Arizona Coyotes players apparently told team moving to Salt Lake

[Rothman]

Utah Saints:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_Saints

[KeithE4Phx]

The sale to Utah Jazz owner Ryan Smith and relocation to SLC is expected to be approved by the NHL Board of Governors tomorrow.  At least the Coyotes went out with a win, beating Edmonton 5-2.

RIP, Arizona Coyotes (1996-2024).  A sad ending to a hard-luck franchise, with one bad owner after another.

https://arizonasports.com/story/3546179/arizona-coyotes-sale-to-ryan-smith-expected-to-be-approved-by-board-of-governors-on-thursday/

[KeithE4Phx]

The purchase of the Phoenix hockey franchise by SLC interests has been approved.  The Arizona Coyotes no longer exists (hopefully temporarily), and its hockey operations are now owned by the Utah Jazz ownership group.  The name of the new team has not been determined.

Alex Meruelo, you're on the clock.  You have five years to build a hockey arena somewhere in metro Phoenix.

https://arizonasports.com/story/3546173/its-official-coyotes-will-move-from-arizona-to-utah-with-sale-to-jazz-owner/

[Max Rockatansky]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

[Rothman]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

[Max Rockatansky]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

No, there are way more ideal places for the former Arizona franchise to have landed.  The Golden Knights are more than enough for the entire desert southwest at this point.

[Rothman]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

No, there are way more ideal places for the former Arizona franchise to have landed.  The Golden Knights are more than enough for the entire desert southwest at this point.

That's my suspicion as well.  Baseball, basketball, football, heck, soccer...volleyball...I'm having trouble seeing Utah as some sort of burgeoning center for hockey.

[epzik8]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

The past few years suggested it was all of these.

[webny99]

Utah Saints:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_Saints

No thanks on this choice - I'm not a fan of the same team names being used in multiple sports to begin with, and the Jazz irony makes it even more distasteful.

[SEWIGuy]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

No, there are way more ideal places for the former Arizona franchise to have landed.  The Golden Knights are more than enough for the entire desert southwest at this point.

Do people from Utah generally root for teams from Las Vegas?

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

[hotdogPi]

Quebec City. Even though the total population is smaller, Canadian cities generally have a greater percentage of the population interested in hockey than American cities.

EDIT: I'm counting, as an estimate, 1.8 million people in Quebec who are closer to Quebec City than Montreal, and this excludes Trois-Rivières and Sherbrooke. Add a small amount more if New Brunswick decides to root for this team.

[Big John]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

No, there are way more ideal places for the former Arizona franchise to have landed.  The Golden Knights are more than enough for the entire desert southwest at this point.

Do people from Utah generally root for teams from Las Vegas?

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

Milwaukee had been lobbying for a team for a good time until Fiserv Forum was built without consideration of hockey.

[Rothman]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

No, there are way more ideal places for the former Arizona franchise to have landed.  The Golden Knights are more than enough for the entire desert southwest at this point.

Do people from Utah generally root for teams from Las Vegas?

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

Hartford.  Bring back the Whalers!

[Max Rockatansky]

Even when the Coyotes were in a real arena half the spectators attending were usually fans of visiting teams.  I'm having a hard time deciding if Phoenix was just a bad NHL market it or was just gross mismanagement of the Coyotes franchise that led to the team never getting a foothold.

Moreover, is SLC really a better market?

No, there are way more ideal places for the former Arizona franchise to have landed.  The Golden Knights are more than enough for the entire desert southwest at this point.

Do people from Utah generally root for teams from Las Vegas?

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

Before the Cardinals were a thing the big following for the NFL in Phoenix was the Broncos.  I'm not sure how that equates for SLC but the distance is similar. 

[JayhawkCO]

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

Quebec City
Hamilton
Kansas City
Houston
Milwaukee
Portland (OR)
Austin
Atlanta

I know some of these have had teams and failed before, but just some options outside of SLC.

[Max Rockatansky]

Atlanta has shown itself to be a nowhere destination for hockey too many times already. 

[mgk920]

The Blackhawks claim territorial rights on the Milwaukee market. 

Mike

[SEWIGuy]

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

Quebec City
Hamilton
Kansas City
Houston
Milwaukee
Portland (OR)
Austin
Atlanta

I know some of these have had teams and failed before, but just some options outside of SLC.

Yeah, but I don't know if any of them are obviously better.

For instance, I am from Milwaukee and know the city very well, and I think an NHL team there would be a failure. There just isn't enough interest in the sport - the AHL Admirals get about 6,000 per game. And the corporate community is already supporting the Bucks, and to a lesser degree Marquette basketball. I haven't heard a serious effort to get a team there since they were up for an expansion franchise in the 90s.

[1995hoo]

People who casually throw around lists of cities are making a couple of assumptions that may or may not be valid, including (but not limited to) there being a suitable arena (Salt Lake City is borderline on that one; Atlanta, for one, is considered not to have one) and an interested ownership group (by most accounts, nobody in Portland has expressed interest), as well as not infringing on another team's territory (huge problem in Hamilton as to the Leafs and the Sabres, also a problem in Milwaukee). The market also has to be big enough; the NHL has expressed skepticism about returning to Quebec City for that reason because it would by far be the smallest NHL market. In this particular case, keeping the franchise in the Western Conference was desirable for balance reasons; while there is recent precedent for having a team in a place where it did not belong (Winnipeg in the Southeast Division for two years), everyone recognized that it was problematic. (I'd argue that the current Atlantic Division is far from ideal with the two Florida teams grouped with Boston, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto, Buffalo, and Detroit.)

