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I-81 in Virginia

Started by cpzilliacus, July 26, 2018, 03:41:20 PM

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sprjus4

Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:45:33 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 05:07:02 PM
Virginia State Police love enforcement and police trapping. Same with certain localities. You'll find them on any interstate really. I-95 from the state line to Stony Creek is a hot spot for both state and local police and same with I-295 around Hopewell, that stretch being enforced by Hopewell's police department, not State Police. I take I-295 often, I never once have not seen them hiding out in the median.

Horseballs.  I drive those highways frequently and 9 times out of 10 I don't see a single stopped police car.
Call it what you want, a lot of people would disagree with you.

Hard to deny the f-a-c-ts.


Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 06:45:20 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:41:04 PM
The fact that you can't just set your cruise control to 79 mph makes you dislike driving in a state?  How fast do you want to go anyway ... 90+?
82 - 83 MPH is the ideal speed for most. Pull them over for speeding sure, but no need for a reckless driving charge. Anything above 85 MPH on the other hand is reckless, and I 100% agree a reckless driving charge is warranted for that.
But that's illegal in Virginia, and you can't use a radar detector to identify where police traps are.

... to break the law.  "82 - 83 MPH is NOT the ideal speed for most", that is exaggerated.

I don't understand why 80 is "bad" and 85 is "peachy".
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 06:46:32 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:45:33 PM
I drive those highways frequently and 9 times out of 10 I don't see a single stopped police car.
Call it what you want, a lot of people would disagree with you.
Hard to deny the f-a-c-ts.

Internet warriors who never post that they were doing 15 or 20 or more over the speed limit.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

roadman65

Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:45:33 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 05:07:02 PM
Virginia State Police love enforcement and police trapping. Same with certain localities. You'll find them on any interstate really. I-95 from the state line to Stony Creek is a hot spot for both state and local police and same with I-295 around Hopewell, that stretch being enforced by Hopewell's police department, not State Police. I take I-295 often, I never once have not seen them hiding out in the median.

Horseballs.  I drive those highways frequently and 9 times out of 10 I don't see a single stopped police car.
Sherman Potter?

Well not quite, I think it was Horsehockey!  But, reminds me of an episode of Mash.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

sprjus4

Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:48:03 PM
"82 - 83 MPH is NOT the ideal speed for most", that is exaggerated.
Then why when I go on 3,000 miles of interstate driving, traffic is usually moving at 79 - 83 MPH?

Occasionally you get the right lane 70 MPH driver, you pass the 65 - 70 MPH trucks, but most cars are maintaining 79 - 83 MPH.

Then the few crazy ones doing 90+ MPH.

The fact is that indeed the average driver is doing about 79 - 83 MPH.

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 06:50:42 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:48:03 PM
"82 - 83 MPH is NOT the ideal speed for most", that is exaggerated.
Then why when I go on 3,000 miles of interstate driving, traffic is usually moving at 79 - 83 MPH?

Because your perceptions are not necessarily reality.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Beltway

I got an interesting evaluation of speed enforcement around the state by colleagues at Richmond Police Department, two sergeants in the Traffic Unit, the unit that deals with this and other tasks.

I will post the details soon, but basically the Internet Warriors do exaggerate things considerably.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

jeffandnicole

I generally do about 78 mph in most 65 and 70 mph highways in VA.  Just like I would do in every other state with the same speed limit.  Many people that claim they want to go over 80 mph in Virginia would also be saying they won't drive 10 mph over the limit anyway, so it's generally a moot point.

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 05:07:02 PM
Agreed on all points. Six lanes is desired, but the issue is cost and the fact we're dealing with VDOT - a broke state transportation agency.

I wish I could be broke...with $5.4 billion in my pocket.

Virginia's DOT is far from broke.  They simply have more needs than money available. 


Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 06:45:20 PM
82 - 83 MPH is the ideal speed for most. Pull them over for speeding sure, but no need for a reckless driving charge. If I'm pulled over for doing 73 MPH in a 60 MPH, I don't get a reckless driving charge. But at 83 MPH in a 70 MPH, I do. Anything above 85 MPH on the other hand is reckless, and I 100% agree a reckless driving charge is warranted for that.

