I-95/Penna Turnpike Interchange

[cpzilliacus]

Something is going on in the next week or two on I-95 North in the interchange area.  Saw a VMS yesterday warning the road will be closed overnight for several nights in a row between PA 413 and US 1 Business.

Hanging steel bridge stringers perhaps?

[roadman65]

I'm surprised they're not including control cities on the new pullthrus. I know that 295 often omits them in general, but this is a chance to fix that.

You think that Philly would be used like on US 1.  Or even include that I-295 S Bound (N Bound) connects eventually to I-95 S Bound.

As far as omitting them on this route, down in Camden Countythey do have them using both the Del. Mem. Br. and Delaware from as far north as Cherry Hill.  Then on the I-295/ US 130 combo going NB they use Westville and Camden in Gloucester County.  Yes up here in Mercer and most of Burlington they are omitted on the pull through signs in favor of a small green shield only panel.

[bzakharin]

I don't think anyone mentioned, but apparently, I-195 will have some exits renumbered as well. Exits 60A and 60B will become 1A and 1B respectively. The existing 1A and 1B will become 1C and 1D. Not sure why this is part of the current renumbering, nor why they're doing it at all. I mean sure it was strange to use 295's exit numbers there, but changing them now will just lead to more confusion.

[jeffandnicole]

I don't think anyone mentioned, but apparently, I-195 will have some exits renumbered as well. Exits 60A and 60B will become 1A and 1B respectively. The existing 1A and 1B will become 1C and 1D. Not sure why this is part of the current renumbering, nor why they're doing it at all. I mean sure it was strange to use 295's exit numbers there, but changing them now will just lead to more confusion.

I know it was mentioned at some point somewhere, because I mentioned all they really needed to do was remove the "6" from 60 and you would have Exits 0A & 0B!

I think it's a smart move, and it does appear this acknowledges the mistake or stupidity when they gave the 295 ramps from Rt. 29/I-195 an Exit 60 at this location.

[akotchi]

^^ There are some I-295 guide signs on this section of I-195 that still have 95 shields on them (I-195 Exit "60B") -- "I-295 North to U.S. 1/I-95" is the message in question.  While they are there (I guess), that exit renumbering is being done while the BGS' are changed to ones without I-95 shields.

Agreed that this exit renumbering should be done anyway.

[storm2k]

I don't think anyone mentioned, but apparently, I-195 will have some exits renumbered as well. Exits 60A and 60B will become 1A and 1B respectively. The existing 1A and 1B will become 1C and 1D. Not sure why this is part of the current renumbering, nor why they're doing it at all. I mean sure it was strange to use 295's exit numbers there, but changing them now will just lead to more confusion.

So they're numbering them as they should have been numbered when that segment of highway was completed 20 something years ago? Dilly dilly!

[Roadwarriors79]

I don't think anyone mentioned, but apparently, I-195 will have some exits renumbered as well. Exits 60A and 60B will become 1A and 1B respectively. The existing 1A and 1B will become 1C and 1D. Not sure why this is part of the current renumbering, nor why they're doing it at all. I mean sure it was strange to use 295's exit numbers there, but changing them now will just lead to more confusion.

I have seen something like this along I-80 in Nebraska. I-76, I-180, I-680 and I-480 all end at I-80, and use the exit numbers based on the I-80 mileposts at their ends.

[bzakharin]

I personally think not having an exit number there would have made the most sense. Treat it as an exit off of NJ 29 which doesn't use numbers. Like the exit for the NJ Turnpike from I-287. Of course they couldn't do that after the fact (Exit nothing formerly exit 60?). The second most logical, and still doable would have been Exit 0. For whatever reason NJ doesn't like those (GSP excluded). But now that it's exit 60, why change it now? MM 60 on 295 is still there. 195 is not being changed. There will be confusion which is completely avoidable.

[AMLNet49]

I personally think not having an exit number there would have made the most sense. Treat it as an exit off of NJ 29 which doesn't use numbers. Like the exit for the NJ Turnpike from I-287. Of course they couldn't do that after the fact (Exit nothing formerly exit 60?). The second most logical, and still doable would have been Exit 0. For whatever reason NJ doesn't like those (GSP excluded). But now that it's exit 60, why change it now? MM 60 on 295 is still there. 195 is not being changed. There will be confusion which is completely avoidable.

Ugh unnumbered exits at the end of roads bother me. It's like imagine there were a hundred steps leading to a pot of gold. Every step has a number on it. At the top, I wouldn't want it to just be a pot of gold. I want it to be a pot of gold on top of an inscribed #100.

[vdeane]

I'm the opposite: I find numbered exits at the ends of roads to be weird.  I can count on one hand the number of highways that have numbered termini in NY (excluding stub endings and the "exits 1 - X" and "exits Y - 61" signs at some Thruway exits).  Unnumbered termini certainly solves the alphabet soup problem for the beginnings of mile-based roads.

