Forgive me if this topic already exists, but I don't recall that it does.
Let's talk about wine. General preferences? Overrated labels? Crowd pleasers? Does terroir matter? Does minerality even exist?
I'll start.
For cooking with red wine, you can't go wrong with a cheap Rhône blend. No overpowering flavor characteristics, not overly sweet, choosing a blend helps hedge your bets, and good quality can be found at low prices.
For cooking with white wine, I really like the neutral flavor profile of Graves. But it can be a bit expensive, so I often go with a Pinot Gris instead.
I like wine whenever I have it but I usually don't out of my way to. We still have about a dozen left over bottles from the Kings River Winery from our wedding two years ago. I've only gotten through maybe 5-6 by myself and my wife probably has had only one?
I don't really like white wine, but I like most varietals of red with favorites being Pinot Noir and Cab Sav. If I'm in the mood for something sweet I love a chilled Michigan cherry wine.
As for national brands I can't stand Barefoot. I've had $4 bottles from Aldi that I've liked better than Barefoot.
One Indiana winery that I don't like is Oliver.
My favorite Indiana wineries are Huber's, Turtle Run, and Butler
My favorite Michigan wineries are Lemon Creek, Round Barn, Warner, 45 North, and Chateau Chantal
Haven't done a California wine trip yet.
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 09, 2021, 07:33:30 PM
I don't really like white wine, but I like most varietals of red with favorites being Pinot Noir and Cab Sav.
Pinot Noir is pretty easy to like. People who aren't big into wine generally like Pinot Noir just fine.
Have you had Merlot? It's similarly easy to like.
Quote from: kphoger on March 09, 2021, 07:50:50 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on March 09, 2021, 07:33:30 PM
I don't really like white wine, but I like most varietals of red with favorites being Pinot Noir and Cab Sav.
Pinot Noir is pretty easy to like. People who aren't big into wine generally like Pinot Noir just fine.
Have you had Merlot? It's similarly easy to like.
I like Merlot with a meal, but I don't enjoy it as much by itself.
Sangria, it can be either Red or White. I haven't had it in awhile, though.
We have oenophile friends who bring a bottle or two when we go out to eat. Almost always red, but different each time. Always great choices.
At parties they host they'll sometimes do a blind tasting contest. Eight sips, ID the variety, extra points for winery and vintage. I've never developed the ability to pin those down. Pinot Noir and Syrah are usually a good choice for me, and pair well with the food we tend to eat.
I like dry wines. Sweet wines give me stomach cramps.
I used to think I didn't like dry wines. Then I realized I was conflating "fruity" with "sweet". I actually quite enjoy dry fruity wines.
I like Cabs, Malbec, and Temparnillo for reds.
I'm not a huge white wine fan except with seafood, but a good chardonnay is my go to.
Some of the bottles I always keep stocked?? Surprisingly enough my wife and I like Kirkland wine from Costco. They're really good for "cheap" wine.
I have never had wine, but I grew up watching Justin Wilson cooking on TV. One of his main rules in cooking was "Never cook with a wine that you don't drink."
We are members of the wine club at Fox Meadow Winery (http://www.foxmeadowwinery.com) in Linden, Virginia. We particularly like their Cabernet Franc and their Pinot Grigio.
Generally, if you come to dinner at our house, you stand a pretty good chance of being served Virginia wine, although on Sunday night we were drinking a Riesling from the Finger Lakes region of New York. At the moment, not counting a bottle of Port and a bottle of sherry, we have two bottles of wine that aren't from Virginia (a Shiraz from Australia that we're saving for a special occasion and a Marquette from Gervasi Vineyard in Ohio). I had one last bottle of Cabernet Franc from Domaine Queylus in Ontario left from our 2019 trip to Toronto, but we drank it earlier this winter.
I remember I first took an interest in wine in the mid-1990s. I was at the grocery store and bought a pork chop to grill and decided to have wine rather than beer, so I asked for a recommendation and the guy suggested a Pinot Noir from Oregon. It went quite well. So the next weekend when I bought a piece of steak, I got the same wine because I had liked it. It was awful. Totally clashed with the steak, had a metallic flavor. That was when I first came to understand that there was something to the whole idea of pairing wine with food.
Quote from: cjk374 on March 10, 2021, 09:17:38 AM
I have never had wine, but I grew up watching Justin Wilson cooking on TV. One of his main rules in cooking was "Never cook with a wine that you don't drink."
In a few applications, I could see using "cooking wine" from the grocery store shelf, though I've never personally done so.
Honestly, the main reason to never cook with a wine that you don't drink is that you have to do
something with the rest of the bottle after you've used the small amount required for the recipe. Might as well pour it in glasses and serve it with dinner!
As for wine we keep stocked... Well, we rarely have more than one or two bottles in the house at a time, but...
La Vieille Ferme white wine
(https://cdn.vin.co/_clients_folder/perrin/perrin_la_vieille_ferme_blanc_2017_vdf_macro_jpg_19208_1024.jpg)
We call this "chicken wine" in our family because of the label. In fact, our sons know it by that name too, even though they're all too young to drink alcohol. It's not a "fancy" wine: it is simply a
vin de France, which is the lowest of the three classifications of French wine. It's a class of simple table wines that are labeled by neither region nor grape varietal. This one is a blend from the Rhône valley–which I've already said is a good bet for red wines–made from like four different varietals. Only 10% of of only one of the varietals is oaked.
As for reds, I generally don't keep them stocked in the house, but rather buy it one bottle at a time, depending on what we're using it for. One thing I use it for every year is in making
rouladen on Ephiphany. I simmer them in a mixture of beef stock, red wine, Worcestershire sauce, and herbs. Perhaps an unusual choice, the wine I often use is a Malbec from Argentina. But if I'm buying something to be drunk with dinner, and I'm not sure of everyone's tastes, then it's always safe to go with a Côtes du Rhône Villages, such as the one below.
(https://cdn.vin.co/_clients_folder/perrin/perrin_bouteillesetetiquettescotesdurhonevillages2010_2_1024.jpg)
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 10, 2021, 09:23:37 AM
I remember I first took an interest in wine in the mid-1990s. I was at the grocery store and bought a pork chop to grill and decided to have wine rather than beer, so I asked for a recommendation and the guy suggested a Pinot Noir from Oregon. It went quite well. So the next weekend when I bought a piece of steak, I got the same wine because I had liked it. It was awful. Totally clashed with the steak, had a metallic flavor. That was when I first came to understand that there was something to the whole idea of pairing wine with food.
In my opinion, most anything pairs well with grilled pork.
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 10, 2021, 09:23:37 AM
... on Sunday night we were drinking a Riesling from the Finger Lakes region of New York.
I know this is beer and not wine, but...
:cheers:
Quote from: webny99 on March 10, 2021, 09:48:43 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 10, 2021, 09:23:37 AM
... on Sunday night we were drinking a Riesling from the Finger Lakes region of New York.
I know this is beer and not wine, but...
:cheers:
I figured you might appreciate that. The label is Glacial Till; they're located in (or near) Hammondsport.
Regarding cooking wine, you have to be cautious with that stuff. There is a product called "cooking sherry" that is extremely salty. Its purpose is to give you the sherry flavor while being unpalatable to drink by itself so that alcoholics won't slug down the whole bottle. I don't know whether other "cooking wines" might be similar.
When I make beef stroganoff, the recipe calls for deglazing the pan with red wine before putting it in the slow cooker. I usually use Hands Cabernet Sauvignon from South Africa for that for the same reason others have discussed: It's eminently drinkable (even if I decide to serve something else with the stroganoff), but it's also not so expensive that I'm reluctant to use it for deglazing. I wouldn't deglaze with a pricey Bordeaux, for example, even if we were going to drink that wine for dinner.
(Edited to fix a verb tense error)
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 10, 2021, 09:23:37 AM
Generally, if you come to dinner at our house, you stand a pretty good chance of being served Virginia wine,
Is that an open invitation? Should we bring a vegetable?
Wine tastes like feet to me. The only wine I'll drink is Cheerwine and that isn't wine.
Quote from: index on March 10, 2021, 10:37:34 AM
Wine tastes like feet to me.
