I-11 - NDOT's lack of "reassurance" signs keeps truckers on old 93

[Sub-Urbanite]

Yeah, perhaps an overhead "I-11 / US 93 North — Las Vegas" sign would have been helpful.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/news-columns/road-warrior/ndot-studies-i-15-gap-between-flamingo-sahara-in-las-vegas/

"I have actually had a few conversations with some truck drivers, and surprisingly they are unaware that there even is a bypass,"  Jerry said. "One thing each of the drivers seemed to say that impressed me is that the signage does not point them to the bypass, so they take the route that they're used to driving through Boulder City."

[The Ghostbuster]

It will probably be signposted eventually. Just give it some time.

[sparker]

Yeah, perhaps an overhead "I-11 / US 93 North — Las Vegas" sign would have been helpful.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/news-columns/road-warrior/ndot-studies-i-15-gap-between-flamingo-sahara-in-las-vegas/

"I have actually had a few conversations with some truck drivers, and surprisingly they are unaware that there even is a bypass,"  Jerry said. "One thing each of the drivers seemed to say that impressed me is that the signage does not point them to the bypass, so they take the route that they're used to driving through Boulder City."

Question:  are the majority of truckers still using the business/old 93 loop through Boulder heading SB or NB?  It seems the greatest potential for such errors would be SB, since that uses a semi-directional relatively high-speed ramp to access the loop -- and truckers who are accustomed to the original route are simply assuming that it's still the through route.  Northbound the exit is a simple diamond and as such a definite exit from the freewas/through facility; truckers would likely be less inclined to exit the freeway there to get on the business loop.  But I agree; some sort of "pull-through" notification at either end should be installed -- most definitely SB, but NB as well -- but possibly a little more subtly!

[Kniwt]

Yesterday morning, I headed north on 11/93 from the Arizona line, and I can't really see why any motorist would think that the old route through Boulder City was still the direct road to Las Vegas.

Granted, there is no BGS saying "I-11/US 93 Las Vegas," but the mainline now clearly keeps drivers on I-11. To get onto the old highway into Boulder City, you have to take NV Exit 2, which is clearly signed "US 93 Business / Boulder City." The northbound VMS (although somewhat small) was flashing "I-11 NOW OPEN" (although, thanks to poor font choice, it read more like "|-||").

The most confusing new sign I saw was "Boulder City / Next 3 Exits." Technically, that's accurate, but the exits in question are Business 93 ... and then nothing until US 95 and Railroad Pass Casino Drive, way up at the other end of the bypass.

[Sub-Urbanite]

I dunno. It just seems like adding through traffic directional signs at the key intersections — both ends of the business loop, plus US 95 — would have made sense.

[roadfro]

NDOT isn't big on pull through signs, so I'm not surprised there aren't any.

I'd agree that the potential for confusion is greater southbound, given the long-term interim construction configuration where southbound 93 traffic used the new flyover to the now business route while phase 2 was still being constructed. (It probably didn't help that they put up the final BGSs during the interim configuration without modification.)

[Sub-Urbanite]

I mean, like, this sign:

https://www.aaroads.com/west/nv-011/i-011-s-exit-015-3.jpg

If you're not using GPS navigation, wouldn't it be fairly easy, without a pull through sign, to assume that that's the way to go?

[vdeane]

Why would they send Hoover Dam traffic that way?  I would think it would be more logical to take exit 2.

[roadfro]

I mean, like, this sign:

https://www.aaroads.com/west/nv-011/i-011-s-exit-015-3.jpg

If you're not using GPS navigation, wouldn't it be fairly easy, without a pull through sign, to assume that that's the way to go?

Why would they send Hoover Dam traffic that way?  I would think it would be more logical to take exit 2.

It's likely a concession on NDOT's part to try to entice touristy people to go through Boulder City. Remember that the alignment of the Boulder City Bypass was selected primarily based on resident outcry–many businesses at the time favored one of the build options that would've put the freeway more through town.

There's a similar signage situation already existing in Boulder City, on southbound US 93 Business (former mainline) approaching the Nevada Way & Buchanan Blvd signal. It shows drivers an option of getting to Lake Mead & Hoover Dam via taking US 93 south or the older Nevada Way route (labeled "TO 93") through the historic downtown business district.

[sparker]

I mean, like, this sign:

https://www.aaroads.com/west/nv-011/i-011-s-exit-015-3.jpg

If you're not using GPS navigation, wouldn't it be fairly easy, without a pull through sign, to assume that that's the way to go?