But that's illegal in Virginia...

Driving 83 in a 70 zone is illegal in EVERY state.  Who says 82-83 is the ideal speed for most?  I'd love to see stats on that one.  And for what it's worth, it's not a guaranteed reckless driving ticket.  A friend of mine got an 81 in a 70 in VA, and it was just a regular ticket.

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 05:07:02 PM
I-295 around Hopewell, that stretch being enforced by Hopewell's police department, not State Police. I take I-295 often, I never once have not seen them hiding out in the median.

Should've been with me this past week.  I didn't see them either direction. 

QuoteThey generally will wait till you exceed 80 MPH though, so they can slap that hefty fine on there for reckless driving.

Site source.  This is extremely contradictory to everyone else stating, including yourself, that it's a speed trap. 10+ over the limit isn't a speed trap.  Especially if you're bitching you won't go 80 or over in the entire state.

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 06:50:42 PM
The fact is that indeed the average driver is doing about 79 - 83 MPH.

So if you're going 83 mph, then half the traffic is still going faster than you?

Doubt it.

sprjus4

Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 07:02:22 PM
Should've been with me this past week.  I didn't see them either direction.
I was there Friday heading southbound, two cops positioned in the median running radar, and one cop pulled over on the shoulder. I see it frequently, I go up this way twice a month.

Hopewell is a well known speed trap. The fact you're trying to deny it is moot.

Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 07:02:22 PM
Driving 83 in a 70 zone is illegal in EVERY state.
Woah, really? I thought the speed limit was just a recommended speed.

roadman65

I think its time for popcorn. :popcorn:
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

hotdogPi

People will stop driving 81 if it turns into a "community grid".  :bigass:
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

famartin

Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:41:04 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 14, 2019, 04:50:56 PM
Virginia has some pretty scenery, but the ban on radar detectors makes me dislike driving in that state.

The fact that you can't just set your cruise control to 79 mph makes you dislike driving in a state?  How fast do you want to go anyway ... 90+?

I have passed state popo doing 78 in the 70 zones and they haven't batted an eye. They really want that 80+ fine.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: famartin on May 14, 2019, 08:28:38 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:41:04 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 14, 2019, 04:50:56 PM
Virginia has some pretty scenery, but the ban on radar detectors makes me dislike driving in that state.

The fact that you can't just set your cruise control to 79 mph makes you dislike driving in a state?  How fast do you want to go anyway ... 90+?

I have passed state popo doing 78 in the 70 zones and they haven't batted an eye. They really want that 80+ fine.

Again, no proof. Cop could've been looking for something else. I was sitting in congestion once...a cop pulled out of the median and pulled someone over. Couldn't have been speeding then. Maybe a headlight or registration violation.

Also, many cops stop someone only to give a reduced violation. May be looking for 81+, but will only write for 79.

sprjus4

Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 08:51:52 PM
Quote from: famartin on May 14, 2019, 08:28:38 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:41:04 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 14, 2019, 04:50:56 PM
Virginia has some pretty scenery, but the ban on radar detectors makes me dislike driving in that state.

The fact that you can't just set your cruise control to 79 mph makes you dislike driving in a state?  How fast do you want to go anyway ... 90+?

I have passed state popo doing 78 in the 70 zones and they haven't batted an eye. They really want that 80+ fine.

Again, no proof. Cop could've been looking for something else. I was sitting in congestion once...a cop pulled out of the median and pulled someone over. Couldn't have been speeding then. Maybe a headlight or registration violation.

Also, many cops stop someone only to give a reduced violation. May be looking for 81+, but will only write for 79.
Do you believe that police trapping is baloney? Doesn't exist? Never happens?

Don't tell me you're one of those people.

famartin

Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 08:51:52 PM
Quote from: famartin on May 14, 2019, 08:28:38 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 06:41:04 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on May 14, 2019, 04:50:56 PM
Virginia has some pretty scenery, but the ban on radar detectors makes me dislike driving in that state.

The fact that you can't just set your cruise control to 79 mph makes you dislike driving in a state?  How fast do you want to go anyway ... 90+?