Regarding Atlanta, there's been a lot of talk about the idea of a suburban arena out near where the baseball team moved. Evidently they have a bunch of market studies that supposedly show an active hockey fanbase in the Greater Atlanta area but that also show that going downtown for a game is a big turnoff to a lot of people because of the traffic and travel time involved (sounds similar to the problem the Coyotes had in Glendale). Who knows whether any of that is really valid. Supposedly the Houston Rockets' owner is interested in landing a team for his city. Why the NHL would want to prioritize a third crack at Atlanta over a new market in Houston that by all accounts provided outstanding support for its WHA team is a mystery to me.

I saw a picture of Salt Lake City's arena in hockey configuration. It looks somewhat worse than the Barclays Center in Brooklyn. Sightlines and obstructed-view seating there were big problems for the Islanders. I don't remember seeing pictures of the Phoenix Suns' arena when the Coyotes played there, but I believe they had very similar issues. Hopefully this doesn't turn out to be a case of history repeating itself. By all accounts, Salt Lake City is the favorite to host the 2034 Olympics, so that ought to help with getting a new arena built.

[Max Rockatansky]

Let me rephrase then, is there any reason to believe the Atlanta fanbase will support an NHL team a third time around?

[SEWIGuy]

I think some of the successful "non-traditional" NHL markets have worked because they don't have a competing NBA team.

Nashville, Raleigh, Las Vegas, San Jose, Tampa, etc. all don't have to compete with a another franchise sucking up ticket and sponsorship dollars playing at the same time.

That being said, I wonder if Kansas City, which has the Sprint Center ready and waiting, would sustainably support a team.

[JayhawkCO]

That being said, I don't know where would be a better place. There doesn't seem to be an obvious location in need of a hockey team.

Quebec City
Hamilton
Kansas City
Houston
Milwaukee
Portland (OR)
Austin
Atlanta

I know some of these have had teams and failed before, but just some options outside of SLC.

Yeah, but I don't know if any of them are obviously better.

People who casually throw around lists of cities are making a couple of assumptions that may or may not be valid, including (but not limited to) there being a suitable arena (Salt Lake City is borderline on that one; Atlanta, for one, is considered not to have one) and an interested ownership group (by most accounts, nobody in Portland has expressed interest), as well as not infringing on another team's territory (huge problem in Hamilton as to the Leafs and the Sabres, also a problem in Milwaukee). The market also has to be big enough; the NHL has expressed skepticism about returning to Quebec City for that reason because it would by far be the smallest NHL market. In this particular case, keeping the franchise in the Western Conference was desirable for balance reasons; while there is recent precedent for having a team in a place where it did not belong (Winnipeg in the Southeast Division for two years), everyone recognized that it was problematic. (I'd argue that the current Atlantic Division is far from ideal with the two Florida teams grouped with Boston, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto, Buffalo, and Detroit.)

Regarding Atlanta, there's been a lot of talk about the idea of a suburban arena out near where the baseball team moved. Evidently they have a bunch of market studies that supposedly show an active hockey fanbase in the Greater Atlanta area but that also show that going downtown for a game is a big turnoff to a lot of people because of the traffic and travel time involved (sounds similar to the problem the Coyotes had in Glendale). Who knows whether any of that is really valid. Supposedly the Houston Rockets' owner is interested in landing a team for his city. Why the NHL would want to prioritize a third crack at Atlanta over a new market in Houston that by all accounts provided outstanding support for its WHA team is a mystery to me.

I saw a picture of Salt Lake City's arena in hockey configuration. It looks somewhat worse than the Barclays Center in Brooklyn. Sightlines and obstructed-view seating there were big problems for the Islanders. I don't remember seeing pictures of the Phoenix Suns' arena when the Coyotes played there, but I believe they had very similar issues. Hopefully this doesn't turn out to be a case of history repeating itself. By all accounts, Salt Lake City is the favorite to host the 2034 Olympics, so that ought to help with getting a new arena built.

Not saying they're all active, viable candidates with perfect arenas and potential owenership groups., but IMO, they're all places that a hockey team could work in the near/medium term wrt interest, population, geography, etc.

[1995hoo]

Here's the Delta Center in Salt Lake City during an LA Kings preseason game last year. From what I understand, the NHL team will likely close off the seats at either end of the upper level because you can't see the goal at your end of the ice from up there.

[KeithE4Phx]

Here's the Delta Center in Salt Lake City during an LA Kings preseason game last year. From what I understand, the NHL team will likely close off the seats at either end of the upper level because you can't see the goal at your end of the ice from up there.

This is similar to the situation at the Footprint Center in Phoenix (America West Arena at the time) that prevented the Coyotes from remaining there in 1998.

[Henry]

Just as we expected: Ryan and Ashley Smith (the new team owners) have already determined that the new name will include Utah to match their other team, the Jazz. More details to come later on, possibly this summer...