My sister (a huge red wine fan) has actually described appreciating a bit of "gym bag" flavor component in a wine. To each his/her own...
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 10, 2021, 10:17:28 AM
Quote from: webny99 on March 10, 2021, 09:48:43 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 10, 2021, 09:23:37 AM
... on Sunday night we were drinking a Riesling from the Finger Lakes region of New York.
I know this is beer and not wine, but...
:cheers:
I figured you might appreciate that. The label is Glacial Till; they're located in (or near) Hammondsport.
Interesting, I've never heard of that one, but have heard of several others near there, including Dr. Konstantin Frank's and Bully Hill. Hammondsport is just at the edge of what I would consider our traditional "wine country", with the the highest concentration of wineries being on the northern ends of Seneca and Cayuga Lakes. But there are plenty of good ones outside that range - Casa Larga, for example, is right here in the Rochester suburbs.
I'm not old enough to drink.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 10, 2021, 10:54:44 AM
I'm not old enough to drink.
Depends on the country. I had legally purchased alcohol by the time I was your age.
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 10:57:54 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 10, 2021, 10:54:44 AM
I'm not old enough to drink.
Depends on the country. I had legally purchased alcohol by the time I was your age.
In what country?
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 10, 2021, 11:07:00 AM
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 10:57:54 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 10, 2021, 10:54:44 AM
I'm not old enough to drink.
Depends on the country. I had legally purchased alcohol by the time I was your age.
In what country?
Germany.
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws that allows a parent to serve alcohol to his or her own child at home, and another carve-out that allows a minor to consume alcohol as part of a religious rite. So, by the time I was your age, I had had beer and wine (and vodka and mezcal) under the supervision of my father, and I had also had wine during Communion at church.
Where do you all like to go for wine?
I miss Total Wine from living in California, but find Costco has a surprisingly great selection.
Has anyone tried an online wine club?
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 10, 2021, 11:36:46 AM
Where do you all like to go for wine?
A large local place (https://goo.gl/maps/fjMd996xkvsrhqDR9). They actual employ people who know what they're talking about.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 10, 2021, 11:36:46 AM
Has anyone tried an online wine club?
Nope. My impression is that those clubs exist to send you mediocre wine on a regular basis, whether you want more or not.
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:54:07 AM
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 10, 2021, 11:36:46 AM
Where do you all like to go for wine?
A large local place (https://goo.gl/maps/fjMd996xkvsrhqDR9). They actual employ people who know what they're talking about.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 10, 2021, 11:36:46 AM
Has anyone tried an online wine club?
Nope. My impression is that those clubs exist to send you mediocre wine on a regular basis, whether you want more or not.
Ha! My wife said almost the same thing about a wine club. She equated it to her experience when she thought 6 CDs for a penny at Columbia House was a great deal back in the 90s.
I used to belong to a wine club–my father gave me a membership one Christmas and renewed it the following year. I don't remember which club it was, but it wasn't California-specific because I recall some South American wines. Some of the wine was pretty good, some of it was just OK. The reds were almost always better than the whites. I found it useful mainly as a way to try wines from different areas that might then lead me to explore other ones–for example, I recall one month they had a red from Uruguay that was pretty good, and I had never had wine from Uruguay before. The one thing was, when I wasn't working from home it was a hassle to receive wine shipments. I'd have them redirected to a local FedEx or UPS place for pickup.
Nowadays, the only wine club we belong to is the one at our favorite winery as mentioned further up the thread. Shipping is a non-issue because we pick it up there (this past weekend, we had two club pickups totalling six bottles and we bought another 15 bottles, one of which we drank there).
In terms of where I buy wine locally, mostly Wegmans and Total Wine.
I know I've brought this up in another thread somewhere, but I am a certified sommelier. I am nowhere close to a master (which is the highest level within the Court of Master Sommeliers), but I'm what you call level two. To get this certification, I had to take the intro class (which was kind of a joke for anyone that's been in the wine/fine dining restaurant biz), but the second level required a written test, a service where you pour wine and answer a battery of questions from one of the masters, and then a blind tasting where they give you four wines and you have to identify the flavor characteristics, the visual characteristics, and then what grape, from what country, and approximate age. I was happily the highest scorer, but don't think I'll ever go for Level 3 (Advanced). Too much work and too much of your own money spent buying nicer wines to be able to taste.
Quote from: kphoger on March 09, 2021, 06:02:13 PM
Forgive me if this topic already exists, but I don't recall that it does.
Let's talk about wine. General preferences? Overrated labels? Crowd pleasers? Does terroir matter? Does minerality even exist?
I'll start.
For cooking with red wine, you can't go wrong with a cheap Rhône blend. No overpowering flavor characteristics, not overly sweet, choosing a blend helps hedge your bets, and good quality can be found at low prices.
For cooking with white wine, I really like the neutral flavor profile of Graves. But it can be a bit expensive, so I often go with a Pinot Gris instead.
General Preferences - Wet. I pretty much like all well-made wines.
Overrated Labels - The Prisoner, Kendall Jackson, Rombauer, Miraval, Caymus, Silver Oak
Crowd Pleasers - Pinot Noir, Carignan, Assyrtiko, Good Riesling
Does Terroir Matter - 100%. I can tell the difference between Rhone Syrah, Australian Shiraz, Washington Syrah etc. Terroir includes everything from climate to soil to wind, etc.
Does Minerality Exist - Meh. I can tell the differences between different soil types, but you don't actually get rocks into the grapes because they don't dissolve. Salt, on the other hand, you can definitely get from coastal varietals
For cooking? Anything worth drinking with maybe the exception of really oaky Chardonnay.
Again, not that I'm the expert of all experts, but if anyone has questions or needs a good bottle recommendation for a special event, I'm your guy.
Chris
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
For cooking? Anything worth drinking with maybe the exception of really oaky Chardonnay.
Too much oak can make for some weird flavors in the dish your cooking. With strong meat dishes, it might blend in to the overall flavor profile, but it's a risk.
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
I know I've brought this up in another thread somewhere, but I am a certified sommelier.
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
Again, not that I'm the expert of all experts, but if anyone has questions or needs a good bottle recommendation for a special event, I'm your guy.
Why do you think I picked
now to start this thread? ;-)
In all seriousness, though, Chianti seems to be all over the place. I've had Chianti I loved and Chianti I hated. Any recommendations on an easily sourced Chianti for someone who doesn't like a lot of oak?
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 12:16:10 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
For cooking? Anything worth drinking with maybe the exception of really oaky Chardonnay.
Too much oak can make for some weird flavors in the dish your cooking. With strong meat dishes, it might blend in to the overall flavor profile, but it's a risk.
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
I know I've brought this up in another thread somewhere, but I am a certified sommelier.
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
Again, not that I'm the expert of all experts, but if anyone has questions or needs a good bottle recommendation for a special event, I'm your guy.
Why do you think I picked now to start this thread? ;-)
In all seriousness, though, Chianti seems to be all over the place. I've had Chianti I loved and Chianti I hated. Any recommendations on an easily sourced Chianti for someone who doesn't like a lot of oak?
Chianti is a challenging one. Basically for a long time, Italians new they could sell schlock to the rest of the world and people would drink it because Chianti sounded fancy. They also liked those cool straw covered bottles (note: most of the ones that come that way know are pretty crappy).
As far as a recommendation, I don't know exactly what's available in Wichita, but believe it or not, Santa Margherita's is not half bad. Probably my favorites that seem to be prevalent around here are Rodáno and Tenuta di Arceno. I generally go for Chianti Classico which is a region within greater Chianti. You tend to have a little more consistency from that region and the bottles are only $2-$3 more than their general "Chianti" counterparts.
Chris
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
Does Terroir Matter - 100%. I can tell the difference between Rhone Syrah, Australian Shiraz, Washington Syrah etc. Terroir includes everything from climate to soil to wind, etc.
Ah, but the questions are numerous:
Are the Syrah from the Rhône, Australia, and Washington different because the wine culture in those areas are aiming for different targets and therefore end up with different results? Or are they different because the soil and climate variations
preclude making any other style? Is it possible to make a Washington Syrah that you would mistake as being from the Rhône, or is that possibility unattainable due to the nature of the terroir itself? Does Australian Shiraz taste the way it does because that flavor profile is merely the most easily attained based on the climate of the area, or is it actually impossible to make the winemaking decisions in Australia that are necessary to produce a Washington-style Shiraz?