I have passed state popo doing 78 in the 70 zones and they haven't batted an eye. They really want that 80+ fine.

Again, no proof. Cop could've been looking for something else. I was sitting in congestion once...a cop pulled out of the median and pulled someone over. Couldn't have been speeding then. Maybe a headlight or registration violation.

Also, many cops stop someone only to give a reduced violation. May be looking for 81+, but will only write for 79.
Whatever helps you sleep at night 🤣

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 07:15:19 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 07:02:22 PM
Should've been with me this past week.  I didn't see them either direction.
I was there Friday heading southbound, two cops positioned in the median running radar, and one cop pulled over on the shoulder. I see it frequently, I go up this way twice a month.
Hopewell is a well known speed trap. The fact you're trying to deny it is moot.

You're trying to salve and make excuses for your speeding.  9 times out of 10 I see no speed enforcement on that part of I-295. 

Police policy is to not ticket for less than 15 over if that is the only thing not in compliance.  You are not being "trapped" if you are stopped for 15+ over, you are speeding be any definition of the term.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

sprjus4

#91
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 09:15:41 PM
9 times out of 10 I see no speed enforcement on that part of I-295.
Yep, proved my point. Denying the facts, and denying the fact it's a well known speed trap that Hopewell has even admitted before. I drive that stretch I-295 frequently, and I know someone who is on it at least 3 times a week, and sees police almost everyday.

You might need to look a little closer into the trees, you'll see them.

Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 09:15:41 PM
Police policy is to not ticket for less than 15 over if that is the only thing not in compliance.  You are not being "trapped" if you are stopped for 15+ over, you are speeding be any definition of the term.
I've been pulled for doing 67 MPH in a 60 MPH on a limited-access, well designed highway around Emporia, in a police trap set up by Emporia police. I've had a friend pulled for doing 64 MPH. 64 MPH. That's not 15 over, that's 4 over. One guy radaring cars going by, then waving at his buddy to go pull them over. They get like 2 or 3 units parked in the median over the hill to catch unsuspecting drivers. I've seen this operation a-l-o-t.

Tell me it's not a police trap.

You're 15 over claim is nothing but the truth.

Just because you've never seen it with your own two eyes (and I'd be willing to be you have, it's hard to not), doesn't make it not true.

EDIT - Another part in Emporia, when you go over the US-301 interchange on US-58 Westbound right before I-95 and the road is going downhill, and the speed drops 15 MPH to 45 MPH. I've seen units parked there before radaring cars coming down the hill still over 45 MPH right in front of the 45 MPH signage, and bam. Pulled & ticketed.

Beltway

#92
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 09:20:18 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 09:15:41 PM
9 times out of 10 I see no speed enforcement on that part of I-295.
Yep, proved my point. Denying the facts, and denying the fact it's a well known speed trap that Hopewell has even admitted before. I drive that stretch I-295 frequently, and I know someone who is on it at least 3 times a week, and sees police almost everyday.
You might need to look a little closer into the trees, you'll see them.

Hopewell was quoted in a newspaper article that they don't stop at less than 15 over.  15+ over is "speeding" and is not "being trapped".

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 09:20:18 PM
Quote from: Beltway on May 14, 2019, 09:15:41 PM
Police policy is to not ticket for less than 15 over if that is the only thing not in compliance.  You are not being "trapped" if you are stopped for 15+ over, you are speeding be any definition of the term.
I've been pulled for doing 67 MPH in a 60 MPH on a limited-access, well designed highway around Emporia, in a police trap set up by Emporia police. I've had a friend pulled for doing 64 MPH. 64 MPH. That's not 15 over, that's 4 over. One guy radaring cars going by, then waving at his buddy to go pull them over. They get like 2 or 3 units parked in the median over the hill to catch unsuspecting drivers. I've seen this operation a-l-o-t.
Tell me it's not a police trap.
You're 15 over claim is nothing but the truth.

Yeah sure uh-huh.  How come speeders always claim to getting stopped for going a few miles over the limit but never admit getting stopped for 15 or 20 or more over?  (because they couldn't call it a "trap", that's why).

