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CA 104

Started by Max Rockatansky, July 10, 2019, 11:58:05 PM

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Max Rockatansky

I'm presently working on CA 104 on Gribblenation and the route has turned out to be far more interesting from Ione eastward than I expected.  I've noted the following alignment changes:

-  The original 1934 Highway ended in Jackson on modern CA 88 at CA 49.
-  By 1940 CA 104 appears to have been cut back to CA 88 on Main Street in Ione.
-  The 1957 State Highway Map is the first to clearly show CA 104 being routed northeast of Ione on LRN 97 to CA 16.
-  CA 104 was shifted to CA 88 east of Ione during the 1964 State Highway renumbering but remained signed to CA 16 until 1965.
-  In 1970 the legislative definition of CA 104 changed to have an east terminus at West Point.  This had the odd effect of making CA 26 between CA 88 east to West Point as legislatively part of 104.  The 1975 shows Ridge Road in Martell becoming part of CA 104, ultimately nothing east of CA 49 on Ridge Road would be built to state Highway standards.
-  By 1984 the legislative definition of CA 104 was cut back to Sutter Creek which meant CA 26 between CA 88 east to West Point was no longer legislatively CA 104.

Hell...I thought CA 124 though Ione was weird already.  I had no idea CA 104 had such a shifting eastern terminus, the western terminus is almost completely static by comparison.


TheStranger

I wonder if the 1974 to 1984 eastern extent was influenced by planning for the unbuilt Route 65 gap

SAMSUNG-SM-G930A

Chris Sampang

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: TheStranger on July 11, 2019, 12:04:53 AM
I wonder if the 1974 to 1984 eastern extent was influenced by planning for the unbuilt Route 65 gap

SAMSUNG-SM-G930A

Shouldn't have been, they were meant to intersect west of Ione. 

Max Rockatansky

Just finished the highway blog on CA 104.  CA 104 has a very strange alignment history with the east terminus which has jumped at frequent points starting all the way back in 1940 when CA 88 was first signed.  CA 104 passes through some unique areas like the grounds of the Rancho Seco Nuclear Generation Station but is mostly associated with the Gold Rush community of Ione.  East of Ione CA 104 follows the derelict Amador Central Railroad which only recently shuttered in 2004.  CA 104 was intended in the 1970s to follow Ridge Road and some of CA 26 to West Point but the connection between CA 49 near Martell to CA 88 east of Jackson was never built.

https://www.gribblenation.org/2019/07/california-state-route-104.html

cahwyguy

#4
I'm working on processing this thread into my pages (making sure all the info is there, etc.), and I've run into a problem. For all your focus on the Eastern end, there's a question on the Western end. It is clear that the current portion of Route 104 from near Galt to Ione was part of LRN 34. But there was once a portion of Route 104 running W from near Galt to Walnut Grove. It is in the 1934 definition of the state sign route, and shows on the state highway map ... but seemingly as a county route. Was it ever a legislative route W of Galt? Was this a county route signed as a state highway? The route ran from LRN 53 near Walnut Grove, but there's no route that states that, so ???.

Any ideas?
Daniel - California Highway Guy ● Highway Site: http://www.cahighways.org/ ●  Blog: http://blog.cahighways.org/ ● Podcast (CA Route by Route): http://caroutebyroute.org/ ● Follow California Highways on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cahighways

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: cahwyguy on July 20, 2019, 11:47:20 AM
I'm working on processing this thread into my pages (making sure all the info is there, etc.), and I've run into a problem. For all your focus on the Eastern end, there's a question on the Western end. It is clear that the current portion of Route 104 from near Galt to Ione was part of LRN 34. But there was once a portion of Route 104 running W from near Galt to Walnut Grove. It is in the 1934 definition of the state sign route, and shows on the state highway map ... but seemingly as a county route. Was it ever a legislative route W of Galt? Was this a county route signed as a state highway? The route ran from LRN 53 near Walnut Grove, but there's no route that states that, so ???.

Any ideas?