[bzakharin]

I personally think not having an exit number there would have made the most sense. Treat it as an exit off of NJ 29 which doesn't use numbers. Like the exit for the NJ Turnpike from I-287. Of course they couldn't do that after the fact (Exit nothing formerly exit 60?). The second most logical, and still doable would have been Exit 0. For whatever reason NJ doesn't like those (GSP excluded). But now that it's exit 60, why change it now? MM 60 on 295 is still there. 195 is not being changed. There will be confusion which is completely avoidable.

Ugh unnumbered exits at the end of roads bother me. It’s like imagine there were a hundred steps leading to a pot of gold. Every step has a number on it. At the top, I wouldn’t want it to just be a pot of gold. I want it to be a pot of gold on top of an inscribed #100.

This isn't just the end of a road. It continues as NJ 29 which doesn't use exit numbers. Therefore, not numbering this exit makes sense because it can be considered as an exit from NJ 29. If NJ 29 were to use exit numbers this wouldn't work. Same with I-287 whose exit for the NJ Turnpike is unnumbered because it transitions into NJ 440 near there, and NJ 440 doesn't number its exits.

I'm the opposite: I find numbered exits at the ends of roads to be weird.  I can count on one hand the number of highways that have numbered termini in NY (excluding stub endings and the "exits 1 - X" and "exits Y - 61" signs at some Thruway exits).  Unnumbered termini certainly solves the alphabet soup problem for the beginnings of mile-based roads.

I agree. I don't think a true terminus has any business having an exit number. The NJ Turnpike's exit 1 is a prime example. Where's the exit?

[PHLBOS]

The NJ Turnpike's exit 1 is a prime example. Where's the exit?

The mainline south toll plaza, just east of where US 40 and I-295 come in. 

Although the toll ticket (see below) lists such as the Delaware Memorial Bridge.

Vintage toll ticket from Alpsroads.net

[cl94]

Beat me to the punch. On ticket systems, exit numbers are mainly toll plaza identifiers. Similar to how Exit 15 is NYSTA's designation for the mainline plaza at Exit 16 and Exit 19 was the Mass Pike designation for the mainline plaza at Exits 18/20 (which are the same exit, but the different numbers were for accounting purporses).

[jeffandnicole]

The NJ Turnpike's exit 1 is a prime example. Where's the exit?

The mainline south toll plaza, just east of where US 40 and I-295 come in. 

Although the toll ticket (see below) lists such as the Delaware Memorial Bridge.

Vintage toll ticket from Alpsroads.net

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1. 

[PHLBOS]

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1.

Technically, it's "Toll Plaza" 1.  There's no interchange at that plaza.

[BrianP]

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1.

Exit and interchange are partially interchangeable.  An interchange is where you can exit and/or enter a highway.  At interchange 1 you can exit the highway southbound.  Or in this case, exit the turnpike system since the highway continues.  And you can enter the turnpike system northbound. 

[jp the roadgeek]

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1.

Technically, it's "Toll Plaza" 1.  There's no interchange at that plaza.

It's the same on I-95 in CT as a holdover from the Connecticut Turnpike days, where Exit 1 was implied to be the former toll plaza.  No change was ever made once tolls were eliminated (hopefully, we do not have to add the word "originally" before eliminated, but I digress).  Under a mileage based system, Exit 2 becomes Exit 1, and Exits 3 and 4 (the second and third exits) remain as is. 

Speaking of CT, there is no consistency as to whether the exits at the termini of highways are numbered.  The southern ends of US 7, CT 8/25, I-91, CT 9, and I-395 at I-95 are not numbered, as are the eastern ends of I-291 and CT 72, and the west end of I-384.  However, the western end of I-291 (1 for CT 218; 2A for I-91 South, and 2B for I-91 North), I-691 (Exits 1-2 for I-84; technically, the eastern terminus exits are, but the mainline continues as CT 66), CT 9 (Exits 31-32 for I-84), and the Milford Connector (1 A-B for US 1, 3 A-B for CT 15) are.  Any instance of where an expressway portion ends is not numbered (western terminus and east end of CT 2, all ends of US 7, north end of CT 25, west end of CT 72, east end of CT 66, east end of CT 2A, eastern terminus of I-384), nor are mainline splits (8/25) or one mainline joining another (CT 2A westbound ramps to I-395).

[AMLNet49]

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1.

Technically, it's "Toll Plaza" 1.  There's no interchange at that plaza.

In popular usage do people assume the Penns Grove exit SB and US 40 NB are Exit 1? Seems like most people would have no idea about the toll plaza being exit 1. I suppose it's possible they could assume 295 Exit 1 is NJTP Exit 1 as well, and then I don't know what they'd call the Penns/US 40 exits

[cl94]

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1.

