certainly highlighted them.  I mean, Section 7.10 - does it really get any clearer than that?

All I can say is, based on personal experience driving the highways down here on a daily basis, you see the actual results of these guidelines: Lanes that aren't impacted remain open; the police, fire and EMS do a pretty good job of keeping out of the way.  Vehicles that can be moved off the road are moved off the road.  Lanes truly are kept open. 

Fatals are a very minor part of the total accidents - generally, fewer than 2 per day statewide.  I think I've driven past 2 in my nearly 19 years of commuting to/from work here in the state.  And note..."driven past two".  One was during a cold winter; a car crossed from the SB to NB lanes, hitting and killing someone.  Traffic on the NB side was lead into the frozen median dirt to get around the scene.  Certainly a major delay.  but traffic kept moving.  In your case you cited, maybe there were reasons for keeping the road closed.  It would be impossible to know, and certainly depends on the circumstances.  I've seen highways and intersections closed as well.

I don't doubt that different agencies handle situations in a different way. It probably boils down to some agency culture... The way I read the document you cite, it is not much more than very generic checklist. Close if needed. Consult others if extended closing. Open when possible...  It is just about how this is actually implemented, what "possible" or "needed" actually means.
I assume there is much more to it in training, past experience, how the supervisor of today's supervisor did it 10 years ago or whatever you call it.
Logged

 


Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.