LRN 34 definitely never made it west of LRN 4 but the concept of CA 104 being signed west of US 99 was something I couldn't really find any evidence for.  Prior to 1940 the Signed State Routes that were signed on County Roads were displayed on 1938 State Highway Map but there is nothing west of Galt for CA 104:

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~239588~5511892:Road-Map-of-the-State-of-California?sort=Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No&qvq=q:caltrans;sort:Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=69&trs=86

Interestingly the 1935 Goshua Map of California does display the early route of CA 12 through Walnut Grove.  There appears to be some sort of major roadway connecting CA 12 near Walnut Grove to Galt but it isn't clear if it was signed as CA 104:

http://cartweb.geography.ua.edu/lizardtech/iserv/calcrgn?cat=North%20America%20and%20United%20States&item=States/California/California1935b.sid&wid=1000&hei=900&props=item(Name,Description),cat(Name,Description)&style=simple/view-dhtml.xsl

The 1935 Division of Highways Map show the alignment above as:

-  Walnut Grove Road to Thorton
-  Probably Thorton Road
-  New Hope Road over the Mokelumne River and into Galt.
-  Lincoln Way appears to be used along with an unclear connection to US 99/LRN 4

https://www.davidrumsey.com/luna/servlet/detail/RUMSEY~8~1~247334~5515378:Sacramento-County-?sort=Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No&qvq=q:california%20division%20of%20highways%20sacramento;sort:Pub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No;lc:RUMSEY~8~1&mi=55&trs=159

cahwyguy

Yet, the definition of SSR 104, from the page you cite in your Gribblenation article, does show 104 as starting near Walnut Grove, so it might very well be that that county route was SSR 104. The question is: Which route? The one that became E13? The route along Walnut Grove Road and New Hope Road? What's clear is that by 1937, the portion W of Galt was no longer signed as 104.
Daniel - California Highway Guy ● Highway Site: http://www.cahighways.org/ ●  Blog: http://blog.cahighways.org/ ● Podcast (CA Route by Route): http://caroutebyroute.org/ ● Follow California Highways on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cahighways

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: cahwyguy on July 20, 2019, 04:47:29 PM
Yet, the definition of SSR 104, from the page you cite in your Gribblenation article, does show 104 as starting near Walnut Grove, so it might very well be that that county route was SSR 104. The question is: Which route? The one that became E13? The route along Walnut Grove Road and New Hope Road? What's clear is that by 1937, the portion W of Galt was no longer signed as 104.

I'd say from what I'm seeing on the 1935 Goshua and Division of Highways maps it was Walnut Grove Road/New Hope Road and not Twin Cities Road.  That routing is very clear as a major County Maintained Highway on the Division of Highways Map and definitely what Goshua is trying to display.  It would have definitely made sense for CA 104 to be signed through Thorton given it would have connected with early CA 12 on Walnut Grove Road.

Note; I'd pulled the definition of CA 104 from what was outlined for CA 104 in the 1934 Department of Public Works guide which announced the Signed State Highways.  They cited Walnut Grove as the intended west terminus.

Max Rockatansky

Note; I went back to the article on Gribblenation and added the evidence discussed here about CA 104 being routed westward from Galt to Walnut Grove.

cahwyguy

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on July 20, 2019, 04:51:02 PM
Note; I'd pulled the definition of CA 104 from what was outlined for CA 104 in the 1934 Department of Public Works guide which announced the Signed State Highways.  They cited Walnut Grove as the intended west terminus.

Actually, they said "Near Walnut Grove", which fits better with the county road location.
Daniel - California Highway Guy ● Highway Site: http://www.cahighways.org/ ●  Blog: http://blog.cahighways.org/ ● Podcast (CA Route by Route): http://caroutebyroute.org/ ● Follow California Highways on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cahighways

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: cahwyguy on July 20, 2019, 05:11:11 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on July 20, 2019, 04:51:02 PM
Note; I'd pulled the definition of CA 104 from what was outlined for CA 104 in the 1934 Department of Public Works guide which announced the Signed State Highways.  They cited Walnut Grove as the intended west terminus.

Actually, they said "Near Walnut Grove", which fits better with the county road location.

You're right...  That makes me think if CA 12 being realigned to the south had something to do with LRN 34 never being extended to west of LRN 4/US 99.  Said alignment would have lost a lot of utility once CA 12 was out of the picture in Walnut Grove.



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