We do sweet wines, and fortunately in South Jersey there are numerous local wineries that have plenty of sweet wines. Not all are good, but some are fantastic.
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 12:27:17 PM
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 10, 2021, 12:09:54 PM
Does Terroir Matter - 100%. I can tell the difference between Rhone Syrah, Australian Shiraz, Washington Syrah etc. Terroir includes everything from climate to soil to wind, etc.
Ah, but the questions are numerous:
Are the Syrah from the Rhône, Australia, and Washington different because the wine culture in those areas are aiming for different targets and therefore end up with different results? Or are they different because the soil and climate variations preclude making any other style? Is it possible to make a Washington Syrah that you would mistake as being from the Rhône, or is that possibility unattainable due to the nature of the terroir itself? Does Australian Shiraz taste the way it does because that flavor profile is merely the most easily attained based on the climate of the area, or is it actually impossible to make the winemaking decisions in Australia that are necessary to produce a Washington-style Shiraz?
Well, for Australian Shiraz specifically, a lot of wine snobs say that they don't have terroir because it's so dry there that they have to irrigate. That means a) you're not getting the same kind of water (chemically) that you would otherwise and b) you're manipulating the growth more than is normally wanted.
There are definitely different winemaking styles, sure. American palates tend to like more fruit-forward wines whereas Old World wine countries tend to like more complexity. Americans like oak on their Chardonnay whereas the French don't normally use it except for Grand Cru (and some Premier Cru) plantings. I feel like you can make an Old World wine taste New World, but it's harder to do the other way around, just because New World generally has more manipulation involved.
The soil and the temperature are, to me, the two biggest variables in wine. In my opinion, you cannot likely make a Rhone style Syrah in Australia just because the grapes get ripe way too quickly. In order to maintain the acid levels of a French wine, you'd have to pick a lot earlier and then the flavor profiles wouldn't have had time to develop. If you let them develop longer, then the grape will get riper meaning more sugar and then, in turn, higher alcohol content which is not characteristic of French wines.
Washington Syrahs and Rhone Syrahs are a lot closer in flavor profile. That said, the northern Rhone (where Syrah is the dominant grape) has schist-clay soils, and Washington has silt-loam soils. Clay soils (like the Rhone) produce bolder, higher tannin reds. The sand in the silt-loam soils (Washington) produce grapes with lighter color that are more aromatic and lighter in tannin. For me, Rhones taste meaty - think Teriyaki, beef jerky, etc. Washington Syrahs tend to be more blueberry and chocolate.
Down the wine rabbit hole for sure.
Chris
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 10, 2021, 11:07:00 AM
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 10:57:54 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 10, 2021, 10:54:44 AM
I'm not old enough to drink.
Depends on the country. I had legally purchased alcohol by the time I was your age.
In what country?
Germany.
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws that allows a parent to serve alcohol to his or her own child at home, and another carve-out that allows a minor to consume alcohol as part of a religious rite. So, by the time I was your age, I had had beer and wine (and vodka and mezcal) under the supervision of my father, and I had also had wine during Communion at church.
To elaborate... The family member carve-out in alcohol laws typically also include spouses. So–assuming that's the case in Kansas, as I haven't actually looked up the laws in a while)–what that means is, when our over-21 friend married his under-21 bride, it was perfectly legal for him to pour her a glass of wine with dinner at home. But, when they both would come over to our house for dinner, I was breaking the law *gasp* by doing so.
OK, truth time. Who here buys wine based on what the label looks like?
:wave:
There's something comforting about a very traditional-looking French wine label. It's like you're being a part of an ancient culture, rather than buying something marketed toward Gen-X and Gen-Y video gamers.
On the other hand, I do appreciate some cool-looking labels.
For example, I bought this one for Epiphany earlier in the year and thought the label was kind of awesome. The wine inside also went well with rouladen, for what it's worth.
(https://raiseyourglassofwine.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/la-maldita-garnacha.jpg)
Rioja, one of the most well-known Spanish vineyard areas. I've been in that area before. However, I prefer Somontano, since that is almost local to me, being to the East (straddling the Prime Meridian).
I've developed my own wine tasting system, based solely on how it feels on the tongue, ranging from water-like to those that are like sandpaper.
Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on March 13, 2021, 04:54:43 PM
However, I prefer Somontano, since that is almost local to me, being to the East (straddling the Prime Meridian).
I've noticed this seems to be a trend on the forum. People buy wine that is somewhat local to their area. Personally, I do tend to shop by region of the world, but I find no particular affinity to wines that are produced close to where I live.
Today was stocking-up day. Usually, we have somewhere between zero and one bottle of wine in the house. On occasion, we have two or three. Now we have four, which means we're officially living the high life. (I've always said that, if I were rich, I'd eat a lot more cheese and drink a lot more wine.) So now, in addition to "chicken wine", we have the three additions below.
(https://i.imgur.com/SmJHeIH.jpg)
I've decided to look up tasting notes online, write them on a card, and tie the card to the necks of the bottles. That way, when it comes time to pick a wine for the evening, we'll actually remember what it's supposed to taste like. I think this will come especially in handy when we have company over, so they can read it too.
Quote from: kphoger on March 13, 2021, 05:10:07 PM
Today was stocking-up day. Usually, we have somewhere between zero and one bottle of wine in the house. On occasion, we have two or three. Now we have four, which means we're officially living the high life. (I've always said that, if I were rich, I'd eat a lot more cheese and drink a lot more wine.) So now, in addition to "chicken wine", we have the three additions below.
(https://i.imgur.com/SmJHeIH.jpg)
I've decided to look up tasting notes online, write them on a card, and tie the card to the necks of the bottles. That way, when it comes time to pick a wine for the evening, we'll actually remember what it's supposed to taste like. I think this will come especially in handy when we have company over, so they can read it too.
Nicely done! You a big seafood fan? Those look like they'd pair nicely.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 13, 2021, 06:21:23 PM
Quote from: kphoger on March 13, 2021, 05:10:07 PM
Today was stocking-up day. Usually, we have somewhere between zero and one bottle of wine in the house. On occasion, we have two or three. Now we have four, which means we're officially living the high life. (I've always said that, if I were rich, I'd eat a lot more cheese and drink a lot more wine.) So now, in addition to "chicken wine", we have the three additions below.
[img
I've decided to look up tasting notes online, write them on a card, and tie the card to the necks of the bottles. That way, when it comes time to pick a wine for the evening, we'll actually remember what it's supposed to taste like. I think this will come especially in handy when we have company over, so they can read it too.
Nicely done! You a big seafood fan? Those look like they'd pair nicely.
I love most all seafood–at least the "normal" stuff. Sea cucumber is like eating rubber bands, but I like most everything else. There honestly aren't very many foods I dislike, and that carries over to seafood.
My wife likes flaky fish, shrimp, that kind of standard thing–not swordfish or sardines or anything outside the norm. She just tried sushi for the first time when we were over at friends' house for the Super Bowl (the thought of raw fish had always kept her from trying it), and she liked it fine.*
One of our sons only likes tilapia, cod, tuna, and maybe salmon. No shellfish.
But, anyway, I do tend to like wine that pairs with seafood, even if it isn't seafood that I eat with it. I enjoy white wines from northern Spain and Portugal, I enjoy Graves, basically I enjoy wines from gravelly soil and/or sea-breeze-swept regions.
The Scarpetta Pinot Grigio is a safe bet for us, and I think we might even have had it once at my parents' house (brought by my sister and her husband). The Sancerre is a fairly safe bet for me, but I'm only 60% sure my wife will like it. The Côtes du Rhône was a gamble, and I'm 95% sure my wife won't like it because she doesn't like tannins. But I like to have red wine in the house, if for no other reason than having company over: some folks (my sister and her husband included) prefer red over white.
* Hmmmmm..... We've been trying to think of new date ideas lately. Going out for sushi with my wife, maybe? Ten years ago, we would have scoffed at the idea, but her tastes have changed since we met.