The courts are a state function, not municipal, and if they get a bunch of people challenging moving violations for a few miles over, they are going to throw those tickets out, as they don't have time for that kind of nonsense, with all the other major things they have to rule on.

If the police really want "revenue" then they are going to issue real tickets for real violations for 15+ over and few if any of them will be dismissed by the courts.

In over a million miles of driving, I have often traveled at 7 or 8 miles over, and have -never- been stopped for that.  I have had exactly one speeding ticket, and that was for 15 over, and if it wasn't on a holiday day (Labor Day) and heading into a small town speed zone I probably wouldn't have been stopped.

US-58 is only an hour from where I live, and I have driven it countless times, not because of need but because like many people here I like to drive on highways.  I drive about 28,000 miles a year and none of that is to work.  I typically set the cruise control on 68 or 70 on that highway in the 60 mph zones, and I have no worry about being stopped by police, and I do not have a radar detector.  Plenty of vehicles travel in the same speed realm.
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

jeffandnicole

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 09:20:18 PM
Pulled & ticketed.

How do you know they were ticketed?

The only way you would know is because you're a cop, or you were the one pulled over.


roadman65

This discussion is like Dejavu with Ethanman 8675309 (or whatever his number was) and the cops on his fictional I-366.  He said that no cop was giving out tickets to those going 85 then, and some argued with the kid that he knew nothing about cops and tickets.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

sprjus4

Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 10:24:00 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 09:20:18 PM
Pulled & ticketed.

How do you know they were ticketed?

The only way you would know is because you're a cop, or you were the one pulled over.
I've already stated I've been pulled. Not on that particular stretch, but 67 MPH in the 60 MPH zone. It was back in 2013. A friend of mine was pulled at 64 MPH in that same 60 MPH, in 2016. But I suppose I'm "lying" to prove a point :-o  :pan:

For other instances, no, technically I don't know they were "ticketed for speeding", but it says something when I drive through there, and I almost always see someone pulled over. I don't see that anywhere else.

For the record, I've not seen so much enforcement in the past few months there, though in December, November, August, July, and my other recent times through there, I've always seen them, one running radar, and one with someone pulled.

Beltway

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 10:50:40 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 10:24:00 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 09:20:18 PM
Pulled & ticketed.
How do you know they were ticketed?
The only way you would know is because you're a cop, or you were the one pulled over.
I've already stated I've been pulled. Not on that particular stretch, but 67 MPH in the 60 MPH zone. It was back in 2013. A friend of mine was pulled at 64 MPH in that same 60 MPH, in 2016. But I suppose I'm "lying" to prove a point

There is nothing new under the sun (Ecclesiastes 1:9).  I've been counterposting speeders in online forums for over 20 years and it is the same old same old, tiresome and wasteful.  Just look at the endless threads about "left lane blockers", for example.

How many times have you and your 'friend' been "pulled" by cops for 15+ over and what were the speeds?

If "pulled" for less than that then what others area(s) was the driver not in compliance with the law?
http://www.roadstothefuture.com
http://www.capital-beltway.com

Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

jeffandnicole

Quote from: Beltway on May 15, 2019, 12:17:10 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 10:50:40 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 14, 2019, 10:24:00 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 09:20:18 PM
Pulled & ticketed.
How do you know they were ticketed?
The only way you would know is because you're a cop, or you were the one pulled over.
I've already stated I've been pulled. Not on that particular stretch, but 67 MPH in the 60 MPH zone. It was back in 2013. A friend of mine was pulled at 64 MPH in that same 60 MPH, in 2016. But I suppose I'm "lying" to prove a point

There is nothing new under the sun (Ecclesiastes 1:9).  I've been counterposting speeders in online forums for over 20 years and it is the same old same old, tiresome and wasteful.  Just look at the endless threads about "left lane blockers", for example.

How many times have you and your 'friend' been "pulled" by cops for 15+ over and what were the speeds?

If "pulled" for less than that then what others area(s) was the driver not in compliance with the law?

I can see someone being stopped for doing 67 in a 60...if they're in the left lane of an otherwise empty highway.  Cop may not say they were stopped for failing to keep right, especially if the law doesn't specify it, but if they have an arrogance towards left lane dicks they can stop someone for going slower than what's normally permitted and site them for a minor speed infraction anyway!