Why would they send Hoover Dam traffic that way?  I would think it would be more logical to take exit 2.

It's likely a concession on NDOT's part to try to entice touristy people to go through Boulder City. Remember that the alignment of the Boulder City Bypass was selected primarily based on resident outcry–many businesses at the time favored one of the build options that would've put the freeway more through town.

There's a similar signage situation already existing in Boulder City, on southbound US 93 Business (former mainline) approaching the Nevada Way & Buchanan Blvd signal. It shows drivers an option of getting to Lake Mead & Hoover Dam via taking US 93 south or the older Nevada Way route (labeled "TO 93") through the historic downtown business district.

If NDOT was under local pressure to make efforts to divert Hoover Dam or Lake Mead traffic through Boulder City, resulting in that particular sign being deployed -- and they're normally averse to pull-throughs in any instance -- the chances of this being resolved anytime soon are slim indeed.  However, if truckers talk to each other through the usual means, they'll probably sooner than later realize that I-11 is not only completed around Boulder but cuts several minutes off their drives.  And enough tourists who don't have or use GPS -- or have limited map-reading skills -- will still slog through Boulder City en route to the dam to keep that downtown busier than it otherwise would be.  Give the bypass a little time to be absorbed into driver "lexicon", and things will sort themselves out.  Yeah, I among others would like to see pull-throughs, but since that's probably not going to happen -- and I-11 is in its infancy -- I wouldn't worry about it too terribly much down the line. 

Also -- it would help if paper maps actually showed that the O'Callaghan/Tillman Bridge existed as a separate facility from Hoover Dam, so folks don't think they still have to travel over the top of the dam to get across the river! -- particularly if they haven't been in the area previously. 

[roadfro]

Also -- it would help if paper maps actually showed that the O'Callaghan/Tillman Bridge existed as a separate facility from Hoover Dam, so folks don't think they still have to travel over the top of the dam to get across the river! -- particularly if they haven't been in the area previously.

What paper maps still don't show the bridge? It's been complete for nearly eight years... 

[Kniwt]

In the absence of a pull-through BGS, the southbound VMS just past Wagonwheel Drive now shows this message. We can debate how accurate it really is.

[sparker]

Also -- it would help if paper maps actually showed that the O'Callaghan/Tillman Bridge existed as a separate facility from Hoover Dam, so folks don't think they still have to travel over the top of the dam to get across the river! -- particularly if they haven't been in the area previously.

What paper maps still don't show the bridge? It's been complete for nearly eight years... 

Slight overstatement on my part; the Rand McNally atlas, for the last few years until the 2019 edition, has shown the bridge as a standard divided highway -- now a freeway with an interchange on either side of the crossing.  The dam is indicated by the usual thin black line north of the bridge -- but I did have to employ a magnifying glass in order to see the dam as depicted on both 2017 and 2019 atlases.  However, even that indication is dwarfed by the sizeable "Henderson" city name indicator immediately north of the dam.  I guess my old eyes (with or without my bifocals) just don't differentiate things like they used to without help.  Now -- I do know that McNally has long used the vertical size (point) of the city name to differentiate city size rather than the old variations on the city-center indicator; but in this case, it tends to mask or overshadow important details.  Maybe it's something their cartography unit should reconsider.  BTW, all this is referring to the NV map; it's marginally clearer on the AZ state map, as the "Henderson" name is moved farther north; also, on the Grand Canyon/Lake Mead insert on the pre-AZ page (2019 p.7), the dam is obscured between the two square green "Exit 2" indicators (one in each state).  Bottom line -- a lot of folks are going to need to use a magnifier or have extraordinary squinting capability to see the small black line for the Hoover Dam indication in the current or previous atlases. 

[Kniwt]

it's marginally clearer on the AZ state map

But there appears to be another significant error in that part of the Arizona map. It looks like, at AZ Exit 2, the old road down to the dam is still shown. (I'm looking with maximum zoom on the iPad app, but it's still not 100% clear.) Although the road still physically exists, it's been barricaded on the Arizona side (presumably for security reasons, so DHS doesn't have to staff a second checkpoint) ever since the bridge opened. That's a big deal for tourists trying to visit the dam from the Arizona side ... and at the offramps for AZ Exit 2, there are multiple signs directing people back onto 93 north to get to the dam.

[Sub-Urbanite]

And that's where signage is important — a "Hoover Dam access — exit 4 miles" sign at Kingman Wash Road could definitely explain to drivers that their map is wrong / their Waze is whacked.

And I still think there should be overhead pullthrough sings across the board on that project, at both ends of Boulder City and at 95.