Quote from: kphoger on March 15, 2021, 09:43:05 AM
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 13, 2021, 06:21:23 PM
Quote from: kphoger on March 13, 2021, 05:10:07 PM
Today was stocking-up day. Usually, we have somewhere between zero and one bottle of wine in the house. On occasion, we have two or three. Now we have four, which means we're officially living the high life. (I've always said that, if I were rich, I'd eat a lot more cheese and drink a lot more wine.) So now, in addition to "chicken wine", we have the three additions below.
[img
I've decided to look up tasting notes online, write them on a card, and tie the card to the necks of the bottles. That way, when it comes time to pick a wine for the evening, we'll actually remember what it's supposed to taste like. I think this will come especially in handy when we have company over, so they can read it too.
Nicely done! You a big seafood fan? Those look like they'd pair nicely.
I love most all seafood–at least the "normal" stuff. Sea cucumber is like eating rubber bands, but I like most everything else. There honestly aren't very many foods I dislike, and that carries over to seafood.
My wife likes flaky fish, shrimp, that kind of standard thing–not swordfish or sardines or anything outside the norm. She just tried sushi for the first time when we were over at friends' house for the Super Bowl (the thought of raw fish had always kept her from trying it), and she liked it fine.*
One of our sons only likes tilapia, cod, tuna, and maybe salmon. No shellfish.
But, anyway, I do tend to like wine that pairs with seafood, even if it isn't seafood that I eat with it. I enjoy white wines from northern Spain and Portugal, I enjoy Graves, basically I enjoy wines from gravelly soil and/or sea-breeze-swept regions.
The Scarpetta Pinot Grigio is a safe bet for us, and I think we might even have had it once at my parents' house (brought by my sister and her husband). The Sancerre is a fairly safe bet for me, but I'm only 60% sure my wife will like it. The Côtes du Rhône was a gamble, and I'm 95% sure my wife won't like it because she doesn't like tannins. But I like to have red wine in the house, if for no other reason than having company over: some folks (my sister and her husband included) prefer red over white.
* Hmmmmm..... We've been trying to think of new date ideas lately. Going out for sushi with my wife, maybe? Ten years ago, we would have scoffed at the idea, but her tastes have changed since we met.
To respond to your footnote, sushi is a great date night. Our kids aren't fans, so it's pretty much our go to when we have a date night sans kids.
Not sure if you like Sake or not, but I do think it compliments sushi nicely.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 15, 2021, 10:09:43 AM
To respond to your footnote, sushi is a great date night. Our kids aren't fans, so it's pretty much our go to when we have a date night sans kids.
Not sure if you like Sake or not, but I do think it compliments sushi nicely.
Obviously sake is great, but unsung hero that no one ever does with sushi - Champagne/other sparkling. High acidity goes will with the fattiness of the fish and the bubbles also help to keep you in check if you happen to put a little too much wasabi on your bite.
Chris
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 15, 2021, 10:23:41 AM
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 15, 2021, 10:09:43 AM
To respond to your footnote, sushi is a great date night. Our kids aren't fans, so it's pretty much our go to when we have a date night sans kids.
Not sure if you like Sake or not, but I do think it compliments sushi nicely.
Obviously sake is great, but unsung hero that no one ever does with sushi - Champagne/other sparkling. High acidity goes will with the fattiness of the fish and the bubbles also help to keep you in check if you happen to put a little too much wasabi on your bite.
Chris
Oh cool. I never knew that. Ill give that a shot next time. Thanks!
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 09:37:51 AM
As for wine we keep stocked... Well, we rarely have more than one or two bottles in the house at a time, but...
La Vieille Ferme white wine
(https://cdn.vin.co/_clients_folder/perrin/perrin_la_vieille_ferme_blanc_2017_vdf_macro_jpg_19208_1024.jpg)
We call this "chicken wine" in our family because of the label. In fact, our sons know it by that name too, even though they're all too young to drink alcohol. It's not a "fancy" wine: it is simply a vin de France, which is the lowest of the three classifications of French wine. It's a class of simple table wines that are labeled by neither region nor grape varietal. This one is a blend from the Rhône valley–which I've already said is a good bet for red wines–made from like four different varietals. Only 10% of of only one of the varietals is oaked.
We cooked chicken piccata with this wine yesterday, then had the rest to drink with dinner. Always a pleaser!
I let our middle son try a sip for the first time. (Our eldest has zero interest in tasting it, and our youngest is too young for me to allow.) We've talked as a family about the dangers of alcohol but also the blessing it is in life–and that both the danger and the blessing are due to the intoxicating effect. He was therefore quite careful to take just a ti-i-i-i-i-iny sip. Then I asked him, "Was it yucky?" He answered, "No, it's kind of OK. Not as good as regular grape juice, though." :D
My family is big into wine, however that gene didn't get passed down to me. Every wine I've tried burns or tastes awful to me, including expensive bottles. I don't like most (pretty much all) alcohol though.
Quote from: Zeffy on March 26, 2021, 05:12:34 PM
My family is big into wine, however that gene didn't get passed down to me. Every wine I've tried burns or tastes awful to me, including expensive bottles. I don't like most (pretty much all) alcohol though.
I'll drink your share. :biggrin:
Actually, probably have.
Chris
Quote from: Zeffy on March 26, 2021, 05:12:34 PM
My family is big into wine, however that gene didn't get passed down to me. Every wine I've tried burns or tastes awful to me, including expensive bottles. I don't like most (pretty much all) alcohol though.
Nothing wrong with that. Alcohol does burn; one commonly described flavor component of alcoholic beverages is 'heat'. Various alcoholic drinks also have bitter, astringent, vegetal, and woody flavors–which not everyone is fond of. Out of curiosity, do you also dislike tea and coffee? Do you dislike dry toast? Pie crust?
(Also, expensive bottles of wine don't necessarily have crowd-pleasing flavors. I see little reason to stray outside the $12-35 range.)
Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 06:08:35 PM
Quote from: Zeffy on March 26, 2021, 05:12:34 PM
My family is big into wine, however that gene didn't get passed down to me. Every wine I've tried burns or tastes awful to me, including expensive bottles. I don't like most (pretty much all) alcohol though.
Nothing wrong with that. Alcohol does burn; one commonly described flavor component of alcoholic beverages is 'heat'. Various alcoholic drinks also have bitter, astringent, vegetal, and woody flavors–which not everyone is fond of. Out of curiosity, do you also dislike tea and coffee? Do you dislike dry toast? Pie crust?
(Also, expensive bottles of wine don't necessarily have crowd-pleasing flavors. I see little reason to stray outside the $12-35 range.)
I love coffee, although not black - it needs some creamer and a bit of sugar for me to tolerate it. Dry toast I don't like as much as toast with butter; pie crust is hit or miss.
Quote from: Zeffy on March 26, 2021, 05:12:34 PM
My family is big into wine, however that gene didn't get passed down to me. Every wine I've tried burns or tastes awful to me, including expensive bottles. I don't like most (pretty much all) alcohol though.
Most wines I like are under $10; local wines are $15 or less.
Anything more than that...eh.
Quote from: kphoger on March 09, 2021, 06:02:13 PM
Forgive me if this topic already exists, but I don't recall that it does.
Let's talk about wine. General preferences? Overrated labels? Crowd pleasers? Does terroir matter? Does minerality even exist?
I go through phases where I prefer sweet wines as well as ones for dry wines. Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on March 26, 2021, 07:30:38 PM
Most wines I like are under $10; local wines are $15 or less.
Anything more than that...eh.
Depends on the type of wine. Some varieties are great at the $9 price point, while others are crappy at that price point. It's really easy to find a good Pinot Grigio for under $12 bucks, though.
I always tell people that I can tell the difference between an $7 bottle of wine and a $15 bottle of wine, and the difference is often worth it. I can also usually tell the difference between a $15 bottle of wine and a $35 bottle of wine, but that the difference is so very slight, that it's usually not worth the extra money.
Quote from: jmd41280 on March 26, 2021, 07:38:36 PM
Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.
If you can find it where you are, La Vieille Ferme makes a great rosé. It's the same label as the "chicken wine" I showed earlier. I usually don't care for rosé all that much, but theirs is good.