Technically, it's "Toll Plaza" 1.  There's no interchange at that plaza.

In popular usage do people assume the Penns Grove exit SB and US 40 NB are Exit 1? Seems like most people would have no idea about the toll plaza being exit 1. I suppose it's possible they could assume 295 Exit 1 is NJTP Exit 1 as well, and then I don't know what they'd call the Penns/US 40 exits

I've always heard that US 130/NJ 49 are Exit 1 (I-295, as signed), US 40 is "Route 40".

[PHLBOS]

Also note: the ticket never says 'Exit'.  It says "Interchange".  Thus, where is Exit 1?  There is no Exit 1.  It's Interchange 1.

Technically, it's "Toll Plaza" 1.  There's no interchange at that plaza.

In popular usage do people assume the Penns Grove exit SB and US 40 NB are Exit 1? Seems like most people would have no idea about the toll plaza being exit 1. I suppose it's possible they could assume 295 Exit 1 is NJTP Exit 1 as well, and then I don't know what they'd call the Penns/US 40 exits

I've always heard that US 130/NJ 49 are Exit 1 (I-295, as signed), US 40 is "Route 40".

Given that those exit ramps are after the mainline toll plaza (while heading southbound); most motorists, E-Z Pass or no E-Z Pass (incorrectly) assume that they are no longer on the NJ Turnpike (System) once they pass through that plaza.

[SignBridge]

I doubt that most drivers ever think about this at all.  (LOL) Mostly only us roadgeeks would ever seriously wonder about these technicalities.

For example: a friend of mine who is a somewhat technically oriented guy, was totally surprised when I pointed out that the NJT used a different configuration to their exit sign system than the MUTCD standard system. He had driven the road hundreds of times and never noticed the difference. But interestingly, he had noticed that the broken white lane lines were longer and wider on the NJT than other interstates.

[roadman65]

The old Rand McNally maps when they used to list the toll roads in a box with its interchanges followed by the route it connects to in italic mentioned Exit 1 for the Delaware Memorial Bridge connecting to Route 49.

With this said, NJDOT considers NJ 49 to be Exit 1A for I-295 but we all know that the NJ Turnpike has its zero milemarker at that interchange too, so technically the NJ 49 ramp going SB is on the turnpike proper.  So it could, in once way of looking at it, as actual Exit 1.  However, it refers to the toll plaza as far as the tolling system goes.

Like in NY on the Thruway, its Exit 15 for the Woodbury Toll Plaza even though several miles south the exit for I-287 S Bound and for NJ Route 17 is signed Exit 15.  Two exits here but the number used differently for two places for two separate purposes.  Exit 15, the actual interchange is for the sequential numbering of all exit ramps, while the number given to the Woodbury Plaza is for accounting purposes on the ticket system as to use Exit number 16 for it would be redundant to the ramp to NY 17 & Future I-86 as it has the Harriman Toll Plaza that SB does collect a toll as well on the same ticket based system.

[hubcity]

I've always heard that US 130/NJ 49 are Exit 1 (I-295, as signed), US 40 is "Route 40".

I'd say that the US 40 exit from the northbound Turnpike, and the NJ 140/CR540 exit from the southbound Turnpike, in deference to their positions on US 40, should be numbered 1D.

I'll get my coat.

[jeffandnicole]

At the 49/130 interchange, it's Exit 1 Southbound, as there's only one exit at the interchange for Rt. 49 South.  On the Northbound side, it's Exit 1A (Rt. 49 South) and Exit 1B (Rt. 130 North).

While it's very clear who's jurisdiction is what on the Northbound side, it's not so clear cut on the Southbound side.  The Turnpike lined it with their unique 25' stripes between where 295 and the NJ Tpk meet and 49/130.  However, NJDOT has their Blue Food service sign here as well.  When I worked the NJDOT yard responsible for plowing down here, our jurisdiction included this stretch of highway.

And when it comes to snow plowing the ramps there, the DRBA gets Exit 1B (Rt. 130 North) and the exit from 49 North to 295 South.  NJDOT plows 295 South to 49 South, 295 North to 49 South, and 49 North to 295 North.   The Turnpike isn't responsible for any of those specific ramps.

[roadman65]

I've always heard that US 130/NJ 49 are Exit 1 (I-295, as signed), US 40 is "Route 40".

I'd say that the US 40 exit from the northbound Turnpike, and the NJ 140/CR540 exit from the southbound Turnpike, in deference to their positions on US 40, should be numbered 1D.

I'll get my coat.

It should be Exit 1C, but I know where you are coming from as Hook Road has 1C on 295 so even though two different roads you bring into the fact that two exits with the same exact number nearby can cause confusion.