I've heard numerous times what a speedtrap Hopewell is.  But like someone has their experiences, I have my experiences as well. 

webny99

Quote from: sprjus4 on May 14, 2019, 05:07:02 PM
It's crazy, above 80 MPH is reckless in Virginia, yet in Texas, 85 MPH is the posted speed on one highway. The reckless threshold should be 85 MPH for 70 MPH stretches. Most would agree.

80 is laughably low for a "reckless" threshold. Even 85 is too low. I would say anywhere from 90 to 100 mph is reasonable, depending upon the speed limit and the quality of the road (but always at least speed limit +20).

It all depends on the context, too. In a rolling backlog with trucks passing each other, if you are weaving around people at 85+, then yes, you probably are behaving recklessly. But in nice weather with low traffic volumes, there is absolutely nothing reckless about driving 90 mph on a high quality road like I-81.

1995hoo

I've always thought the idea of designating a particular speed as automatic grounds for a reckless driving charge is sort of dumb. Some cops agree. I'm sure I've mentioned before that I was at the Fairfax County courthouse once waiting for the traffic docket to finish and one of the defendants was charged with simple speeding for going 98 mph on I-66 west of Fair Oaks Mall. The judge asked the cop why he didn't charge the guy with reckless driving and the cop said he didn't feel the guy was a danger to himself or anyone else–the weather was dry, it was late at night and there was a full moon, the road was empty, and the guy was driving a brand-new Corvette such that the cop concluded the guy gave in to the impulse to see what the car could do. The judge accepted that as reasonable, although he still gave the defendant some jail time. (Judges in Fairfax County will routinely sentence you to one day in jail for every mile per hour above 90. I believe Jayson Werth got a reduced number of days via a plea-bargain.)

Thing is, setting aside things like residential streets where it's often obviously reckless to go even 50 mph, I think we all know there are some roads where speeds of 90+ can be perfectly reasonable while there are other Interstates where 60 mph might be a bit much. I tend to think a law that allows you to be charged with a criminal offense (misdemeanor reckless driving) merely because you went 11 mph over the speed limit (81 mph in a 70-mph zone) is a bit of a "gotcha" law. If you were going 11 mph over while weaving in and out of traffic, tailgating, passing on the shoulder (generally acting like someone from PG County, Maryland, in other words!), then sure, that may be reckless. But simply going 11 over with no other issues? That's always seemed a little unreasonable to me, and my feeling on that is underscored by the fact that for years we were fed the same BS line about "speed limits are set for your safety and it's unsafe to exceed them." Really? Then explain to me how it is that once upon a time it was "unsafe" to go faster than 55 mph on I-66 between Haymarket and I-81, but now it's "safe" to go 70 mph on the same stretch of road that now carries more traffic than it did in the 55-mph era with no significant design changes other than a small widening at Haymarket. It seems to me that if it is deemed "safe" to go 70 mph on I-66, then the threshold for what is "reckless" should likewise change because one aspect of recklessness would often be attempting to go considerably faster than everyone else on the road.

BTW, for those who don't realize it, speed alone is not the only basis for a reckless driving charge in Virginia. You can be charged with reckless driving even if you're not going very much over the speed limit. For example, a cop could probably write you a reckless ticket if you're weaving in and out tailgating and cutting off trucks, or if you use the shoulder to bomb past stopped traffic:

Quote§ 46.2-852. Reckless driving; general rule.
Irrespective of the maximum speeds permitted by law, any person who drives a vehicle on any highway recklessly or at a speed or in a manner so as to endanger the life, limb, or property of any person shall be guilty of reckless driving.

There are a series of other provisions following that section that prescribe other things that constitute reckless driving; for example, the next section (46.2-853) states, "A person shall be guilty of reckless driving who drives a vehicle which is not under proper control or which has inadequate or improperly adjusted brakes on any highway in the Commonwealth." Illegally passing a stopped school bus that is discharging or taking on kids is reckless driving, too. I've long felt that reading a phone, like sending and receiving text messages while driving, should be chargeable as reckless driving under the "general rule" quoted above.
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