Thanks for the suggestion on the "chicken wine." We like to make piccata, so that might be worth a try if one of the usual stores has it.
Regarding sweet red wine, Fox Meadow's Freezeland Red is a sweet red. Not as sweet as a Port.
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 26, 2021, 08:37:31 PM
Thanks for the suggestion on the "chicken wine." We like to make piccata, so that might be worth a try if one of the usual stores has it.
Regarding sweet red wine, Fox Meadow's Freezeland Red is a sweet red. Not as sweet as a Port.
I usually go with a less-fruity Pinot Gris for making Piccata. But the chicken wine was already in the fridge.
This might be met with some disagreement, but....
My wife bought a box of wine. Not Franzia (though I drank my share. In college we used to have Tour de Frnazia parties) but a Black Box Cabernet that is pretty damn good. I grilled some steaks tonight and it went nicely with em
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 26, 2021, 09:54:28 PM
This might be met with some disagreement, but....
My wife bought a box of wine. Not Franzia (though I drank my share. In college we used to have Tour de Frnazia parties) but a Black Box Cabernet that is pretty damn good. I grilled some steaks tonight and it went nicely with em
No scorn from me. I've got a Wine Cube red blend box from Target in my fridge right now. It's all right. It gets me feeling good with fewer calories than beer, and the box wasn't much more expensive than a 4-pack of local IPAs for 3 liters worth of wine.
Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 08:40:36 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 26, 2021, 08:37:31 PM
Thanks for the suggestion on the "chicken wine." We like to make piccata, so that might be worth a try if one of the usual stores has it.
Regarding sweet red wine, Fox Meadow's Freezeland Red is a sweet red. Not as sweet as a Port.
I usually go with a less-fruity Pinot Gris for making Piccata. But the chicken wine was already in the fridge.
We usually use Pinot Grigio, mostly just because we almost always have various ones on hand.
Regarding boxes of wine, it's not a boxed wine. It's cardbordeaux.
Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 08:24:21 PM
Quote from: jmd41280 on March 26, 2021, 07:38:36 PM
Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.
If you can find it where you are, La Vieille Ferme makes a great rosé. It's the same label as the "chicken wine" I showed earlier. I usually don't care for rosé all that much, but theirs is good.
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll have to keep an eye out for it.
I got a bottle of the "chicken wine" at Wegmans today for $7.99. I'll let you know how it is when we try it. We had hanger steak tonight, so we had Cabernet Sauvignon.
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws
Nope. In fact, only 29 states have a parental exemption, so it's more like a little over half.
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.
Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.
Quote
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.
Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.
Just because cheaper wines aren't bad doesn't mean more expensive wines aren't better. You can drive a Geo Metro and it'll get you there, but a BMW is a nicer ride. If you have the budget for the BMW, it wouldn't be terrible if you had to drive the Metro every once in a while, but it'd be a lot nicer to drive the BMW all the time. I drink box wine from time to time, but if I go out to get a bottle of wine for non special events, it's normally in the $20-25 range.
As far as holding the glass, by the stem directly underneath the bowl. That way you don't warm up the wine.
Chris
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 28, 2021, 10:53:35 AM
Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.
Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.
Just because cheaper wines aren't bad doesn't mean more expensive wines aren't better. You can drive a Geo Metro and it'll get you there, but a BMW is a nicer ride. If you have the budget for the BMW, it wouldn't be terrible if you had to drive the Metro every once in a while, but it'd be a lot nicer to drive the BMW all the time. I drink box wine from time to time, but if I go out to get a bottle of wine for non special events, it's normally in the $20-25 range.
As far as holding the glass, by the stem directly underneath the bowl. That way you don't warm up the wine.
But–let's be honest–there's no need to buy a Lamborghini Aventador, even if you can afford one. I agree that the $20-25 range is good one, but some varietals of similar quality can be found for half that price.
I hold the stem. I don't try and grip the bottom in any way, or else I'm going to end up spilling it all over the table at some point.
Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws
Nope. In fact, only 29 states have a parental exemption, so it's more like a little over half.
So... most? :-D
Thanks for actually looking up the numbers.
Quote from: 1995hoo on March 27, 2021, 10:08:01 PM
I got a bottle of the "chicken wine" at Wegmans today for $7.99. I'll let you know how it is when we try it. We had hanger steak tonight, so we had Cabernet Sauvignon.
I came on here to warn you that it might be too fruity for your personal taste. But, if you usually go with Pinot Grigio, then I think you'll be pleased.
Out of curiosity, what are you favorite non-local Pinot Grigio bottles?
Quote from: kphoger on March 30, 2021, 10:11:44 AM
Quote from: jayhawkco on March 28, 2021, 10:53:35 AM
Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
I think paying a lot for wine makes no sense. Cheap wine, unless it's downright bad, isn't noticeably worse than expensive wine. You're basically spending extra for the label.
Also, out of curiosity, how does everyone hold their wine glasses? It seems there are almost countless ways that people choose to cradle their drinks.
Just because cheaper wines aren't bad doesn't mean more expensive wines aren't better. You can drive a Geo Metro and it'll get you there, but a BMW is a nicer ride. If you have the budget for the BMW, it wouldn't be terrible if you had to drive the Metro every once in a while, but it'd be a lot nicer to drive the BMW all the time. I drink box wine from time to time, but if I go out to get a bottle of wine for non special events, it's normally in the $20-25 range.
As far as holding the glass, by the stem directly underneath the bowl. That way you don't warm up the wine.
But–let's be honest–there's no need to buy a Lamborghini Aventador, even if you can afford one. I agree that the $20-25 range is good one, but some varietals of similar quality can be found for half that price.
Agreed, but there are times and places for a $70-$80 bottle (Premier Cru Burgundy, Amarone, Cote-Rotie, aged Barolo, etc.). I agree re: $2,000 bottles of Chateau Petrus and stuff like that. I'd love to taste it, but I'm never buying a bottle of Domaine Romanee-Conti (the most expensive wine in the world on release). I've held and sold one, but never gotten a chance to sample. I think the most expensive bottle I've ever tasted was Penfolds Grange which new releases go for about $500 wholesale.
Chris
Thanks for the "chicken wine" suggestion. We had a bottle tonight with a chicken pasta dish my wife put together and it was quite pleasant–she said to buy it again, especially given the price.
Quote from: kphoger on March 30, 2021, 10:11:44 AM
Quote from: interstatefan990 on March 28, 2021, 01:17:10 AM
Quote from: kphoger on March 10, 2021, 11:17:26 AM
But there's also a carve-out in most (all?) states' drinking laws
Nope. In fact, only 29 states have a parental exemption, so it's more like a little over half.
So... most? :-D
Thanks for actually looking up the numbers.
"Most" would be closer to 35 or 40 states in my book. But you're welcome. :cool:
For me, the way I hold mine depends on the formality of the event (fancy schmancy, I know). Most formal = by the tippy top of the stem. Least formal = by the bowl. Least, least,
least formal = grabbing the entire stem like it's a handle.
Quote from: kphoger on March 26, 2021, 08:24:21 PM
Quote from: jmd41280 on March 26, 2021, 07:38:36 PM
Right now, I'm into sweet reds and rosés. I usually stick to the local wineries, as I have found their wines to be much better than the national brands. Western PA has quite a few good wineries.
If you can find it where you are, La Vieille Ferme makes a great rosé. It's the same label as the "chicken wine" I showed earlier. I usually don't care for rosé all that much, but theirs is good.
We had the La Vieille Ferme rosé this past Sunday night with the following. It was a very good combination. (The quote tag isn't a link because this is a post from another forum).
Quote from: 1995hoo
I made this last night with the modifications noted below it brackets. Very good. It had been a few years since I'd last made this and I think I should make it more often. This came from Bon Appetit magazine and I believe it is a Steven Raichlen recipe. I didn't bother cutting up the chicken and making kebabs; I just cooked the whole boneless chicken breasts as they were.
1½ tablespoons Aleppo pepper or 2 teaspoons dried crushed red pepper plus 2 tablespoons Hungarian sweet paprika, plus additional Aleppo pepper or paprika for sprinkling [I used the paprika option]
1 cup plain whole-milk Greek-style yogurt (8 ounces) [I used two four-ounce containers of lemon-flavored Siggi's skyr]
3 tablespoons extra-virgin olive oil
2 tablespoons red wine vinegar
2 tablespoons tomato paste [I skipped this because we didn't have any]
2 teaspoons coarse kosher salt
1 teaspoon freshly ground black pepper
6 garlic cloves, peeled, flattened
2 unpeeled lemons; 1 thinly sliced into rounds, 1 cut into wedges for serving [I skipped this in favor of using the lemon-flavored skyr]
2¼ pounds skinless boneless chicken (thighs and/or breast halves), cut into 1¼-inch cubes [we used breasts and I didn't bother cutting them up]
Flat metal skewers [I skipped skewers]
If using Aleppo pepper, place in large bowl and mix in 1 tablespoon warm water. Let stand until thick paste forms, about 5 minutes. If using dried crushed red pepper and paprika combination, place in large bowl and stir in 2 tablespoons warm water and let stand until paste forms, about 5 minutes.
Add yogurt, olive oil, red wine vinegar, tomato paste, 2 teaspoons coarse salt, and 1 teaspoon black pepper to spice mixture in bowl; whisk to blend. Stir in garlic and lemon slices, then chicken. Cover and chill at least 1 hour. (Can be made 1 day ahead. Keep chilled.)
Prepare grill (medium-high heat). Thread chicken pieces on metal skewers, dividing evenly. Discard marinade in bowl. Sprinkle each skewer with salt, pepper, and additional Aleppo pepper or paprika. Brush grill rack with oil. Grill chicken until golden brown and cooked through, turning skewers occasionally, 10 to 12 minutes total. Transfer skewers to platter. Surround with lemon wedges and serve.
My wife and I went out to Olive Garden Saturday evening for our 15th anniversary.
(Aside: You don't like Olive Garden? That isn't authentic Italian food! you say? Get over it. I had pasta with marinara sauce and meatballs. How is that not authentic Italian food? At any rate, even if you don't like Olive Garden, it's worth going there the same weekend your city's schools have prom. It's great people watching. Girls who probably shouldn't have tried to squeeze into that dress, boys who have obviously never worn a suit before, colors that do not exist in nature.)
When the waiter brought our salads out, I said to him, I forgot to ask earlier, but could you bring me a glass of Chianti?
He got this confused look on his face. Uhhh, probably, I guess so... he started.
It's on the menu, I said.
In that case, then I'm sure I can.
Not a minute later he came to the table, menu in hand, and asked me to point it out to him–which I did.
At that point, I became telepathic and could hear what the waiter was thinking: Oh, the CHAI-ant-ee! :-D
(This was the same waiter I had told earlier to bring me a mineral water. He apparently consulted with someone else, and that someone else then came to the table to inform me they don't sell mineral water, and that the closest thing they have is San Pellegrino. That's what I meant, I said. So then she went back and brought me a bottle that says 'MINERAL WATER' right there on the label. :banghead: )
OK, now, the restaurant was using a limited menu–presumably the one they've been using since restaurants reopened nearly a year ago. On that limited menu, there are like five red wines. FIVE. And one of them is called 'Red Blend'. I ordered what is arguably the most famous varietal from Italy. And he had no clue.
Maybe he was on loan from Burger King...
Quote from: kphoger on April 26, 2021, 12:55:40 PM
My wife and I went out to Olive Garden Saturday evening for our 15th anniversary.
(Aside: You don't like Olive Garden? That isn't authentic Italian food! you say? Get over it. I had pasta with marinara sauce and meatballs. How is that not authentic Italian food? At any rate, even if you don't like Olive Garden, it's worth going there the same weekend your city's schools have prom. It's great people watching. Girls who probably shouldn't have tried to squeeze into that dress, boys who have obviously never worn a suit before, colors that do not exist in nature.)
When the waiter brought our salads out, I said to him, I forgot to ask earlier, but could you bring me a glass of Chianti?
He got this confused look on his face. Uhhh, probably, I guess so... he started.
It's on the menu, I said.
In that case, then I'm sure I can.
Not a minute later he came to the table, menu in hand, and asked me to point it out to him–which I did.
At that point, I became telepathic and could hear what the waiter was thinking: Oh, the CHAI-ant-ee! :-D
(This was the same waiter I had told earlier to bring me a mineral water. He apparently consulted with someone else, and that someone else then came to the table to inform me they don't sell mineral water, and that the closest thing they have is San Pellegrino. That's what I meant, I said. So then she went back and brought me a bottle that says 'MINERAL WATER' right there on the label. :banghead: )
OK, now, the restaurant was using a limited menu–presumably the one they've been using since restaurants reopened nearly a year ago. On that limited menu, there are like five red wines. FIVE. And one of them is called 'Red Blend'. I ordered what is arguably the most famous varietal from Italy. And he had no clue.
Maybe he was on loan from Burger King...
Happy anniversary to you and the Mrs! Sorry to hear it wasn't that great of an experience, but you got a laugh out of me on a Monday morning.
Been there before.....I usually am a generous tipper but "service" like that greatly draws down my generosity.
I still tipped pretty well, because he was very friendly and attentive. That made up for the obvious newbie gaffes.
Quote from: kphoger on April 26, 2021, 12:55:40 PM
(Aside: You don't like Olive Garden? That isn't authentic Italian food! you say? Get over it. I had pasta with marinara sauce and meatballs. How is that not authentic Italian food? At any rate, even if you don't like Olive Garden, it's worth going there the same weekend your city's schools have prom. It's great people watching. Girls who probably shouldn't have tried to squeeze into that dress, boys who have obviously never worn a suit before, colors that do not exist in nature.)
I like Olive Garden all right but Norman has an independent Italian restaurant that is a little bit better for about the same price, so I usually vote for that whenever we're making dinner arrangements and Italian is a possibility. We have a friend who joins us sometimes and I tend to get outvoted whenever she's around, though.
As for the rest of your experience, it sounds like your waiter may have been frazzled by all of hubbub of the prom date couples, such that he just wasn't in the frame of mind to handle the more refined taste of the old folks celebrating their anniversary! :P
I thought I had posted this, but apparently not...
Because my wife only likes to have a small amount of wine with any meal, and because she doesn't like any red wine at all, I've long been hesitant to open a bottle. If it's for cooking with, then it usually only calls for a cup or so, and then there's enough left in the bottle after dinner that it starts to go "off" before I can finish it. (I'm pretty sensitive to the "off" flavors that wine gets when left over, even with a vacuum pump.) So my general rule has been to only open a bottle if I can reasonably expect to finish it that day or the next. Otherwise, I've felt it was a waste of perfectly good wine.
Recently, however, I tried something out. After dinner, I poured whatever was left in the bottle into an ice cube tray. Because of the alcohol content, they came out a little slushy, but still solid enough to put in a gallon-size Ziploc bag in the deep-freeze. It's no good for drinking after that, of course, but it's perfectly suitable for cooking with. I find myself reaching for that Ziploc bag all the time now when cooking, to plop a couple of "wine cubes" into the pan. Great for deglazing, or for adding flavor to grains as they boil. I'd already been regularly making my own vegetable stock and storing it in the deep-freeze, but this is great to have on hand too.
Quote from: kphoger on October 24, 2023, 02:13:29 PM
I thought I had posted this, but apparently not...
Because my wife only likes to have a small amount of wine with any meal, and because she doesn't like any red wine at all, I've long been hesitant to open a bottle. If it's for cooking with, then it usually only calls for a cup or so, and then there's enough left in the bottle after dinner that it starts to go "off" before I can finish it. (I'm pretty sensitive to the "off" flavors that wine gets when left over, even with a vacuum pump.) So my general rule has been to only open a bottle if I can reasonably expect to finish it that day or the next. Otherwise, I've felt it was a waste of perfectly good wine.
Recently, however, I tried something out. After dinner, I poured whatever was left in the bottle into an ice cube tray. Because of the alcohol content, they came out a little slushy, but still solid enough to put in a gallon-size Ziploc bag in the deep-freeze. It's no good for drinking after that, of course, but it's perfectly suitable for cooking with. I find myself reaching for that Ziploc bag all the time now when cooking, to plop a couple of "wine cubes" into the pan. Great for deglazing, or for adding flavor to grains as they boil. I'd already been regularly making my own vegetable stock and storing it in the deep-freeze, but this is great to have on hand too.
Just seems to me that you just have to drink 3.5 glasses of wine when you open a bottle.
Despite the fact that I'm a certified sommelier, I still almost always keep a box of white wine in the fridge for cooking/drinking a random glass.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 25, 2023, 11:04:41 AM
Just seems to me that you just have to drink 3.5 glasses of wine when you open a bottle.
I know your tongue was halfway in your cheek as you typed that, but... Three glasses is pushing it for me, and requires me to spread them out over a couple of hours. Even then, I can't have anywhere to go that evening.
Quote from: kphoger on October 25, 2023, 11:08:55 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 25, 2023, 11:04:41 AM
Just seems to me that you just have to drink 3.5 glasses of wine when you open a bottle.
I know your tongue was halfway in your cheek as you typed that, but... Three glasses is pushing it for me, and requires me to spread them out over a couple of hours. Even then, I can't have anywhere to go that evening.
Alas, my tolerance is such that 3 glasses is not an unreasonable amount for me in a couple hour span. A lifetime of being in the restaurant biz I guess.
I absolutely love wine. I'm studying to take the level one sommelier exam right now.
I used to drink a lot of red but for at least two or three years now, I have a very heavy preference for whites and sparkling. And port and Sauternes.
I generally tend to prefer Old World—Spanish and French, but I'll not turn down South Africa or South America. Not a huge fan of California—too well represented.
I love white burgundy, Sancerre, Vermentino, gruner veltliner, oh and dry German Riesling. And Albariño.
Cava and champagne for sparkling.
Quote from: achilles765 on October 26, 2023, 04:13:36 AM
I absolutely love wine. I'm studying to take the level one sommelier exam right now.
I used to drink a lot of red but for at least two or three years now, I have a very heavy preference for whites and sparkling. And port and Sauternes.
I generally tend to prefer Old World—Spanish and French, but I'll not turn down South Africa or South America. Not a huge fan of California—too well represented.
I love white burgundy, Sancerre, Vermentino, gruner veltliner, oh and dry German Riesling. And Albariño.
Cava and champagne for sparkling.
For white wines in general, I'm not sure I've had a bad one from the Willamette Valley of Oregon.
Quote from: achilles765 on October 26, 2023, 04:13:36 AM
I absolutely love wine. I'm studying to take the level one sommelier exam right now.
I used to drink a lot of red but for at least two or three years now, I have a very heavy preference for whites and sparkling. And port and Sauternes.
I generally tend to prefer Old World—Spanish and French, but I'll not turn down South Africa or South America. Not a huge fan of California—too well represented.
I love white burgundy, Sancerre, Vermentino, gruner veltliner, oh and dry German Riesling. And Albariño.
Cava and champagne for sparkling.
My issue with California wines isn't the representation. It's that they're generally too heavy handed. Too much oak on their Chardonnay. Too much extraction on their reds. Santa Barbara is really the only region I really enjoy from CA.
I'm a bit fan of all of the selections you name above except for Gruner. Not sure what it is, but I have never tasted one that excited me, and I've probably tasted near 100 in my lifetime. It's too Pinot Grigio boring for me. If you like all of those whites, you should try to track down an Assyrtiko, a Greek white with a lot of saline character.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:19:58 AM
It's too Pinot Grigio boring for me.
Hey! I love pinot grigio/gris!
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 11:31:05 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:19:58 AM
It's too Pinot Grigio boring for me.
Hey! I love pinot grigio/gris!
The only ones I tend to find interesting at all have a touch of bottle aging. Otherwise PG, to me, is the generic definition of white wine -- a bottle that's fine for $9-10, but anything more than that I could find something dramatically more interesting.
There are a couple wineries in the Traverse City area that produce cherry/grape blends. Always get a couple bottles every time I'm up that way.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:33:28 AM
The only ones I tend to find interesting at all have a touch of bottle aging. Otherwise PG, to me, is the generic definition of white wine -- a bottle that's fine for $9-10, but anything more than that I could find something dramatically more interesting.
A lot of times, I have "not dramatically interesting" in mind when shopping for white wine, because it's primarily for cooking with and I try to avoid any strange flavors getting concentrated in what's probably a light dish.
If I want something more interesting, then I often have good luck with the north coast of Spain.
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 11:51:15 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:33:28 AM
The only ones I tend to find interesting at all have a touch of bottle aging. Otherwise PG, to me, is the generic definition of white wine -- a bottle that's fine for $9-10, but anything more than that I could find something dramatically more interesting.
A lot of times, I have "not dramatically interesting" in mind when shopping for white wine, because it's primarily for cooking with and I try to avoid any strange flavors getting concentrated in what's probably a light dish.
If I want something more interesting, then I often have good luck with the north coast of Spain.
To be honest, I've cooked with a lot of different white wines over the years and can't remember ever tasting a difference between varietals. Even super oaky Chardonnays don't come through any different than something light and bright. I guess something super flabby and overripe with no acid left whatsoever, but I don't buy stuff like that.
I do love northern Spanish whites. If you can track a Txakolina down (from the Basque region), they're delightful. They also make great rosé. Ameztoi is my favorite producer.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 12:16:15 PM
If you can track a Txakolina down (from the Basque region), they're delightful.
Pretty sure I've had one. When I get home later, I'll sift through my notes.
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 12:18:48 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 12:16:15 PM
If you can track a Txakolina down (from the Basque region), they're delightful.
Pretty sure I've had one. When I get home later, I'll sift through my notes.
Yep. I've had the 2020 vintage of this:
(https://www.wine.com/product/images/c_fit,q_auto:good,fl_progressive/dho6tez9diy8wd7hkhqk.jpg)
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 06:05:41 PM
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 12:18:48 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 12:16:15 PM
If you can track a Txakolina down (from the Basque region), they're delightful.
Pretty sure I've had one. When I get home later, I'll sift through my notes.
Yep. I've had the 2020 vintage of this:
Unfamiliar with the producer, but I'm sure it was pretty tasty. I've never had a bad one.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:19:58 AM
Quote from: achilles765 on October 26, 2023, 04:13:36 AM
I absolutely love wine. I'm studying to take the level one sommelier exam right now.
I used to drink a lot of red but for at least two or three years now, I have a very heavy preference for whites and sparkling. And port and Sauternes.
I generally tend to prefer Old World—Spanish and French, but I'll not turn down South Africa or South America. Not a huge fan of California—too well represented.
I love white burgundy, Sancerre, Vermentino, gruner veltliner, oh and dry German Riesling. And Albariño.
Cava and champagne for sparkling.
My issue with California wines isn't the representation. It's that they're generally too heavy handed. Too much oak on their Chardonnay. Too much extraction on their reds. Santa Barbara is really the only region I really enjoy from CA.
I'm a bit fan of all of the selections you name above except for Gruner. Not sure what it is, but I have never tasted one that excited me, and I've probably tasted near 100 in my lifetime. It's too Pinot Grigio boring for me. If you like all of those whites, you should try to track down an Assyrtiko, a Greek white with a lot of saline character.
I actually have had a couple of Assyrtiko before. I did like it. Very interesting.
I also don't care for Pinot Grigio.
I used to think I didn't like Chardonnay. But then I realized that many of my favorite wines are actually Chardonnay—Chablis, champagne, white burgundy. So I realized it's that I don't like CALIFORNIA Chardonnay. Too much oak and often too buttery.
Quote from: achilles765 on October 27, 2023, 02:05:52 AM
I used to think I didn't like Chardonnay. But then I realized that many of my favorite wines are actually Chardonnay—Chablis, champagne, white burgundy. So I realized it's that I don't like CALIFORNIA Chardonnay. Too much oak and often too buttery.
Oak and buttery tend to go together, don't they? I like unoaked California Chardonnay just fine. But y'all would probably find it too boring...
Quote from: kphoger on October 27, 2023, 11:17:06 AM
Quote from: achilles765 on October 27, 2023, 02:05:52 AM
I used to think I didn't like Chardonnay. But then I realized that many of my favorite wines are actually Chardonnay—Chablis, champagne, white burgundy. So I realized it's that I don't like CALIFORNIA Chardonnay. Too much oak and often too buttery.
Oak and buttery tend to go together, don't they? I like unoaked California Chardonnay just fine. But y'all would probably find it too boring...
It probably accentuates it, but no, not inherently. Oaky flavors come from vanillin, a compound that comes from the wood. Butteriness comes from diacetyl, a compound that is created during a secondary fermentation called malolactic fermentation, which converts malic acid (think apples) to lactic acid (think milk). A wine doesn't have to be aged in barrel after having gone through malolactic.
I like unoaked California Chardonnay just fine; I wish more would make it in this Chablis style. I also like oaked Santa Barbara Chardonnays from good producers (Sandhi is my favorite) because they don't go heavy handed on the barrels' char. Santa Barbara, despite being the southernmost of California's wine regions, is also the coolest, so their wines tend to have brighter acidity to balance out the oak/butter.
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 11:00:22 AM
For white wines in general, I'm not sure I've had a bad one from the Willamette Valley of Oregon.
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 11:31:05 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:19:58 AM
It's too Pinot Grigio boring for me.
Hey! I love pinot grigio/gris!
Oh, hey, look what I found in the basement, just waiting to be had with dinner on Monday...
(https://i.imgur.com/6tWAEbf.jpg)
Quote from: kphoger on November 01, 2023, 02:52:10 PM
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 11:00:22 AM
For white wines in general, I'm not sure I've had a bad one from the Willamette Valley of Oregon.
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 11:31:05 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 11:19:58 AM
It's too Pinot Grigio boring for me.
Hey! I love pinot grigio/gris!
Oh, hey, look what I found in the basement, just waiting to be had with dinner on Monday...
(https://i.imgur.com/6tWAEbf.jpg)
I'm sure it'll be absolutely fine. :)
I meant day before yesterday, not next week. Yes, it was good for both cooking and drinking. The rest is now in an ice cube tray in the freezer (hey, I should empty that into a freezer bag).
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 07:22:16 PM
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 06:05:41 PM
Quote from: kphoger on October 26, 2023, 12:18:48 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on October 26, 2023, 12:16:15 PM
If you can track a Txakolina down (from the Basque region), they're delightful.
Pretty sure I've had one. When I get home later, I'll sift through my notes.
Yep. I've had the 2020 vintage of this:
Unfamiliar with the producer, but I'm sure it was pretty tasty. I've never had a bad one.
Just recently, a Total Wine & More opened up on the northeast side of Wichita. It felt like cheating on my usual liquor store, but I went up there to check it out. One thing I specifically wanted to see was their Txakoli(na) selection. They had a total of one option.
For our family Epiphany dinner this year, on Saturday, I went back to my regular liquor store and picked up a bottle of Asko Txakloli 2022, from the Basque Country. It's 80% Hondarrabi Zurri and 20% Petit Courbu. Very crisp and fruity, just what my wife and I like, with a faint grassy note at the end. Quite refreshing and easy to drink. The little bit that remained after dinner is now in my freezer in cube form.
Otherwise . . .
For simmering the
rouladen (along with beef broth and Worcestershire sauce and carrots and celery and bay leaves and thyme), I picked up a good old Côtes du Rhône blend—Grenache and Syrah. This one was a 2021 Réserve from Cellier des Dauphins, which is nothing special but perfect for cooking. Nothing left of that one: the whole bottle went into the electric skillet.
Along with the Txakoli, I also picked up a Malbec from Mendoza, Argentina, to have with dinner. This one was a 2020 from Matias Ricitelli under the label "Hey Malbec!". It was even better than expected, primarily because it was actually less dry than the bottom of the three wise men's sandals. Boy oh boy, is it a dark color! Like, purple. What I couldn't fit in an ice cube tray (I'm the only one in the family who likes any red wine) after dinner is still waiting for me, vacuum-pumped, on the kitchen counter. I look forward to having it this evening.
All sounds good to me! Recently had some friends over and did Thai food. Started with a Crèmant de Loire Rosé that was really good bang for the buck. Then moved onto a Vin d'Alsace that was a Gewurztraminer, Riesling, and Pinot Blanc blend, but sadly mostly the latter which left it pretty one note. Finished up with a demi-sec Vouvray that was lovely. All $22 or less.
Quote from: kphoger on January 08, 2024, 02:26:39 PM
I also picked up a Malbec from Mendoza, Argentina, to have with dinner. This one was a 2020 from Matias Ricitelli under the label "Hey Malbec!". It was even better than expected, primarily because it was actually less dry than the bottom of the three wise men's sandals. Boy oh boy, is it a dark color! Like, purple. What I couldn't fit in an ice cube tray (I'm the only one in the family who likes any red wine) after dinner is still waiting for me, vacuum-pumped, on the kitchen counter. I look forward to having it this evening.
Finished off the bottle yesterday evening. One glass with dinner, a second glass on its own while taking down Christmas decorations. I'd never have thought of enjoying a Malbec on its own, but this one definitely pleased.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on January 08, 2024, 11:01:12 PM
All sounds good to me! Recently had some friends over and did Thai food. Started with a Crèmant de Loire Rosé that was really good bang for the buck. Then moved onto a Vin d'Alsace that was a Gewurztraminer, Riesling, and Pinot Blanc blend, but sadly mostly the latter which left it pretty one note. Finished up with a demi-sec Vouvray that was lovely. All $22 or less.
I've only found one or two rosé wines that I like. Usually, they taste too much like wine that was opened two days earlier.
It's been a long time since I've bought a Gewürtz. I used to buy it a lot back in the day, back before I knew much of anything about wine other than that I liked Riesling. These days, I steer toward something a little less sweet.
Ooh, a demi-sec Vouvray sounds good. I find a lot of Vouvray wines to be a little to oily for my liking, so I imagine a demi-sec would be more enjoyable.
Quote from: kphoger on January 09, 2024, 12:42:58 PM
Quote from: kphoger on January 08, 2024, 02:26:39 PM
I also picked up a Malbec from Mendoza, Argentina, to have with dinner. This one was a 2020 from Matias Ricitelli under the label "Hey Malbec!". It was even better than expected, primarily because it was actually less dry than the bottom of the three wise men's sandals. Boy oh boy, is it a dark color! Like, purple. What I couldn't fit in an ice cube tray (I'm the only one in the family who likes any red wine) after dinner is still waiting for me, vacuum-pumped, on the kitchen counter. I look forward to having it this evening.
Finished off the bottle yesterday evening. One glass with dinner, a second glass on its own while taking down Christmas decorations. I'd never have thought of enjoying a Malbec on its own, but this one definitely pleased.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on January 08, 2024, 11:01:12 PM
All sounds good to me! Recently had some friends over and did Thai food. Started with a Crèmant de Loire Rosé that was really good bang for the buck. Then moved onto a Vin d'Alsace that was a Gewurztraminer, Riesling, and Pinot Blanc blend, but sadly mostly the latter which left it pretty one note. Finished up with a demi-sec Vouvray that was lovely. All $22 or less.
I've only found one or two rosé wines that I like. Usually, they taste too much like wine that was opened two days earlier.
It's been a long time since I've bought a Gewürtz. I used to buy it a lot back in the day, back before I knew much of anything about wine other than that I liked Riesling. These days, I steer toward something a little less sweet.
Ooh, a demi-sec Vouvray sounds good. I find a lot of Vouvray wines to be a little to oily for my liking, so I imagine a demi-sec would be more enjoyable.
The explosion of popularity of Rosé has definitely contributed to having a lot of crappy stuff in the market. If you happen to find Planeta, it's a Sicilian rosé from Nero d'Avola and Nerello Mascalese that should be something like $12-15 in a liquor store. Every vintage I've ever had has been good.
I don't love Gewurz on its own. Too flowery.
The demi-sec was more of a way to calm down the spice in the Thai food. Sugar kills heat. It was fine, but I tend to like my Chenin Blanc to smell like snuggle sheets, and this one was a little bit less of that fresh laundry smell that I like.